2020 S63 176K MSRP -- for low 70!!??
11-26-2023, 12:32 PM
#26
Interesting reason for spending that amount for the carbon brakes. The primary reason for those brakes are your secondary reasons - better performance, especially when hot, and lighter weight. That is why we used them on jet planes and why race cars like F-1 use them.
When I bought my wagon I couldn't find the one with CCB's so I ended up buying a Low mileage set and installed it on mine. At least in our application, the brakes are bigger, lighter and absolutely no brake dust. With considerably less rotating mass, the car not only accelerates but brakes better too.
Last edited by Faast; 11-26-2023 at 12:54 PM.
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Streamliner (11-26-2023)
11-26-2023, 01:02 PM
#27
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100 bucks, I meant, the investment to fix the curbs on those wheels via a diamond cut machine to re-surface them and then powder coat them as needed.... I've had to do that a couple of times when we lived in the Chicago area.... Majority of highly reputable shops would charge anywhere from 100 USD to 300 USD PER* wheel. Reading my post again, I have no idea what I meant by "additional wheel" though... lol
The dashboard issue should be covered under warranty. It's a known issue and that's not the first time am seeing a W222 with such problem. A quick search led me to two incidents wherein owners of S560s were able to get that covered under warranty. Another poster claimed having that done 3 times in FL, all under warranty. My concern, though, if service decided to do a full replacement of the dash instead of trying to fix, at that point I would rather pay out of pocket to fix it (glue it) elsewhere rather than getting someone to play with the cabin up to that level for a full dashboard replacement.... Former posters didn't specify how theirs were fixed though.
The dashboard issue should be covered under warranty. It's a known issue and that's not the first time am seeing a W222 with such problem. A quick search led me to two incidents wherein owners of S560s were able to get that covered under warranty. Another poster claimed having that done 3 times in FL, all under warranty. My concern, though, if service decided to do a full replacement of the dash instead of trying to fix, at that point I would rather pay out of pocket to fix it (glue it) elsewhere rather than getting someone to play with the cabin up to that level for a full dashboard replacement.... Former posters didn't specify how theirs were fixed though.
Last edited by Wolfman; 11-27-2023 at 05:23 PM.
11-26-2023, 01:26 PM
#28
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Says YOU! I spent over $16K to add the AMG CCB’s to my SL450, for only two reasons: No dust and I like the way they look. The fact that they reduce unsprung weight, contributing to better ride quality & handling, along with additional stopping power, was just icing on the cake. If I had been able to order the CCB on my W222’s, I would have. They are simply amazing!
My point exactly. And to think that ceramic pads are anywhere close to dust free like CCB’s is just wishful thinking.
Having years of experience with both, to me, spending the money is a no-brainer when getting a new car.
The brakes are also subsidized; the option is only $9k, a fraction of the actual cost of these…
Having years of experience with both, to me, spending the money is a no-brainer when getting a new car.
The brakes are also subsidized; the option is only $9k, a fraction of the actual cost of these…
These brakes are completely overkill for any street car. If you like them though then Godspeed. To say that the only way to get dust free braking, or at least extremely low dusting braking is to spend $10k+ on CCBs is hogwash though
I can drive my car now for a whole week and it will have no visible brake dust, for $600 worth of ceramic pads. If you want the braking performance or just the concept mentally that you have CCBs then that’s fine, but they are not required for low/no dusting.
Last edited by SW20S; 11-26-2023 at 01:33 PM.
11-26-2023, 01:40 PM
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Its pretty darn dust free, and I still have my sixteen thousand American dollars lol.
These brakes are completely overkill for any street car. If you like them though then Godspeed. To say that the only way to get dust free braking, or at least extremely low dusting braking is to spend $10k+ on CCBs is hogwash.
I can drive my car now for a whole week and it will have no visible brake dust, for $600 worth of ceramic pads. If you want the braking performance or just the concept mentally that you have CCBs then that’s fine, but they are not required for low/no dusting.
These brakes are completely overkill for any street car. If you like them though then Godspeed. To say that the only way to get dust free braking, or at least extremely low dusting braking is to spend $10k+ on CCBs is hogwash.
I can drive my car now for a whole week and it will have no visible brake dust, for $600 worth of ceramic pads. If you want the braking performance or just the concept mentally that you have CCBs then that’s fine, but they are not required for low/no dusting.
That said, your hogwash statement simply indicates a lack of knowledge, including regular brake job costs on the S63 with steels. CCB's will be a cheaper option over time...
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S_W222 (11-26-2023)
11-26-2023, 01:45 PM
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Everybody does things differently. We only have CCB's on performance cars but after having them I will add them to any car that we configure. They add that much value to the driving experience. Btw, Streamliner paid more as they were a retrofit; quite a bargain though actually as a normal retrofit is about $22k+. The factory option is less than $9k.
That said, your hogwash statement simply indicates a lack of knowledge, including regular brake job costs on the S63 with steels. CCB's will be a cheaper option over time...
That said, your hogwash statement simply indicates a lack of knowledge, including regular brake job costs on the S63 with steels. CCB's will be a cheaper option over time...
As for my hogwash comment, sorry but it’s true. You do not have to have CCBs to have an extremely low dusting brake pad. I have them on my car, after a week of driving there is barely any dust when you wipe your finger on the wheels. It’s actually quite amazing. Not denying the superior performance of CCBs, but they are not required for extremely low dust.
11-26-2023, 02:11 PM
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Nothing wrong with that, everybody spends their money as they see fit. It’s more the hypocrisy of deriding people spending more for a hand built engine and calling that “marketing nonsense” that nobody will ever use the capability of (ergo a waste of money) when he spent $16,000 on brakes he will never use the capability of that I find funny.
As for my hogwash comment, sorry but it’s true. You do not have to have CCBs to have an extremely low dusting brake pad. I have them on my car, after a week of driving there is barely any dust when you wipe your finger on the wheels. It’s actually quite amazing. Not denying the superior performance of CCBs, but they are not required for extremely low dust.
As for my hogwash comment, sorry but it’s true. You do not have to have CCBs to have an extremely low dusting brake pad. I have them on my car, after a week of driving there is barely any dust when you wipe your finger on the wheels. It’s actually quite amazing. Not denying the superior performance of CCBs, but they are not required for extremely low dust.
11-26-2023, 02:26 PM
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Nothing wrong with that, everybody spends their money as they see fit. It’s more the hypocrisy of deriding people spending more for a hand built engine and calling that “marketing nonsense” that nobody will ever use the capability of (ergo a waste of money) when he spent $16,000 on brakes he will never use the capability of that I find funny.
As for my hogwash comment, sorry but it’s true. You do not have to have CCBs to have an extremely low dusting brake pad. I have them on my car, after a week of driving there is barely any dust when you wipe your finger on the wheels. It’s actually quite amazing. Not denying the superior performance of CCBs, but they are not required for extremely low dust.
As for my hogwash comment, sorry but it’s true. You do not have to have CCBs to have an extremely low dusting brake pad. I have them on my car, after a week of driving there is barely any dust when you wipe your finger on the wheels. It’s actually quite amazing. Not denying the superior performance of CCBs, but they are not required for extremely low dust.
11-26-2023, 02:33 PM
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Mine brakes just as well as it did on the OEM brakes, which is very well, and there is almost zero dust. I am a pretty hard driver. On the OEM pads the front wheels were noticeably black after one days driving.
11-26-2023, 02:59 PM
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FWIW, Streamliner had already installed Porterfield Ceramic pads on his SL before deciding to take the jump to CCB's so he was able to experience the same SL with OEM pads, ceramic pads and CCB's. He is not a hard driver like me but can easily compare all since they were on the same car...
Last edited by Wolfman; 11-26-2023 at 03:05 PM.
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S_W222 (11-26-2023)
11-26-2023, 05:38 PM
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I am not discounting the performance of CCB but I do know from these pads and other ceramic pads I have had before, dust is a non issue. Not all are created equal. Spending $16,000 on CCB to do away with the very small light dust these ceramic pads generate would be insane.
Even if the CCB produce ZERO dust, it would be a minuscule improvement that would not at all be worth the cost. Upgrade to CCB for the braking performance, dust isn’t a reason to do it, if that’s your primary driver for doing that there are way more cost effective ways to accomplish that
Even if the CCB produce ZERO dust, it would be a minuscule improvement that would not at all be worth the cost. Upgrade to CCB for the braking performance, dust isn’t a reason to do it, if that’s your primary driver for doing that there are way more cost effective ways to accomplish that
11-26-2023, 05:59 PM
#36
11-26-2023, 06:06 PM
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I am not discounting the performance of CCB but I do know from these pads and other ceramic pads I have had before, dust is a non issue. Not all are created equal. Spending $16,000 on CCB to do away with the very small light dust these ceramic pads generate would be insane.
Even if the CCB produce ZERO dust, it would be a minuscule improvement that would not at all be worth the cost. Upgrade to CCB for the braking performance, dust isn’t a reason to do it, if that’s your primary driver for doing that there are way more cost effective ways to accomplish that
Even if the CCB produce ZERO dust, it would be a minuscule improvement that would not at all be worth the cost. Upgrade to CCB for the braking performance, dust isn’t a reason to do it, if that’s your primary driver for doing that there are way more cost effective ways to accomplish that
This maybe different for others but I choose the option for all the attributes I mentioned earlier. $9k is a bargain for that IMO.
I’d say that ceramic pads reduce brake dust by maybe 75-80%.
In the context of the S63, which would be the relevant car, the dealer will charge between $7k-$9k to swap the set of multi-piece steel rotors/pads with less than half the longevity.
Of course people can go to an indie or get gyro disc rotors but you will be at it much earlier.
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S_W222 (11-26-2023)
11-26-2023, 06:10 PM
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Everything I post is my opinion lol. I don’t care what anybody spends their money on, but I certainly have opinions. It’s the hypocrisy that I find funny, not the choice of upgrading to the CCB. I think lots of things people spend money on are insane, but I understand people having different values. Spending that money for brakes when you will never realize the full benefit of them precludes you from saying other people spending money on things they will never see the full benefit of is silly. Hand built engines, CCBs when you just drive gently on the street…both examples of people buying what they want not what they need
And I would say the reduction in brake dust for my S560 is more like 90%
And I would say the reduction in brake dust for my S560 is more like 90%
Last edited by SW20S; 11-26-2023 at 06:25 PM.
11-26-2023, 06:41 PM
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Taking a diversion…. Which ceramic pads have you tried, and what were your impressions? Having to wash the wheels after short trips has me ready to pull the trigger and swap pads out.
11-26-2023, 06:56 PM
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11-26-2023, 06:57 PM
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The ceramic pads are one of the best upgrades I have ever done on a car period. They have really improved my enjoyment of the car.
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dmatre (11-26-2023)
11-26-2023, 08:30 PM
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To be fair, it is a 3D Burmester system as shown on the build sheet. Rotating tweeters are installed now per comments. Supposed COVID oversight which could be possible. There is no rear climate control on the window sticker and the headrest looks ok; also nothing on the sticker. That was an option.
11-26-2023, 09:28 PM
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The posts about CCB brakes just make me laugh!
The CCBs are the best value for the money on heavy S63 AMGs.
I wished when I ordered my 2019 S63 AMG that I did European Delivery on had CCBs. There were only two options I did not get on the car-CCBs and the color changing "sun roof" (I know Streamliner loves the panorama roof!!). I now have about 50k miles on the car with two brake jobs totaling $14k for rotors and pads for the none CCBs--yes I go to my local dealer for the service and I could do it myself since I have a 2 post lift but I spend too much time tracking my Corvettes and racing in the SCCA to work on my MB S63. The CCBs would last about 100k miles. If I keep the car 100k miles I would have spend about 28k in rotors and pads for the non CCBs. Now, I am considering an order for a 2024 S63 AMG E Performance but I am noticing that CCBs are not available and I WILL NOT order that heavy "pig" without CCBs. I also noticed that the specs show the car limited at 155 mph whereas my 2019 S63 is limited at 186mph. My guess is that until they offer the CCBs they will limit the speed to 155. Normally the US spec comes with the AMG Drivers Package Std which increased my car to 186mph. I also noticed on the German MB website that the specs are also limited the car to 250 kph/155 mph although a couple of early Youtube testers show the car going upto 290kph (probably before the worldwide shortage of CCBs hit). I am guessing it is due to worldwide shortage of CCBs. I have CCBs on both of my 2023 Corvette Z06s. They are the best brakes money can buy and if one has a heavy car with lots of horse power, the CCBs are a must. Wished I could reorder my 2019 S63 with the CCBs.
The CCBs are the best value for the money on heavy S63 AMGs.
I wished when I ordered my 2019 S63 AMG that I did European Delivery on had CCBs. There were only two options I did not get on the car-CCBs and the color changing "sun roof" (I know Streamliner loves the panorama roof!!). I now have about 50k miles on the car with two brake jobs totaling $14k for rotors and pads for the none CCBs--yes I go to my local dealer for the service and I could do it myself since I have a 2 post lift but I spend too much time tracking my Corvettes and racing in the SCCA to work on my MB S63. The CCBs would last about 100k miles. If I keep the car 100k miles I would have spend about 28k in rotors and pads for the non CCBs. Now, I am considering an order for a 2024 S63 AMG E Performance but I am noticing that CCBs are not available and I WILL NOT order that heavy "pig" without CCBs. I also noticed that the specs show the car limited at 155 mph whereas my 2019 S63 is limited at 186mph. My guess is that until they offer the CCBs they will limit the speed to 155. Normally the US spec comes with the AMG Drivers Package Std which increased my car to 186mph. I also noticed on the German MB website that the specs are also limited the car to 250 kph/155 mph although a couple of early Youtube testers show the car going upto 290kph (probably before the worldwide shortage of CCBs hit). I am guessing it is due to worldwide shortage of CCBs. I have CCBs on both of my 2023 Corvette Z06s. They are the best brakes money can buy and if one has a heavy car with lots of horse power, the CCBs are a must. Wished I could reorder my 2019 S63 with the CCBs.
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Wolfman (11-28-2023)
11-26-2023, 09:36 PM
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11-26-2023, 09:52 PM
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Stream,
I love cars so two are better than one!! Actually, one is a Z06 and the other is a Z06/Z07 with the high performance track package. I track the Z06s over 40 days per year so I alternate cars. Also, I would have gotten two Z07s but they are very rare and I was lucky to get one since in the 2023 model year they made just over 1000 of the Z07s and they will make a very limited number for 2024. They both are 670 hp flat plane crank motors that are just awesome. I have been waiting for MB to come out with their new GT two door (I may consider one of these) but I was really hoping MB would come out with the new GTR. I have fallen in love with the GTR on the track as I have been spending the past few years with the AMG Driving Academy in the Pro and Pro Plus classes at Road Atlanta, COTA and Laguna Seca and love the GTR for the track but I have to say that the 2023/2024 C8 Z06s are one of the best supercars in the world for the money! Loves the Corvettes but I am also a very faithful MB owner over the past 30+ years. Prior to the two Z06s I also owned a 2021 Corvette C8 Stingray that I put 12,000 track miles on--what an awesome track car for under $100k while the Z06s I have are around $150k and $170k respectively.
And yes I realize the CCBs can bolt on to the S63 but I spend $35k in track tires per year for the Corvettes so I guess I will pass on the bolt-ons.
I love cars so two are better than one!! Actually, one is a Z06 and the other is a Z06/Z07 with the high performance track package. I track the Z06s over 40 days per year so I alternate cars. Also, I would have gotten two Z07s but they are very rare and I was lucky to get one since in the 2023 model year they made just over 1000 of the Z07s and they will make a very limited number for 2024. They both are 670 hp flat plane crank motors that are just awesome. I have been waiting for MB to come out with their new GT two door (I may consider one of these) but I was really hoping MB would come out with the new GTR. I have fallen in love with the GTR on the track as I have been spending the past few years with the AMG Driving Academy in the Pro and Pro Plus classes at Road Atlanta, COTA and Laguna Seca and love the GTR for the track but I have to say that the 2023/2024 C8 Z06s are one of the best supercars in the world for the money! Loves the Corvettes but I am also a very faithful MB owner over the past 30+ years. Prior to the two Z06s I also owned a 2021 Corvette C8 Stingray that I put 12,000 track miles on--what an awesome track car for under $100k while the Z06s I have are around $150k and $170k respectively.
And yes I realize the CCBs can bolt on to the S63 but I spend $35k in track tires per year for the Corvettes so I guess I will pass on the bolt-ons.
11-26-2023, 11:42 PM
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This is clearly a scam. You can see it in 2 seconds. It has most of the components of the 3D Burmester system, but where are the rotating door speakers??? And the build sheet says rear seat climate control...also missing. It even has the wrong front seats. The headrest should be electrically operated, with NO button on the headrest for forward and back movement. The headrest movement, all 4 directions, is operated by the switch on the door. I feel sorry for the person who buys this car
- 3D Burmester tweeters: the seller declared that and said the original 3D ones failed and were replaced with standard ones.. this was mentioned in the post/comments.
- rear seat climate control: Actually the build sheet does NOT say that. It says heated and ventilated rear “seats”, which is different from the rear AC (separate package). Unless I missed a line on the spec sheet?
- Wrong front seats… Am curious why do u think it has the wrong seats? They seem to be the right one, what am I missing?
- Headrest: I am not sure what that button does honestly, and not sure if there is anything wrong with the headrests either. Interesting… good eyes.. But I still don’t see a mismatch with what the spec sheet says.
Last edited by S_W222; 11-26-2023 at 11:53 PM.
11-26-2023, 11:46 PM
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Stream,
I love cars so two are better than one!! Actually, one is a Z06 and the other is a Z06/Z07 with the high performance track package. I track the Z06s over 40 days per year so I alternate cars. Also, I would have gotten two Z07s but they are very rare and I was lucky to get one since in the 2023 model year they made just over 1000 of the Z07s and they will make a very limited number for 2024. They both are 670 hp flat plane crank motors that are just awesome. I have been waiting for MB to come out with their new GT two door (I may consider one of these) but I was really hoping MB would come out with the new GTR. I have fallen in love with the GTR on the track as I have been spending the past few years with the AMG Driving Academy in the Pro and Pro Plus classes at Road Atlanta, COTA and Laguna Seca and love the GTR for the track but I have to say that the 2023/2024 C8 Z06s are one of the best supercars in the world for the money! Loves the Corvettes but I am also a very faithful MB owner over the past 30+ years. Prior to the two Z06s I also owned a 2021 Corvette C8 Stingray that I put 12,000 track miles on--what an awesome track car for under $100k while the Z06s I have are around $150k and $170k respectively.
And yes I realize the CCBs can bolt on to the S63 but I spend $35k in track tires per year for the Corvettes so I guess I will pass on the bolt-ons.
I love cars so two are better than one!! Actually, one is a Z06 and the other is a Z06/Z07 with the high performance track package. I track the Z06s over 40 days per year so I alternate cars. Also, I would have gotten two Z07s but they are very rare and I was lucky to get one since in the 2023 model year they made just over 1000 of the Z07s and they will make a very limited number for 2024. They both are 670 hp flat plane crank motors that are just awesome. I have been waiting for MB to come out with their new GT two door (I may consider one of these) but I was really hoping MB would come out with the new GTR. I have fallen in love with the GTR on the track as I have been spending the past few years with the AMG Driving Academy in the Pro and Pro Plus classes at Road Atlanta, COTA and Laguna Seca and love the GTR for the track but I have to say that the 2023/2024 C8 Z06s are one of the best supercars in the world for the money! Loves the Corvettes but I am also a very faithful MB owner over the past 30+ years. Prior to the two Z06s I also owned a 2021 Corvette C8 Stingray that I put 12,000 track miles on--what an awesome track car for under $100k while the Z06s I have are around $150k and $170k respectively.
And yes I realize the CCBs can bolt on to the S63 but I spend $35k in track tires per year for the Corvettes so I guess I will pass on the bolt-ons.
11-27-2023, 12:17 AM
#48
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Taking another look, I agree that it is not a car I would personally buy, but I disagree that it is a scam.
- 3D Burmester tweeters: the seller declared that and said the original 3D ones failed and were replaced with standard ones.. this was mentioned in the post/comments.
- rear seat climate control: Actually the build sheet does NOT say that. It says heated and ventilated rear “seats”, which is different from the rear AC (separate package). Unless I missed a line on the spec sheet?
- Wrong front seats… Am curious why do u think it has the wrong seats? They seem to be the right one, what am I missing?
- Headrest: I am not sure what that button does honestly, and not sure if there is anything wrong with the headrests either. Interesting… good eyes.. But I still don’t see a mismatch with what the spec sheet says.
- 3D Burmester tweeters: the seller declared that and said the original 3D ones failed and were replaced with standard ones.. this was mentioned in the post/comments.
- rear seat climate control: Actually the build sheet does NOT say that. It says heated and ventilated rear “seats”, which is different from the rear AC (separate package). Unless I missed a line on the spec sheet?
- Wrong front seats… Am curious why do u think it has the wrong seats? They seem to be the right one, what am I missing?
- Headrest: I am not sure what that button does honestly, and not sure if there is anything wrong with the headrests either. Interesting… good eyes.. But I still don’t see a mismatch with what the spec sheet says.
- It has code 402 Rear seat Climate control on page 111, on the build sheet. But the car doesn't have rear seat climate control.
- Again, on page 111 on the build sheet it has code 402 for Rear seat climate control. As you know, MB sells packages. When you have rear seat climate control you automatically also get electrically adjustable headrest, which means you won't have the button on the side of the headrest. You can check that in the booklet.
- Any car that has code 402 automatically also gets headrest that move up/down & forward/backwards with the button on the door, not a button on the headrest. That's how MB offers the package. Any W222 with rear climate control will also have the front headrest functions, just like yours did, and my current car.
Maybe it isn't a scam but too many holes for me.
11-27-2023, 08:55 AM
#49
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I think the reason the car has not sold is all the holes that have been mentioned here. It just doesn’t “feel right” and these buyers are pretty savvy.
Last edited by SW20S; 11-27-2023 at 09:01 AM.
11-27-2023, 10:40 AM
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I agree…. And for that reason I think 72K was a very fair deal. Honestly if am truly interested to own one for the fun of it for a few months or a year, assuming the car mechanically runs great, this would have been a great deal. It was easy to track down where this car resided and to find the original seller. I still prefer a no-holes vehicle but for 70-72K that was going to be a good deal for short ownership experience and quick re-sale later with minimal loss.
