Need SPECIFICS on Hi-flow Cataltyic Converter installation
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03 C32 AMG
Need SPECIFICS on Hi-flow Cataltyic Converter installation
I hate ricer shops, i went to this huge tuning shop in town today to ask about this issue and the techs looked like they crapped their pants at the thought of even touching an MB. Those guys sure are scared of computers, simple minds for simple engines i guess. Anyways, to my question....
My cats are giving the traditional death rattle, its between 2-2.5K RPMs. The CLK 320 has 4 cats, two primary and two secondary. Two are round cylinders (the ones just after the manifold) , two are flattened cylinders (down between the round cats and the resonator).
Question 1) which are the primaries, which are the secondaries?
I have been hearing some rattling from underneath, i think its either going to be the heatshielding or one of the cats. If it is the cat, i want to replace it with a high-flow cat. I've heard this issue discussed here alot, but have never gotten a clear idea on what EXACTLY to do with the install.
I've heard of the following manufacturers making high flow cats for our cars, i dont want to spend more than $150-$200 a piece. Which is best?
1) Magnaflow
2) Random Technology (have heard that they were cheap and came apart easily)
3) Evosport (sells one, what brand is it?)
With regard to the install:
I've heard that one set of cats can be removed without setting off a CEL, and the other set can be replaced by high flow cats.
1) Is this true? Any other recommendations?
2) Which cats (primary or secondary) can i remove without setting off a CEL?
3) What sould be done with the O2 sensors to prevent a CEL or malfuctioning.
I'll post pics later of the stock setup so you can see what i'm talking about, thanks for the help.
My cats are giving the traditional death rattle, its between 2-2.5K RPMs. The CLK 320 has 4 cats, two primary and two secondary. Two are round cylinders (the ones just after the manifold) , two are flattened cylinders (down between the round cats and the resonator).
Question 1) which are the primaries, which are the secondaries?
I have been hearing some rattling from underneath, i think its either going to be the heatshielding or one of the cats. If it is the cat, i want to replace it with a high-flow cat. I've heard this issue discussed here alot, but have never gotten a clear idea on what EXACTLY to do with the install.
I've heard of the following manufacturers making high flow cats for our cars, i dont want to spend more than $150-$200 a piece. Which is best?
1) Magnaflow
2) Random Technology (have heard that they were cheap and came apart easily)
3) Evosport (sells one, what brand is it?)
With regard to the install:
I've heard that one set of cats can be removed without setting off a CEL, and the other set can be replaced by high flow cats.
1) Is this true? Any other recommendations?
2) Which cats (primary or secondary) can i remove without setting off a CEL?
3) What sould be done with the O2 sensors to prevent a CEL or malfuctioning.
I'll post pics later of the stock setup so you can see what i'm talking about, thanks for the help.
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03 C32 AMG
Pics to explain...
Here are the top (rounded) cats, O2 sensor location indicated by arrows.
Closeup and better angle of left side of first picture
Top O2 sensor of cat on the right.
Top 02 sensor of cat on left, also look at the note in red, is this a problem?
Other cats (lower, just before resonator). There were no other O2 sensors that i could find other than the ones before and after the rounded cats pictured above.
Seeing as how the first cats (rounded) are sandwiched between O2 sensors, im guessing these cannot be removed. Am I right? Which should be replaced with a hi-flow cat, and which should be removed? Right now my guess is that the big ones in the last pic are removable, but the round ones can only be replaced with hi-flow units.
Also, i took a rough measurement of the diameter of the piping, it looks like the circumference is about 7.5 inches so that would put the diameter at about 2.5 inches, can anyone verify this for me?
Closeup and better angle of left side of first picture
Top O2 sensor of cat on the right.
Top 02 sensor of cat on left, also look at the note in red, is this a problem?
Other cats (lower, just before resonator). There were no other O2 sensors that i could find other than the ones before and after the rounded cats pictured above.
Seeing as how the first cats (rounded) are sandwiched between O2 sensors, im guessing these cannot be removed. Am I right? Which should be replaced with a hi-flow cat, and which should be removed? Right now my guess is that the big ones in the last pic are removable, but the round ones can only be replaced with hi-flow units.
Also, i took a rough measurement of the diameter of the piping, it looks like the circumference is about 7.5 inches so that would put the diameter at about 2.5 inches, can anyone verify this for me?
Last edited by King320; Nov 28, 2005 at 01:04 AM.
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From: Brisbane, Australia
CLK55 AMG 2006 Cabrio, BMW M3 2008 DTC Cab new (M3 e46 SMG 2003 Cabrio Sold), BMW X5 tt Diesel 2008
You can remove the first set closest to the manifolds, leave other two on and leave all the sensors in place.
Last edited by robertus; Nov 28, 2005 at 08:26 AM.
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1951 Caterpiller D6
Originally Posted by robertus
You can remove the first set closest to the manifolds, leave other two on and leave all the sensors in place.
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1998 honda civic lx
E55AMG99... I LOVE your sig, about the soldier. Really good and true.
Sorry to hijack the threat King320...just had to recognize that sig.
Return to talk of catalytic converters now :-D
Sorry to hijack the threat King320...just had to recognize that sig.
Return to talk of catalytic converters now :-D
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1951 Caterpiller D6
Try these two threads for more info. Once you ignore the trolls, there is some great info for your project.
https://mbworld.org/forums/w211-amg/119722-race-cats-going.html
https://mbworld.org/forums/w211-amg/105259-my-tuning-idea-remove-cats.html
Thanks milllx but I cannot take credit for it. Father Dennis O'Brien, Chaplain in the United States Marine Corps wrote the poem which I paraphrased. The words and meaning are indeed very true.
https://mbworld.org/forums/w211-amg/119722-race-cats-going.html
https://mbworld.org/forums/w211-amg/105259-my-tuning-idea-remove-cats.html
Originally Posted by milllx
E55AMG99... I LOVE your sig, about the soldier. Really good and true.
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03 C32 AMG
well, webshots has been a bust thus far, here's a link to the pics, ill keep seeing if i can get them to work on the thread, but this might just be easier.
http://community.webshots.com/album/512045984tHWjhC
http://community.webshots.com/album/512045984tHWjhC
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Wow, looks like victor ran into a LOT of problems. Think a simple 320 motor would cause as much drama about backpressure and exhaust flow capacity as the 55k? I'd hate to spend money removing these things only to find that it made the car slower and quieter, what would be the point of that?
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EVE
I believe when I spoke to Corey (of Kleemann) last about the issue of replacing catalytic converters he insisted that the role of the 02 sensors before and after the primary cat is just to test for the efficiency of the cat converter, that it actually works, therefore if you replaced the primary cat with a random tech cat, it would be just fine if you can weld on 02 bungs. The secondary cats can be removed.
flip
flip
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Originally Posted by mig888
I believe when I spoke to Corey (of Kleemann) last about the issue of replacing catalytic converters he insisted that the role of the 02 sensors before and after the primary cat is just to test for the efficiency of the cat converter, that it actually works, therefore if you replaced the primary cat with a random tech cat, it would be just fine if you can weld on 02 bungs. The secondary cats can be removed.
flip
flip
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c43
sry to jack, but I am also looking into replaceing my cats with some high flow or race cats, if I had 200 cell, would this pass ca smog test? would magflow universal obdII highflow cats work without setting off o2s, and I feel you for people not wanting to touch your cats, albert at tws was trying to explain to me how it would not work at all if I was try to do that, I really want high flow cats, to a 2.25 pipe to muff, not sure what I can do, and not sure if the c280 has the 4 cats or two, I think it is four, close enough to a clk320
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Originally Posted by Ashkan's C280
sry to jack, but I am also looking into replaceing my cats with some high flow or race cats, if I had 200 cell, would this pass ca smog test? would magflow universal obdII highflow cats work without setting off o2s, and I feel you for people not wanting to touch your cats, albert at tws was trying to explain to me how it would not work at all if I was try to do that, I really want high flow cats, to a 2.25 pipe to muff, not sure what I can do, and not sure if the c280 has the 4 cats or two, I think it is four, close enough to a clk320
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c43
I should gain quite a bitt, the cats are the most restrictive part of my cars exhuast system, and it does not seem to cost too much I'd be interested, around 600-700 for two race cats, a 2.25 pipe and a mag muff, seems fair to me, does anyone have advice?
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From: WOT somewhere in the Bay Area
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Originally Posted by Ashkan's C280
I should gain quite a bitt, the cats are the most restrictive part of my cars exhuast system, and it does not seem to cost too much I'd be interested, around 600-700 for two race cats, a 2.25 pipe and a mag muff, seems fair to me, does anyone have advice?
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Originally Posted by E55AMG99
I'd be really curious to know what the cost per HP works out to.
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c43
well if I gained 15hp from cats a pipe and muff I would be happy, and the car should sound better, and correct me if I am wrong, but I think I should be saving some weight as well as having the car run better for it, so I believe it would be worth the gain, I'm not stupid and think this would add 30hp, I only have a I6, but I think 20hp could be gained on a v8, and maybe 15 if I am lucky for me, at least it will be light sound better, and have some better hp, and for me 15 hp is a lot, my stock is only 195, and I have done a few mods, and I'd like to think I have 200hp crank, prob not but it makes me feel better, so 10hp gain is 5% and 15hp is 7.5% that is a lot to me
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Originally Posted by King320
HAHA, when it comes to MB tuning ^^this^^ should be the least of your worries. Its actually not that bad for the power, about on part with an eisenmann race exhaust (minus the sound of course) my only concern is if that power will actually show up.
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Originally Posted by Ashkan's C280
well if I gained 15hp from cats a pipe and muff I would be happy, and the car should sound better, and correct me if I am wrong, but I think I should be saving some weight as well as having the car run better for it, so I believe it would be worth the gain, I'm not stupid and think this would add 30hp, I only have a I6, but I think 20hp could be gained on a v8, and maybe 15 if I am lucky for me, at least it will be light sound better, and have some better hp, and for me 15 hp is a lot, my stock is only 195, and I have done a few mods, and I'd like to think I have 200hp crank, prob not but it makes me feel better, so 10hp gain is 5% and 15hp is 7.5% that is a lot to me
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R170
Originally Posted by King320
MBs are heavy cars. Switching out your cats or even deleting them altogether isnt going to save you weight of any consequence.
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20-30 lbs might make a difference on the track, but i dunno what kind of difference you're going to see on the street. Thats roughly equivalent to me having or not having my bookbag in the car.
Dave, post PICS when you do yours. I think our setups are identical, which is the primary and secondary? Im assuming the first ones are primary since they're monitored by 02 sensors, are you replacing these with anything? Also do you think we're risking the same issues that Victor ran into on the E55?
Dave, post PICS when you do yours. I think our setups are identical, which is the primary and secondary? Im assuming the first ones are primary since they're monitored by 02 sensors, are you replacing these with anything? Also do you think we're risking the same issues that Victor ran into on the E55?
