Kleemann vs AMS headers
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Joined: Apr 2011
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From: Central Connecticut
86 190D (Exported to the Nerderlands), 87 300TD (Sold), 82 Ford F150 3spd, 99 E300D (RIP), 02 E55
Tell you the true, they are changing their company big time. What if something goes wrong with the header ? crack ? who will service the product ? For me, I rather pay a bit more to get peace of mind.
Kleemann bring more power and more reputable. One day if you sell, it might add value (not much). Just make sure if Cory can re-program your ECU. If he can then DO IT ! the sound will be louder and awesome ! My W211 RUNS strong and response Faster than before ! Maybe the SC belt change help but my car runs in Crazy mode all the time now ! At crank about 540Hp !
Kleemann bring more power and more reputable. One day if you sell, it might add value (not much). Just make sure if Cory can re-program your ECU. If he can then DO IT ! the sound will be louder and awesome ! My W211 RUNS strong and response Faster than before ! Maybe the SC belt change help but my car runs in Crazy mode all the time now ! At crank about 540Hp !
. I think it is mend to be...Kleemann headers!!I talk to Cory this afternoon and he told me I shouldn't have any problem programing the ECU as my car is a 2002....only a few earlier models might have a problem. He told me that pretty much, the kleemann fit right in the oem spot with the acception of taking the down pipe out and weld the Kleemann pipe in front of the 2nd cats. He also mention to leave the 2nd cats alone....the 2nd cats only deplete 2hp hence will not make a difference, for the noise level. The sensor plugs screw right in the kleemann down pipe. I also read that, with the Mandrel bends, there will be less obstuction to the flow and will definately feel the difference in the behaviour of the engine.
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From: Socal, Chino
E55 2006 / CLS55 / S450 / Jag XKR2011
You are right CharlyE500. I think it is mend to be...Kleemann headers!!
I talk to Cory this afternoon and he told me I shouldn't have any problem programing the ECU as my car is a 2002....only a few earlier models might have a problem. He told me that pretty much, the kleemann fit right in the oem spot with the acception of taking the down pipe out and weld the Kleemann pipe in front of the 2nd cats. He also mention to leave the 2nd cats alone....the 2nd cats only deplete 2hp hence will not make a difference, for the noise level. The sensor plugs screw right in the kleemann down pipe. I also read that, with the Mandrel bends, there will be less obstuction to the flow and will definately feel the difference in the behaviour of the engine.
. I think it is mend to be...Kleemann headers!!I talk to Cory this afternoon and he told me I shouldn't have any problem programing the ECU as my car is a 2002....only a few earlier models might have a problem. He told me that pretty much, the kleemann fit right in the oem spot with the acception of taking the down pipe out and weld the Kleemann pipe in front of the 2nd cats. He also mention to leave the 2nd cats alone....the 2nd cats only deplete 2hp hence will not make a difference, for the noise level. The sensor plugs screw right in the kleemann down pipe. I also read that, with the Mandrel bends, there will be less obstuction to the flow and will definately feel the difference in the behaviour of the engine.
Good luck ! once you have everything done please post some sound clip !
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From: Central Connecticut
86 190D (Exported to the Nerderlands), 87 300TD (Sold), 82 Ford F150 3spd, 99 E300D (RIP), 02 E55
After all the fip-flopping, I finally pull the trigger.....I was about to check on the ECU in my car this weekend and got an email from gpt....telling me that they have one set of headers left in their warehouse. The price they give me was even lower then the discounted price on the original website and it was free shipping. It was just a no brainer as you can't beat it...hence i ordered it. They also mention about the crank pulley....which is far lighter then the original 2.7lbs vs 6.7lbs stock. I might get that too and install both items together. With the headers and pulley, I believe that will be stage 2 mods right? Has anyone install both items in their car? I would like to hear from someone who has..my indie shop mechanic told me that will really open the car up...not that it is not at the current stock level.
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Joined: Apr 2011
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From: Central Connecticut
86 190D (Exported to the Nerderlands), 87 300TD (Sold), 82 Ford F150 3spd, 99 E300D (RIP), 02 E55
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E55 2006 / CLS55 / S450 / Jag XKR2011
+1 the pulley don't really do anything in W210. They might try to clean the inventory for good deal but not sure it really will worth it. Few months ago, someone was selling at $350 i decided not to take it because not much benefit.
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W210 E55
What is the potential danger using the aluminuim pulley from AMS. Please let me know if anyone has experience with it. I want to do both the headers and pulley the same time....probably delete the 2nd cats this summer and move the x-pipe forward where the 2nd cats reside. Then my mod for this car will be complete
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From: Central Connecticut
86 190D (Exported to the Nerderlands), 87 300TD (Sold), 82 Ford F150 3spd, 99 E300D (RIP), 02 E55
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Thread Starter
Super Member
Joined: Apr 2011
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From: Central Connecticut
86 190D (Exported to the Nerderlands), 87 300TD (Sold), 82 Ford F150 3spd, 99 E300D (RIP), 02 E55
Got my headers in yesterday....
I finally got my headers in yesterday. I am still waiting on the pulley which I had ordered last week. When these are all in, will have to spend a day at my indie shop to put them babies in
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1999 C43, 2008 P30 E63, 2014 SQ5, 2024 Model Y Performance
The horror stories with the pulley are regarding the balance. I have read that they aren't balanced properly and cause damage to the crank/motor.
That being said there are members on here that have the pulley installed and have no complaints. I thought about getting the pulley as well but once I learned that it was a one size fits all (for 5.4 and 4.2 M113 motors) it seemed that the balance issue could be true (AMG has different crank pulleys for the M113's be it the 4.2, 5.4, or 5.4k)
As far as no gains that is a lie. If the weight quoted above is true, dropping 4 lbs from the crank pulley should net some noticeable gains. Not only will you gain power at the rear wheel but your motor will rev quicker as there is about 66% less mass to spin.
That being said there are members on here that have the pulley installed and have no complaints. I thought about getting the pulley as well but once I learned that it was a one size fits all (for 5.4 and 4.2 M113 motors) it seemed that the balance issue could be true (AMG has different crank pulleys for the M113's be it the 4.2, 5.4, or 5.4k)
As far as no gains that is a lie. If the weight quoted above is true, dropping 4 lbs from the crank pulley should net some noticeable gains. Not only will you gain power at the rear wheel but your motor will rev quicker as there is about 66% less mass to spin.
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From: Bostonian Ma
2012 CLS63 AMG
The horror stories with the pulley are regarding the balance. I have read that they aren't balanced properly and cause damage to the crank/motor.
That being said there are members on here that have the pulley installed and have no complaints. I thought about getting the pulley as well but once I learned that it was a one size fits all (for 5.4 and 4.2 M113 motors) it seemed that the balance issue could be true (AMG has different crank pulleys for the M113's be it the 4.2, 5.4, or 5.4k)
As far as no gains that is a lie. If the weight quoted above is true, dropping 4 lbs from the crank pulley should net some noticeable gains. Not only will you gain power at the rear wheel but your motor will rev quicker as there is about 66% less mass to spin.
That being said there are members on here that have the pulley installed and have no complaints. I thought about getting the pulley as well but once I learned that it was a one size fits all (for 5.4 and 4.2 M113 motors) it seemed that the balance issue could be true (AMG has different crank pulleys for the M113's be it the 4.2, 5.4, or 5.4k)
As far as no gains that is a lie. If the weight quoted above is true, dropping 4 lbs from the crank pulley should net some noticeable gains. Not only will you gain power at the rear wheel but your motor will rev quicker as there is about 66% less mass to spin.
the only issue the user will have is what I like to call user error. The andy shop has installed them incorrectly in addition they probably didn't use lock tight and torqued to spec (this is on the install sheet that is provided with the pulley) nor did they probably have it re-torqued after a few thousand miles. We drive these cars hard. I have mine looked at whenever I'm in the Andy shop just for safety check. Just with any mod you will have to keep an eye on it.You can definitely feel the difference down low and up top.
with the headers and the pulley on a NA along with res delete/ high flows /x-pipe you are squeezing whatever HP/TQ AMG left behind. Which is not much... For the money it's not a bad investment as the headers are now $650I'm pulling the trigger today for the AMS headers then Tune
then next projectArmani
Last edited by armaniE55; Feb 29, 2012 at 01:27 PM.
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E55 2006 / CLS55 / S450 / Jag XKR2011
Allow me to chime in. Having the AMS pulley myself. Don't be scared the issue you will have is what I like to call user error. The andy shop did not install them correctly in addition they probably didn't use lock tight and torqued to spec (this is on the install sheet that is provided with the pulley) nor did they probably have it re-torqued after a few thousand miles. We drive these cars hard. I have mine looked at whenever I'm in the Andy shop just for safety check. Just with any mod you will have to keep an eye on it.
You can definitely feel the difference down low and up top. with the headers and the pulley on a NA along with res delete/ high flows /x-pipe you are squeezing whatever HP/TQ AMG left behind. Which is not much... For the money it's not a bad investment as the headers are now $650
I'm pulling the trigger today for the AMS headers then Tune then next project
Armani
the issue you will have is what I like to call user error. The andy shop did not install them correctly in addition they probably didn't use lock tight and torqued to spec (this is on the install sheet that is provided with the pulley) nor did they probably have it re-torqued after a few thousand miles. We drive these cars hard. I have mine looked at whenever I'm in the Andy shop just for safety check. Just with any mod you will have to keep an eye on it.You can definitely feel the difference down low and up top.
with the headers and the pulley on a NA along with res delete/ high flows /x-pipe you are squeezing whatever HP/TQ AMG left behind. Which is not much... For the money it's not a bad investment as the headers are now $650I'm pulling the trigger today for the AMS headers then Tune
then next projectArmani
I wonder how much HP at crank with all the mods ? 400hp ? and wonder how will do 1/4 mile. I wish my W210 can make to the 11's.
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From: Bostonian Ma
2012 CLS63 AMG
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210 55
jajajajajaja also, with ur new brake discs you need more extra hp's Fabio Daniel
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From: Bostonian Ma
2012 CLS63 AMG
Fabio I told you come to the states and we can race for it 
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From: PDX
1999 C43, 2008 P30 E63, 2014 SQ5, 2024 Model Y Performance
Mine is shipping out tomorrow
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From: PDX
1999 C43, 2008 P30 E63, 2014 SQ5, 2024 Model Y Performance
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From: Socal, Chino
E55 2006 / CLS55 / S450 / Jag XKR2011
W211 stock best run was 11.8s but weight 4100Lbs which about 500Lbs more than W210. I have faith that W210 400Hp can do high 11's !
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From: Socal, Chino
E55 2006 / CLS55 / S450 / Jag XKR2011
Lets say at crank hp.
- Airbox 15hp
- Header 30hp
- OE tuning 30hp
- Pulley 20hp
Total 95 + 349 = 444Hp. or lets be more conservative at least around 420hp.
- Airbox 15hp
- Header 30hp
- OE tuning 30hp
- Pulley 20hp
Total 95 + 349 = 444Hp. or lets be more conservative at least around 420hp.
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86 190D (Exported to the Nerderlands), 87 300TD (Sold), 82 Ford F150 3spd, 99 E300D (RIP), 02 E55
Also don't forget to do the quick ECU reset!!
Last edited by snooozie; Feb 29, 2012 at 10:58 PM.
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From: PDX
1999 C43, 2008 P30 E63, 2014 SQ5, 2024 Model Y Performance
The first Audi R8 (4.2L V8) was 424 HP, 3600 lbs, and ran a 1/4 mile in 12.5 seconds. Its about 200 lbs heavier but with 24 more horse power and is no where near 11 seconds.
The C63 AMG is 480 HP, 3900 lbs, and runs a 12.4 second 1/4 mile
Check out this link:
http://robrobinette.com/et.htm
The calculator is accurate within a couple tenths, using the calculator and the 3700 lbs + 400 HP you get about a 12.9 second 1/4 mile which sounds pretty accurate.
Like I stated before you would need to be @ 500 HP+ or lose about 700-1000 lbs to get into the 11's.
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From: PDX
1999 C43, 2008 P30 E63, 2014 SQ5, 2024 Model Y Performance
This HP addition is a common misconception. When the manufacturer states adds "X" amount of HP it doesn't necessarily mean at the peak, they are stating the maximum HP that is added.
Example:
lets say the headers add 30 HP but it adds the 30 HP @ 3400 RPM but your peak HP is @ 5800 RPM where it is only adding 15 HP. You can't just add up the total HP that is claimed as it is added at different points in the RPM range. No doubt you are going to have more power but it's not like you add up the numbers and add that to the peak power rating.
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Joined: Apr 2011
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From: Central Connecticut
86 190D (Exported to the Nerderlands), 87 300TD (Sold), 82 Ford F150 3spd, 99 E300D (RIP), 02 E55
Allow me to chime in. Having the AMS pulley myself. Don't be scared the only issue the user will have is what I like to call user error. The andy shop has installed them incorrectly in addition they probably didn't use lock tight and torqued to spec (this is on the install sheet that is provided with the pulley) nor did they probably have it re-torqued after a few thousand miles. We drive these cars hard. I have mine looked at whenever I'm in the Andy shop just for safety check. Just with any mod you will have to keep an eye on it.
You can definitely feel the difference down low and up top. with the headers and the pulley on a NA along with res delete/ high flows /x-pipe you are squeezing whatever HP/TQ AMG left behind. Which is not much... For the money it's not a bad investment as the headers are now $650
I'm pulling the trigger today for the AMS headers then Tune then next project
Armani
the only issue the user will have is what I like to call user error. The andy shop has installed them incorrectly in addition they probably didn't use lock tight and torqued to spec (this is on the install sheet that is provided with the pulley) nor did they probably have it re-torqued after a few thousand miles. We drive these cars hard. I have mine looked at whenever I'm in the Andy shop just for safety check. Just with any mod you will have to keep an eye on it.You can definitely feel the difference down low and up top.
with the headers and the pulley on a NA along with res delete/ high flows /x-pipe you are squeezing whatever HP/TQ AMG left behind. Which is not much... For the money it's not a bad investment as the headers are now $650I'm pulling the trigger today for the AMS headers then Tune
then next projectArmani
This thing is super light and shiney
