how fast is a 560sel?
06-10-2004, 11:37 AM
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Turbo Diesel
how fast is a 560sel?
loooking into my next mercedes, i';ve decided i LOVE the 126 chassis.
and, after dieseling in a 124, i want some pick up.
i'm thinking 560sel.....but i read it was rated at something like..230-240 hp? thats it? out of 5.6 v8?
is the 560 quick? quicker than 240 would make it seem?
and, after dieseling in a 124, i want some pick up.
i'm thinking 560sel.....but i read it was rated at something like..230-240 hp? thats it? out of 5.6 v8?
is the 560 quick? quicker than 240 would make it seem?
06-10-2004, 02:39 PM
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2006 Aston Martin Vantage
The 560SEL does 0-60 in about 7.5 sec and the quarter in about 15.8 secs... Those are just approximate numbers. The US version is quite limited in power, especially for a 5.6L engine. I think i read somewhere that the power is restricted due to emission laws and 3 catalytic conveters are used. May be without the cats, the car would be closer to Euro spec?
As for the drive, the car does feel quick if it is a good sample. There is a nice punch off the line as well as higher speeds. This is just feel though. In comparison to a 420SEL, the 560 feels like a rocket since it has lower end acceleration. However, if you let the car get rusty, it will feel terrible... There may be a feel of power loss and lagging low rpm acceleration. This is just a personal observation from a 560SEL I had an opporitunity to "test drive," when it was mint and as well as after an accident (which the car was neglected after it was fixed since it seemed to not be the same I guess).
As for the drive, the car does feel quick if it is a good sample. There is a nice punch off the line as well as higher speeds. This is just feel though. In comparison to a 420SEL, the 560 feels like a rocket since it has lower end acceleration. However, if you let the car get rusty, it will feel terrible... There may be a feel of power loss and lagging low rpm acceleration. This is just a personal observation from a 560SEL I had an opporitunity to "test drive," when it was mint and as well as after an accident (which the car was neglected after it was fixed since it seemed to not be the same I guess).
06-11-2004, 12:02 AM
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1986 560SEL, 97 BMW 740iL
considering the designed is 18 years old, 7.5 seconds to 60 mph is pretty good IMO. Top speed I believe is limited to 155 mph here (US spec.) 
06-11-2004, 01:39 PM
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Turbo Diesel
i looked at one today at a local used car dealer (
)
SUCH a beautiful car. that 126 chassis is all I ever need in an automobile. he tried to tell me that it was a florida car (
) and that it was garage kept all the time, "unlike the other cars on the lot, they don't keep this one out in the snow like the rest of the car."
man those lines all end in perfect harmony.
this one wasn't in such good of shape, but still gorgeous.
) SUCH a beautiful car. that 126 chassis is all I ever need in an automobile. he tried to tell me that it was a florida car (
) and that it was garage kept all the time, "unlike the other cars on the lot, they don't keep this one out in the snow like the rest of the car." man those lines all end in perfect harmony.
this one wasn't in such good of shape, but still gorgeous.
06-11-2004, 08:49 PM
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I would probably avoid ones that are not in good shape as they tend to have many previous owner and/or are not maintained well.
Cracks in the dash may tell you that the car never saw a garage, so expect harder leather and quick dulling paint. Since these cars are pretty old, maintainence may not exist and oil change frequencies may not be to recommended standards. Relating to the age and condition, if you see imperfections, the car could have been used for not what it was for (luxury sedan), such as transportation of equipment, heavy boxes and the like directly on the rear leather seats.
Overall, I would be weary of purchasing a 560SEL short of good condition. Despite the nice-ness of the car, due to the "affordable" used price, some people buy them for the name plate and never take care of it. They may end up selling them when they notice it "rusting" and can't afford the maintanence. You might be looking at one of these which is something to watch out for.
Cracks in the dash may tell you that the car never saw a garage, so expect harder leather and quick dulling paint. Since these cars are pretty old, maintainence may not exist and oil change frequencies may not be to recommended standards. Relating to the age and condition, if you see imperfections, the car could have been used for not what it was for (luxury sedan), such as transportation of equipment, heavy boxes and the like directly on the rear leather seats.
Overall, I would be weary of purchasing a 560SEL short of good condition. Despite the nice-ness of the car, due to the "affordable" used price, some people buy them for the name plate and never take care of it. They may end up selling them when they notice it "rusting" and can't afford the maintanence. You might be looking at one of these which is something to watch out for.
06-11-2004, 09:35 PM
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Unless you want to go 140 - 150 mph, the 560 is great.
It may ONLY have 238 SAE bhp, BUT that is achieved at 4800 rpms.
Thus, you will feel the same thrust as a Euro 560 up until the 4800 rpm mark where the 560 may start to feel a little "flat".
The torque, at 287 lb/ft, is almost as good as Eurospec, so off the line it shouldn't be all that different.
A 560 is nice, if one can afford the gas for a 12 - 16 mpg car that requires no less than 91 octane.:o
Top speed of a 560SEL should be in the mid to upper 140's. Look at it this way...All newer sport-luxury cars, including the E500, are limited to 130 mph, anyways. Go down a hill, and you will beat out an E55 kompressor which tops out at 155 without removing the limiter.
Nobody can stop you, lol!
It may ONLY have 238 SAE bhp, BUT that is achieved at 4800 rpms.
Thus, you will feel the same thrust as a Euro 560 up until the 4800 rpm mark where the 560 may start to feel a little "flat".
The torque, at 287 lb/ft, is almost as good as Eurospec, so off the line it shouldn't be all that different.
A 560 is nice, if one can afford the gas for a 12 - 16 mpg car that requires no less than 91 octane.:o
Top speed of a 560SEL should be in the mid to upper 140's. Look at it this way...All newer sport-luxury cars, including the E500, are limited to 130 mph, anyways. Go down a hill, and you will beat out an E55 kompressor which tops out at 155 without removing the limiter.
Nobody can stop you, lol!
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06-13-2004, 12:14 AM
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The question is folks;
How much power do we really need? Last time I checked, the speed limit was 65 mph on most Interstates, and the traffic increases everyday with the exponential growth factors of the great surplus population.
HP and torque numbers are rising TOO fast these days. The engines aren't built to handle it, and I predict their lives and dependability will be shortened drastically. All but the economical roundabouts which only have modest gains in performance.
The M117 560 engine's design dates to the M116(also the 420SEL) which was drawn up and conceived in the mid - late '60's before the 280SE 3.5 came out, and the 350SL. We're talking the same basic engine design for 20 years or so.
Mercedes just wants to supercharge this, or quadruple-turbocharge that. The internals aren't meant to take that kind of abuse for 400K miles. Not for the money they sell these Benzes for(relatively cheap performance per dollar ratio).
BUT, everyone's into the game. Its a fight for the top spot in numbers. Who gives a cluck!
How much power do we really need? Last time I checked, the speed limit was 65 mph on most Interstates, and the traffic increases everyday with the exponential growth factors of the great surplus population.
HP and torque numbers are rising TOO fast these days. The engines aren't built to handle it, and I predict their lives and dependability will be shortened drastically. All but the economical roundabouts which only have modest gains in performance.
The M117 560 engine's design dates to the M116(also the 420SEL) which was drawn up and conceived in the mid - late '60's before the 280SE 3.5 came out, and the 350SL. We're talking the same basic engine design for 20 years or so.
Mercedes just wants to supercharge this, or quadruple-turbocharge that. The internals aren't meant to take that kind of abuse for 400K miles. Not for the money they sell these Benzes for(relatively cheap performance per dollar ratio).
BUT, everyone's into the game. Its a fight for the top spot in numbers. Who gives a cluck!
06-13-2004, 01:30 PM
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E55, GLS450, GL63, GLE350
The engines aren't built to handle it, and I predict their lives and dependability will be shortened drastically. All but the economical roundabouts which only have modest gains in performance.
06-13-2004, 10:48 PM
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Originally posted by BlownV8
You care to explain how you know and where you got the information that the new Mercedes engines aren't built to support the hp they are making?
You care to explain how you know and where you got the information that the new Mercedes engines aren't built to support the hp they are making?
I have no critical information to share. For cry eye, the engines are only at most 2 years old.
Time will tell. I won't call the curtains to be drawn yet.
Last edited by DslBnz; 06-13-2004 at 10:53 PM.
07-04-2004, 04:36 PM
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Compared to other cars, they are very durable engines, if they are "hot rodded" they won't last very long no matter how much hp they have, if they are driven maturely they will last for a long time, 240hp isn't alot of power imo, but these new cars with 400+ hp, i don't know time will tell thou, there are new techniques and materials in newer engines so maybe they will last for along time. Either way, if you hot rod them they will break, just like any other car.
However, they should be driven at different speeds and varied loads, they don't need to be completely babied probebly isn't even good for them either. But driven maturely they will last along time, but knowing that you have alot of hp on tap can be very stress relieving, as long as the engines remain reliable.
However, they should be driven at different speeds and varied loads, they don't need to be completely babied probebly isn't even good for them either. But driven maturely they will last along time, but knowing that you have alot of hp on tap can be very stress relieving, as long as the engines remain reliable.
07-05-2004, 01:33 PM
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E55, GLS450, GL63, GLE350
Hot rodding only makes an engine more efficient. What breaks engines is improper fueling, cooling, lubrication, or metal fatigue. I think it is a pretty ignorant remark to say that an engine will not last as long if you make more horsepower. In fact, there are a few modifications that will give you more horsepower and make your engine last longer.
For example, the US 560 SEC/SEL have the absolute worst manifolds that I have ever seen. There is so much heat and pressure that is built up in cylinder #8 from the poor design that you will get a head gasket failure and oil leaks over time. Look at your # 8 cylinder and see if it has oil caked up around the exhaust manifold. If you have the US manifolds and your car has high mileage, you will have those leaks and it is a matter of time before you have to pull the heads and replace the head gasket The excessive heat also causes the valve stem seals to go quicker than they normally should. Get headers or the Euro manifold and you will have more horsepower and an engine that will run cooler and last longer.
An engine is an air pump. The engine will make more power by getting more air in and out of the motor. Hot rodding only makes your engine more efficient. With most things, knowing where to stop hot rodding is the key to an engines longevity. Modern normally aspirated engines produce more horsepower due to electronic engine management systems, better heads, better intakes, and better cams. The new Mercedes engines will last longer with less hastle, better power, and better emissions.
For example, the US 560 SEC/SEL have the absolute worst manifolds that I have ever seen. There is so much heat and pressure that is built up in cylinder #8 from the poor design that you will get a head gasket failure and oil leaks over time. Look at your # 8 cylinder and see if it has oil caked up around the exhaust manifold. If you have the US manifolds and your car has high mileage, you will have those leaks and it is a matter of time before you have to pull the heads and replace the head gasket The excessive heat also causes the valve stem seals to go quicker than they normally should. Get headers or the Euro manifold and you will have more horsepower and an engine that will run cooler and last longer.
An engine is an air pump. The engine will make more power by getting more air in and out of the motor. Hot rodding only makes your engine more efficient. With most things, knowing where to stop hot rodding is the key to an engines longevity. Modern normally aspirated engines produce more horsepower due to electronic engine management systems, better heads, better intakes, and better cams. The new Mercedes engines will last longer with less hastle, better power, and better emissions.
07-06-2004, 01:53 AM
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I agree with BlownV8 remarks re. hot rodding.
Especially a big V8 isn't really stressed with a supercharger, provided you cool it sufficiently. Btw, on the highway I have the same mileage in our SL55 as in our previous Cl500. Reason? The supercharger is disengaged during crusing and only kicks in when stepping on it.
Re. the560 SEL question, I can only share my experience with the high-power Euro version (they had two engine configs.). This one had 300hp, and none of these cars were delimited at the time (including the US versions). The speedo went to 240 km/h which is about 149 mph but the needle continued to go past it to about 260 km/h (162 mph).
On a good day, the car hit 260 without any issues and stayed there for some time, but it's important to know that the old analog speedos weren't very accurate either. I assume the top speed to be close to 150 mph.
It may be interesting to know that the engine would not break a sweat going 130mph as touring speed. Many times (usually in the evening) I drove that speed for about 650 miles straight (Switzerland to northern Germany, except the three gas station stops and road construction; other speed limits were blatantly ignored as speeding tickets were not sent outside of the EU. I had Swiss license plates) and the car was fine to over 200K miles (never any engine or transmission work besides the scheduled service).
Hope this helps...
Wolfman
Especially a big V8 isn't really stressed with a supercharger, provided you cool it sufficiently. Btw, on the highway I have the same mileage in our SL55 as in our previous Cl500. Reason? The supercharger is disengaged during crusing and only kicks in when stepping on it.
Re. the560 SEL question, I can only share my experience with the high-power Euro version (they had two engine configs.). This one had 300hp, and none of these cars were delimited at the time (including the US versions). The speedo went to 240 km/h which is about 149 mph but the needle continued to go past it to about 260 km/h (162 mph).
On a good day, the car hit 260 without any issues and stayed there for some time, but it's important to know that the old analog speedos weren't very accurate either. I assume the top speed to be close to 150 mph.
It may be interesting to know that the engine would not break a sweat going 130mph as touring speed. Many times (usually in the evening) I drove that speed for about 650 miles straight (Switzerland to northern Germany, except the three gas station stops and road construction; other speed limits were blatantly ignored as speeding tickets were not sent outside of the EU. I had Swiss license plates
) and the car was fine to over 200K miles (never any engine or transmission work besides the scheduled service). Hope this helps...
Wolfman
07-07-2004, 09:30 AM
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W126 500SEC and 560SEL
Hi all.
I have a 1989 200,000m 560SEL which I have personally had 147mph on the speedo, there was 1000rpm left but foot flat to the floor, there was no more power left.
0 - 60 is around 7 seconds.
UK spec is 300bhp, 0 - 60: 7.1sec, 149mph top speed
I have a 1989 200,000m 560SEL which I have personally had 147mph on the speedo, there was 1000rpm left but foot flat to the floor, there was no more power left.
0 - 60 is around 7 seconds.
UK spec is 300bhp, 0 - 60: 7.1sec, 149mph top speed
