Mercedes MB

MERCEDES BENZ E220 W212 2010 VIN: WDD2120021A286427 ,,

We have an ongoing issue with this car, It randomly shuts itself off . Per the AUTEL Diagnostic it shows 2 Errors which are : U12000 Communication with the starter or alternator has a malfunction and U010600 Communication with Glow Output stage has a malfunction. Check engine light always on. Error coeds can't be deleted.
Like I mentioned before some times it takes longer some times shorter for the car to turn on the ESP error and to shuts itself off . Car is normally charging the battery , and we have measured the volts when the car Shuts itself off and every thing seems to be ok all values are in range when that happens , we even added one more battery just to see maybe he loses power in a millisecond and no luck.
We changed the Relay on the front of the car for the heaters of starting the car because it showed that mistake to. Picture is attached :

We also tested all fuses on the front and back , also we tested all relays on the front and back they seem to be working perfect , except testing the box on the side where is the Battery located.
Last thing is that we thin that on that side where the Battery is located there is an box where are two relays , one is the for airbag and one is the Gruner 750 H ,
Here is the picture , I have ordered an new box like this to see is that the problem . If not then it will be an real pain to check all the wirings and etc. If anyone of you here had an same problem like this would appreciate some help .
As of now I think this relay/diode is failing .


As of now I think this is the problem , like this not connected it has connectivity between both sides (open) .

If you could help let me know .

Thank you !

S-Prihadi

First of, I have zero knowledge on your engine, 4 cylinder diesel OM651.
However, I will try my best to help from the electrical point of view.

Now........

MB wrote :
Per the AUTEL Diagnostic it shows 2 Errors which are : U12000 Communication with the starter or alternator has a malfunction and U010600 Communication with Glow Output stage has a malfunction.

U code is a code where the LIN data line of these 2 devices is not speaking to the engine computer N3/9.
These 2 devices shared the same LIN bus. See my red circle and lines.




The green line is where I find the wiring for glow plug module N14/3 power source, as the dumbest of the dumbest design there is. I will discuss this later.

Back to the U code.
When the N14/3 glow plug module goes bad as in shorted due to overload or overheating or whatever, it can create a short-circuit too at the LIN and hence the alternator's LIN also stops working ( but alternator is fine without a LIN ),
that is why you also got the alternator LIN communication failure code. I hope the engine computer N3/9 LIN chip is not damaged yet....usually they are tough, so I read.

This glow plug module ( relay ) goes bad is not new, I googled : In fact in UK it is a recall






See, RISK OF FIRE ..... of course it will be on fire with ease. Because there should be a proper sized fused for glow plug module/relay which MB should have installed,
and not relying on a freaking Pyro Fuse of typically 350 AMPS !!!!



I am still amazed till today, why is it MB wiring for F32 and Starter System always have mistake ?? See above, why MB never drew the alternator for F150 pyro fuse ??
For above drawing : Ignore the fact that I am using ( top left ) Code ME04 car ( hybrid), yours should be U240...but is is the same design at the section I used as example



.







Now, do yourself a favor. Please verify for me and for your future database keeping : See below.

Take a look at your alternator, if based on above drawing there should be 3 big wires at the B post, the biggest and the only big post on the alternator, the other one is a small plastic connector for the LIN baby sized 0.75 mm2 single wire
1st wire should be 35 mm2 which is from F150 pyro fuse, or MR8 connection at F32 prefuse.
2nd wire should be 25 mm2 to the starter solenoid.
3rd wire should be 10 mm2 to the glow plug module/relay.
You must find this 3 wires and inspect the 3rd wire for damage to the insulation.



==============

ESP warning. This is my guess : If indeed the K2 relay is already weak magnetically for its latching or worn out contact points.
Your K2 is a mechanical relay, so worn out contact points is a high possibility at this age and mileage.




Your ESP module is basic version, based on the data-card of your car ( using VIN Decoder )
So one of its fuses, which is Fuse 14 is from K2 output, hence it is called 30g circuit ( clamping device ).
It also get bigger fuse from F32. We are only interested in Fuse 14. If your K2 relay goes intermittent bad during a drive and voltage loss for 1-2 seconds, your ESP may report the DTC.
What is the actual DTC number and description from Autel for ESP ?







Mercedes tried to squeeze so much information on a single wiring diagram to suit ALL the available variants, as such the conditional labeling gets either screw-up or reader will not be able to guarantee its accuracy or both.
Example based on above diagram :
U12 means valid for LEFT HAND drive
U13 means valid for RIGHT HAND drive
U240 means valid for all market except USA
We should be using U12 for your car, a left hand drive. But you can also use U240 because your car is non-USA market.
So how many fuses does your N30/4 ESP module will get then if you use U12 and U240 ? you go and count yourself and be confused.



If you want to confirm that you K2 is bad or not, you need to do a load test on it.
I think Autel can do bidirectional for K2 relay, I never tried with but you should look into it at Rear SAM module, because the command comes from Rear SAM.



==========================


Here is why I said : I find the wiring for glow plug module N14/3 power source, as the dumbest of the dumbest design there is.
Glow plug module N14/3 at the wire size of only 10 mm2 I predicted to consume no more than 60 -100 amps during pre-heat mode or 800 to 1,300 watts for a 4 cylinder engine.
If the short-circuit happens to the N14/3 in a closed circuit mode, its wire of 10 mm2 will melt its jacket and catch fire first before the king kong sized F150 pyro fuse which is approx 350 amps
will even started to warm up.

OK, let say the pyro fuse got blown finally, after that you will possibly damage to the alternator.
Alternator can not have its output disconnected during running or during power generation. Its voltage regulator will go bad very fast and hopefully the diode trio won't get damaged.

If I were you, I will measure what Glow plug module N14/3 will consume during a pre-heat and get an inline fuse 1.25 bigger than the measured consumption amperage.
Inline fuse to protect the Glow plug module N14/3 from doing other damage when and if it fails again in a short circuit mode.
On a B03 Start Stop version, MB place an inline fuse hidden at the wire itself, under heat shrink. No fuse block or housing, they soldered the fuse to the wire.
This is at the baby 12Ah battery at the trunk. It is called F97 fuse at 100 amps.



Oky doky......... good luck with the troubleshooting.





Attached is your car data-card ( ignore the wrong 2001 year, see the date : 2010-04-28 EuApprDate : 20100428 ) and wiring schematics to assist you.
A true proper data-card is if someone has access to online MB EPC. I don't.

S-Prihadi

To answer your last statement :




Your car datacard & ESP Wiring attached

Mercedes MB

Thank you for this info , I'm working on this car at my cousins garage , I know about other electronics not that much into cars , but I'm familiar with these things , I'm lucky that it's not a rush for me to fix this car, and you helped me with these schematics , I have waited for some spare parts , and will update all the thing I done here on this forum so it could be useful to someone else . Tomorrow , I will check all the wiring , and shortly will let you know what was the issue . Thank you so much for these diagrams .

Mercedes MB

Okay , I have checked all the wirings that were connected to this problem .
I have verified the wire from the ALTERNATOR to The Glow Plug Module , it is working and has connectivity , same are with the remaining two that go to the starter and F32 Box right side of the car . All wires have good contact and are in good shape . Also that wire from Alternator to Glow Plug has no fuse , which is ridiculous like you said . But the wire is in good shape .
I have also checked the Wire that goes from the Alternator to The ECU and Glow Plug Module , that wire is bricked . Also is in good shape has contact , I have tested all of them with an Multimeter .

Here are some pictures :


This is the connector that connects all of those 3 wires together .





All of those Relay in front SAM , are working to , I have added an new Glow plug , but same issue on the diagnostic .
When I saw everything seemed to be good with the wires , I had to do an Test Drive. And I have enabled on the LCD in the car to see the Voltage in the car . Then when I was driving for an 15 minutes , I started to press down on the trottle and the car showed the ESP error , I saw that the Voltage was rapidly going up and down from 12,3 V to 14,7 . Even When you come to a normal stop it goes from 12 to 14,7 up and down , When you turn on the AC it goes 14,7, When you turn it off it goes 12,7 volt, which is kind of confusing. Also i remembered at one time I had an hard time starting the car in the morning , it turned on the car from the first try but took some time . I think at the end it's the Alternator , And we are waiting for the other guy to check on it as that is not something I have done before ., I will let you know in couple of days was it the Alternator ,. I think the car should have stable voltage not something that is changing every second when you drive or not drive . When you press full gas it goes almost to 12 , when you drive it normally without the AC lights and etc it still is not stable it goes up and down . So will check on that .

Thank you for all of those Schematics and diagrams , It helped me a lot . Thank you for your time to .

I have one more question regarding your WIS /ASRA , I have downloaded one for my self that is working on Virtual Machine , and when I log in on the web browser it does not show the Wis button , only Comment button . Any chance you had some similar issues ?

Thank you Friend !

S-Prihadi

Mercedes charging profile is on purpose a YOYO as you see, down-up-down in the name to save emission.....or sell more batteries
When you turned on the AC charging goes up because that is part of the charging program, sometime you need the AC blower to be near maximum to get alternator to charge 14.x volts.
The charging profile is not the same for all engine, but the same YOYO they are.
If you want stable charging, disconnect the single LIN small wire to the alternator and the alternator will use its own voltage regulator to manage voltage, no more inteference from Engine Computer via the LIN bus/wire.
Your alternator NOW is working, no worry.

This is how my alternator is doing when the LIN wire is disconnected : https://mbworld.org/forums/e-class-w...ontroller.html
You have to test on your alternator.



You did not tell us what is the DTC code the ESP shows ?
Now, the car is aging and all connectors are not as clean as new. Give me the ESP DTC and do basic ground and power check for it, this time the bigger fuse one.

Check cleanliness of W70 ground of ESP.
Check condition of female pins/terminals of ESP connector, see any corossion green crusty or not ?
Check female pin/terminal fitment....anyone opened up ones or feeling loose ? U must use proper male pin/probe size, no thicker than 0.7mm, flat blade for small female terminal and no bigger than 0.8mm thick for bigger female terminal.

Check if your ESP get the big power/fuse from F32 prefuse block or from N10/1 Front SAM ?
You can check by removing fuse no 20 of 40 amps and fuse no 1 of 25 amps at FRONT SAM... they go to pin 25 with wire 2.5mm red-with yellow stripe and pin 1 with 4mm wire red-with green stripe at ESP connector.

The N30/4 wiring diagram I have attached previously, also seen below.




W70 ground is located at : My car is right hand drive, so it may be opposite position on a Left Hand Drive car, but WIS shows W70 is on the LEFT side of car and WIS is 90% based on Left Hand Drjve car.



Have fun troubleshooting.....................

CaliBenzDriver

I don't mean to interfere... OP alternator voltages below 12.6V, that is a call for action.

Year 2010 does not feature the "Engine Cut-Off" right? Yet it already has Bosch "Smart Charging" from 12.6V up to 14.9V.

12.3V and below 12.0V... is serious trouble all around. This condition helps disrupt crazy modules and cooks batteries with 90Amps "charge" surges. 2010 has no trunk AUX, perhaps a dash SLA.

To bypass the yoyo for free ...:

• simply drive with HL ON or
• durably disconnect ALT LIN control.

The amazing Bosch ECU firmware causes runaway voltage regulation. At that rate, scan the car to see what else is happening

Mercedes MB

This is an update, sadly I still didn't got the chance to solve this problem , I have sent it to one guy who checked the alternator he said its working fine no issues with the alternator . Then I sent it to the another guy who did some resets , and after those resets I still had the engine light one but after 2 days it went off. Now What I forgot to mention is that this car was in one place for about 6 months , No one drove it . And what is also feeling suspicious is the cooling fan it turns it self randomly to . When you turn off the car it goes high speed then it turns itself after 10 seconds off. Then when you turn it on sometimes from a fresh starts the temperature is not even start to grow , the fan goes full speed. Now to get back to the reset thing. After the reset the check engine light was still on and after a day or two it has turned itself off. Now when I make a full stop but now rarely it still sometimes shuts itself off but now there is no check engine light on . But in the past even when I delete the check engine light off, it turns on once it shuts itself down. Now it does not do that. I have 3 errors that show as : U0106 Glow Output stage Communication Fault Status: Intermittent ,, U0120 Starter/Generator Control Module - Status : Intermittent , P0685 The output for Relay Circuit 87 Has an electrical fault or open circuit , And the forth error U010087 Can message : Engine Control Module Fault , Status Intermittent .
That being said , Car still drivers good but goes off randomly sometimes. What I saw now when you drive slowly it sometimes start to hopping , . Sometimes when driving it goes off for a secind and turns on ack again , The needles go to the starting point and then come back on on the cluster .

THIS IS THE BLUEEFFICIENCY

Now the connector of the ventilator fan has been checked , all connectors are good , I have even checked the Front Sam Box connectors they are in a really good shape . BUT I CANT FIND THE SMALL BATTERY I have looked on all possible locations back in trunk , in front on the drivers side . There is no damn battery . I swear I have even put a camera in the small spots where I could look . There is no small battery . . Do you guys think this could be the ECU Problem . Because this things are randomly happening , And if an wire or connector was bad it would be all the time problems . I can driver for 4 hours straight nothing will happen , but tomorrow I can start and go for 3 meters and it will shuts itself off. And if you think the ECU could be the problem , Could I be able to find one that is same but to delete the data on that one and install the one from my ECU . I think some of those ECU's can be done by Autel . I have changed the normal car battery also same problem .

And also The ECU gets sometimes hot you cant hold your hand on top of it to much hot .

Sorry for the bother guys.

Mercedes MB

I think it could be the ECU , If someone can check my last post and give an advise please .

Thank you !

Lukeingame

i Have a E240 2003 W211 Had ESP fault multiple times. tried clearing code but came back,,, today i cleaned out the throttle head and the error didnt come back. the throttle pedal sensor was reading a fault and the dirt effected the throttle.

Mercedes MB

That would be something like this :


If you read my car is doing the following ,randomly when coming to a full stop tuning off or at small speeds like 5 - 10 km/h jerking . Like it is struggling. Was that the issue with your car ?

Mercedes MB

I found when my car now deletes the check engine light and works normal, as soon as I put the ac at high speed , the outside fan goes to high speed real quick and after 30 do 50 seconda car turns off shows the esp an all mistakes .

what the hell .

Mercedes MB

Hello , I have found something now just want to make sure if someone can assist , because from my side from others I got ton of theory information , but I need an conclusion .
Please see the picture now ;
On the STARTER , We have per the diagram two wires that go to the starter one Goes from Alternator positive , and one goes from the connector X26(1) I will attach the picture from the connector x26 , from that connector it goes to the Front Sam .

That wire on my side when I test it with continuity mode shows that is grounded , and it has also continuity with positive side . Now I got confused , I disconnected the Battery and the X26 connector so I have eliminated the front SAM when testing . And it still has connection with positive and ground on continuity mode .

Which to me is not ok , Some people here say it should be that way some people got confused to .



That purple wire has plus and minus on it at the same time , When battery is connected or not .


That is the connector on the starter side , and when I disconnected it it cuts of the Front SAM . Now per old and some of Starters I saw on the internet and physically , they get their ground trough their body . Now is this normal that this purple wire has plus and minus at same time , I think its now but Want to double check .

If anyone can assist I would appreciate it .

Thank you !

CaliBenzDriver

I think I can answer your question about:
"Both positive and negative in the same wire..."


Starter relay coil
Concider the starter circuit above circled in blue.

The purple line reaches the relay coil inside Starter M1 that is connected both to GND and the positive side of switched starter motor.
It's am weird custom coil with 3 connections... perhaps internally switched.

When open you read the voltage present on the other side of windings with no voltage drop because circuit is opened.

When closed you read the control voltage necessary to command the relay coil to close the circuit.

A lot of automotive controls are done by switching GND on a circuits connected to positive power side, usually 14v unless injectors.

CaliBenzDriver

Pls give us a fresh list of faults description in English with your diesel.

Is this random shut-off still current ?

Can you summarize the status and what was done to correct the issue ?

Hopefully we can further help you.

Mercedes MB

Hey thank you for helping me out regarding the alternator wire , It was definitely confusing a bit . But I'm learning , And I'm great-full for this , in some bad things there are good things to .
I will send you a list of the DTC's , Im working on two sides, my main job and on this car , but will send a full list , and I stumbled on this issue .
Like you see in the past the cars shuts itself randomly , I checked what I was able to check , I have even sent the car to an good electrician ,he didnt had that much time checked some stuf , and I gived him an ECU , I was able to get it from my friend very cheap , so just to eliminate that problem. Car has still the same issue just randomly cuts off ,after the ecu replace, if you are driving it goes off for a second and back on when the error accourss , when turned on in place or come to a stop it shuts off .

Now S-Prihadi helped a lot . See the picture attached ,and check the blue wire I circled and draw . That line is connecting ECU Alternator and Glow Plug , I have unplugged that wire from the alternator and I have unplugged the Glow plug module to - Car runs like a charm . No issues what so ever , I have my stable 14.00 Volts now , Like S-Prihadi said it would be . And cars runs completely normal now . I have the check engine light one tho . Now what is interesting . I have left the Lin wire from the alternator unplugged , and I have plugged in back the glow plug module . On its own after few restarts the car turns off the check engine light . But now after some driving it didn't shut itself off . It randomly turned the check engine light on and it felt like the car went to neutral in the gearbox , the rpms went to high , when I was driving I had to slow down , and then it was moving again . I had to stop by my cousin and he has only the Cheap Delphi diagnostic , I have read the faults , and besides the permanent alternator no communication error(because the lin wire is unplugged) , it showed the glow-plug error even if it was plugged in , and it showed mistake now on gearbox that the error accoured in 4 gear no communication error , and it showed the P200A The cylinder 1 charge shift valve has a fault .
I will again check the Z7/5Z1 connection and Z9, On the multi-meter continuity mode it has connection and is not shorted to ground . Will have to dig a bit deeper now . But at least I found what to unplug so the car has no issues or what soever .


The car had these main errors when those wires have been connected : The output relay of Circuit 87 open circuit or has a fault, Glow Plug has no communication , Sometimes it showed the Alternator no communication to . Now when disconnected only 2 errors which is normal No communication with alternator permanent and Glow plug no com .


Here is the picture bellow of that Lin line that I unplugged on both sides glow plug and Alternator .

CaliBenzDriver

okay, seems you are making progress with your diesel engine stop quitting randomly.

> LIN String:
Having the ALT LIN disconnected is a good practice against crazy ECU draining BATT. while driving.

The LIN line is now shared only with Starter, GlowPlug and ECU.
Which one is your bad-guy... starter or GP??

Mercedes MB

Short Update ,

I'm waiting for my friend to come back from another country he has a bidirectional scanner , I live in a small town that is why there is a pain in the *** to get to an good scanner , But I have ordered my Pico scope and eventually I will order an diagnostic tool to .

Now until he comes I played around a bit . I have again checked my Z9 Connection which connects the Alternator and Glow Plug module, It looks fine nothing that much suspicious has connection on both ends ,


Now that is the connections that connects ECU, ALTERNATOR , GLOWPLUG relay,

Now I tried few combinations , when the GP Is connected and the alternator is not , Sometimes it turns off the check engine and it doesn't shut off , but randomly it sometimes shows the check engine light , and messes up the gearbox communication ,

With the glow plug relay disconnected and the lin line to alternator connected it has the check engine light on all the time which is normal , but cars shtus off randomly , now this shows that something else is still messing up .

Then I checked the Z7/5z1 Connections , all look the same , but I was not able to see where all of those cables go on the WIS ASRA , Because on wis where I looked this particular model of car, it had some combinations on the z7/5z1 like red blue with red green cables , or on my model it showed that it goes only to one cable and from there the color to another then going straight to x26(1) Connector . But on my car I saw 6 all the same wires Red and green . Check on the picture .

Now I'm thinking if any of those wires is going to the throttle head, That is what I would check next when the Oscilloscope comes to check the chart.

S-Prihadi

Too bad I am blind on MB diesel engine and its ECM wiring, otherwise I might be able to contribute more.

All I can say is this :
ECM wiring schematic is full of options or contains other variant of the same engine too , which can have a slight different wiring.
You have to "clean" the schematic you are using to match the wiring on your car as per your option and in real time as per the wires on the engine...no fun job.

Coming across different wire colors is not a new thing for MB, I seen my actual wiring color is not the same as diagram.

Some colors I notice can be different in real wire vs diagram :
White, can be mistaken for pink or vice versa.
The green comes in many tone, as such sometimes I thought I am having a grey wire while diagram shows green.
Have I seen wire color which does not exist in my diagram for that particular pin connection.......YES, I have two wires having colors not matching the diagram of Front SAM N10/1.

Have I come across intermediate connector which diagram does not show ? Yes, there are 2 of such connectors for my Front SAM N10/1.

Any diagram is only as good as its accuracy.
So handle that priority first.

Good luck