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Doesn't really matter as long as it GETS changed. Oil interval at 5k mi with standard stuff (EVERYTHING is in the Owner's Manual, btw) and you're gtg.
But it does matter for the cold starts. If you get very cold temperatures, like around “0F” and colder, you really need that “0” as the low viscosity indicator on the oil to be able to start the engine with some lubrication flowing in the tiny oil channels right away. I would not risk that with too thick oil in cold temp.
After oil heats up it is fine no matter what the lower number is, the critical time is right after start.
as I mentioned earlier the temp range (cold or hot) in the merc owners manual is one to one with either 30 or 40 grade - but on the list 30 is the first column...
on later engines here's a load of manufacturers that have moved on for newer vehicles and here it shows its the manu spec that matters not the old rubbish on the front of a bottle
CASTROL EDGE 0W-20 C5
ACEA C5, C6
API SP
ILSAC GF-6
GM dexos1™ Gen 3*
Jaguar Land Rover engine oil specification STJLR.03.5006
This is somewhat anecdotal but I remember back when Ford introduced 5W-20 for their US vehicles. They made the mistake of retroactively applying their new fuel economy oil. What I recall was a bunch of RV guys running the Triton V10 in their Class C and Class A motorhomes and there was a period of significantly increased engine failures. If I recall Ford went back and said "oh yeah maybe not 5W-20 in those. Whoops."
Maybe that is an extreme example but it still applies if you like to exercise your vehicles like I do.
I run 5W-40 in my AMG products because I don't use them in the winter and I want the shear stability of 5W-40 vs 0W-40 (all things equal).
This is somewhat anecdotal but I remember back when Ford introduced 5W-20 for their US vehicles. They made the mistake of retroactively applying their new fuel economy oil. What I recall was a bunch of RV guys running the Triton V10 in their Class C and Class A motorhomes and there was a period of significantly increased engine failures. If I recall Ford went back and said "oh yeah maybe not 5W-20 in those. Whoops."
Maybe that is an extreme example but it still applies if you like to exercise your vehicles like I do.
I run 5W-40 in my AMG products because I don't use them in the winter and I want the shear stability of 5W-40 vs 0W-40 (all things equal).
What Kevm14 said. I run full synthetics 0-40 because this is my daily driver with temperatures occasionally below 0 degF.
I appreciate a debate about deeply detailed and long historical subjects like the evolution of motor oil with somewhat scientific data and real world experience to mix in the soup.
We’re only commuting. There’s trucking, F1, off-road, Top Fuel Drag (not gay)Cars, professional and commercial boating, on and on.
There is butt ton of real world data about oil and the combustion motor.
My good friend in the 90’s argued synthetic oil I ran in my motorcycle was no better protection than the Dino oil he ran in his. The whole synthetic thing was a conspiracy to charge us more money!
I serviced high performance fighter jets in the 1970’s, designed and built in 1950’s. Every gearbox on the jets were filled with “full synthetic “. Military and the Rolling Stones were involved in setting the stage for consumer higher price gouging…
More facts from reputable sources are abundant and support why synthetic is superior to dinosaur oil.
I get a little confused sometimes of correct viscosity vs engine vs operating environment.
Once figured out, I try to buy the best oil and filter in addition to timely oil and filter changes are cheap insurance.
JR
Last edited by johnnyrocket52; 11-27-2023 at 01:36 AM.
What Kevm14 said. I run full synthetics 0-40 because this is my daily driver with temperatures occasionally below 0 degF.
I appreciate a debate
My good friend in the 90’s argued synthetic oil I ran in my motorcycle was no better protection than the Dino oil he ran in his. The whole synthetic thing was a conspiracy to charge us more money!
JR
a lot of sense in your post - these bits add more
the difference between manu specs, relate to which and the quantity of what additives its got in there (which is why it matters)
on the old fossil air cooled boxer engine's to 2012 on BMW bikes, they would suggest you don't use synthetic oils until you'd done at least 20k miles or it never really got run in - because synthetic oils were so good it didn't clean up the rough surfaces from nasty machining and rough build
the difference between manu specs, relate to which and the quantity of what additives its got in there (which is why it matters)
on the old fossil air cooled boxer engine's to 2012 on BMW bikes, they would suggest you don't use synthetic oils until you'd done at least 20k miles or it never really got run in - because synthetic oils were so good it didn't clean up the rough surfaces from nasty machining and rough build
Yes. In the big oil debates, there’s a lot money in it, for them , but for me it breaks down to simply two things:
1). Combustion engines can serve up toasty temperatures on a hot day in the desert. Depending which testing and oil types, the internet articles about oil vary for synthetic oil breaking down at 450F to 700F and Dino at 250F to 300F. Winner: synthetic.
2). The modern day evolution of the additives separates the men from the boys. Synthetic additives have evolved and Dino oil got left behind with the lawn mowers, sort of (great additives but core Dino oil breaks down much before synthetic). Winner: Full Synthetic European and North American Car Formulas. Hometown boy chooses Mobile-1.
Articles speak to when Dino oil makes sense, Botus breaking in an engine when synthetic is too slick to break in or someone saving money to purchase more beer. Just have to change Dino oil more often, conversely, less beer.
My good friend highlighted the fact back the 60s his Dad changed his Dino oil and filter every other month before it turned dark. When they rebuilt the motor, the insides looked brand new. That there proves Dino oil works good just good as synthetic, and it’s one third the price! Must have only drove it to Church on Sunday.
Now that I reflect back, it’s starting to look like that test was rigged!
In a nutshell, if it meets or exceeds MB 229.5
l push the I believe button, and use it!
JR
Last edited by johnnyrocket52; 11-29-2023 at 06:45 PM.
1) lots of progress on material used to make an engine and even more on machining - these days laser sensors check the size live as its being made and clever CNC machines adjust tooling or better still swap tooling to a new one on the fly to compensate
2) cyl head, manifold design, emission control and fuel used is so far forwards its hard to comprehend - its all means the engine operates very differently and burn far closer tot he right stuff the right way. Black engine oil is the debris from wear, cold start contamination, but its mostly combustion gases going past the piston rings.
lots to choose... only one will be the best of mobil one products out there
This product is recommended for use in applications requiring:
APICF
VW503 01
This product meets or exceeds the requirements of:
AAE (STO 003)Group B7
APISJ
APISL
APISM
APISN
APISN PLUS
APISP
ACEA A3/B3
ACEA A3/B4
Ford WSS-M2C937-A
Fiat 9.55535-M2
-
Properties and Specifications
Grade
SAE 0W-40
Flash Point, Cleveland Open Cup, °C, ASTM D92
230
Kinematic Viscosity @ 40 C, mm2/s, ASTM D445
78,3
Kinematic Viscosity @ 100 C, mm2/s, ASTM D445
13,8
Density @ 15.6 C, g/ml, ASTM D4052
0,841
Viscosity Index, ASTM D2270
182
Pour Point, °C, ASTM D97
-42
THE GREEN ONE SAYS • Mobil 1 ESP X3 0W-40 can only be used in the vehicles for which it is approved. It is not backward compatible with vehicle engines requiring an A40, C30 or C20 . ***
*** Always consult the owner's manual of the vehicle for the manufacturer's recommended viscosity grade and specifications
the morons then don't tell you what A40 is (although a Porsche spec is A40)
nearly two dozen lawsuits are underpinned by accusations that the industry severely aggravated the environmental crisis with a decades-long campaign of lies and deceit to suppress warnings from their own scientists about the impact of fossil fuels on the climate and dupe the American public
The environmentalist Bill McKibben once characterized the fossil fuel industry’s behavior as “the most consequential cover-up in US history”. And now for the first time in decades, the lawsuits chart a path toward public accountability that climate activists say has the potential to rival big tobacco’s downfall after it concealed the real dangers of smoking.
“We are at an inflection point,” said Daniel Farber, a law professor at the University of California, Berkeley and director of the Center for Law, Energy, and the Environment.
they knew they needed to stop in 1979, an Exxon study said that burning fossil fuels “will cause dramatic environmental effects” in the coming decades. “The potential problem is great and urgent,” it concluded.
James Black - Exxon's science advisor in 1978 There is a "window of five to ten years before the need for hard decisions regarding changes in energy strategy might become critical."
so when your grandchildren are dying in a couple of years... your can be content that
But it does matter for the cold starts. If you get very cold temperatures, like around “0F” and colder, you really need that “0” as the low viscosity indicator on the oil to be able to start the engine with some lubrication flowing in the tiny oil channels right away. I would not risk that with too thick oil in cold temp.
After oil heats up it is fine no matter what the lower number is, the critical time is right after start.
I once looked up the cold pour points for Mobil 1 and they were identical for 0W, 5W, and 10W
These are full synthetics which are basically unphased by ambient temperature. The top number is more relevant to engine design (internal clearances) than it is to ambient temperature. The 0W-16 Toyota currently specifes isn't appropriate for your Mercedes that specifies 5W-40, but both are fine at all temperatures in their proper applications.
If you must know, the 229.5 approval oil made by Mobil and packaged with Mercedes labeling available from dealers is 5W-40
People get all macho about oils for diesels, but 229.51 and 229.52 are not anything better than 229.5 and the 30 spec of those isn't what Mercedes specifies for M273 engine in your S550. 229.51 and 229.52 DO NOT meet specification 229.5. You do not require oil with ash removed to protect your diesel particulate filter ... since you don't have one.
BTW, if you want Mobil 1, Mercedes 229.5 MUST be printed on the bottle.
I once looked up the cold pour points for Mobil 1 and they were identical for 0W, 5W, and 10W
These are full synthetics which are basically unphased by ambient temperature. The top number is more relevant to engine design (internal clearances) than it is to ambient temperature. The 0W-16 Toyota currently specifes isn't appropriate for your Mercedes that specifies 5W-40, but both are fine at all temperatures in their proper applications.
If you must know, the 229.5 approval oil made by Mobil and packaged with Mercedes labeling available from dealers is 5W-40
People get all macho about oils for diesels, but 229.51 and 229.52 are not anything better than 229.5 and the 30 spec of those isn't what Mercedes specifies for M273 engine in your S550. 229.51 and 229.52 DO NOT meet specification 229.5. You do not require oil with ash removed to protect your diesel particulate filter ... since you don't have one.
BTW, if you want Mobil 1, Mercedes 229.5 MUST be printed on the bottle.
11-26-2023, 10:22 AM
