snovvman

Seeing the key-triggered trunk closing thread got me thinking... Coming from BMWs, if you have factory diag/programming tools, you can almost change every behavior of the vehicle. Features such as video in motion, disabling the navigation lockout, changing locale of voice prompts, whether a light controller checks for a bulb (if one upgraded from incandescent to LED), enabling/disabling airbags, enabling/disabling remote window up/down, and so much more all can be had. I've even flashed the DME (ECU) from EU to US and back (emissions implications). I see that VIM can be had here but a harness is required.

Can this sort of thing be done on the Benz platform? Since I now essentially own a S550 (car is still across the country...) from years of owning several BMW 7s, I started looking for mods/hacks/DIYs/retrofits for the Benz. Speaking of retrofits, there often features available in newer gen BMWs that can be transplanted to an older platform. And while I can always find plenty of that for BMWs, I am coming up short for the Benz. Am I just looking in the wrong places, or, is Benz more restrictive/limited or the Benz crowd simply less of the DIY type?

As an example, I saw that the MY13 M-Class supports A2DP, AVRCP, and MAP Bluetooth profiles, I know it is not available for the W221. After looking around, I don't see the possibility of a retrofit. Based upon my experience with BMWs, such retrofit would be possible and someone would have posted a DIY article. Here is one example BMW E38 DIYs/mods: http://www.e38.org/

This is not at all about bashing Benz or suggesting that it is inferior. I know better :-) I believe that there are *many* things that the Benz does very well or better than the Bavarian offering. Afterall, I am "here" and not "there". I simply want to understand the landscape better, having never owned a Benz...

Thanks.

Edit: I have to add that this Forum has been great so far. I have received great help from many members, some well above and beyond... The help this Forum provided played a crucial role in my decision to go Benz.... Cheers.

wywywywy

Yes a lot can be done with a knock off SD CONNECT tool and pirated Xentry/DAS software.

The problem is that the knock off tool is much more expensive (more than 20 times) than the BMW one, which is like £10 for a K+D CAN INPA adapter.

The software is also a lot more complicated, not to mention the set up.

So that's why you don't see as many people playing around with MB systems on the internet. It just isn't as popular due to a higher bar of entry.

Nickthegreek

Yes, It is much more expensive but well worth it and an investment. An S class has many complicated electronic control systems and diagnosing is almost impossible and very expensive without it.

I think mercedes does tend to be very restrictive and makes it difficult to modify their cars. There are a few people on the web that do retrofits on mercs for a living like i believe mbenznl

mnje350

So I have a hypothetical question. If you do modify a system or function and then later on have a problem with the system that requires a repair and you have an MB warranty or other third party warranty. . .

Can't the shop drill into the onboard computers and detected the non-authorized modification and void the warranty? I wondered that about the people that change the programming on ignition systems. In some countries you get fined for such a mod. In other places, repairs simply are excluded from warranty coverage maybe.

I guess if the car is out of warranty coverage, what does it matter.

cmpcpro

I know when I bought my 2014 Silverado that was a problem. The computer could tell if anything was modified, even the speedo recal for bigger tires, and would automatically flag it for warranty purposes. The guys on there knew up front if they modded their software, anything related to it would be void.

DaveW68

If changes are made via MB programming through their proprietary software and equipment, how could it possibly void your warranty?

mnje350

I am asking the question, again hypothetically, such that the modification is made through a third party and not an MB dealer. I am no expert but I believe that programming is based on the country and region that the car was originally sold and marketed in. While you could probably modify a system, ignition map, or function to enable a feature or change performance that is not available in the original delivered country, with the MB tools, it may still be an excuse to exclude waranty coverage. I am guessing mind you, that warranties purchased are based on the features included in the data card the car was originally delivered with. Just curious.

snovvman

For the dealer/manufacture to deny warranty, they would have to establish a nexus that the modification had a direct effect on the failure. In other words, if you modified the taillights and the steering wheel's wood cracks, they cannot deny the claim. I believe there is also legislation/consumer protection law(s) that provide for that.

If I flashed the programming on my ECM/DME (don't know what Benz calls their engine management computers) from U.S. to EU and back again, and my nav screen suffers a hardware failure, I think they would have a hard time making a case to deny warranty.

I've made many mods to my BMWs using factory software/hardware, and never once has the dealer give me a hard time. Again, don't know about Benz.

mnje350

I am not questioning a mod to the tail lights and warranty coverage to a failure of the power seats...

I question a modification to ignition programming and boost the engine output. If you make that mod and later on have a tranny issue BMW won't bat an eye and cover repairs under warranty? Good to know.

snovvman

Nuru

That is most likely because they did not detect the mod, if they detected the mod, then the dice starts rolling whether or not they will go for warranty coverage or not. I have retrofitted factory NAV into two C-classes (W203, W204) and retrofitted folding rear seats in a W204 and a W212. The W204's NAV retrofit worked fine, but it did require the use of a XENTRY/DAS terminal and the use of the Developers menu to configure the COMAND to report NAV data to the IC display. The individual who set it up also configured the car so that when I went to the dealership, the option did not cause the MB computers to burp on it. The dealership was really surprised as they sold me that car and could not figure out how come the configuration was not causing issues with software upgrades directed by the MB computers. Apparently the MB computers accepted the newly installed options as stock. I do not know what the guy did to set the system up like that, but he said it would work and it did. Access to a SD Connect and the XENTRY/DAS application suite is critical to retrofitting or enabling options on a car.

snovvman

I am motivated to setup my own XENTRY/DAS. I found many sources for software (including versions that support 221), but I see that the multiplexer might be a bit harder.

For the BMW GT1, someone developed a multiplexer emulator. This allowed the use of a generic cable that cost less than $100. I have not seen the same on the M-B side. I do see Chinese-made interfaces but have read that some do not work properly.

It would be great to see/explore/edit the settings and perform my own diagnostics. I realize I am taking a chance with warranty issues, but it is much too interesting to ignore. If anyone has information, please send it this way. Thanks.

Nuru

For 2010 and above W221 and the W222, the C4 SD Connect and XENTRY/DAS is what you need.

snovvman

If there is a "Thanks" button on the forum, I would have pushed it.

Nuru

You are welcome. BTW, this thread is primarily C3, but it will help you with learning what can be done with the STAR Diagnose system (XENTRY/DAS C3 [serial connection version] and C4 SD Connect [wireless and wired Ethernet connections version])

https://mbworld.org/forums/w211-amg/...ts-o-pics.html

Nickthegreek

If you look on ebay there are quite a few people selling the original Dell Latitude D630 with C4 Mux. Get that and don't fool around with the imitation Chinese mux's and virtual operating systems. It goes for around a grand but for a car that costs a grand on average for even small repairs it pays for itself in no time.

Nickthegreek

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Top-quality-MB-star-SD-C4-full-set-D630-laptop-Xentry-12-2014-HD-Software-/321630235168?hash=item4ae2a7ea20&item=321630235168&pt=Motors_Automotive_Tools&vxp=mtrBOOM!!! and comes with 12/14 software that upgrades until the next release!!!

Nuru

That seems to be a bit on the high side of the pricing from what I have seen in the past.

Nickthegreek

This is not a knockoff. This is the actual equipment and software. 600 is probably the cheapest youll find it.

Nuru

Nick, to get an authentic version of this set-up costs several thousand dollars and comes with some period of online access to the MB STAR Service computers. This one on the web is definitely a clone from China. Take a look at the link to the thread I posted in the earlier post and thatt will provide you with a load of info about these clones. There are a ton of these on sale from Chinese Vendors. You might be able to get a real system, used from Germany, but even then, that is hard to do as MB really keeps a tight handle on this and tends to only lease the Authentic C4 SD Connect Siemens multiplexor with their latest XENTRY/DAS applications suite to MB dealers and MB authorized independents. I have heard they provide updates and take the old equipment back from the dealers and independents. A dealer or independent goes out of business, and MB wants their leased equipment back.