P0410 on S600 getting frustrated...
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2005 Mercedes S600, 2004 Mercedes E500 4-Matic, 2002 Mercedes C32 AMG, 2001 Trans-Am WS-6
**UPDATE - SOLVED** P0410 on S600 getting frustrated...
I've been chasing a P0410 code for almost a year now on my 2005 S600 and am getting really frustrated, so I figure I'll throw out what I have so far.
I've replaced the secondary air injection pump, the replacement turned out to be bad, so I replaced it again and verified it works (I can hear it activating, and I can trigger it via DAS).
Because it's turning on, I'm assuming it's not the relay panel (correct me if I'm incorrect with this assumption). I did, however, replace the HELA relay that plugs into the panel anyway, just in case.
If I reset the light, it drives for about 50-100miles, but when the CEL decides to come back on, it does it CONSISTENTLY when I come to a stop at a light (when the car stops and is at idle, I can hear the SAI pump turn on for a moment, then turn off, then the light comes on). I realize the pump shouldn't run all the time, it doesn't. I'm guessing it's activating and looking for a drop at the o2 sensors, which it must not see, hence the CEL turning back on. I've replaced the sensors anyway (no codes...but @ 100k miles, it can't hurt).
I've pulled the two saucer shaped valves off the car (front of engine where the hoses lead to). They were both coked with black soot on the inside, so I soaked in cleaner, wiped them off, made sure the plunger could move, and reinstalled. I'm wondering if these could be bad? I did look at the reeds, but was scared to touch them (I sprayed them with plastic safe cleaner but didn't physically manipulate them).
Cleared all the codes again yesterday, but today when driving to work, it popped back on at the McD's drive though window (same deal...could hear the pump turn on, then off, then the light).
Help, please. Thoughts? Thanks!!
I've replaced the secondary air injection pump, the replacement turned out to be bad, so I replaced it again and verified it works (I can hear it activating, and I can trigger it via DAS).
Because it's turning on, I'm assuming it's not the relay panel (correct me if I'm incorrect with this assumption). I did, however, replace the HELA relay that plugs into the panel anyway, just in case.
If I reset the light, it drives for about 50-100miles, but when the CEL decides to come back on, it does it CONSISTENTLY when I come to a stop at a light (when the car stops and is at idle, I can hear the SAI pump turn on for a moment, then turn off, then the light comes on). I realize the pump shouldn't run all the time, it doesn't. I'm guessing it's activating and looking for a drop at the o2 sensors, which it must not see, hence the CEL turning back on. I've replaced the sensors anyway (no codes...but @ 100k miles, it can't hurt).
I've pulled the two saucer shaped valves off the car (front of engine where the hoses lead to). They were both coked with black soot on the inside, so I soaked in cleaner, wiped them off, made sure the plunger could move, and reinstalled. I'm wondering if these could be bad? I did look at the reeds, but was scared to touch them (I sprayed them with plastic safe cleaner but didn't physically manipulate them).
Cleared all the codes again yesterday, but today when driving to work, it popped back on at the McD's drive though window (same deal...could hear the pump turn on, then off, then the light).
Help, please. Thoughts? Thanks!!
Last edited by marktan; 01-08-2013 at 04:37 PM.
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2005 Mercedes S600, 2004 Mercedes E500 4-Matic, 2002 Mercedes C32 AMG, 2001 Trans-Am WS-6
I've got STAR DAS/XENTRY, and I see where I can turn it off...I am afraid it will fail the Chicago yearly emissions test if I do (??)
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2005 Mercedes S600, 2004 Mercedes E500 4-Matic, 2002 Mercedes C32 AMG, 2001 Trans-Am WS-6
Without hooking it up to the car, I'll have to dig in the Xentry simulaton when I get home, but I do recall seeing an option for disabling the MIL as it pertains to the pump.
Off the top of my head, I think it was in Drive --> Motronic 2.7 -->adaptations or developer menu.
You can also send a signal to the unit under actuations to test it. Sorry I don't have more off hand.
Given my emissions test need, I have until March or April to figure this out.
Off the top of my head, I think it was in Drive --> Motronic 2.7 -->adaptations or developer menu.
You can also send a signal to the unit under actuations to test it. Sorry I don't have more off hand.
Given my emissions test need, I have until March or April to figure this out.
Last edited by marktan; 11-21-2012 at 12:48 AM.
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2005 Mercedes S600, 2004 Mercedes E500 4-Matic, 2002 Mercedes C32 AMG, 2001 Trans-Am WS-6
Well I wanted to wait for several hundred miles to pass, and I'm happy to report that my P0410 (Secondary Air) problem has been resolved. The light has been on for almost a year and probably 10k miles, and I've been trying to diagnose the damn thing for months. What a pain in the *** to diagnose and remedy!!! There was nothing in DAS that helped to identify or solve the problem other than remotely activating the secondary air pump or being told to check voltage at the relay.
Here's the saga in a nutshell. FWIW, a lot of time (months) and miles (thousands) may bave passed between steps as I either didn't have time to mess with it, or I was so disgustingly pissed I refused to deal with it.
P0410 code triggered:
1) Replaced SAP relay ($25)...still no pump activation. CEL Code returned after ~100 miles.
2) Replaced Secondary air pump ($400)...code returned after ~50 miles.
3) Turns out the replacement pump was bad, so I replaced that again. Verified function via DAS this time. Code returned after ~30 miles.
4) removed and de-coked the two secondary air (saucer shaped) check valves and reed valves in front of the engine ($10 in carb cleaner). They were completely sealed shut with carbon. Checked valve function ($50 vacuum tool) while off the car. Good. reinstalled. Code returned after ~60 miles.
5) Checked the actual vacuum LINE from valve. No seal. Apparently the translucent white rigid-plastic vacuum tube had broken inside the black sheathing (probably when I moved it to replace my coil packs) so it wasn't visible that the line was broken. Replaced entire vacuum line ($12) between the check valves and the control valve solenoid thing (under the passenger side intercooler next to the turbo vacuum valve solenoid) with silicone vacuum tubing (couldn't find the original rigid line). Cleaned the little blue dime-sized check valve as well. Made it ~30 miles, and the light came back on.
6) Last ditch effort, I ordered and replaced the black vacuum control solenoid ($40) about two weeks ago. After 560 miles, no light!!
Thus ends this chapter. I just wanted to give others an idea of things to look at/for if you experience this as well.
Here's the saga in a nutshell. FWIW, a lot of time (months) and miles (thousands) may bave passed between steps as I either didn't have time to mess with it, or I was so disgustingly pissed I refused to deal with it.
P0410 code triggered:
1) Replaced SAP relay ($25)...still no pump activation. CEL Code returned after ~100 miles.
2) Replaced Secondary air pump ($400)...code returned after ~50 miles.
3) Turns out the replacement pump was bad, so I replaced that again. Verified function via DAS this time. Code returned after ~30 miles.
4) removed and de-coked the two secondary air (saucer shaped) check valves and reed valves in front of the engine ($10 in carb cleaner). They were completely sealed shut with carbon. Checked valve function ($50 vacuum tool) while off the car. Good. reinstalled. Code returned after ~60 miles.
5) Checked the actual vacuum LINE from valve. No seal. Apparently the translucent white rigid-plastic vacuum tube had broken inside the black sheathing (probably when I moved it to replace my coil packs) so it wasn't visible that the line was broken. Replaced entire vacuum line ($12) between the check valves and the control valve solenoid thing (under the passenger side intercooler next to the turbo vacuum valve solenoid) with silicone vacuum tubing (couldn't find the original rigid line). Cleaned the little blue dime-sized check valve as well. Made it ~30 miles, and the light came back on.
6) Last ditch effort, I ordered and replaced the black vacuum control solenoid ($40) about two weeks ago. After 560 miles, no light!!
Thus ends this chapter. I just wanted to give others an idea of things to look at/for if you experience this as well.
Last edited by marktan; 01-11-2013 at 12:25 PM.
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'96 SL600, '05 S55 AMG, '06 C230
Good news, Marktan! I was intrigued by your problem as the P4010 error on my '05 S55 is uncannily similar. You discuss replacing the black solenoid, is that the one that activates the secondary air check valves? Just wanted to clarify.
Cheers,
Jeff
Cheers,
Jeff
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Last edited by marktan; 01-11-2013 at 12:27 PM.
#13
6) Last ditch effort, I ordered and replaced the black vacuum control solenoid ($40) about two weeks ago. After 560 miles, no light!!
Thus ends this chapter. I just wanted to give others an idea of things to look at/for if you experience this as well.[/QUOTE]
Marktan
Could you please tell me the part number or if you have a picture I have the same problem I'm in mexico and the local mercedes has no clue on what is the black vacuum control solenoid??
thanks
Thus ends this chapter. I just wanted to give others an idea of things to look at/for if you experience this as well.[/QUOTE]
Marktan
Could you please tell me the part number or if you have a picture I have the same problem I'm in mexico and the local mercedes has no clue on what is the black vacuum control solenoid??
thanks
#15
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Passed California Emissions Test with P0410 code!! Well, here's what I did: Reset the code, smog shop said the computer had 4 items that were "Not Ready." so I put about 50 miles on it, went back, and then 2 items were "Not Ready," but that's OK, you can pass with a maximum of 2 registers not ready (the car had not yet checked those systems). As soon as I got about 60 miles on it, CEL was back on, but Smog was DONE!!
I'm chasing the P0410 problem on my 99 SLK230 now, have replaced the EGR valve, check valve, vacuum hoses, oil separator, cleaned MAF, Air system, throttle body, big valve on the supercharger, and checked that solenoid valve, which seemed to work, but I don't know if vacuum is flowing/blocking as it should, so I will replace that next. I'll post what finally fixes mine (if anything ever does!!).
I'm chasing the P0410 problem on my 99 SLK230 now, have replaced the EGR valve, check valve, vacuum hoses, oil separator, cleaned MAF, Air system, throttle body, big valve on the supercharger, and checked that solenoid valve, which seemed to work, but I don't know if vacuum is flowing/blocking as it should, so I will replace that next. I'll post what finally fixes mine (if anything ever does!!).
Last edited by SoCalSLKDude; 03-19-2015 at 04:28 AM.
#16
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I get the code now and then, but it usually clears on its own after three or four drives. I have replaced the vacuum actuators, checked lines, etc. One nice Spring day, I will try cleaning the air passages in the head with a piece of heavy, square weed cutter line.
#17
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That was the last thing we did - removed the pipe that the EGR check valve is attached to, that goes into the exhaust - and cleaned it out with a frayed SS wire cable chucked into a drill! No change for me.
#18
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5) Checked the actual vacuum LINE from valve. No seal. Apparently the translucent white rigid-plastic vacuum tube had broken inside the black sheathing (probably when I moved it to replace my coil packs) so it wasn't visible that the line was broken. Replaced entire vacuum line ($12) between the check valves and the control valve solenoid thing (under the passenger side intercooler next to the turbo vacuum valve solenoid) with silicone vacuum tubing (couldn't find the original rigid line). Cleaned the little blue dime-sized check valve as well. Made it ~30 miles, and the light came back on.
6) Last ditch effort, I ordered and replaced the black vacuum control solenoid ($40) about two weeks ago. After 560 miles, no light!!
This photo is from my S65. I may have damaged the white rigid vacuum line when moving it out of the way to replace the coil pack. Below that is the vacuum line which goes to a T connector for the turbo solenoid.
Last edited by amstel78; 02-26-2017 at 06:15 PM.
#19
James,
Just did this over the weekend on my CL65. You do not remove the vacuum lines from the valve; the two valves are each attached in place to the silver metal 'stand' by a small clip on the black metal band holding the vacuum valve to the silver stand. Push the clip in slightly and the valve assembly slides off towards the front of the car.
dave
Just did this over the weekend on my CL65. You do not remove the vacuum lines from the valve; the two valves are each attached in place to the silver metal 'stand' by a small clip on the black metal band holding the vacuum valve to the silver stand. Push the clip in slightly and the valve assembly slides off towards the front of the car.
dave
#20
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James,
Just did this over the weekend on my CL65. You do not remove the vacuum lines from the valve; the two valves are each attached in place to the silver metal 'stand' by a small clip on the black metal band holding the vacuum valve to the silver stand. Push the clip in slightly and the valve assembly slides off towards the front of the car.
dave
Just did this over the weekend on my CL65. You do not remove the vacuum lines from the valve; the two valves are each attached in place to the silver metal 'stand' by a small clip on the black metal band holding the vacuum valve to the silver stand. Push the clip in slightly and the valve assembly slides off towards the front of the car.
dave
#21
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Only thing I can think of now is that there's an issue with 126/1 and 126/2 or that my O2 sensors are getting lazy and not registering the change in exhaust oxygen content fast enough once the pump kicks on.
In the interim, I end up clearing out the P0410 DTC with an OBD tool as having the CEL come on messes with my OCD..
#22
Super Member
Does anyone have a part number for me? I’m also getting this P0410 code and it’s annoying.
#23
MBWorld Fanatic!
I finally just used DAS to tell the ECU to not monitor the system - no longer get a MIL (check engine light), no code, no affect on emissions testing. The secondary air system is one of the things that make the W220 a very low emissions vehicle, which is lower than Federal standards require.
#24
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I finally just used DAS to tell the ECU to not monitor the system - no longer get a MIL (check engine light), no code, no affect on emissions testing. The secondary air system is one of the things that make the W220 a very low emissions vehicle, which is lower than Federal standards require.
#25
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DAMIFINO - I've slept since then. I spent several hours on DAS exploring different ways to change what was active and what wasn't. I'm in the middle of a major move, so probably won't have time to go back in anytime soon - Sorry!