thunderbenz

Greetings:

I ask the following because the manual states not to use chains with our 4Matic SUVs.

Has anyone used chains with the 4Matic SUV?
If so, did you use it on the Front or Rear axels?
Did you have any issues using the chains?
If you could, any recommendations on a brand of chains for our cars?
Any other comments appreciated!

Thanks in advance.

Maj. Dundee

Your ESP will light up like a Christmas tree and braking will be compromised.

thunderbenz

Then, how do 4Matic owners drive to the snow without worrying?!!

I took my 4Matic to Tahoe once and the car slipped and I had to clip the rear bumper to save the car from hitting a post head on! And, YES I was driving slow as hell (like 5 mph or less)! I had new all-season tires.

Even a set of snow tires are not a match to actual chains...

What are my option to drive in the snow with these systems??

Anyone in the snow areas, please help. Thanks!

expl0rer

I live in Eastern Canada. We get snow in the winter.

Your slide would have been very much a result of your tires not being as good on snow (and maybe ice under the snow?) as winter tires would be. Even the worst winter tire is somewhat better than most all season (really, three season) tires There are 4 season tires made by Nokian and GIslaved which combine compounds from all season and winter tires. I have not used any of those, but a friend swears by his Nokians on his and his wife's Subarus. MIchelin has a CrossClimate tire which seems like it could be a good compromise for occasional winter driving. I would use the Cross Climate if it came in my summer tire size, but it does not. I would not be a good candidate for the Nokan or Gislaved options. I would prefer, and use, two sets of tires. One for spring through fall, and a second one for winter.

Keep in mind that in icy conditions, your best bet is studded tires, but even those are not 100% guaranteed to save our tail in all icy conditions. They may not be legal in your area because they are not kind to the roads either. Here's how I would rate tires from best to worst for winter driving conditions including ice: winter studded tires > winter tires which are not studded > 4 season tires > all season tires (aka three season tires) > summer performance tires. I have left out off road tires from this list. I would consider those to be somewhere between four season and all season tires, depending on the compounds they are made with.

All season tires are not your best friend in temps below 7C/45F. The compounds most all season tires are made of will harden and that will contribute to their ability to adhere to the road. That, I consider the first and most important factor about tire chjoice for winter. The second one, IMHO, is the amount of contact your tires make with the road. What size tires are you running currently? In my example, I have a 2010 GL 550 (X164) with 21 inch wheels and OEM size 295/40R21 Pirelli. That makes for a nice and wide contact patch, which is fantastic in the summer. Keeps the truck planted and sure footed in corners. But I have skated, literally, downhill with those tires in a light dusting of snow. I wouldn't call that fun. In snow, you would want a smaller contact patch, which essentially translates to more weight per square inch. All things equal, the narrower tires are less likely to lose grip when they are not as wide as the 295s because the weight of the vehicle pushes down on the road on the smaller patch of the narrower tires. More pressure per square inch, which is good. I mentioned that I have a dedicated set for winter - wheels and tires. I chose to run Nokian Hakkapeliitta 9 SUV (not studded). There are other good options as well and less expensive than my choice. The recommended winter size would have been 275/55R19, IIRC, but I chose a 255/55R19 instead. My choice was based on the arguments above . That is the narrowest I would go for my SUV's size and weight and probably for the ML as well. There is such a thing as too narrow. You don't want to go too narrow, which will come with its own challenges and disadvantages, infringing on safety being one. Your speedometer will not display the correct speed when you use tires, the diameter of which is not equal to your OE tires. You just have to account for that as well. For my example, the speedometer displays a higher speed than my actuall speed (measured with GPS) when I use the winter setup. FYI, my speedometer is not 100% accurate with the summer tires either, it still displays higher than my actual speed, but the difference is smaller.

With narrower tires, there is a trade off. You have less contact with the road so your driving style must account for that. You can't treat your car the same as when you are driving it in the summer and with wider tires. It goes without saying that your driving must account for the conditions around you and your tires are part of the equation.

thunderbenz

Thanks for the reply explOrer! Lots of good info.

I run 255/50/R19 a/s plus, Pirellis as well, on AMG rims. I've been driving only ONE week of the year in show during the winter season with no issues until a few years ago, when my R-class slid into the rail. I was driving less than 5 mph, but my tires could not grip any of the new snow on the road. After that, I stopped driving in the snow since I have a choice in So. CALIF.

But, now I want to drive to the snow again but fear sliding again so I'm looking into chains, which seems to be a no-no on these cars exp. on only one axel. When I had a 4runner, I just slap some chains in the rear and I was fine.

So are my only options:
1- Getting a set of cheap rims with narrower SNOW tires; or
2 - Or, can I use chains on ALL 4 wheels/tires on the 4Matcis?

Thanks!

expl0rer

Wait! You have an R350? Not an ML. This would not be the right forum for the R class. If you posted in the R class forum, you might get replies from other fellow owners about how they are dealing with occasional snow. My mistake in thinking you had an ML.

If the owner's manual does not recommend chains, I would avoid using them. If you did, you're probably setting yourself up for other problems you'll have to solve later.

I am not sure if the 4Matic in the R is the same as the ML or GL. The three platforms share some components, but I don't know if the AWD in the R is similar to the AWD in the other two. I just don't know enough about it. I could be wrong here, but I would think that the 4Matic in the C, E, or S class, for example, is different from the 4Matic in the ML and GL. I don't know where the R would fall.

I can't tell you which route to go, that would be your decision, as it's your car and money. Personally, if I were in your situation, I would not invest into a second set of wheels/tires that I would use only one week of the year. It makes no economic sense to me. I would look for a tire which could handle the warm weather and occasional winter conditions. When I researched the Michelin Cross Climate a while back, it seems like a good choice for that scenario. Look up the characteristics of your tire and the Cross Climates on Tire Rack. Compare all categories, not just "driving in snow". Which one comes on top? If you search here (maybe you did but you didn't say that you didn't find any information), perhaps the R class owners had a tire discussion at some point and that might help you as well.

Tires are a subjective topic. Just because one person likes a tire does not mean the next one will as well, for the same reasons, or at all. I am not pushing you towards the Michelins, even though it might seem so. I just think that they would work for your situation, but there are probably other options as well, perhaps cheaper, but I just don't know about those other tires.

Talk to a couple of local tire shops, explain your predicament and see what they recommend for tires.

sak335

I live in Finland. I haven't seen the pavement in weeks, every road is covered in compacted snow/ice. I run regular (unstudded) Bridgestone Blizzaks on 18" rims (the summer tires are 20") and a bit narrower than the stock tires that came on my GL. I can't say that I've ever run into a condition where I've had issues with this set up. When I take the kids to school in the morning and the plow hasn't been through yet, even with up to a foot of snow, I just raise the air suspension and drive on through. The 4Matic system is *so* much better than either the AWD systems on a Volvo XC and the BMW X1 that my wife's company cars have. There really is no comparison.

I know that CHP will sometimes tell you that you can't head over the mountain into Tahoe without chains, but I have to believe that if you have a capable vehicle with snow tires, that they would let you pass through. Especially if you show them that you aren't supposed to run chains on the vehicle.

B34chBum

^^ +++

Exactly. The Donner Pass is the only place I've ever seen posted for snow chains required - I was then driving 18-wheeler and the rest of the guys I was running with were scared to go over without renting chains.
(Yes, chains for rent what a racket!)

I was loaded to limit so no problem with traction, I just tippy-toed over the pass and kept motoring until my next fuel stop.
Your problem is with your tires, not lack of chains.
And while on topic of winter traction - even with good tires or chains your braking will never be anything like what it is on dry pavement.
You have a choice then, drive gently or learn to love the sliding.
Even if you love sliding you must learn how to manage it when it happens (when, not if)!