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What happens if something breaks while car is at dealership?
How does your dealership handles things if something breaks while the car is at their place?
In my case:
Car had issues with engine shutting of while driving (see here: https://mbworld.org/forums/gl-class-...ssor-dies.html ). Later, at the dealership the car wouldn't start at all.
Dealership changed the ignition switch and than the front fuse box. Problem seems solved. (I even suspect the ignition switch wasn't the problem, only the front fuse box was the issue - but cannot prove it).
BUT: They say, also my key broke while it was at their place (second key still works). But they say: It's just old (2008 GL550) and won't take any responsibility for it.
Is there any chance to get them paying for the broken key?
I mean: How likely is it that key, ignition switch, fuse box all randomly break at the same time?
This is a conversation between you and the service manager with the option to escalate to the dealership GM.
If you strongly believe you’re correct, present the data and if they don’t goodwill you a new key; the nuclear option would be to take them to small claims court (in the US).
Not sure how the legal scenario plays out under the crown up there.
This is a conversation between you and the service manager with the option to escalate to the dealership GM.
If you strongly believe you’re correct, present the data and if they don’t goodwill you a new key; the nuclear option would be to take them to small claims court (in the US).
Not sure how the legal scenario plays out under the crown up there.
Well, there is not much data to present... the key (which never made any problems before) broke while it was at their place. Was it because of their wrongdoing - who knows?
Was just wondering if there is like a general MB policy (or experience from other clients) how dealerships handle things that break on their watch...
I would even guess that they might even have an insurance for this kind of stuff - does anybody know?
Some people say there is no such thing as a coincidence, but it's not unusual for something old to break while it's being worked on, and that's not really the fault of the dealership. Hard to argue that the fob wasn't on its last leg after this many years and fumbling around with it just may have given it the death knell. For example last weekend I did some clean up around my home theater and unplugged my front speaker towers which have built-in powered subs. After I put everything back together and plugged the speakers back in, one of them had a persistent hum. Turns out it's a known issue with these speakers over time. Mine are 10 years old now, and the simple act of unplugging them and plugging them in killed the amp in one of the speakers. So now I have to decide if I wanna replace the capacitors that are known to fail, or just get new speakers. Stuff wears out over time. They may have replaced the battery to see if the problem is with the fob, but taking it out may have broken something that had gotten weak over the years and may have happened to you next time you needed to replace the battery. You can try to take it apart and clean it. It may just be corrosion on some of the contacts, or maybe the battery was leaking.
the key (which never made any problems before) broke while it was at their place.
I hear where you're coming from and understand why you're asking. But if you think about it... ALL things work great until they break. This just happened to happen while someone else had the car. I'm sure they weren't playing baseball with it, or anything like that! So, no, one would not expect them to pay for it - although maybe if you're nice about it, they'll discount it for you?
As far as the ignition switch and fuse box thing... I don't know about you, but these techs know much more than me so I wouldn't second guess them based on a "feeling" when they're doing actual diagnosing. PLUS, it's possible they narrowed it down to those two things and it was actually cheaper to replace both right away than replace one... test things out... find out the first thing was good... then replace the second thing and put the first, old part back in. In other words, they may have actually been doing you a favor. Or... maybe both things were, in fact, bad.
Seppone: Your description doesn't include much information to link the breakage to the dealership. Perhaps you just didn't mention it, or I have missed it. Did the key suffer physical damage while there? (Cracks, scratches, dents, abuse, etc) Does it look like it was dropped or taken apart etc? Did a tech say "Sorry we dropped it, now it won't work so we need your backup...?"
If you have no evidence other than 'It was there' then it sounds like a weak case.
Maybe don't stress about it too much... Do you have a friend who is good with electronics? Maybe they could take a look at it for you. Perhaps you just have a dirty or loose connection inside the remote that could be fixed for nearly free.
Just as one simple diagnostic idea: when you push the unlock button on your "broken" remote, do you see the red light flash? Would be interesting to know if its getting power... (thats usually question one in my mind)
Last edited by justin3219; 08-30-2021 at 12:12 AM.
Yeah, the keys, the keys...
Unfortunately, they break enough that a New key is often used as part of diagnostics.
Basically, if you could spend 3 hours/whatever on a more involved test Without having first retrying with a Known Good key (and to the dealership that means a New Key), than they figure it's less risk to go ahead and get another key, than go down a longer/more costly diagnostic path. Here the labor rate is no Doubt a factor in their decision-making. They want to be sure, and they Don't want it coming back afterword.
(Devil's advocate hat coms Off)
Having said all that, my local dealership has an unpublished policy: "Either 1) the factory pays for it, or 2) the customer pays for it. We don't pay for ****!"
In all likelihood, your dealership is doing a combination of these, or lies somewhere in the middle.
For the time and stress, and the $350 for a new key that you've now paid for - the question is what to do?
If nothing else, you could put it in a drawer at the opposite end of your house from the garage, and change the battery every 3 or 4 years. And hand it to them with the car the next time you go there.
And only ever else get it out, for diagnostic purposes. And don't drop your other ones.
Welcome to the Mercedes way.
P.S. My wife now drives a new Kia, and when I asked them about The Key, they said theirs cost about the same to get get a replacement.
Hopefully that helps
Yeah, the keys, the keys...
Unfortunately, they break enough that a New key is often used as part of diagnostics.
Basically, if you could spend 3 hours/whatever on a more involved test Without having first retrying with a Known Good key (and to the dealership that means a New Key), than they figure it's less risk to go ahead and get another key, than go down a longer/more costly diagnostic path. Here the labor rate is no Doubt a factor in their decision-making. They want to be sure, and they Don't want it coming back afterword.
(Devil's advocate hat coms Off)
Having said all that, my local dealership has an unpublished policy: "Either 1) the factory pays for it, or 2) the customer pays for it. We don't pay for ****!"
In all likelihood, your dealership is doing a combination of these, or lies somewhere in the middle.
For the time and stress, and the $350 for a new key that you've now paid for - the question is what to do?
If nothing else, you could put it in a drawer at the opposite end of your house from the garage, and change the battery every 3 or 4 years. And hand it to them with the car the next time you go there.
And only ever else get it out, for diagnostic purposes. And don't drop your other ones.
Welcome to the Mercedes way.
P.S. My wife now drives a new Kia, and when I asked them about The Key, they said theirs cost about the same to get get a replacement.
Hopefully that helps
The point is that we are here talking about a C$1,500 key (USD 1,200) ...
I hear where you're coming from and understand why you're asking. But if you think about it... ALL things work great until they break. This just happened to happen while someone else had the car. I'm sure they weren't playing baseball with it, or anything like that! So, no, one would not expect them to pay for it - although maybe if you're nice about it, they'll discount it for you?
As far as the ignition switch and fuse box thing... I don't know about you, but these techs know much more than me so I wouldn't second guess them based on a "feeling" when they're doing actual diagnosing. PLUS, it's possible they narrowed it down to those two things and it was actually cheaper to replace both right away than replace one... test things out... find out the first thing was good... then replace the second thing and put the first, old part back in. In other words, they may have actually been doing you a favor. Or... maybe both things were, in fact, bad.
Well, I have experience with older cars of different brands and know some stuff about probability & coincidence. So it's not just a feeling. And I never had anything like this...
The point is that we are here talking about a C$1,500 key (USD 1,200) ...
Wow. I mean, just wow. Sue them. Do it. Sorry, but that's total B.S.
To be clear and please don't misunderstand me-
Wild horses couldn't drag me (, Nor my car) to my local dealership. They are just-that-crooked. That's my personal experience talking.
But I can't believe the cojones on your service writer. They must be under the impression you wipe your you know what, with money.
Figure out whatever recourse is available to you, given your local laws
You need to make it hurt, for them as well. If all you get for $1200 is a key you must have some recourse..
Sorry, I had no idea / assumed your cost was more in line with mine.
Last edited by B34chBum; 08-30-2021 at 11:05 PM.
Reason: spelling
Okay, 2 doubles of scotch talking, in my previous posts.
They're still talking, but not so loudly I hope.
Reality check - $1500 CAD got you a new key, but Only a new key?
I'm thinking $1500 might just be going rate for the EIS in your neck of the woods (EIS is the module in the dash your key fits into).
But for only a key, that's not petit theft, it's grand larceny.
Okay, 2 doubles of scotch talking, in my previous posts.
They're still talking, but not so loudly I hope.
Reality check - $1500 CAD got you a new key, but Only a new key?
I'm thinking $1500 might just be going rate for the EIS in your neck of the woods (EIS is the module in the dash your key fits into).
But for only a key, that's not petit theft, it's grand larceny.
Yep, it's just the key and only includes the programming of the key which is obviously mandatory. The EIS has already been changed...
Well, I have experience with older cars of different brands and know some stuff about probability & coincidence. So it's not just a feeling. And I never had anything like this...
With working on older cars, I am sure you didn't! For example, the entertainment system is connected together with some type of fiber optics. There are TONS of sensors on newer cars. Many systems are VERY voltage sensitive. Comparing older cars to newer cars isn't really valid - yes, the whole suck, bang, blow principle still holds true... but there's a WHOLE lot more going on. If you go back and read my post, the point was more about how they could very well have been trying to SAVE you money.
@Seppone do you have an update on what happened with this? Did you just eat it, sue them, or they discount it?
They did not move a bit. But I continue to put pressure on them, and if I have to go up to the Mercedes headquarters in Stuttgart, I will do it.
But it's really so embarrassing for Mercedes and damaging the brand so badly: I mean, you break someone else's stuff - what do you do?
They did not move a bit. But I continue to put pressure on them, and if I have to go up to the Mercedes headquarters in Stuttgart, I will do it.
If you’re applying this “pressure” on a individual basis, forget about it.
The key to any possibility of success is a full nuclear response on every social and review site to include a scathing review on Google, BBB, and use Hashtags that are likely to to be seen by social media managers in Stuttgart. You will have to be the equivalent of the guy who stands out front of a business they’re protesting, but on a massive, concerted, persistent online basis. Your effort will have to be like an ad campaign, not just a one off.
So if you’re not ready to go all out, don’t bother. As others have more eloquently put it:
Originally Posted by Max Blast
“Admit nothing, deny everything, make counter-accusations.”
Originally Posted by B34chBum
"Either 1) the factory pays for it, or 2) the customer pays for it. We don't pay for ****!"
I still think youre going to be hard pressed to prove that anything was their fault. As we kind of talked about above, things do break at weird times, sometimes. For example, if you grabbed your keys one morning and the key fob didn't work, would you blame yourself? It worked the night before but the next morning it didn't. It was just "it's time" - everything works fine until it doesn't. This just happened to happen while the dealer had it.
Could a tech have been a little rough with it by tossing it on a desk to the service manager? That's reasonable to think so - although that's really just guessing so still no evidence. While you may want to "think" that they are at fault to avoid the cost... what evidience do you have to prove it? You're saying that "they broke it" - but if you want to try and pursue it, you have to have some evidence - not just a "feeling" or a "want". Just arbitrarily saying it doesn't make it fact.
Besides, if that "toss" caused it to malfunction, it just means it was about ready to malfunction and would have happened anyways - but while in your possession.
I think you're better course of action is discuss the amount that a new fob costs - although I don't think you ever confirmed with us whether there was more to it, or not. However, if you've been pushy with the "broken" issue, you may have burned that bridge.
As I mentioned earlier - I do get it. It sucks to get your vehicle back only to find out something else is wrong. But I'm in a similar business and I can tell you, for a fact, that it does sometimes happen that way. It's just the way the cookie crumbles sometimes.
Only one thing matters: the font 9 small print T's and C's on the (back of the) Work Order Agreement.
The vast majority of customers do not read what they sign. But in the US, that service/work order agreement spells out your rights and limitations. Don't know about Canada.
READ IT!
To make matters worse, all dealers in the US have gone to an Arbitration clause ... you cannot even take them to court.
I have been known to cross out sections in the various clauses I don't agree with. The average Service Advisor does not have a clue what I just did ... or I add my own terms on the face of it, depending on what needs to be done.
The point is that we are here talking about a C$1,500 key (USD 1,200) ...
Wait a second.... 1,500.00 Canadian for a key?! You're getting taken to the proverbial "Cleaners"! A new, programmed key for these vehicles should not cost anymore than $250.00 to $300.00 U.S., and that's a freaking stretch in my book!
08-28-2021, 10:45 AM
So, no, one would not expect them to pay for it - although maybe if you're nice about it, they'll discount it for you?
