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W166 -ML 350 BLUETEC-190hp-Engine STOPED While Driving and then DO NOT turn anymore
Hi Everyone.
I will try to explain the short story/history/symtoms of the car.THERE ARE 2 INCIDENTS..don t know if is any LINK between them...
Started 2 years ago that appear minor problems but with High RISK!
First signs was 2 years ago while driving the car on road with 80-90km/h and suddenly stopped the engine at 90km and also stopped all the electronics on dashbord turned off for a few seconds....I was lucky to stop the car safe ...without brakes and stering whell that moved verry hard because no engine running...i was waiting 1 min and then turn the key ,engine start! everything was ok,running like before . I was driving directly to MB service (out of warranty) and they told me that might be the auxiliary battery And main baterry should be replaced.i do that and replaced,Also i remember on diagnosis appear just 1 error,say something with High Voltage protection..don t remember exactly,No problems for 4-5 months and again happened the same thing.. Again was to MB SERVICE but this time no errors found..they keep the car 2 weeks but never happened to them same thing...so they don t know what was happening.Startkng from 2nd incident each 6 months happened 2 times more and then i do the service only to a local repair shop...a bad choice/experience to do that service with local repair shop.You will find why was bad chioice...(that sercice repairshop have good reputation because the main Mechanic worked for a long time to MB and was verry experienced...) with car service and now i have a lot of problems with the car.
—Now 2nd INCIDENT! My car has 160.000 km and a few days ago stopped like before but this time no starting,no turn to the engine.ALL dashboard electronics are ok,feels like without power/battery. I put the car on trailer and go to the local mechanik,he told me that is the starter problem,need to be replaced.I changed the starter and still the engine no turn!He SAID the engine is BLOCKED,i didn t belive him and put again the car on trailer and send to MB.
SAME STORY,Engine BLOCKED! ,do not turn! I said is not true because my car has no smoke,no strange noise,no cranks,everything hear ok before the engine stopped.I take out the car from mercedes and send it to another friend wich i remember he was working to a car service.He looked on the engine and find out the problem,THE crankshaft flywheel is damaged,some components from this piece goes behind the flywheel and is locked/blocked.
After the CRANKSHAFT FLYWHELL was replaced,he turned with key manualy the engine and now the engine was turing...so is NOT BLOCKED! GOOD NEWS! But—- when checked the oil appear a big PROBLEM! the oil looks like JAM!! (I will try to post the picture!) That mean the oil was not changed for atleast 40.000KM.I think the 1st local mechanik wich changed the starter didn t make any replacement of oil/filters of my car....
He cleaned/flushed the engine and put a new oil filter and new oil.Also he replaced the fuel filter. The engine was started, and keep the fingers crossed to not hear any noise from the engine due bad oil problem..NO NOISE WHEN STARTING THE ENGINE,but after 15-20 seconds the engine shout down!(now the dashbord electronics do not shut down..just the engine) Started a few times and after 15-20 seconds the engine shut down.
Now,he think is a problem with fuel pump..will try to replace(no errors on diagnostic,no errors on board,tomorrow will try with STAR diagnostic tool) .Also he think is possibile the DPF ,exaust engine pipe,he think the engine shout down because no fuel is enough to keep the engine running...
ANY SUGESSTIONS? SOME ONE HAVE ANY IDEAS? I appreciate!
THANK YOU FOR READING ,i will update here if i find out the problem...
Taking into account the sludge on the oil filter, your engine is toast. Even if you ever get it running again, there's been damage done on your motor. That #hit ain't buffing out....
Motor sounds good, which is incredible considering the tar in your oil system. I'd say run Liqui Moly engine flush through it along with a few oil changes and hope for the best.
Ok,thanks for the informations....i will do that tomorrow..Still wondering why the engine stop running after 15-20 sec...🤷🏻♂️ Is possibile that the exaust or dpf pipe is blocked by oil?
Also if try to inceease the acceleration the engine stops
Based on the amount of sludge shown I highly suspect the engine has not been maintained well. Could you let us know how often you change the engine oil and what oil you are using?
I Just read a post from another user wich posted here a few moments ago but dissapered that comment regarding his answer about crank bearing sugestion..i think he deleted....anyway,his sugestion i think it is TRUE!!..CRANK BEARING .damaged.....also my mechanic said that probabiliy the crank bearings need to be replaced if i am LUCKY...,THANK YOU FOR info .Today I flushed the engine,put another MB oil and new filter and same...running aprox 25 seconds and stops.Tomorrow will take out the oil and look under the car through oil pan for crank beatings damage and if will be damaged will replace the crank bearings through oil bath path.I will update the status tomororow evening,or when the berings will be changed,If any one have any opinion please share with me.
Based on the amount of sludge shown I highly suspect the engine has not been maintained well. Could you let us know how often you change the engine oil and what oil you are using?
Last time(now) until i found out i estimate at 40.000km .The old mechanik lie to me that he changed but as you can see at the upper pictures was not changed .The oil and filters for verry long time....usually i go to change at 12.000km...
I use only MB original or mobil 1.
Last time(now) until i found out i estimate at 40.000km .The old mechanik lie to me that he changed but as you can see at the upper pictures was not changed .The oil and filters for verry long time....usually i go to change at 12.000km...
I use only MB original or mobil 1.
I see. For the sludge build up fresh oil will not wash it out. As pointed by the other folk you need to run some engine cleaner (like the liqui moly one) to ease the sludge. Good luck with it! Hopefully it didn't cause any bad damage to the engine.
I'd replace the oil every 8000-10000km (5000-6000 miles) depending on your driving situation. The MB oil is not very good and expensive. I've been using Amsoil oil and it works well, and I've heard the Liqui Moly oil works good as well. Make sure you get something certified by MB 229.51 or MB 229.52. 229.52 oil is preferred but 229.51 works as well. DO NOT USE oil with 229.5 certification only.
I see. For the sludge build up fresh oil will not wash it out. As pointed by the other folk you need to run some engine cleaner (like the liqui moly one) to ease the sludge. Good luck with it! Hopefully it didn't cause any bad damage to the engine.
I'd replace the oil every 8000-10000km (5000-6000 miles) depending on your driving situation. The MB oil is not very good and expensive. I've been using Amsoil oil and it works well, and I've heard the Liqui Moly oil works good as well. Make sure you get something certified by MB 229.51 or MB 229.52. 229.52 oil is preferred but 229.51 works as well. DO NOT USE oil with 229.5 certification only.
Thank for the informatiin,Yes it was cleaned with special engine cleaner solution 2times,Also after cleaner we put a new oil filter and new oil...we will takeout the oil tomorrow to check the crank bearings ,for sure need to be replaced...hope that the engine will not have other damages...luckly just the crank bearings,will see tomorrow.Now have 229.52 Mobil1(is not big difference on Mobil 1 or Mb ,just more €1-€1.5/l ) I will keep 5w30-Mobil 1 ,same 229.52.
What I don't understand is why the engine shuts down after 25 seconds. Unless it's literally seizing up and stopping. In which case it normally shouldn't start up again. And to not only start again, but run so relatively quietly... Some thing else is shutting the engine down, I would think.
As Genius stated, you'll need to do some serious engine flushes to make a dent in that sludge. And you may be spending all this cash on oil and flush on an engine that's toast.
Thank for the informatiin,Yes it was cleaned with special engine cleaner solution 2times,Also after cleaner we put a new oil filter and new oil...we will takeout the oil tomorrow to check the crank bearings ,for sure need to be replaced...hope that the engine will not have other damages...luckly just the crank bearings,will see tomorrow.Now have 229.52 Mobil1(is not big difference on Mobil 1 or Mb ,just more €1-€1.5/l ) I will keep 5w30-Mobil 1 ,same 229.52.
Be frank, I wouldn't suggest you to keep trying those cleaners and replacing oil. If you really want to do it, use some cheap diesel oil (like the Delvac 5W-40 you can find in Walmart) since you are replacing it in a short time, as long as it's DPF compatible (no zinc in the oil).
Instead, if I were you I would do the following:
1. Find someone who has Star/Xentry and read out if there's any trouble code in the engine module. As Peter mentioned, it's not very likely the shutoff is due to the sludge, but something else is happening in the engine so there might be a trouble code. Further, monitor the essential sensors data with the Star/Xentry until the engine shuts off to see if you can find any clue.
2. If no clue is found, I would hoist the engine out and inspect the crank bearings and seals, before deciding what you want to do next. This only requires removal of the oil pan+pickup tube once the engine is out. Also this can give you a better idea about the internal of the engine, as of how badly it's gunked up and if any critical part is loose. Also inspect the timing chain as it's the part that easily gets damaged with the sludge buildup. Not to mention that with the engine out and oil pans removed it's much easier to clean the internal parts with whatever cleaner you want to use, plus physical scrubbing.
I understand that you want to solve the issue with minimum possible amount of work. I used to do this before but sometimes it ended up costing me more. Hoisting a MB engine is not that much work as you might imagine. To hoist the OM642 out of a W166 you only need to disconnect the harness from ECU and fuel line from the pump feeding, intake (just the 2 charge air ducts) and exhaust, and then remove the coolant hoses and detach the A/C compressor from the engine (no need to discharge the A/C system). Then you can disconnect the engine from transmission and lift it out. There's plenty of room in the front so it doesn't even need to remove the radiator.
Be frank, I wouldn't suggest you to keep trying those cleaners and replacing oil. If you really want to do it, use some cheap diesel oil (like the Delvac 5W-40 you can find in Walmart) since you are replacing it in a short time, as long as it's DPF compatible (no zinc in the oil).
Instead, if I were you I would do the following:
1. Find someone who has Star/Xentry and read out if there's any trouble code in the engine module. As Peter mentioned, it's not very likely the shutoff is due to the sludge, but something else is happening in the engine so there might be a trouble code. Further, monitor the essential sensors data with the Star/Xentry until the engine shuts off to see if you can find any clue.
2. If no clue is found, I would hoist the engine out and inspect the crank bearings and seals, before deciding what you want to do next. This only requires removal of the oil pan+pickup tube once the engine is out. Also this can give you a better idea about the internal of the engine, as of how badly it's gunked up and if any critical part is loose. Also inspect the timing chain as it's the part that easily gets damaged with the sludge buildup. Not to mention that with the engine out and oil pans removed it's much easier to clean the internal parts with whatever cleaner you want to use, plus physical scrubbing.
I understand that you want to solve the issue with minimum possible amount of work. I used to do this before but sometimes it ended up costing me more. Hoisting a MB engine is not that much work as you might imagine. To hoist the OM642 out of a W166 you only need to disconnect the harness from ECU and fuel line from the pump feeding, intake (just the 2 charge air ducts) and exhaust, and then remove the coolant hoses and detach the A/C compressor from the engine (no need to discharge the A/C system). Then you can disconnect the engine from transmission and lift it out. There's plenty of room in the front so it doesn't even need to remove the radiator.
thank you for all the details and helpp yo you amd other members on this forum...I THINK I will take in consideration what you said soon...Just now flushed withbspecial engine cleaner 2times and another 2 times with new oil and new oil filters...allmost same like yestrday...i will post a new video in a few minutes....
NEW VIDEO ATTACHED.Now the engine is clean as much as possibile with new oil and new filter...after 15-20sec the engine is shut down... no errors on dashboard or on star... it is possibile (i don t know how to say in english) that that the engine/jump out /slide from chain..is not on 0 anymore ?
NEW VIDEO ATTACHED.Now the engine is clean as much as possibile with new oil and new filter...after 15-20sec the engine is shut down... no errors on dashboard or on star... it is possibile (i don t know how to say in english) that that the engine/jump out /slide from chain..is not on 0 anymore ?
did you at any point consider scanning the truck instead of this guessing game?
What scanner did you use? If the vehicle is shutting off like that, there will be codes in the ECU.
Not necessarily. If there's restriction in fuel supply or blockage in intake it can have no logged code. That's why I suggested the OP to use Star/Xentry to monitor the critical sensor data like fuel rail pressure, intake charge pressure, etc. Not sure if the OP has done that yet.
NEW VIDEO ATTACHED.Now the engine is clean as much as possibile with new oil and new filter...after 15-20sec the engine is shut down... no errors on dashboard or on star... it is possibile (i don t know how to say in english) that that the engine/jump out /slide from chain..is not on 0 anymore ?
I don't think it has anything to do with the timing chain based on the video but not 100% sure. Did you check the status of the air filters and fuel filter? It can simply be a restricted fuel flow due to clogged fuel filter if the pattern is consistent. That's why I'm suggesting to monitor the critical sensor data in Star/Xentry. If you keep an eye on the fuel rail pressure it should tell you if the fuel supply is good. Then if you look at the charge air pressure and MAP sensor it will tell you if the engine is receiving proper intake air. And so on.
New video...Now ,after new oil and new filter (5th time) the engine was running 15 minutes..but this time the engine have a loud noise(hear on video) now we have left 2 optiioms:
1 : to change the CRANKSHAFT BEARINGS(access from oil bath to make the change)
2: Rocker/tapped (to replace) this we will do after we will complete 1 step....
What do you say about this steps?
thank you
any chance to fix the engine? Can have more damages?
I don't think it has anything to do with the timing chain based on the video but not 100% sure. Did you check the status of the air filters and fuel filter? It can simply be a restricted fuel flow due to clogged fuel filter if the pattern is consistent. That's why I'm suggesting to monitor the critical sensor data in Star/Xentry. If you keep an eye on the fuel rail pressure it should tell you if the fuel supply is good. Then if you look at the charge air pressure and MAP sensor it will tell you if the engine is receiving proper intake air. And so on.
I poster a new video,The chain /engine was not fixed at 0 point....due to bad lubrification..the chain was not fixed at 0,after we fix it now put another oil ..and is running..this time with noise... see the new video.Thx
I poster a new video,The chain /engine was not fixed at 0 point....due to bad lubrification..the chain was not fixed at 0,after we fix it now put another oil ..and is running..this time with noise... see the new video.Thx
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