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HI Benz friend has anybody installed a catch can on a E350 with m276 motor ? trying to see if can add a catch can due to some minor oil, I was looking a the m156 motor adapter on ebay I don't know if these will fit for the m276 the adaptor for the Throttle body to the oil separator
I was cleaning my throttle body and noticed an oil inside, its not a blowby. These DI engines tends to gunk up the intake valves when oil enters the Plenum, actually Im working on my chain tensioners due to rattle,I just want to see if anybody install a catch can e350 thanks
I was cleaning my throttle body and noticed an oil inside, its not a blowby. These DI engines tends to gunk up the intake valves when oil enters the Plenum, actually Im working on my chain tensioners due to rattle,I just want to see if anybody install a catch can e350 thanks
"These DI engines" aren't all the same... Would love to see some M157, M278, M276 evidence of carbon build-up on intake valves. I keep searching and keep coming up dry, so please do share...
"These DI engines" aren't all the same... Would love to see some M157, M278, M276 evidence of carbon build-up on intake valves. I keep searching and keep coming up dry, so please do share...
Hi these are the intake valves . im in a process of using a intake valve cleaner to be able to remove some of these built up thru the Years. This engine has only 52k miles
My plan is to use this adapter fitting to the Oil separator pipe that goes to the Throttle body. And add a catch can in between by using these adaptors from M156 motor I emailed the seller asking the measurement of this fittings to see it this can be use on M276. My goal is to prolong the life of my MB.
Here's what I can add to this thread: Initially about 4 years ago when we bought our E550 used, I was very concerned about this issue. I couldn't find much at all specific to our engine(s), but found plenty on other makers' DI engines and the various solutions to the problem (mostly, once it is occurring). So I asked my MB dealer Service Manager, and back then they were suggesting that all of the DI engines get treated with this BG Intake cleaning system, which could only be done at the dealer and was sort of a "subscription" type purchase - you had to do it at least every year. I asked him if they were experiencing customers with cars that had the problem, and they had: a single customer. I asked what MB did to solve it (knowing that other manufacturer's cars were getting intakes cleaned with walnut shell blasting and other such techniques), and he said Mercedes replaces the entire head assemblies. Since I was under warranty I asked if this was now part of the maintenance requirement to which he said No. I asked so if this happens to my car, will warranty cover the head replacement and he said Yes.
Subsequently I looked into why we MB owners weren't hearing of or having these failures that were so common on other DI cars, and here are the 2 things I came away with: the MB DI is centered in cylinder top and actually can inject fuel on the back side of the intake valve. And 2nd: the PCV system is far more sophisticated than other makers, using better liquid knock down so the oil doesn't get into the PCV stream as easily.
My dealer stopped recommending the BG treatment after that 1st year. I found that this problem was pretty significant on Ford Ecoboost engines (another close-as-can-be turbo to exhaust stream design). Ford, for a long time, has denied warranty to any engine that has shown to have had any sort of upstream cleaning done to it. Why? Because they did it themselves and found the turbos were either immediately failing or failing within a thousand miles.
The solution for many DI cars is a catch can. But the real solution is a dual injection system, that first Toyota and then Ford and others have gone to (clean the intake valves the old way, with fuel). But Mercedes didn't follow until very recently - my assumption is that since they had the most experience with DI, their implementation was simply "better" and this issue isn't very common. The picture above is not a very dirty intake valve(s). Look around the internet and see some really bad build-up, that does affect performance...
I'm not installing a catch can on my M278, but I am on another vehicle with a different DI set-up (which is known to have significant potential issues).
Not trying to bash anyone for doing a catch can at all. Just saying that if this was an issue for us, we'd know about it, and FOR SURE there'd be lots of aftermarket implementations/offerings for our engines...
My $.02 and let's keep this discussion going - I'm here to learn...
Here's what I can add to this thread: Initially about 4 years ago when we bought our E550 used, I was very concerned about this issue. I couldn't find much at all specific to our engine(s), but found plenty on other makers' DI engines and the various solutions to the problem (mostly, once it is occurring). So I asked my MB dealer Service Manager, and back then they were suggesting that all of the DI engines get treated with this BG Intake cleaning system, which could only be done at the dealer and was sort of a "subscription" type purchase - you had to do it at least every year. I asked him if they were experiencing customers with cars that had the problem, and they had: a single customer. I asked what MB did to solve it (knowing that other manufacturer's cars were getting intakes cleaned with walnut shell blasting and other such techniques), and he said Mercedes replaces the entire head assemblies. Since I was under warranty I asked if this was now part of the maintenance requirement to which he said No. I asked so if this happens to my car, will warranty cover the head replacement and he said Yes.
Subsequently I looked into why we MB owners weren't hearing of or having these failures that were so common on other DI cars, and here are the 2 things I came away with: the MB DI is centered in cylinder top and actually can inject fuel on the back side of the intake valve. And 2nd: the PCV system is far more sophisticated than other makers, using better liquid knock down so the oil doesn't get into the PCV stream as easily.
My dealer stopped recommending the BG treatment after that 1st year. I found that this problem was pretty significant on Ford Ecoboost engines (another close-as-can-be turbo to exhaust stream design). Ford, for a long time, has denied warranty to any engine that has shown to have had any sort of upstream cleaning done to it. Why? Because they did it themselves and found the turbos were either immediately failing or failing within a thousand miles.
The solution for many DI cars is a catch can. But the real solution is a dual injection system, that first Toyota and then Ford and others have gone to (clean the intake valves the old way, with fuel). But Mercedes didn't follow until very recently - my assumption is that since they had the most experience with DI, their implementation was simply "better" and this issue isn't very common. The picture above is not a very dirty intake valve(s). Look around the internet and see some really bad build-up, that does affect performance...
I'm not installing a catch can on my M278, but I am on another vehicle with a different DI set-up (which is known to have significant potential issues).
Not trying to bash anyone for doing a catch can at all. Just saying that if this was an issue for us, we'd know about it, and FOR SURE there'd be lots of aftermarket implementations/offerings for our engines...
My $.02 and let's keep this discussion going - I'm here to learn...
Hi diesel-dan thanksfor chiming in The picture of the intake valve was in the middle of cleaning and there are more carbon deposit that I took off. I was a former tech on GM and Lexus for 30 years and I was just concern about the oil contamination in the plenum and not being wash away from the injectors. I used sell the BG cleaners on our customers cars back in the day and those works pretty great on cleaning the both valves intake and exhaust.. the design on our engine are really modern, but the additional injectors would be nice to wash away the carbon from the intake valves, when I used to work at lexus some of the new DI engine have 2 injectors I guess they know the purpose of the second one. Im still looking get an adaptor for this project and definitely this will cut the oil contamination in the system.
What is the end result if a catch can is not installed on an engine that allegedly would benefit from having one?
Less deposit build-up on back side of intake valves and stems, mostly from oil mist in PCV stream hitting hot valves and staying. With port injection, fuel would keep the valves clean, and that is why (no matter what the manufacturers claim) they are pretty much all going to dual injection systems...
That's my take on it, you read any forum with DI motors of the past 6+ years and they all seem to have the issue. That's why I find it curious we never hear about it on our cars and MB stuck with single DI injection for so long? Must happen, or why are they too going to dual injection...?
In the picture above, there's no carbon on those valves. They are squeaky clean. Seriously. This is carbon, from my Audi S5:
Darel I took out most of the carbon, I should have taken the picture before cleaning it, I dont have the walnut cleaning machine, so its a labor of love cleaning style lol
02-18-2020, 11:53 AM
