Dude, just stop commenting. Your info is great, and we get it, but not properly bedding the brakes will not warp the rotors. It will just(MAYBE) leave an uneven surface build up from pad debris. MB would not have replaced rotors on many cars if this was the case, but it is not. The rotors are junk and warp very easily, no fault of any drivers not bedding their pads, or seasoning their rotors. Your beating the horse with your useless youtube videos which we all have probably seen as we were researching our problems. And most of those videos are from aftermarket manufacturers, in which case made for road racing applications. Leave this topic to owners with E550's to discuss, you don'y even have these problems.

 

We just need to research the Manufacturer of the front rotor in our E550, an avoid them, the Pads are Akebono's. When ready just replace both front rotor and pads with quality parts from different manufacturer at an independent MB service shop, at cheaper cost than $750 dealer charges. A member in this forum solved his brake shuddering and shaking by going this route and very happy with his brake performance. MB dealers think we can afford $65,000 car, so we throw $750 away for poor and defective original parts.

 

Glyn M Ruck: Akebono Brake Corporation not Pagid supply pads for 2010-2011 MB E550, but I don't know the supplier of Disc/Rotor. Supplier of rotor for W212 E550 probably change from Brembo due to MB cost cutting because previous E550 2009 going back don't have this shudder and shaking problems.

 

I highly doubt Mercedes expects their drivers to properly "bed" their brakes. Most BM drivers I know only want to deal with three things:

Brakes, gas, and steering.

I can just imagine MB trying to tell some grandma how to bed the brakes of her car. The brakes should work properly under normal use and if they do not, it is a defect.

 

Thank you, perfect point like I said in my previous comment on page 1.... Not everyone is young/mechanically inclined and understand anything about this topic, some can not even work a smart phone let alone bed their brakes...lol

 

My 2010 does not have an issue either. Only problem was brake dust, which I fixed by changing to ceramic pads. No dust and absolutely no vibrations.

 

Good to see someone else with the right mind.

If the problem was uneven brake pad deposit on the rotor, i.e. dirty rotor, MB would just have cleaned them. But they have changed lots of rotors and this means they either find warped rotors or unevenly worn rotors.

MB dealers do not fix anything, they just change parts so these same make crappy rotors will be installed in the car again and the problem goes on.

A better fix for a warped rotor would be to turn it flat unless it would go under thickness limit. When the rotor gets warped once it does because of the "heat treatment" it experiences under use. I don't think it would do it again but as said, MB dealers do not fix any parts, they just change parts.

 

Totally agree. "Normal use" is the gotcha. If every driver had this problem MB would lose customers and money just keeping up with warranty brake failures. But not every driver has the problem. Do you? It's usually driver and environment specific. I fell into that category when I worked/commuted on freeways so I bed my brakes. Solved my brake shuddering and squealing that I had on all my cars (with disk brakes) previously. I've since slowed down and no longer commute but still do the bedding procedure out of habit....it can't hurt. I have my own 'theory' of why it seems to be more prevalent with the 550s than the 350s. Most people don't buy a 550 to plod along in traffic

 

The only reason dealers replace the rotors before they are worn is because it's not cost effective to turn them. You cannot just remove the rotors and wipe them clean. Some manufacturers can turn them while still on the axle with a special machine but the bottom line is a layer of material must be removed to get back down to a clean base. That takes time. Rather than tie up a work bay to 'fix' a part they just replace it and then fill that bay again with money making repairs. By replacing them they could do at least two brake jobs in the time it takes to machine the rotors. Rotors do not "warp". That's a car myth. If a rotor became hot enough to change the crystalline structure to bend then the pads would have caught fire and melted. The dealer uses nomenclature on their work order that justifies them getting credit for the replacement . That doesn't mean it's the real failure cause of the part. I have seen MB bulletins that spell out the criteria for getting credit for replacing rotors under warranty and faulty pad deposits wasn't a reason. It's not a "heat treatment" during break in that makes the brakes effective, it's the even deposit of pad material imbedded in the rotor so you gain nothing from cutting them and putting them back on from that perspective. The only purpose of the rotor is to dissipate heat so getting it hot isn't going to hurt it. I replaced so many pads and rotors (and turned them) before I started bedding them that I could do it in my sleep. I never got anywhere complaining to the dealers....they all blamed it on my "driving style" and said it was a small percentage of people so they could live with it. You may still have problems after doing a bedding procedure on new pads and rotors. Then I would go aftermarket. The shudder drove me nuts.

 

Bedding was a rule of thumb when brake pads had asbestos in them. Asbestos if extremely heat resistant. The reason brake bedding was common was to eliminate brake squeal. This is not really needed today, but, it is a procedure that will cause no harm, and actually may help. If MB wanted their customers to perform bedding procedure on the brake pads, there would be a procedure to follow in the Owner's Manual. There is no such procedure in the owners manual. MB designs their brakes to provide stopping power from Autobahn speeds, as do all German manufacturers as well as most European manufacturers. If the brake pad is loose, squealing or vibration are likely. Bedding used to resolve this, but today, with the non-asbestos materials and higher metallic content, it is very easy for the pads to "glaze" the rotors under hard use. This will also cause a vibration. If you are experiencing this regularly with your driving style, then after-market pad may be the simple fix. At 49K miles on my E350 Bluetec, my brakes were absolutely great. An interesting observation about MB brakes on their sport models: The E sport models have cross drilled rotors. Cross drilling can create stress points in the rotor. The can deform under heavy use and cause a shudder felt in the steering wheel. Interestingly, I learn from my service rep that MB actually casts the perforations into the rotors for the S-Class during the manufacturing process. This eliminates the chance for stress points.

The following is from the MBUSA S-Class site:

"Perforated and internally ventilated front brake discs help to better dissipate the hot gases generated during hard or repeated braking, helping resist brake fade in order to maintain maximum braking performance. The perforations are cast in place when the rotor is made, to prevent the creation of stress points that can occur during conventional cross-drilling. For more even and powerful braking force, the front discs feature large 4-piston calipers."

 

Correct. Once again...I suggested preemptive bedding to the OP because of recurring failures. "Normal" driving beds brakes on its' own.....for normal drivers/driving. It's transparent but still happens. My understanding of bedding differs from yours. Equal material transfer from pad to entire rotor face is necessary for optimum operation regardless of pad material. Spotty transfer is a primary cause for vibration/shudder/squealing. I believe it's the 'glaze' you refer to.

Maybe this is what they're experiencing? A supposedly warped rotor would be wavy but equal thickness. My experience with cross drilled rotor failures is cracks emanating from the holes. Do these with failures have abnormal rotor appearance?

np888....It seems your thread has morphed/hijacked to a 'bedding' thread. Sorry, but maybe it will get you an answer anyway. If you want, I'll open another thread on bedding because there seems to be opinions around it but I think these discussion will help you even if not directly. Hopefully draw more of those affected in for discussion.

 

Keep in mind that the rotors on the Sport E's are conventionally crossed drilled, not cast as they are in the S-Class.

 

"cross drilled" as advertised on some brakes, aren't the same for the Merc. They are perforated at "birth", so there is no drilling after they are initially cast. If these rotors are indeed warping, it's just bad materials, too thin, or there is some other factor contributing to the lack of cooling. Maybe the pad can take a wider range of heat, yet the rotors cannot, or perhaps the pads are themselves too small. E350 owners are NOT immune to this, by the way, it's just more prevalent with the E550 owners, perhaps because of the additional weight on the front end.

 

Update: I took my car to a different MUCH better dealer, and they replaced all four rotors for me (even though the car is a 100 miles out of brake warranty) without me even having to argue, or ask them to do it.

 

Nice. MB aims to please. I guess you have a new dealer now Are you going to bed them in this time Only takes about 20 minutes and its' worth the effort. The hardest part is finding a stretch of road without traffic to do it. If you have to stop completely and wait in the middle of the process use the P brake to hold. If bedding doesn't help at least you'll know.

 

I just looked at mine and they are cast in. Maybe they've changed?

 

True story....yesterday at my physical therapy session the man on the table next to me was an MB dealer mechanic and also drives an E350. He said the same thing. He said "1 in 200" will suffer the problem. Or about 1/2%. He also said it's usually repeated with the same drivers. He said they didn't bother measuring the rotors before replacement because with the symptom it's obvious and measuring is a waste of time. He never heard of bedding. I asked him if there was a fix for repeat failures and his answer was very interesting. "Aston Martin rotors". He attributed the failures to driving style and conditions.

 

Most likely true. I'm 90% freeway, very little city driving and I rarely get over 65 mph on our highways. This last time, I took 1000 miles to bed the pads. Never left my foot on the brake after the freeway (Used park and parking brake while idle). Never used anything but steady firm pressure. So far so good. Lease is almost up, however and this is my last Merc ... when they can't get brakes to function on a "sport" vehicle, I'm done.

 

NOW THAT IS GREAT TO HEAR!!! I'm so glad you are getting a resolution.

And good for that dealer! (You might want to shout him out here.)

 

LOL at not bedding the brakes as the culpit of this vibration issue. It's simple. The reason is that the rotors are junk. MB knows this. There is an improved rotor with a different part number now. Whether or not your dealer gives you a hard time about replacing them under warranty is up to the dealer. Different dealers yield different results.

 

Different part numbers doesn't always mean improved, it's most likely MB changed suppliers.

 

Dealer replaced front rotors ~12k miles ago, but vibrations are back again.

They fastened someting on front wheels/suspension (don't have the paperwork) two months ago, but vibrations are back again. Bedding method described on this thread did not help at all.

Anybody else experiencing the same / any ideas on what to try next?

 

At this point one may have to actually take the rotors to bed, and make them happy, if you know what I mean

 

Why is it on E550 only, not on E350? Only difference is engine size V6 verses V8.

 

There is quite a difference besides the engine. Sometimes a salesman will say that because they don't have one to sell you. Relevant to this thread, the brake components are different than any E350.


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