Improviz

No, an answer to my questions will be fine. Does more agressive gearing make a car faster? And if so, how?

I'd like an answer to my questions. You ridiculed me for pointing out that Mercedes have far more agressive gearing than your car, and for my stating, accurately, that agressive gearing makes cars faster, which I showed by illustrating how it gives more torque multiplication and hence far more wheel torque. Then, you turn around in this thread and argue that your 3.15:1 is faster than a 2.73:1.

So which is it?

Why won't you answer, ricker?

Improviz

Ah, I see, you are going to take the same tack as thericker, namely that any articles which show the C4S as faster MUST be The Absolute Standard, while any articles which show the opposite are completely, utterly, totally false.

Unfortunately, the Road & Track article of a C4S test of which you speak is not in my posession; can you scan it; I subscribe, but have not yet received the August 2006 issue. Perhaps you have?

And again unfortunately, this time for you, Car & Driver is not the only publication to have tested the SLK55 faster than the C4S. The German publication Auto Motor und Sport has tested both. Here are the results:

AMS's test of Porsche 997 C4S, 1/2006:
0 - 80 km/h 3,6 s
0 - 100 km/h 5,1 s
0 - 120 km/h 7,0 s
0 - 130 km/h 8,0 s
0 - 140 km/h 9,1 s
0 - 160 km/h 11,5 s
0 - 180 km/h 14,7 s
0 - 200 km/h 18,2 s

AMS's test of Mercedes SLK55 AMG, 4/2005:
0 - 80 km/h 3,4 s
0 - 100 km/h 4,8 s
0 - 120 km/h 6,3 s
0 - 130 km/h - s
0 - 140 km/h 8,3 s
0 - 160 km/h 10,8 s
0 - 180 km/h 13,3 s
0 - 200 km/h 16,8 s

Wow, that seems to be quite a difference there for the Benz, SL Brabus. So, I now have two magazines to your one which have tested the SLK55 faster.

And interestingly enough, they also tested a six-speed manual C6 Corvette in August 2005.
AMS's test of six-speed manual Corvette, 8/2005:
0 - 80 km/h 3,7 s
0 - 100 km/h 5,2 s
0 - 120 km/h 6,6 s
0 - 130 km/h - s
0 - 140 km/h 9,0 s
0 - 160 km/h 10,9 s
0 - 180 km/h 13,6 s
0 - 200 km/h 16,8 s

Interesting that the six speed corvette seems to have been tested slower to all speeds below 200 km/h.

And as I pointed out, thericker drives a four-speed auto.

So what does the six-speed test you quoted from Road & Track have to do with what his car will do?

SL BRABUS

Improviz....... I subscribe to it too......but have not get it yet...... I read it over the book store.......Go to any supermarket, or book store they should have them........ why do subscribe people get their mag late.... ....we should get them before they hit the newstand....

Improviz

Yeah, I agree, and it pisses me off!

Yellow R1

Bingo! We have a Winner Ladies & Gentlemen! Some mags have the SLK55 in front, others the MN6 C6, & still others the 911 4S. The point, corrected "deciphered" by Jesse , is they are all within .1 to .2 sec of another in the Quarter.

And, FWIW, SL Brabus, I ran a std blue Carerra S in our SLK last year (2WD &
weighs a bit less = quicker than the 4S) when getting some race gas. Guess what? He got pulled by about a car length from about 10 mph (when he decided to get be a "Hero") to about 75 mph. So, we have multiple data points (including 1 real world experience to a variant of the 911 which is actually a hair quicker than its 4S bretheren). I still say the cars are pretty evenly matched but if I had to bet money on either, I'd put it on the SLK. It weighs 75 lbs less, does not suffer from 4WD parasatic drive train loss, has significantly more torque to "fight nature" as speed increases, more aggressive gearing (as Improv has correctly noted), and will never "blow a shift" (which can happen with a manual in the "heat of battle").

-Matt

Improviz

Absolutely. There are so many things that can go wrong in a race w/a manual: bogged clutch, slipped clutch, slow shift, missed shift, mistimed shift, bouncing off the rev limiter, etc. etc. etc.....and reaction times vary from person to person, etc...shoot, even if the Porsche driver did everything absolutely perfectly and reacted 0.3 slower, he's gonna lose, big time.

Throw in production tolerances to the mix. Cars DO NOT all produce the same rated horsepower from the factory; some produce more, others less, others right on the money. So many variables, which is why the mags *always* publish a "significant difference" factor for their test results, and that number is normally 0.5 seconds. Meaning that if two cars are within 0.5 of one another, the winner is not gonna be a foregone conclusion....unless you managed to get two drivers with *identical* skill, reaction time, shift times, etc. at the wheel, and what are the odds of that??

And skill is also a *huge* factor w/a manual tranny. It takes a lot of time, practice, and stuff you're simply born with (reflexes, reaction time) to be able to hit these times with any level of consistency, and even with an automatic, it's tricky in these high-torque beasts to always get good launches. You learn this stuff pretty quickly when you go to a track for the first time, which will learn ya that: 1) those guys who drive for the mags are pretty good drivers, and 2) there's more than a bit of skill involved in matching those times, let alone beating them, thanks to all of the aforementioned variables...

The automatic removes all of these variables except wheelspin from the launch, which gives the AMG cars a big advantage against any of their manual-transmissioned counterparts, and is also the main reason that bracket racers are almost always equipped w/ automatic transmissions. If you have two cars whose measured 1/4 times are within 0.5 of one another line up, 9/10 times the auto is gonna win on the street, simple as that. There are manual drivers out there who can nail great times with consistency, but they're about as rare as an uncooked steak.

ash-c32

dont mess with the p-car from 70+
and under braking it`ll wup any merc (slr and clk dtm not included) which have possibly the worst dive and diagonal pitch under braking of any performance car ive driven. However they are good for cruising

Improviz

Did you see the test results from Car & Driver? All the way up to 150, which is as high as they measured, the SLK was faster than the Porsche.

Braking by the Porsche was indeed better, though minutely, 152 ft. from 70 mph compared to 156 for the SLK55 (a benefit, along with less dive, of having the engine mounted in the rear), and if I was going to a proper track, I'd want the Porsche, but at the dragstrip (or on highway runs) I'd put my money on the AMG.

Improviz

...where oh where did he go?

jangy

When is this ricker race? I'll go, too. Looks like a few too many people in here are starting to lose the respect of a good *** woopin. Bring that '05 vette. Go get whatever done to it you want, but please o please get some coilovers first 'cause I am gonna spank your ***!! Funny, you want to race a CLK and an SLK. What's the matter Mr. Chevy, you scared of the little old Kompressor!!??!!

2K6E55

Damn... That's NOT what I want to hear... I am waiting for my 4CS...

Yellow R1

Yup, dead on Impro. See ya Buddy.

-Matt

SL BRABUS

Matt.....you got nothing to worry about.......Your Kleemann S7 K55 will P.car........ One thing about the P.car all-wheel-drive that thing take off like a fu*k arrow.........

jangy

I drove a 997S pretty hard and it gets the job done. It is just not that creechy doing it. Very similar toa go catr. the power is really used in the handling, which is already on rails.

Thericker

Not at all I'm pretty sure you'll take me, but not by as much as your thinking Why don't you meet us in LA next week and bring that a$$ whopin' All in good fun there BIG talk

Improviz

...what a surprise.

So is anyone gonna videotape this thing? It'd be cool if we could have a camera at each end of the run, as in the E55 vs. Cobra videos I posted (these two):

Video one: stock E55 vs. 452 rwhp Cobra

Video two: stock E55 vs. 452 rwhp Cobra: the rematch:

I'm very anxious to see thericker, in his car where shorter gearing *does* help acceleration, defeat the SLK55 and put "BUSLENGTHS" on the CLK55--cars where shorter gearing does *not* help acceleration.

Improviz

....and, surprise, surprise, the SLK55 beat his mouthy *** in the 1/4, just as we'd been telling him all along.

Click here to read all about it:

So, *****er: since all of those "BONE STOCK" C6 A4 3:15s like yours are running 12.5's, I guess that Falco's SLK55 is running what, 12.3's or 12.4's??



Hmm, *****er: looks like the results you got were in line with what the evil Car & Driver results were predicting, and you're modded, while Falco is stock!

Guess there's something to those "worthless" magazine test results after all, eh? So who needs therapy now, son?

Thericker

Geez where was this 1/4 mile track I was suposedly at? We ran on the freeway for very short bursts & I beat him, the 1st 2 runs Falco got the jump on me as I posted.
We'll run again but it will have to wait for a while I'm having some Medical issues right now, I'm sure your all broken up to hear about that thanks no condolences are needed.

Ever thought about trying De-caff?

SLK55R

I'm just appreciative that these two car owners took time to help us do a brief comparison. Is this the end all of C6 vs a SLK55? no I'm sure others will try as well and they will be good races. Glad to hear that these cars are comparable in performance.

I don't bother racing C6's but I'd love to run a Z06.

L8Apex

Nice run. The slk55 would put up a good fight against the 997. Especially if the Pcar gets a bad launch. (Which most do) My 964t was a bear to get off of the line quickly. But once it was out of 2nd gear it was typically game over for the other guy.

C6 z06 yes. C5 NOT. I have run several c5 Z06 vettes in my E55 and walked away. I must say, they look pretty good in my rearview mirror. Yes my car is bone stock.

Isn't Palmdale an 1/8 mile track for test & tune wed?

FishtailnZ

Well that was a bit of a soap opera...but it's a slow night shift so read it all I did! Umm...what was this all about again? *L*

vraa

Impro, drop with the name calling.
Next flying insult after this post will result in a 7 day ban.

Improviz

You wrote in here that you'd whip any of these "heavier, lower-powered Benzes", and ridiculed myself and others who patiently pointed out that the car's more agressive gearing and extra gears made the difference, dismissing us as "magazine racers" who didn't know what we were talking about. So yeah, I decided to you a bit...I'm sure you'd have done the same if it'd been me who'd gotten beat.

Actually, even though you threatened me at one point, you will be surprised to know that while I do find you to be annoying at times, I certainly don't wish you any injury or calamaties, and do, in fact, honestly hope that you're OK and everything turns out well for you. So I do extend you condolences, whether you like it or not. Get well soon.

Fock no, where's the fun in that???

Seriously: best wishes, and get well soon.

Improviz

Hmm, can I do running insults, then? Walking insults? How about running gags?

vette

run from a dig , and PLEASE, vid or ban