Who's copying who?
#26
Guest
Posts: n/a
Originally posted by I was framed.
Actually he has a point... I'm sure everyone has heard the saying "quality over quantity." What I think is that MB is now concentrating more on quantity and abandoning their quality roots. I remember way back when dinosaurs walked the earth, MB's were like the boss on the road. Nowadays they're only depending on the name of the brand to be boss and they're lossing the boss position.
A close friend of mine had a 199x(3?) C230 (220 or 230?) and the engine flat out failed in December. He also has a LS400 that was bought at the same time as the C230 and that car is as solid as the first day.
Actually he has a point... I'm sure everyone has heard the saying "quality over quantity." What I think is that MB is now concentrating more on quantity and abandoning their quality roots. I remember way back when dinosaurs walked the earth, MB's were like the boss on the road. Nowadays they're only depending on the name of the brand to be boss and they're lossing the boss position.
A close friend of mine had a 199x(3?) C230 (220 or 230?) and the engine flat out failed in December. He also has a LS400 that was bought at the same time as the C230 and that car is as solid as the first day.
If you want to say MB has reliablility and quality issues, then it stems from the CL to the SL, the S all the way down to the hatchback coupe. Its not just the C class.
Infact it seems like the New E class is having ALOT more problems then C class owners.
Besides the C Sedan has been out for a long time since the late eighties. Its nothing new. If you are talking about the Hatchback then I somewhat agree Aesthetically cheapening the brand IMO.
Last edited by Guest0001; 01-21-2004 at 01:53 AM.
#27
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2000 W210 E55->2003 R230 SL500->2004 W211 E55->2007 997TT+2007 E63->2010 GLK350->2012 E550 4matic
Agree
Originally posted by Noble C320
The problems are not just rooted in the C class! Saying that is just ignorant (I am not saying you are but that Moron Gekko.)
The problems are not just rooted in the C class! Saying that is just ignorant (I am not saying you are but that Moron Gekko.)
What a moron indeed.
#28
Senior Member
Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 397
Likes: 0
From: Toronto, Ontario Canada
2002 C240 Classic - Orion Blue Beast!!
Originally posted by Gekko
Mercedes should have never came out with the C-Class. It de-valued and cheapened the brand for two reasons. One, it took MB's reputation for poor quality to a whole new depth. Two, and most importantly, the cheap price allowed a large group of poor, juvenile wannabes that are concerned with displaying a perceived but false "status", access to and the continued degradation of a *ONCE* great and exclusive brand. You know what the "C" stands for, don't you? "Cheap".
Mercedes should have never came out with the C-Class. It de-valued and cheapened the brand for two reasons. One, it took MB's reputation for poor quality to a whole new depth. Two, and most importantly, the cheap price allowed a large group of poor, juvenile wannabes that are concerned with displaying a perceived but false "status", access to and the continued degradation of a *ONCE* great and exclusive brand. You know what the "C" stands for, don't you? "Cheap".
MB's problems have nothing to do with the C class, or any other class in particular. It has to do with MB's focus, philosophy and direction. MB needs to spend less $$$ on technology and more on QA. They need to be more diligent when evaluating parts suppliers. Gawd knows they have failed us in this regard.
I have no problem with Lexus. They are a smart company which builds reliable cars. I'm not a fan of thier styling, and that's one thing that's stopped me from buying one. The idea of paying premium $$ for a rebadged Toyota is another.
Enjoy your car my friend, and let us enjoy ours.
#34
hey noble,
i'm curious because he's been bashing MB's pretty hard.
one thing is for sure.....i would take a C class over and ES
any day of the week. the C is a very attractive vehicle that
exudes style and class. ES on the other hand....looks like
a used bar of soap.....but .....jdpowers says it's the most
reliable blah blah blah
i'm curious because he's been bashing MB's pretty hard.
one thing is for sure.....i would take a C class over and ES
any day of the week. the C is a very attractive vehicle that
exudes style and class. ES on the other hand....looks like
a used bar of soap.....but .....jdpowers says it's the most
reliable blah blah blah
#35
Guest
Posts: n/a
Originally posted by S55inPA
hey noble,
i'm curious because he's been bashing MB's pretty hard.
one thing is for sure.....i would take a C class over and ES
any day of the week. the C is a very attractive vehicle that
exudes style and class. ES on the other hand....looks like
a used bar of soap.....but .....jdpowers says it's the most
reliable blah blah blah
hey noble,
i'm curious because he's been bashing MB's pretty hard.
one thing is for sure.....i would take a C class over and ES
any day of the week. the C is a very attractive vehicle that
exudes style and class. ES on the other hand....looks like
a used bar of soap.....but .....jdpowers says it's the most
reliable blah blah blah
ES is the worst looking of the lexus line up. Even Lexus drivers admit its a disgrace to the brand.
I don't care what JD Powers say. For God sakes they rated Jaguar the most POS company in the world higher than MB. But then again I assuming people who buy a Jag do not have high expectations LOL!!. JD Powers is an absolutely useless, subjective survey.
#36
noble,
even if MB was number 1 in jdpowers eyes i would only buy a MB if it was attractive and had the features i was looking for(safety, power, technology etc). i still can't understand why people who truly love cars would let a survey dictate what they drive. i could understand if a soccer mom used that kind of information but not anyone who was truly excited about cars. and what really makes me laugh is that because MB isn't number 1 in jdpowers surveys fans of other brands like to portray MB's as being junk that is just a plain whacked and delusional
even if MB was number 1 in jdpowers eyes i would only buy a MB if it was attractive and had the features i was looking for(safety, power, technology etc). i still can't understand why people who truly love cars would let a survey dictate what they drive. i could understand if a soccer mom used that kind of information but not anyone who was truly excited about cars. and what really makes me laugh is that because MB isn't number 1 in jdpowers surveys fans of other brands like to portray MB's as being junk that is just a plain whacked and delusional
#37
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 1,425
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2000 W210 E55->2003 R230 SL500->2004 W211 E55->2007 997TT+2007 E63->2010 GLK350->2012 E550 4matic
ES300
Originally posted by Noble C320
Yeah he has an inferiority complex. poor guy.
ES is the worst looking of the lexus line up. Even Lexus drivers admit its a disgrace to the brand.
Yeah he has an inferiority complex. poor guy.
ES is the worst looking of the lexus line up. Even Lexus drivers admit its a disgrace to the brand.
I guess the only reason I would go for the ES is the ML stereo?
#38
Hey guys, don't be so harsh on the guy. By calling him an idiot, how much more mature does that make you? Name calling doesn't make you any smarter...
Anyways, I agree that the ES is ugly. I got it as a loaner when my GS was in for its 30k tune up. I was surprised though. The interior was top notch, ride quality was excellent, and I was thoroughly satisfied with it.
Noble320: I wouldn't call it a disgrace to the brand. It might be the ugliest (I agree with you guys ) but it does hold up the values of Lexus quite well.
I don't get what's with the bashing on Lexus here. What's up with that?
Anyways, I agree that the ES is ugly. I got it as a loaner when my GS was in for its 30k tune up. I was surprised though. The interior was top notch, ride quality was excellent, and I was thoroughly satisfied with it.
Noble320: I wouldn't call it a disgrace to the brand. It might be the ugliest (I agree with you guys ) but it does hold up the values of Lexus quite well.
I don't get what's with the bashing on Lexus here. What's up with that?
#39
Guest
Posts: n/a
Originally posted by I was framed.
Hey guys, don't be so harsh on the guy. By calling him an idiot
I don't get what's with the bashing on Lexus here. What's up
with that?
Hey guys, don't be so harsh on the guy. By calling him an idiot
I don't get what's with the bashing on Lexus here. What's up
with that?
#40
Originally posted by Noble C320
Have you read this thread fully? If you did you would understand why. The man set himself up. If he is going to come here and splurt out BS I will **** on him.
Have you read this thread fully? If you did you would understand why. The man set himself up. If he is going to come here and splurt out BS I will **** on him.
#41
hey guys,
I was framed......you completely missed the point about that thread. the main reason i started the "banned at club lexus" thread was...not to discuss whether MB's are better than Lexus or vice versa. it is a thread that was created mainly to point out how unfairly i was treated for having an opposing view. remember...i was banned from that website for just having an opinionn contrary to that of most club lexus members. it seemed from what the moderator had sent to me in an email ... a bunch of club lexus members were emailing him complaining about my posts.
as far as i know .....nobody is complaining to any moderators about Gekko's posts. nobody is trying to ban him. his opinion is not being silenced. he's free to keep posting and engage other MBworld members. it seems to me that he has an opinion contrary to that of most MBworld posters and he should be imho allowed to post that opinion.
in this current thread it easy to see that MBworld is a much more open and accepting forum for differing opions.
I was framed......you completely missed the point about that thread. the main reason i started the "banned at club lexus" thread was...not to discuss whether MB's are better than Lexus or vice versa. it is a thread that was created mainly to point out how unfairly i was treated for having an opposing view. remember...i was banned from that website for just having an opinionn contrary to that of most club lexus members. it seemed from what the moderator had sent to me in an email ... a bunch of club lexus members were emailing him complaining about my posts.
as far as i know .....nobody is complaining to any moderators about Gekko's posts. nobody is trying to ban him. his opinion is not being silenced. he's free to keep posting and engage other MBworld members. it seems to me that he has an opinion contrary to that of most MBworld posters and he should be imho allowed to post that opinion.
in this current thread it easy to see that MBworld is a much more open and accepting forum for differing opions.
#43
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Joined: Nov 2001
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2000 W210 E55->2003 R230 SL500->2004 W211 E55->2007 997TT+2007 E63->2010 GLK350->2012 E550 4matic
20 years later...
Originally posted by S55inPA
hey guys,
I was framed......you completely missed the point about that thread. the main reason i started the "banned at club lexus" thread was...not to discuss whether MB's are better than Lexus or vice versa. it is a thread that was created mainly to point out how unfairly i was treated for having an opposing view.
hey guys,
I was framed......you completely missed the point about that thread. the main reason i started the "banned at club lexus" thread was...not to discuss whether MB's are better than Lexus or vice versa. it is a thread that was created mainly to point out how unfairly i was treated for having an opposing view.
I would stay way from any community where the 'big brothers' like to play God and silence opposing views. Citizens acting as police secretly reporting to the authority.. 'Self-proclaimed higher counsel members' underhandedly deciding to have the unpopular man eliminated?!
Too Orwellian for my taste.
#44
Ok guys, it's obvious that this guy is just trolling the forum, trying to rile people up. The best way to combat a troll is to ignore it and let it die. Stop feeding that sissy's posts.
I knew she was a troll the minute I saw all those cross posts basically saying the same thing. Just let the thread die and don't respond to that idiot anymore.
I knew she was a troll the minute I saw all those cross posts basically saying the same thing. Just let the thread die and don't respond to that idiot anymore.
#45
Originally posted by tifosiv122
WoW! How dumb are you?
TOYOTA OWNS AND DESIGNS LEXUS
MERCEDES OWNS CHRYSLER, NOT THE OTHER WAY AROUND!
You don't see a Chrysler designed Mercedes do you?
If you drive a Lexus ES it's just a fancy Camary that you paid more for...
Erik
WoW! How dumb are you?
TOYOTA OWNS AND DESIGNS LEXUS
MERCEDES OWNS CHRYSLER, NOT THE OTHER WAY AROUND!
You don't see a Chrysler designed Mercedes do you?
If you drive a Lexus ES it's just a fancy Camary that you paid more for...
Erik
#46
Senior Member
Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 397
Likes: 0
From: Toronto, Ontario Canada
2002 C240 Classic - Orion Blue Beast!!
Originally posted by deuce zer0
Have you not seen a dramatic downfall in MB products in the past years? Do you also actually think that when they bought chrysler that they didnt incorprate anything into the manufactoring of the mercedes from the chrystler corporation? As for what i am driving right now, its just a beautiful rebadged chrysler that wont stay out of the shop. And as far as the new CLS comming out, if i am not mistaken it was designed by someone who they got from Hyundai.
Have you not seen a dramatic downfall in MB products in the past years? Do you also actually think that when they bought chrysler that they didnt incorprate anything into the manufactoring of the mercedes from the chrystler corporation? As for what i am driving right now, its just a beautiful rebadged chrysler that wont stay out of the shop. And as far as the new CLS comming out, if i am not mistaken it was designed by someone who they got from Hyundai.
Who cares who designed the CLS? So what if he was from huyndai. Designers move around all the time. They never stay with the same company that long. All that matters is that they stay within the appproved design theme. Remember, the MB higher ups have final say over a design, not the designer.
Unless MB pulls a BMW then we won't be seeing bangled cars in their lineup.
#48
Originally posted by S55inPA
[Bit seems to me that he has an opinion contrary to that of most MBworld posters and he should be imho allowed to post that opinion. [/B]
[Bit seems to me that he has an opinion contrary to that of most MBworld posters and he should be imho allowed to post that opinion. [/B]
My take on the parts subject is that MB is simply not taking the time to put together their cars together with as much care and quality as they did in the past. Correct me if I'm wrong, but aren't MOST parts constructed equally? Putting aside the specially made AMG or M components I think car parts are pretty much equal. I don't think Lexus components are manufactured any differently than the MB components. I think it has more to do with the mentality of the automaker of the vehicle.
If MB focused more on quality and achieved the quality we would expect instead of returning to the dealer ever other week, I would without a doubt and without any hesitation put down my order for the E55 that I've been dreaming about.
#50
>"Lexus is a copier not an innovator. everything that is in a Lexus can be had 2 to 3 years earlier in a German car. sometimes 5 or more years earlier."
For the record, the US patent and trade market office shows 8,060 issued patents assigned to Toyota. There are 2,227 assigned to Daimler Benz.
For the record, the US patent and trade market office shows 8,060 issued patents assigned to Toyota. There are 2,227 assigned to Daimler Benz.