View Poll Results: Which is the better car
Mercedes S-Class
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149
81.42%
Lexus LS430
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34
18.58%
Voters: 183. You may not vote on this poll
MERCEDES S-CLASS vs LEXUS LS430
#151
all lexus people can do is complain about the price of the S class (if you are buying a car in this range price shouldnt be as important as you are making it) and reliability (i have NEVER had a problem with my S class Mercedes so this is not an issue for me) In the end Mercedes is FAR more stylish (mercedes vs lexus styling is the difference between man and god) and has a much better ride
#152
Originally posted by internet_mafia
I think that it's a shame that Lexus liked the W140 so much that they used it as thier inspiration when they designed the LS. You can almost super-impose the LS 430 over a 92'-99' S class. I like the S class because the styling is 100% original. You lexus lovers out there may talk down about the S class for whatever "reasons", but you are the ones who are driving the product of a company that looks up to Mercedes for guidance. Just admit it, the Lexus brand means "second-rate".
I think that it's a shame that Lexus liked the W140 so much that they used it as thier inspiration when they designed the LS. You can almost super-impose the LS 430 over a 92'-99' S class. I like the S class because the styling is 100% original. You lexus lovers out there may talk down about the S class for whatever "reasons", but you are the ones who are driving the product of a company that looks up to Mercedes for guidance. Just admit it, the Lexus brand means "second-rate".
#153
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2007 S550 Sport
Lexus meaning second rate? Lexus is the brand that "woke up" MB in the 90's and lit a fire under their butts. Lexus made a better MB than MB. The fact that a "rebadged Toyota" did it is just that more embarrassing. So there is no question that Lexus looks to MB for guidance, it's the difference between a 13 year old company and a century year old company. And each has to rely on it's strengths. It will be a sad day when MB looks to Lexus to decide which way the luxury market will go. The Germans are famous for their powertrains and handling, and that shows. The Japanese are famous for their reliablity and that shows. Now styling is very subjective. Its funny how millions of people "admired" the styling of the old 140 body S class. And when Lexus came out with the new LS, people claimed it was too boxy, outdated, blah blah. Yeah, it was an updated carbon of the 140, but who cares, it works. When the new S came out, many people who own the previous model derided it for being too curvy, they didn't like the more modern look. I don't like the styling of the new LS, but it looks better than the old S and the old LS and for many thats all that matters.
As for comparisons between the LS and new S, if you're comparing the LS430 to the S430, I don't know how you're convincing yourself. Styling preferences aside, the LS is a better car, powertrain wise, luxury wise, reliability wise. If you want a sports car get an E, GS, or 5-Series. That's not the point. The benefit of the S is that you can get a S500, S600, which I feel are not playing in the same league as the LS and are better vehicles.
I also feel that now with MB thriving, they're going back to their old ways. Reliability is down across the board with all their vehicles (except the M-class, but those were horrible when they first came out). Just look through this board at how many people have peoblems with their new MB's. If you haven't had any problems, then lucky you, but you're likely in the minority. My 9 year old Lexus SC300 has had zero problems other than normal wear and tear. My dad's 2000 S500 has already been at the MB dealer 3 times.
If you're looking at performance and value, the new LS is a better car than the new S430. To compare the LS430 to the whole S-class is a moot point. And I really hope MB owners do not get complacent and defend MB blindly just because they feel having a 3 pointed star means everything. I like both the Lexus and MB names. They make the other better for it. But I won't play favorites and brand loyalty is biggest load of s**t, so give credit where it is due.
It's funny how I've had to write this same sort of post over at the clublexus forums, people comparing the LS430 to the S600... geez...
As for comparisons between the LS and new S, if you're comparing the LS430 to the S430, I don't know how you're convincing yourself. Styling preferences aside, the LS is a better car, powertrain wise, luxury wise, reliability wise. If you want a sports car get an E, GS, or 5-Series. That's not the point. The benefit of the S is that you can get a S500, S600, which I feel are not playing in the same league as the LS and are better vehicles.
I also feel that now with MB thriving, they're going back to their old ways. Reliability is down across the board with all their vehicles (except the M-class, but those were horrible when they first came out). Just look through this board at how many people have peoblems with their new MB's. If you haven't had any problems, then lucky you, but you're likely in the minority. My 9 year old Lexus SC300 has had zero problems other than normal wear and tear. My dad's 2000 S500 has already been at the MB dealer 3 times.
If you're looking at performance and value, the new LS is a better car than the new S430. To compare the LS430 to the whole S-class is a moot point. And I really hope MB owners do not get complacent and defend MB blindly just because they feel having a 3 pointed star means everything. I like both the Lexus and MB names. They make the other better for it. But I won't play favorites and brand loyalty is biggest load of s**t, so give credit where it is due.
It's funny how I've had to write this same sort of post over at the clublexus forums, people comparing the LS430 to the S600... geez...
#154
I agree, for the most part, with Mr. "T0ked."
I think a lot of people miss an important point when they claim a Lexus is just a re-badged Toyota: Toyota (and Honda) both mass-produce very reliable, average family sedans. I think that's quite a feat of an engineering in and of itself; I find it difficult to imagine BMW or Mercedes building a *very* reliable, moose-test-passing car for $15k-$22k (prices for an Accord or a Camry). The Mini and A-class are both north of the $20k mark, and they've got their own requisite problems. The fact of the matter is Toyota can mass-produce reliable cars cheaply, and that's a skill MB apparently doesn't have, when even a $55k E500 has a slew of issues. And I think this basic reliability translates into a very good car when Toyota decides to build an LS or GS or whatever.
I'm not a brand-loyalist either, as I've had both Lexi and MBs in our family stable. I think both make fantastic cars, and each have their own strengths. I also had the pleasure of driving a friend's 540i today, and boy, if you want a sporty driving experience, no E-class or GS is ever going to match that. Took a 10-mph hairpin at about triple the speed with the 540i; first time, DSC stopped me from taking a nice drift through, the second time, I turned off DSC, and boy, fantastic!! I just think it's so wondeful we have so many choices, and I hope MB, Lexus and BMW keep pushing each other to just make better and better cars.
![Smilie](https://mbworld.org/forums/images/smilies/smile.gif)
I'm not a brand-loyalist either, as I've had both Lexi and MBs in our family stable. I think both make fantastic cars, and each have their own strengths. I also had the pleasure of driving a friend's 540i today, and boy, if you want a sporty driving experience, no E-class or GS is ever going to match that. Took a 10-mph hairpin at about triple the speed with the 540i; first time, DSC stopped me from taking a nice drift through, the second time, I turned off DSC, and boy, fantastic!! I just think it's so wondeful we have so many choices, and I hope MB, Lexus and BMW keep pushing each other to just make better and better cars.
#155
Originally posted by T0ked
Now styling is very subjective. Its funny how millions of people "admired" the styling of the old 140 body S class. And when Lexus came out with the new LS, people claimed it was too boxy, outdated, blah blah. Yeah, it was an updated carbon of the 140, but who cares, it works. When the new S came out, many people who own the previous model derided it for being too curvy, they didn't like the more modern look. I don't like the styling of the new LS, but it looks better than the old S and the old LS and for many thats all that matters.
Now styling is very subjective. Its funny how millions of people "admired" the styling of the old 140 body S class. And when Lexus came out with the new LS, people claimed it was too boxy, outdated, blah blah. Yeah, it was an updated carbon of the 140, but who cares, it works. When the new S came out, many people who own the previous model derided it for being too curvy, they didn't like the more modern look. I don't like the styling of the new LS, but it looks better than the old S and the old LS and for many thats all that matters.
Again, Lexus enhanced upon the W140, so it is no suprise that it outshines a 10 year old style. The core of the argument though is that duplicating the W140 led to Lexus "obtaining" a winning design without actually doing any work, which is the equivalence of plaigerism.
#156
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2007 S550 Sport
Of course they sold more, the new S attracted more people. If you read some of the magazine articles and people who write to them, many people did not agree with MBs newly styled S. They felt it was too radical, especially from previous owners. And that's what my post states. Nothing more, nothing less. Nowhere does it say that millions of people preferred the styling of the 140. Nothing was exaggerated. The only one doing that is you.
Like I said, styling is subjective. Just like the new Bimmer 7 and Z4. Some people love it and some hate it. I think the new S is beautiful which is why I pushed my father to get the S500, but it's more than skin that makes a car. There are those who love the styling of the new LS. Obviously since this is an MB forum, people here have already made up their minds that the S is prettier than the LS.
The core of the arguement is is the LS430 a better car than the S-class, and at certain levels of equipment, it is.
Like I said, styling is subjective. Just like the new Bimmer 7 and Z4. Some people love it and some hate it. I think the new S is beautiful which is why I pushed my father to get the S500, but it's more than skin that makes a car. There are those who love the styling of the new LS. Obviously since this is an MB forum, people here have already made up their minds that the S is prettier than the LS.
The core of the arguement is is the LS430 a better car than the S-class, and at certain levels of equipment, it is.
#159
Originally posted by T0ked
And how does that translate to millions of people dissed the new S????
And how does that translate to millions of people dissed the new S????
#160
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Yes, derided by "many people who own the previous model". How that translates into millions is beyond me. But we are now getting into an arguement over symantics. Anyway, the new S attracted many new buyers and many previous model owners, that is obvious. But the core of my arguement still stands.
#161
The Lexus LS comes off as a cheap shot when compared to the S430. I mean, everything about the LS spells MERCEDES. I notice that this is only with a lexus. When I look at the interior of the LS, all I see is S-class, from the steering wheel, headrests, door panels, etc. Every other car manufacture has their own identity and style, Lexus doesn't. This is what my beaf is with the clowns who dare to compare a wannabee to the real thing. If you want Mercedes styling, then by a Mercedes.
The foolish love-lexus logic goes like this:
"So what if our car tries to looks like a mercedes from inside and out. So what if it's not original. So what that the LS doesn't pack the unrivaled technology of a mercedes. At least the LS is more reliable."
How do you define reliable? How do you measure it?
Style, uniqueness, prestige, technology, craftmenship, and the quality of the materials is what really matters. You can't offset all of these things by comparing how frequent a car visits the dealership. So you're not getting a better car for the money, you are getting a cheaper built car for your money. The S class blows away the LS car in terms of the number of safety/sensing programs and the years of research dedicated to providing the latest technology.
The foolish love-lexus logic goes like this:
"So what if our car tries to looks like a mercedes from inside and out. So what if it's not original. So what that the LS doesn't pack the unrivaled technology of a mercedes. At least the LS is more reliable."
How do you define reliable? How do you measure it?
Style, uniqueness, prestige, technology, craftmenship, and the quality of the materials is what really matters. You can't offset all of these things by comparing how frequent a car visits the dealership. So you're not getting a better car for the money, you are getting a cheaper built car for your money. The S class blows away the LS car in terms of the number of safety/sensing programs and the years of research dedicated to providing the latest technology.
#163
Senior Member
Originally Posted by internet_mafia
The Lexus LS comes off as a cheap shot when compared to the S430. I mean, everything about the LS spells MERCEDES. I notice that this is only with a lexus. When I look at the interior of the LS, all I see is S-class, from the steering wheel, headrests, door panels, etc. Every other car manufacture has their own identity and style, Lexus doesn't. This is what my beaf is with the clowns who dare to compare a wannabee to the real thing. If you want Mercedes styling, then by a Mercedes.
The foolish love-lexus logic goes like this:
"So what if our car tries to looks like a mercedes from inside and out. So what if it's not original. So what that the LS doesn't pack the unrivaled technology of a mercedes. At least the LS is more reliable."
How do you define reliable? How do you measure it?
Style, uniqueness, prestige, technology, craftmenship, and the quality of the materials is what really matters. You can't offset all of these things by comparing how frequent a car visits the dealership. So you're not getting a better car for the money, you are getting a cheaper built car for your money. The S class blows away the LS car in terms of the number of safety/sensing programs and the years of research dedicated to providing the latest technology.
The foolish love-lexus logic goes like this:
"So what if our car tries to looks like a mercedes from inside and out. So what if it's not original. So what that the LS doesn't pack the unrivaled technology of a mercedes. At least the LS is more reliable."
How do you define reliable? How do you measure it?
Style, uniqueness, prestige, technology, craftmenship, and the quality of the materials is what really matters. You can't offset all of these things by comparing how frequent a car visits the dealership. So you're not getting a better car for the money, you are getting a cheaper built car for your money. The S class blows away the LS car in terms of the number of safety/sensing programs and the years of research dedicated to providing the latest technology.
#164
There is a $20k price gap between the two vehicles. The fact that you would compare the two tells me that the Lexus wins for "value". The LS430 also obviously wins for performance. The LS430 has been considered the most well-built vehicle, and has awards for reliability, so there's that. The 2004 LS430 boasts Grade 6 leather and numerous standard options. While the 2006 S-Class should be superior, the current incarnation is definately being outdone.
#167
Originally Posted by Samoan_Ridah
The LS just looks ugly to me. I wouldn't care if they gold plated the dashboard or put lambskin on the seats, the thing is just hideous.
S-Class hands down!
S-Class hands down!
But as for what suits me, it would be the S-Class. It's a great car, IMHO!
![thumbs](https://mbworld.org/forums/images/smilies/thumbsup.gif)
#168
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w211 & w124
Originally Posted by DevilishBenz
Sorry Brian, I gotta disagree. The LS is very beautiful on the outside.
But as for what suits me, it would be the S-Class. It's a great car, IMHO!![thumbs](https://mbworld.org/forums/images/smilies/thumbsup.gif)
But as for what suits me, it would be the S-Class. It's a great car, IMHO!
![thumbs](https://mbworld.org/forums/images/smilies/thumbsup.gif)
I would still drive one. I just wouldn't buy one.
#171
![Exclamation](https://mbworld.org/forums/images/icons/icon4.gif)
Originally Posted by 1SICKLEX
S 430 (well discontinued now)
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Uhhhh, S-55 OWNZS LS 430 but LS430>S 500 IMO
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Uhhhh, S-55 OWNZS LS 430 but LS430>S 500 IMO
Toyota's offsrping with LS label is better match for E-Class, than S-Class
No matter which S-Class you take, it is worthless to compare lower level vehicle with Mercedes.
BTW why you don't compare it with Hyundai Sonata or Kia Amanti???
![hammer](https://mbworld.org/forums/images/smilies/bonk.gif)
#172
![Talking](https://mbworld.org/forums/images/icons/icon10.gif)
Originally Posted by lex400sc
Funny you call it a "riceburner", but the riceburner will smoke it's pricier competitors the S430 and S500. Ain't that a biitch!?
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![Roll Eyes (Sarcastic)](https://mbworld.org/forums/images/smilies/rolleyes.gif)
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![Roll Eyes (Sarcastic)](https://mbworld.org/forums/images/smilies/rolleyes.gif)
No fool tries to compare Ferrari Enzo and Ford Mustang as cars...?
LS430 is totally tasteless design with most of the features "borrowed" from German car makers, with only exception of Navi system, the rest is - p.o.s.
Toyota vs Mercedes?
That's funny!
![beat](https://mbworld.org/forums/images/smilies/beat.gif)
![wwf](https://mbworld.org/forums/images/smilies/chairshot.gif)
#174
Originally Posted by DMI+RY
with only exception of Navi system, the rest is - p.o.s.
#175
![Exclamation](https://mbworld.org/forums/images/icons/icon4.gif)
Originally Posted by Tandrek
The Lexus LS430 boasts Grade 6 leather, while the S-Class only offers Grade-5 leather. The Lexus LS430 is approximately $55k, while the S-Class is closer to $75k. Additionally, the Lexus LS430 both outperforms and outlasts (reliability) the S-Class. The Navi System is not the only superior factor...
Going further....
Leather? Well, very hard to tell, I prefer Napa leather (installed on S500 and up S-Class) rather than LS430.
Price difference? Yes, about 50% more for S500, but if you are getting the Car and not average vehicle.
Reliability? Yeah, lately MB has some issues in electrical department mostly because of asian friends... I believe they are working on that and S-Class getting better lately...
Considering LS430 reliability - well, its advertised very well as reliable car, thanks to quick problem reaction of Lexus dealers, but the car has fewer electronics and systems than S-Class...
Another thing which was kinda funny, my sister drive LS430 (lease, 2nd year, about 18k miles). Last month completely dead car went to dealer... What happened?
Even I was shocked - engine replacement!
So, talking about reliability...
![drive](https://mbworld.org/forums/images/smilies/driving.gif)