SL55/63/65/R230 AMG: SL65 Catless Downpipes
#77
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#78
I'm kinda wondering if there's room for improvement by just removing the airbox with JUST a flash? I was considering going catless, but I already have no mufflers and don't want it that loud. I also don't want to buy new mufflers either, especially since I don't know what to buy. I don't want to ruin the V12tt sound. Did I understand you to say I would pick up 20whp by removing my airbox altogether, and then lose nothing by adding a better breathing intake setup?
#79
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2014 cls63 a amg. 2018 AMG GTR
Rear tank and a Killer Chiller would be like having the tank full of ice 24/7. My water temps are 39-41 degrees on a 100 degree day. Yes 60 degrees or even more below ambient.
#81
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06 SL65AMG, 13 Tesla Model S 60kwh, 02 Jaguar S-Type 3.0, 12 S550 4 Matic, 07 E320 Bluetec, 06 LX470
I'm gonna try it out regardless see what happens since the mod wont cost a lot it wont hurt to try and compare to stock and see how well it cools. If it doesn't work out it didn't cost me a lot and ill just either buy Spedriven set or have a custom set made. But with no one really modding the krap out of the SL its a lot of R&D regardless and I don't mind testing everything out.
As for exhaust I lost 20 rwhp with air box to 540, when air box came out went to 636. so intakes are a must.
I'm gonna look into killer chiller though and do some research
As for exhaust I lost 20 rwhp with air box to 540, when air box came out went to 636. so intakes are a must.
I'm gonna look into killer chiller though and do some research
#83
Think about this for one second. Your cooling setup is using ambient air to cool your charged air. Adding more and more volume does not = better cooling. You sit in traffic and that larger volume is gonna work against you. It will heat up and take longer to cool. Also flow is critical, what size pump are you running? I still dont understand the need for 4 intercoolers when 2 good ones should be plenty. I'd say one but that would require more plumbing. At the end of the day it's your car so you can do whatever you please. Just giving you advice. Reminds me of people thinking putting 4 turbos on the car will make more power because it's more turbos or putting carbon fiber wrapped pieces making their car lighter ![nix](https://mbworld.org/forums/images/smilies/nixweiss.gif)
![nix](https://mbworld.org/forums/images/smilies/nixweiss.gif)
I can understand how adding heat exchanges to dissipate heat by using ambient air can only reduce the coolant temp so much and can also maintain a higher coolant temp without proper airflow or pump flow.
My question is, would a larger top mount intercooler, or quad set up, take the same hot charged air created by the turbo and heat the coolant less? In other words, since the heat generated by the turbos remains the same, would larger intercoolers create a lower change in temp in coolant returning to the heat exchange, allowing the heat exchange to be more effective?
#84
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V12-Biturbo
As Blackbenz noted, of course removing entire airbox will increase power, you removed all air restriction possible BUT... After adding any CAI solution back those gains will not increase, they will certainly give up the majority of gains vs running NO airbox whatsoever.
However running no airbox/cai you wont keep those massive gains, it will only be drawing hellish furnace temperature quality air & the perf will go down severely, way past restrictive oem boxes etc.. Remember your hood is fully OPEN during these dyno tests w/huge cooling fans blowing fresh air into turbs, NOT so in real world, it turns into a portal to hell itself when hoods closed ol..
Any free flowing wider dia CAI solution will be an improvement over stock boxes/filters (ive tried dyno/street tested every concievable CAI)
The oem design is full of 2-3 90 deg bends that lead to a final candy bar sized slit that ultimately leads to turbo inlet, worst power robbing oem airbox design I've ever seen. Big hint toward keeping more of those gains use as little metal tubing as possible, it heat soaks instantly especially on turbocharged engines leaving you w/fancy Hot Air Intake negating any ram air design after its heated to running temperature.
Adding your 3-4" Heat Exchanger idea to mix will just hinder the cooling ability of any v12tt further.. Trust the OG's trying to steer you in proper direction here, few of us have been modding them for many, many, years.. Biggers not always better ie add too large a turbo & you'll have massive turbo lag etc etc..
Here's my super secret mod of ALL MODS.. Do so at your own risk, seek Doctors approval/advice before install as acceleration is soo brutal/violent only the healthiest virile men should attempt such modifications![Wink](https://mbworld.org/forums/images/smilies/wink.gif)
However running no airbox/cai you wont keep those massive gains, it will only be drawing hellish furnace temperature quality air & the perf will go down severely, way past restrictive oem boxes etc.. Remember your hood is fully OPEN during these dyno tests w/huge cooling fans blowing fresh air into turbs, NOT so in real world, it turns into a portal to hell itself when hoods closed ol..
Any free flowing wider dia CAI solution will be an improvement over stock boxes/filters (ive tried dyno/street tested every concievable CAI)
The oem design is full of 2-3 90 deg bends that lead to a final candy bar sized slit that ultimately leads to turbo inlet, worst power robbing oem airbox design I've ever seen. Big hint toward keeping more of those gains use as little metal tubing as possible, it heat soaks instantly especially on turbocharged engines leaving you w/fancy Hot Air Intake negating any ram air design after its heated to running temperature.
Adding your 3-4" Heat Exchanger idea to mix will just hinder the cooling ability of any v12tt further.. Trust the OG's trying to steer you in proper direction here, few of us have been modding them for many, many, years.. Biggers not always better ie add too large a turbo & you'll have massive turbo lag etc etc..
Here's my super secret mod of ALL MODS.. Do so at your own risk, seek Doctors approval/advice before install as acceleration is soo brutal/violent only the healthiest virile men should attempt such modifications
![Wink](https://mbworld.org/forums/images/smilies/wink.gif)
![](http://www.demon-tweeks.co.uk/blog/wp-content/uploads/2013/08/Physics-Troll.jpg)
Last edited by Thericker; 02-05-2014 at 07:43 PM.
#85
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06 SL65AMG, 13 Tesla Model S 60kwh, 02 Jaguar S-Type 3.0, 12 S550 4 Matic, 07 E320 Bluetec, 06 LX470
I'm thinking about a custom HE made or one that is close to the dimensions of 29-29.5 inches wide, 6 inches tall and 2.5 inches thick since it will fit the bumper np.
For the CAI tom we have the parts coming in for the intake and see if we can trim some stuff to have the intakes in front of the radiator. If not I'll prob do a short ram until I get the body kit on my car the question is do I go 3 inch pipe or 4 inch if I do short ram?
What I'm really curious is the housing on the SL600 turbos? Is it the same as the 65? I was thinking about rebuilding the turbo with a larger wheel. If the housing is the same I'll just get a pair of 600s and rebuild on those. But if the housing is different I'm gonna have to find some 65 turbos to use to build. Prob drive that until the transmission goes bust and rebuild the transmission.
For the CAI tom we have the parts coming in for the intake and see if we can trim some stuff to have the intakes in front of the radiator. If not I'll prob do a short ram until I get the body kit on my car the question is do I go 3 inch pipe or 4 inch if I do short ram?
What I'm really curious is the housing on the SL600 turbos? Is it the same as the 65? I was thinking about rebuilding the turbo with a larger wheel. If the housing is the same I'll just get a pair of 600s and rebuild on those. But if the housing is different I'm gonna have to find some 65 turbos to use to build. Prob drive that until the transmission goes bust and rebuild the transmission.
#87
When in doubt, do nothing. I'll wait for everyone else to make the mistakes this time. I'l leave my meth kit on the shelf for now...can't get EC to return an email, let alone a custom tune...
#88
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06 SL65AMG, 13 Tesla Model S 60kwh, 02 Jaguar S-Type 3.0, 12 S550 4 Matic, 07 E320 Bluetec, 06 LX470
Yeah I was kinda waiting for someone to do some mods put the some info up but only info that's really available is Therickers build so I figured might as well guinea pig my car and tweak some stuff around and see how different stuff will cause the car to react.
The exhaust alone took some time figuring out what was causing it not to perform well at first but honest I love the trial and error stuff till the car runs right. I'm prob gonna have to at least experiment with 3-4 intakes until I get the results I want.
After that is sorted out then off for turbo upgrade off the OEM so gonna have to PM Shardul lol
But I was looking into the killer chiller that some people suggested. Will they allow you to use this on the track? I assume the A/C needs to be on for the freon to flow but I've been reading the tracks wont let you use it with water leaking?
The exhaust alone took some time figuring out what was causing it not to perform well at first but honest I love the trial and error stuff till the car runs right. I'm prob gonna have to at least experiment with 3-4 intakes until I get the results I want.
After that is sorted out then off for turbo upgrade off the OEM so gonna have to PM Shardul lol
But I was looking into the killer chiller that some people suggested. Will they allow you to use this on the track? I assume the A/C needs to be on for the freon to flow but I've been reading the tracks wont let you use it with water leaking?
#90
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Killer Chiller with a large rear mount tank would be perfect. Yes the AC keeps running. I dont get any water coming out of mine when staging. Track never said anything to me either. Kept my car running entire time when in line. I have seen people add ice to their rear tanks and still only have 70 degree water. Chiller will drop it down to 39-40 degrees. you would have to add a LOT of ice to get that kind of drop.
#95
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Kit I got was about $600 from Joe Kincaid. Was a kit made for my W211 so I am sure it works with your car or he could put one together that does. Its all about having the right fittings. I paid someone around $300 for the install. Worth every penny. I just wish I had done a rear tank instead of the 2.5 gal tank. More water would help.
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06 SL65AMG, 13 Tesla Model S 60kwh, 02 Jaguar S-Type 3.0, 12 S550 4 Matic, 07 E320 Bluetec, 06 LX470
It got me curious, even if they wont let you use it while your at the track runs I would think it would at least help with cooling the car down in between runs or just crusing
#97
It also seems that you have to discharge your whole AC system to connect everything up and you probably have to refresh it a little heavier than you normally would to account for the extra load on the AC system?
#98
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#99
Any progress on the CAI? Finally took my exhaust and air box off today. Geez what a piece of crap the air box is....No wonder these things are starved for air at anything over stock boost levels...Going to start gathering material to fab up my catless downpipes...
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06 SL65AMG, 13 Tesla Model S 60kwh, 02 Jaguar S-Type 3.0, 12 S550 4 Matic, 07 E320 Bluetec, 06 LX470
Had both my struts changed ABC is working fine so no more crazy rodeo on the dyno like before, and put a Quaife LSD in, but the EC/DC shop had there dyno filled up for there sale they had, but now that everything is running fine I will be there this week getting results on the 3 inch intake and also collect data on how fast it will heat soak as I'm gonna use silicone piping, and mod the OEM air box as well and compare results