MAF HELL. PLEASE HELP!!
03-23-2017, 09:47 AM
#77
Senior Member
Unfortunately there isn't sufficient info in those photos to make any sort of educated guess as to the condition of your O2 sensors. It'd really have to be diagnosed in real time by someone familiar with emissions systems.
Did you decide to replace the cats anyway? I know you said you already ordered and received them right?
Did you decide to replace the cats anyway? I know you said you already ordered and received them right?
03-23-2017, 02:23 PM
#78
Member
Thread Starter
Unfortunately there isn't sufficient info in those photos to make any sort of educated guess as to the condition of your O2 sensors. It'd really have to be diagnosed in real time by someone familiar with emissions systems.
Did you decide to replace the cats anyway? I know you said you already ordered and received them right?
Did you decide to replace the cats anyway? I know you said you already ordered and received them right?
I unfortunately still haven't ordered my MBII, so I looked for what was available in local parts stores, so that I could do the live readings on my 02 sensors & fuel trim, check all cylinders (even though the misfire monitors are ready, so I was almost certain it wasn't a plug or coil issue).
The scan tools that are readily available and capable of doing what I wanted were $200+ and weren't as comprehensive as I believe the MBII ($150) is for these cars. I needed to know for certain though as yesterday and today are the only days out of the week that I can be without the car. So I bit the bullet and took it to Mercedes (a different one as I've hated the first two) early this morning for confirmation.
They did all the required testing and the foreman spoke with me about all the results, my 02 sensors are not original, and are operating correctly/ no adaptive issues- fuel trims are good, pressure/map (is there
) and functioning correctly, maf functioning correctly. Only thing left is the cats, they said they were 200% positive and that confirmation based on actual diagnosis and not just code reading was all I needed. They at least were a decent dealership, I rather liked them a lot better than either of the two I had already been to. They didn't try to sell me on factory or convince me aftermarkets wouldn't work. The foreman actually offered to put them on if they were bolt on applications. I took it directly to the exhaust shop and left it, they are being done as we speak. Let's hope after this I can actually enjoy the car for a while. I hadn't even gotten to the little cosmetic things I want to do, it's been one thing after the next and both me and my wallet are quite tired.
02 sensors, replace them because cats are being replaced or leave them alone if they are still doing their job correctly? Spark plugs and a regular tune will be in my immediate future -iridium or regular platinum?
03-23-2017, 02:35 PM
#79
Senior Member
Leave the O2 sensors for now since they're still working. As for plugs, can't go wrong with either. Iridium will have a slightly longer lifespan than the platinum plugs, but won't give you any additional power. They'll also cost more. Either way, it's up to you.
Got my fingers crossed for you. Hope that once the exhaust shop installs the new cats, you'll be trouble free (for at least a while). I can completely sympathize with you and your wallet. I'm going to have to replace the engine mounts in my car soon, along with front torque arms, and lower control arms due to worn out ball joints.
Got my fingers crossed for you. Hope that once the exhaust shop installs the new cats, you'll be trouble free (for at least a while). I can completely sympathize with you and your wallet. I'm going to have to replace the engine mounts in my car soon, along with front torque arms, and lower control arms due to worn out ball joints.
03-24-2017, 12:24 AM
#80
Member
Thread Starter
Leave the O2 sensors for now since they're still working. As for plugs, can't go wrong with either. Iridium will have a slightly longer lifespan than the platinum plugs, but won't give you any additional power. They'll also cost more. Either way, it's up to you.
Got my fingers crossed for you. Hope that once the exhaust shop installs the new cats, you'll be trouble free (for at least a while). I can completely sympathize with you and your wallet. I'm going to have to replace the engine mounts in my car soon, along with front torque arms, and lower control arms due to worn out ball joints.
Got my fingers crossed for you. Hope that once the exhaust shop installs the new cats, you'll be trouble free (for at least a while). I can completely sympathize with you and your wallet. I'm going to have to replace the engine mounts in my car soon, along with front torque arms, and lower control arms due to worn out ball joints.
Having the V12 biturbo, but never having driven an AMG- I didn't believe I was seeing any loss in power. The car had a decent kick, or so I thought. As my guy thoughtfully pointed out though, I bought it running like sh*t, so what could I compare it to
. After picking it up this afternoon, I can see just how much the engine was suffocating during the last week and how thankful it seems to be able to breathe again. This thing has serious power, to the point where I believe I will have to relearn the car - hell, the car may have to relearn itself. What a difference, really. Rear cats are gone entirely, it only sightly roars above what I believe factory would, but oh boy does it move. Throttle response is flawless. It has been a long and expensive journey bringing her back to life, but driving it now makes it feel like it's been worth it. The exhaust guy said he tried to clear the code like 3 times but it wouldn't go out. When I started her up, it went out on its own (good sign). Fingers crossed that it will hold steady, I will come back and update the thread either way.
As always, the help I received here is/was massively appreciated and invaluable in most instances.
I did see you on the AMG forums, the price we pay to love these cars right. I will likely go with the regular Bosch platinum once I have had a chance to recover from this month. I had really good luck on FCP Euro and you can't beat their lifetime replacement policy. Anytime it goes, you get new ones, period. I didn't find the torque arms you mentioned and it looks like those two control arms will set you back a bit. Mounts are very reasonable, the Mercedes brand version is $90-something.
https://www.fcpeuro.com/products/mer...oem-w215lcakt1
https://www.fcpeuro.com/products/mer...unt-2202400917
I'll speak with you soon, hopefully with nothing but good news to share
03-24-2017, 02:00 AM
#81
Hopefully it works out and there's no more issues !!
your v12 biturbo should be quite a bit faster then this Amg s55 though - this is the earlier non supercharged Amg with about 350 horses , your biturbo 600 should be making nearly 500
your v12 biturbo should be quite a bit faster then this Amg s55 though - this is the earlier non supercharged Amg with about 350 horses , your biturbo 600 should be making nearly 500
03-24-2017, 07:15 AM
#82
Senior Member
The price of the engine mounts on my S65 aren't expensive and if I happen to have type B engine mounting arms, then hopefully I'll be able to swap them out myself. If not, then the labor cost alone is close to $2k to do the job.
As for the torque arms, they're sometimes also referred to as thrust arms. They attach to the front knuckle. The lower control arms also attach to the knuckle but also serve as the lower attachment point for the ABC strut. Replacing both is fairly straightforward.
But I digress. Your car should be breathing a lot better now. Glad to hear that everything again seems to be working well. Come back to us in a few days with updates. Hopefully no more codes will appear.
As for the torque arms, they're sometimes also referred to as thrust arms. They attach to the front knuckle. The lower control arms also attach to the knuckle but also serve as the lower attachment point for the ABC strut. Replacing both is fairly straightforward.
But I digress. Your car should be breathing a lot better now. Glad to hear that everything again seems to be working well. Come back to us in a few days with updates. Hopefully no more codes will appear.
03-24-2017, 11:09 AM
#83
Member
Thread Starter
Thank you though, I hope so as well.
03-24-2017, 11:29 AM
#84
Member
Thread Starter
The price of the engine mounts on my S65 aren't expensive and if I happen to have type B engine mounting arms, then hopefully I'll be able to swap them out myself. If not, then the labor cost alone is close to $2k to do the job.
As for the torque arms, they're sometimes also referred to as thrust arms. They attach to the front knuckle. The lower control arms also attach to the knuckle but also serve as the lower attachment point for the ABC strut. Replacing both is fairly straightforward.
But I digress. Your car should be breathing a lot better now. Glad to hear that everything again seems to be working well. Come back to us in a few days with updates. Hopefully no more codes will appear.
As for the torque arms, they're sometimes also referred to as thrust arms. They attach to the front knuckle. The lower control arms also attach to the knuckle but also serve as the lower attachment point for the ABC strut. Replacing both is fairly straightforward.
But I digress. Your car should be breathing a lot better now. Glad to hear that everything again seems to be working well. Come back to us in a few days with updates. Hopefully no more codes will appear.
If you can do the job yourself, all the better for you and your pockets. Maybe you can check out Victor and come back to us with your experience. He seems to pick repairing original parts over replacing them. Not saying your parts can be repaired, especially the mounts, but I'd love to see what he's capable of.
Yes, I will certainly update in some time and fingers crossed the cel stays off and codes remain at 0.
03-24-2017, 11:42 AM
#85
Senior Member
If I had an S55, or even an S600 NA, then the mounts would be easy. Unfortunately, the two turbos are right over the mounts in my car, making replacement a huge PITA. I already checked with Victor, and he says it's about $2k if he does the work. The dealer is about the same in terms of labor costs.
If I do end up having type B mounting arms, then I'll try to tackle this next winter when the car is garaged. If it's type A, then I don't know... WIS states the entire engine has to come out to replace the mounts. Others here have had luck dropping the subframe but even then, it's still an enormous pain to do.
If I do end up having type B mounting arms, then I'll try to tackle this next winter when the car is garaged. If it's type A, then I don't know... WIS states the entire engine has to come out to replace the mounts. Others here have had luck dropping the subframe but even then, it's still an enormous pain to do.
03-24-2017, 08:43 PM
#86
Super Member
If I had an S55, or even an S600 NA, then the mounts would be easy. Unfortunately, the two turbos are right over the mounts in my car, making replacement a huge PITA. I already checked with Victor, and he says it's about $2k if he does the work. The dealer is about the same in terms of labor costs.
If I do end up having type B mounting arms, then I'll try to tackle this next winter when the car is garaged. If it's type A, then I don't know... WIS states the entire engine has to come out to replace the mounts. Others here have had luck dropping the subframe but even then, it's still an enormous pain to do.
If I do end up having type B mounting arms, then I'll try to tackle this next winter when the car is garaged. If it's type A, then I don't know... WIS states the entire engine has to come out to replace the mounts. Others here have had luck dropping the subframe but even then, it's still an enormous pain to do.
03-24-2017, 11:04 PM
#87
Being quite honest, I don't drive the hell out of my cars, I'm a mom of two- I typically just cruise along with the flow of traffic. I'm also in Long Island, Suffolk County,where the police are overpaid and underworked, i.e. bored and looking for someone to harass. Judging just off of the throttle response and how quickly it picks up off the line - I want to say the AMG feels more responsive. Perhaps it has something to do with the weight of the engine or the fact that the abc system is gutted(overall weight) in the AMG and I never did in the CL600? I do remember when I first got the cl600, I was challenged at a light by a gentleman. The torque almost startled me, the cl600 is definitely a force to be reckoned with.
Thank you though, I hope so as well.
Thank you though, I hope so as well.
The s600 in stock tune is very tame unless you get a aftermarket tune or are heavy on the pedal . The turbo feels faster when at large throttle , and as the speed climbs much faster without letting up
I have a 500 and biturbo s600- the 500 feels more responsive at light throttle , but upon heavy throttle the 600 just keeps pulling hard where the 500 can't quite pull away as hard
03-25-2017, 12:14 AM
#88
Member
Thread Starter
If I had an S55, or even an S600 NA, then the mounts would be easy. Unfortunately, the two turbos are right over the mounts in my car, making replacement a huge PITA. I already checked with Victor, and he says it's about $2k if he does the work. The dealer is about the same in terms of labor costs.
If I do end up having type B mounting arms, then I'll try to tackle this next winter when the car is garaged. If it's type A, then I don't know... WIS states the entire engine has to come out to replace the mounts. Others here have had luck dropping the subframe but even then, it's still an enormous pain to do.
If I do end up having type B mounting arms, then I'll try to tackle this next winter when the car is garaged. If it's type A, then I don't know... WIS states the entire engine has to come out to replace the mounts. Others here have had luck dropping the subframe but even then, it's still an enormous pain to do.
I hope for your sake it's type B. You could continue to shop around the indy circuit if it is infact A, but sometimes you get what you pay for and you don't want just anyone in charge of lifting your approx $50k engine out of your car and then the supercharger to boot. Any mistakes could cost you way more than the original 2k. Fingers crossed that it's B and you can do it yourself.
03-25-2017, 12:25 AM
#89
Member
Thread Starter
yes, I do know what you mean about the non turbo car feeling more responsive .
The s600 in stock tune is very tame unless you get a aftermarket tune or are heavy on the pedal . The turbo feels faster when at large throttle , and as the speed climbs much faster without letting up
I have a 500 and biturbo s600- the 500 feels more responsive at light throttle , but upon heavy throttle the 600 just keeps pulling hard where the 500 can't quite pull away as hard
The s600 in stock tune is very tame unless you get a aftermarket tune or are heavy on the pedal . The turbo feels faster when at large throttle , and as the speed climbs much faster without letting up
I have a 500 and biturbo s600- the 500 feels more responsive at light throttle , but upon heavy throttle the 600 just keeps pulling hard where the 500 can't quite pull away as hard
03-25-2017, 06:03 PM
#90
Senior Member
Bummer about the mounts, I just had the motor and trans mounts done on mine and even in the S55 they aren't super easy. I love the 600/65's.. I'm definitely a luxury car enthusiast and all the little creature comforts of the 600/65's are really neat to me.. but I was just too afraid of that V12 TT.. my MB specialist said the motor has to come out for a lot of repairs which really left a bad taste in my mouth.. as I get older I don't have the time or patients to do a lot of my own wrenching like I used to do.. I'm really glad you are able to do your own work!! I thought I was the only fool around who's dumped a load of money making my ten year old w220 perfect but I see your on my tail lol!
I solved my leaking transmission issue; damn thing was just overfilled. I took enough out that the fluid was right between the 80 degree hash marks when hot. No more leaks.
Secondly, I was in the process of replacing my transmission mount when after removing the old mount, realized that the one I got from FCP Euro was the wrong one. It bolted to the transmission just fine, but when I lowered it onto the crossmember, only then saw that I was missing a bolt hole. I couldn't bolt it to the cross member. Removed it, put the old one back for now.
I also replaced a torn up rear passenger control arm cover. PO must have driven over something that just chewed it up. Fortunately the control arm itself was OK.
Finally, I got the three front belly pans back on after all the mounting hardware finally arrived from ECS.
At this point, only thing left to do is sort out my continuing P0410 error code (secondary air injection pump). The pump itself works. I can hear it turning on when first starting the car when the engine is cold. I thought i might have pinched or cracked a vacuum line when reinstalling the passenger side coil pack, so I replaced the vacuum line going into the secondary air injection vacuum solenoid. That didn't solve it. So, probably will replace the solenoid soon to see if that helps.
There is light at the end of the tunnel. Just hope I don't run out of money before that happens.
03-25-2017, 06:25 PM
#92
Senior Member
03-26-2017, 09:18 AM
#93
MBWorld Fanatic!
Another possible failure mode for the secondary air injection system is carbon-plugged passages in the cylinder head. Using an old speedometer cable (remember them?) or heavy square string-trimmer cord and a variable-speed drill to do some roto-rooting can help clear the passages. Just pull the two vacuum-operated valves and ream as much as you can.
You can also apply vacuum to the vacuum-operated valves to check the diaphragms.
You can also apply vacuum to the vacuum-operated valves to check the diaphragms.
03-26-2017, 03:10 PM
#95
Former Vendor of MBWorld
I'll be 39 in May. I also have two young daughters and a career that takes up a huge portion of my free time. To be completely honest, I'm not a fan of wrenching on my cars. I prefer driving them. I however have been cursed by the sensibility fairy plus have the benefit of mechanical inclination. So, in order to save money I end up doing most things myself. That said, I spent most of today on a cold concrete floor underneath my car. Not exactly a fun moment for me, but I did manage to fix a few pending issues.
I solved my leaking transmission issue; damn thing was just overfilled. I took enough out that the fluid was right between the 80 degree hash marks when hot. No more leaks.
Secondly, I was in the process of replacing my transmission mount when after removing the old mount, realized that the one I got from FCP Euro was the wrong one. It bolted to the transmission just fine, but when I lowered it onto the crossmember, only then saw that I was missing a bolt hole. I couldn't bolt it to the cross member. Removed it, put the old one back for now.
I also replaced a torn up rear passenger control arm cover. PO must have driven over something that just chewed it up. Fortunately the control arm itself was OK.
Finally, I got the three front belly pans back on after all the mounting hardware finally arrived from ECS.
At this point, only thing left to do is sort out my continuing P0410 error code (secondary air injection pump). The pump itself works. I can hear it turning on when first starting the car when the engine is cold. I thought i might have pinched or cracked a vacuum line when reinstalling the passenger side coil pack, so I replaced the vacuum line going into the secondary air injection vacuum solenoid. That didn't solve it. So, probably will replace the solenoid soon to see if that helps.
There is light at the end of the tunnel. Just hope I don't run out of money before that happens.
I solved my leaking transmission issue; damn thing was just overfilled. I took enough out that the fluid was right between the 80 degree hash marks when hot. No more leaks.
Secondly, I was in the process of replacing my transmission mount when after removing the old mount, realized that the one I got from FCP Euro was the wrong one. It bolted to the transmission just fine, but when I lowered it onto the crossmember, only then saw that I was missing a bolt hole. I couldn't bolt it to the cross member. Removed it, put the old one back for now.
I also replaced a torn up rear passenger control arm cover. PO must have driven over something that just chewed it up. Fortunately the control arm itself was OK.
Finally, I got the three front belly pans back on after all the mounting hardware finally arrived from ECS.
At this point, only thing left to do is sort out my continuing P0410 error code (secondary air injection pump). The pump itself works. I can hear it turning on when first starting the car when the engine is cold. I thought i might have pinched or cracked a vacuum line when reinstalling the passenger side coil pack, so I replaced the vacuum line going into the secondary air injection vacuum solenoid. That didn't solve it. So, probably will replace the solenoid soon to see if that helps.
There is light at the end of the tunnel. Just hope I don't run out of money before that happens.
I'm sorry to hear about the situation with the mount, were you able to get in touch with someone and get it remedied or is there something I can do to help out on that one--Kyle
03-26-2017, 03:52 PM
#96
Senior Member
03-26-2017, 03:53 PM
#97
Senior Member
Edit: just called FCP Euro. I gotta say, these guys rock. Talk about awesome customer service. I really appreciate your help Kyle.
Last edited by amstel78; 03-27-2017 at 11:39 AM.
03-28-2017, 01:10 AM
#98
Member
Thread Starter
Amstel, sorry to hear about your troubles. At least you were able to get a few things done. FCP Euro is pretty stellar, have to love a company that stands by its merchandise and values its customer. I have to ask, what on earth is an "Italian Tune-UP"?
You may have come across this already, but I did a quick search for you. It's the least I could do after the help you gave me.
This was on the E Class forum, but I believe the mechanics of the secondary air system are identical. Maybe check out that check valve OhLord is referring to.
I'm happy to report that the S55 is holding up well with all of its new parts and I don't anticipate any immediate headaches. I'll continue to check back in and see how your issues are coming along.
You may have come across this already, but I did a quick search for you. It's the least I could do after the help you gave me.
the code clearing had not thing to do with what you put in the fuel.The sec air pump comes on at start up to inject added oxygen into the exhaust so that the cats fire up in under 2 minutes.The P0410 will return. At least until you fix the secondary air issue. Lucas will not do it. P0410 also has no affect on mpg.The air pump comes on for a few minutes when the engine is cold(you can hear it pumping along when the engine is at high idle on cold start and then it goes off.
The obd2 system checks it periodically for proper function.
Check vac lines to it.Disconnect the feed lines to the exhaust and spray with crc cleaner, check the check valve. It is not a circuit malfunction or anything that a fuel additive will repair.
In colder months the check valve will fill with moisture,The weather has warmed up and the code is gone,it will return when the weather gets cold.Cheap part,replace it before it damages the air pump,which ain't so cheap.
The obd2 system checks it periodically for proper function.
Check vac lines to it.Disconnect the feed lines to the exhaust and spray with crc cleaner, check the check valve. It is not a circuit malfunction or anything that a fuel additive will repair.
In colder months the check valve will fill with moisture,The weather has warmed up and the code is gone,it will return when the weather gets cold.Cheap part,replace it before it damages the air pump,which ain't so cheap.
I'm happy to report that the S55 is holding up well with all of its new parts and I don't anticipate any immediate headaches. I'll continue to check back in and see how your issues are coming along.
03-28-2017, 09:23 AM
#99
Senior Member
Thanks, yes I saw that thread. It's given me some ideas. I'm still trying to figure out what exactly a check valve is on the M275 engine although I have a feeling it's the saucer-like device mounted at the front that has a vacuum line going into to it, and two larger air hoses coming in and out of it.
As for the "Italian tune-up", lol... it's basically a few passes at WOT (wide open throttle) to blow out any carbon build up in the engine. Granted, it's a bit difficult to do in an S65 on public roadways. I added some Techron to the tank to help clean out the fuel system. May add a bit of seafoam as well later to the crank right before I change the oil in two weeks.
I'll solve this issue eventually.
As for the "Italian tune-up", lol... it's basically a few passes at WOT (wide open throttle) to blow out any carbon build up in the engine. Granted, it's a bit difficult to do in an S65 on public roadways. I added some Techron to the tank to help clean out the fuel system. May add a bit of seafoam as well later to the crank right before I change the oil in two weeks.
I'll solve this issue eventually.
04-18-2017, 10:19 PM
#100
Member
Thread Starter
Just popping in to check on you guys, Amstel how did you make out? I'm happy to report the S55 is still running strong.
Last edited by CLK500 TWINS; 04-19-2017 at 01:01 AM.
