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I think the current C-Suite at Mercedes and AMG has lost touch with their customers. Some signs of things crumbling and hopefully improving, is the recent resignation of the AMG CTO undoubtedly at least partly over the flop of putting a 4-cylinder PHEV powertrain in the new C63 and the resulting lack of sales. Tobias Moers the head of AMG at the time reportedly stormed out of the boardroom when this decision was made and resigned shortly after. He was probably the only one who saw this coming. MB and AMG have been pushing forward with developing cars that nobody asked for and nobody wants. EVs have seen some growth largely fueled by early adopters, but are now hitting a wall trying to enter the mass market. While some people continue to claim EVs are the future, I'm starting to think they are actually doomed, simply because they are incompatible with the majority of people's lifestyles. Cities where EVs would make a lot of sense don't and won't have the charging infrastructure any time soon or ever that would allow apartment dwellers to actually live with an EV. EVs are primarily bought by single family home owners in the boonies who can charge at home and commute into the cities for work. I suppose there's some good news to that as most of the traffic and pollution in cities is not caused by those who live in the city, but people living in the boring suburban sprawl with few local job opportunities having to commute to the cities to work.
Last edited by superswiss; 05-18-2024 at 06:56 PM.
2023 EQE 500 SUV electric and 2024 Jaguar F-PACE SVR 5.0L
One bad quarter of EV sales (just Q1 2024) and they give up. That's what I call commitment! If you look at the sales numbers the middle-tier EQE (sedan and SUV) actually sold quite well. So not surprisingly they decided to produce more Maybach EQSes. You can now get one with an expensive "night package" instead of the rear refrigerator though. I'm sure my chauffeur will appreciate that.
I recall comparing it to a 2006 Honda Civic when the EQS sedan launched. Two years later, it’s grown on me, and I found myself leasing one in March for a “rock bottom” deal since no one wants them. Drives well, feels solid, iPad on wheels, but I realize she’s not been voted the prettiest at the prom. Let’s see how it evolves…but I’m enjoying the German engineering and first effort from a heritage brand.
I think the current C-Suite at Mercedes and AMG has lost touch with their customers. Some signs of things crumbling and hopefully improving, is the recent resignation of the AMG CTO undoubtedly at least partly over the flop of putting a 4-cylinder PHEV powertrain in the new C63 and the resulting lack of sales. Tobias Moers the head of AMG at the time reportedly stormed out of the boardroom when this decision was made and resigned shortly after. He was probably the only one who saw this coming. MB and AMG have been pushing forward with developing cars that nobody asked for and nobody wants. EVs have seen some growth largely fueled by early adopters, but are now hitting a wall trying to enter the mass market. While some people continue to claim EVs are the future, I'm starting to think they are actually doomed, simply because they are incompatible with the majority of people's lifestyles. Cities where EVs would make a lot of sense don't and won't have the charging infrastructure any time soon or ever that would allow apartment dwellers to actually live with an EV. EVs are primarily bought by single family home owners in the boonies who can charge at home and commute into the cities for work. I suppose there's some good news to that as most of the traffic and pollution in cities is not caused by those who live in the city, but people living in the boring suburban sprawl with few local job opportunities having to commute to the cities to work.
I mostly agree with you.
However, I with literally hundreds of 2023 EQS SUVs sitting unsold in tiny Canada, we can now get one at such significant discounts, it makes sense in many ways. Also, I can recharge the battery for $5, vs $200 to fill the tank of a similar gas powered Mercedes for similar range. Think about that!
I am smart enough to know that EVs are not "greener" than IEC cars; but it's good to have choice and there are some technical advantages. And if it costs 40X less to run, I'm definitely interested.
I mostly agree with you.
However, I with literally hundreds of 2023 EQS SUVs sitting unsold in tiny Canada, we can now get one at such significant discounts, it makes sense in many ways. Also, I can recharge the battery for $5, vs $200 to fill the tank of a similar gas powered Mercedes for similar range. Think about that!
I am smart enough to know that EVs are not "greener" than IEC cars; but it's good to have choice and there are some technical advantages. And if it costs 40X less to run, I'm definitely interested.
Makes sense sure, but I have to want the car and enjoy having the car as a car guy...and I just have zero desire to drive an EQS or any other EQ vehicle.
Makes sense sure, but I have to want the car and enjoy having the car as a car guy...and I just have zero desire to drive an EQS or any other EQ vehicle.
Its not EVs, lots of EVs I would choose.
Yeah, they are better than anything from Tesla, but they are not enthusiast cars. The EQS is for long distance (but not too long!) drives to your cottage, or for in city commutes.
Yeah, they are better than anything from Tesla, but they are not enthusiast cars. The EQS is for long distance (but not too long!) drives to your cottage, or for in city commutes.
I'd rather have an S Class for that use...or in an EV an i7.
Has nothing to do with the drive of the EQS, they drive great...my issue with it is the styling and the interior finishes
I mostly agree with you.
However, I with literally hundreds of 2023 EQS SUVs sitting unsold in tiny Canada, we can now get one at such significant discounts, it makes sense in many ways. Also, I can recharge the battery for $5, vs $200 to fill the tank of a similar gas powered Mercedes for similar range. Think about that!
I am smart enough to know that EVs are not "greener" than IEC cars; but it's good to have choice and there are some technical advantages. And if it costs 40X less to run, I'm definitely interested.
Yes, you can undoubtedly get a great lease deal on these, which will also protect you from the insane depreciation. But while we are talking about running costs, let's also mention that insurance costs are higher for EVs and given the weight and instant torque you might need to factor in at least one set of new tires during a lease, which you may not need to with a lighter ICE. Personally I've never bought a car based on the running costs. It's just not something that matters for me and I have a feeling that the typical Mercedes buyer isn't all that concerned about fuel costs. $200 is about what I pay in fuel costs for our two cars combined in a month. I'm just not car dependent like many are in North America, so most days I don't even drive and when I do drive I want it to be an experience and not tool around silently w/o any emotion. I've always said, EVs can make a lot of sense for the poor souls that subject themselves to hours long commutes every day, but EVs are not gonna solve what is the insanity of commuter traffic in North America.
Last edited by superswiss; 05-18-2024 at 09:22 PM.
Yes, you can undoubtedly get a great lease deal on these, which will also protect you from the insane depreciation. But while we are talking about running costs, let's also mention that insurance costs are higher for EVs and given the weight and instant torque you might need to factor in at least one set of new tires during a lease, which you may not need to with a lighter ICE. Personally I've never bought a car based on the running costs. It's just not something that matters for me and I have a feeling that the typical Mercedes buyer isn't all that concerned about fuel costs. $200 is about what I pay in fuel costs for our two cars combined in a month. I'm just not car dependent like many are in North America, so most days I don't even drive and when I do drive I want it to be an experience and not tool around silently w/o any emotion. I've always said, EVs can make a lot of sense for the poor souls that subject themselves to hours long commutes every day.
Those running costs are nothing compared to the fuel savings. Absolute drop in the bucket.
I pay $350-$400 a month just to fuel the S560. Since we have replaced the Pacifica with the PHEV Pacifica my fuel cost on that went from one tank every 2 weeks to one tank every 2-3 months. Remember too no oil changes, no expensive services...an EV is much cheaper to run.
The running costs wouldn't make the decision for me but they are a nice bonus. I like EVs because of the smooth and silent driving experience and the fun power.
I think MB made the mistake to set the expectation that the EQS was the EV of S class. It is not.It should never have been, and it should never will be.
I think MB made the mistake to set the expectation that the EQS was the EV of S class. It is not.It should never have been, and it should never will be.
They should make an EV S Class, I would buy it today.
Those running costs are nothing compared to the fuel savings. Absolute drop in the bucket.
I pay $350-$400 a month just to fuel the S560. Since we have replaced the Pacifica with the PHEV Pacifica my fuel cost on that went from one tank every 2 weeks to one tank every 2-3 months. Remember too no oil changes, no expensive services...an EV is much cheaper to run.
The running costs wouldn't make the decision for me but they are a nice bonus. I like EVs because of the smooth and silent driving experience and the fun power.
The problem here is really not the cost of the fuel, but the time wasted commuting in the first place. How many hours do you commute per day/week? What's that costing you in lost time? As a consultant, 2 hours in commuter traffic costs me more in lost billing than what you pay in fuel per month. Most people don't even realize what their commute costs them on top of the raw fuel costs. Time is money. The operating costs as a whole are a drop in the bucket.
The problem here is really not the cost of the fuel, but the time wasted commuting in the first place. How many hours do you commute per day/week? What's that costing you in lost time? As a consultant, 2 hours in commuter traffic costs me more in lost billing than what you pay in fuel per month. Most people don't even realize what their commute costs them on top of the raw fuel costs. Time is money. The operating costs as a whole are a drop in the bucket.
It depends on what you do for a living. My commute to my office is short, it’s about 15 minutes. But I drive around from location to location as a part of my work.
Nothing you’re saying about cost of commuting has anything to do with the fact that it is much cheaper to operate an EV.
[QUOTE=SW20S;8972694]I just have zero desire to drive an EQS or any other EQ vehicle./QUOTE]
Then I'm curious: Why are you reading/posting in this forum?
(You have to hand it to the oil companies. They've done a remarkably good job poisoning the well with a flood of anti-EV propaganda in recent months.)
The article is salacious w/ MB seemingly having misjudged what their customers want. But as I've mentioned here before, we are arguing about the most first of first world problems here. S Class vs. EQS class comfort is strictly personal opinion and variable--one size fits all declarative statements are worthless. The EQS is super fast, super quiet, very comfortable (my opinion), and gets great range for the market. My opinion is it is the most amazing car I've ever had (had dozens), and it is a long term keeper for me because I will not care about an extra 15 miles of range or a tweak of the front grill. The residual value is a bummer only if you sell.
Regarding jelly bean shape....do people still look at other people's cars and judge them for it? Back in the early 1990's, I drove a red Porsche 944S in Milwaukee. It got attention everywhere I went, and it was relatively rare to have such a car. Over time, in my experience, people seem to care less and less about what other people drive. Social classes are increasingly isolated from each other. Everyone I know drives a MB, BMW, Lexus, etc. Having a fancy car is just table stakes, and no big deal.
And as per usual jackwagon posting: I think you kids call it trolling.
Originally Posted by SW20S
Those running costs are nothing compared to the fuel savings. Absolute drop in the bucket.
I pay $350-$400 a month just to fuel the S560. Since we have replaced the Pacifica with the PHEV Pacifica my fuel cost on that went from one tank every 2 weeks to one tank every 2-3 months. Remember too no oil changes, no expensive services...an EV is much cheaper to run.
The running costs wouldn't make the decision for me but they are a nice bonus. I like EVs because of the smooth and silent driving experience and the fun power.
And then: [QUOTE=SW20S;8972694]I just have zero desire to drive an EQS or any other EQ vehicle./QUOTE] Then I'm curious: Why are you reading/posting in this forum?
PFL205.064 with M276.823 (Oil pump solenoid defeated)
Originally Posted by Surge
I mostly agree with you.
However, I with literally hundreds of 2023 EQS SUVs sitting unsold in tiny Canada, we can now get one at such significant discounts, it makes sense in many ways. Also, I can recharge the battery for $5, vs $200 to fill the tank of a similar gas powered Mercedes for similar range. Think about that!
I am smart enough to know that EVs are not "greener" than IEC cars; but it's good to have choice and there are some technical advantages. And if it costs 40X less to run, I'm definitely interested.
Well, the carbon tax increase and the other taxes on top of the taxes we pay as Canadians doesn't help either, I agree.
Edit: MB Canada has been holding strong on the EQS and EQE prices for a long time even after MBUSA started having crazy lease deals, if what you said is true MB Canada finally started offering lease deals on the EQ series, that might explain why I started seeing them more on the road in the GTA.
Last edited by W205C43PFL; 05-19-2024 at 08:38 AM.
Then I'm curious: Why are you reading/posting in this forum?
(You have to hand it to the oil companies. They've done a remarkably good job poisoning the well with a flood of anti-EV propaganda in recent months.)
I am very interested in EVs, MB has great EV technology. My dislike for the EQ models has nothing to do with the EV powertrains or EVs, I just don't like the styling and thats not exactly an unpopular opinion...thats why MB is changing their approach entirely. I don't post regularly in this forum, only when there is a topic that interests me.
[QUOTE=hyperion667;8972825]And as per usual jackwagon posting: I think you kids call it trolling.
Originally Posted by SW20S
Those running costs are nothing compared to the fuel savings. Absolute drop in the bucket.
I pay $350-$400 a month just to fuel the S560. Since we have replaced the Pacifica with the PHEV Pacifica my fuel cost on that went from one tank every 2 weeks to one tank every 2-3 months. Remember too no oil changes, no expensive services...an EV is much cheaper to run.
The running costs wouldn't make the decision for me but they are a nice bonus. I like EVs because of the smooth and silent driving experience and the fun power.
And then:
Originally Posted by SW20S
I just have zero desire to drive an EQS or any other EQ vehicle./QUOTE]
Originally Posted by SW20S
Then I'm curious: Why are you reading/posting in this forum?
He just wants to make sure it's clear he would never be caught dead in an EQS
He just wants to make sure it's clear he would never be caught dead in an EQS
I think I've made that clear lol...clearly I'm not alone. Looking forward to the next generation of MB EVs and hopefully they will be more appealing to the masses like me.
05-18-2024, 06:26 PM
