jdj27x

Question-

Is it possible to install the Kleemann / asp/ renntech pulley without the software?

How does the car respond without the ecu changes? a/f ratio?


Thanks for the help!

-Jordan

vraa

https://mbworld.org/forums/showthrea...ghlight=pulley

https://mbworld.org/forums/showthrea...ghlight=pulley

https://mbworld.org/forums/showthrea...ghlight=pulley

I hope those help you out. Searching does wonders

jcjmw

My understanding is no. From what Kleeman told me, the pulley increases boost but the ecu has to be re-programmed to provide the correct AF for the increased boost. This is my understanding.

jdj27x

I tried to search and didnt find anything!

I guess after you have 25,000 posts your searching skills might be better


Thanks bro, ill check out those links!

DFW01E55

I've had an ASP pulley for 7 months without an ecu tune. Does it run rich? Yes.
Does it run fast? Oh heck yeah.

Do I care enough to have an ecu flash that's no different from one car to another? No.

One day, specific tuning will be available for each car, then I'm up for it.

ROCKETW19

no you dont need the ecu done. but if you go ASP you better get cooling upgrade.

jangy

I disagree. I do not think that ANY of the aftermarket pulleys "need" the ECU tune to get gains. in fact, I'd love to see data separating the two components and seeing just what each gives. Once you have added pulley, headers, TB, etc. to open up the air, then yes an ecu tune can help. Also, it can raise your rev limiter (some cases) and speed limiter. Lastly, it can set the car up for optimum octane. But that is all it is good for until you hit igher stages.

The car runs so rich as it is. Adding a little boost just doesn't take that rich away.

jdj27x

THE MASTER HAS SPOKENN!


Jangy,

I read that the pulley might cause increased jerkyness or harshness of sc engagment without the software....? any truth?

zdkdeeier493

I'm running an ASP with no software. The car is a bit jerky, and downshifts from 2nd to 1st can sometimes be mildly violent, but the car runs great overall. Power feels unlimited and acceleration is linear and significantly faster than a stock E55. My father has a stock '04, and I can most definitely notice a difference between the two. So far the car has had no problems with cooling (I did have the problem with the IC shutoff, but the dealer fixed that and its been fine since) and idle is constant and unwavering. Hope this helps.

jdj27x

what causes the jerkyness?

zoink

My car is with Renntech pulley w/o ECU update. Increase in power? Yes... I could feel it. Plus, S/C whine is a little louder now due to increase in boost.

The car has worse jerk when S/C engages. According to Adam the tuner, it can be minimized by remapping the ECU. I'm not that techie... but that's what he told me.

He suggested me the following upgrades after pulley upgrades: ECU, cooling and then other stuff like aux. tensioner, TB, header, etc.

Ted Baldwin

..............If your car is actually running rich, then that is not bad. You don't need an ECU tune. Your car is safe.

Ted

stevebez

A couple of things ... the jerkyness is lag of the S/C spooling up / boost build up / clutch engaging and perhaps some belt slip ... - this BTW is only from when the S/C is disengaged to engaging - if its already engaged and you floor it - its whiplash city ...

On the ECU - I have a theory here where I think the ECU sees the higher boost and dumps fuel to protect the motor... i.e. even more than in a stock setup where the car runs rich. Not ideal by any means, but also means you can run without ecu tune but you will be leaving power on the table if you do not do a tune. This will also only help if the car is runnign cool enough. If IAT's get too high timing will be pulled / and or fuel dumped ... so even a tune may not work as desired unless motor is seeing cool enough IAT's.

The problem is finding a specific tune for your mods - e.g. TB, Headers, Pulley, Fuel, Airbox, Filters, cooling system all contribute to how agressive the tune can be.

The only guys I know who do custom tunes is Wetterauer. I will go with them once all my mods are finally installed ...

It seems the concensus is you need to start off with cooling the motor more before you add any more boost...

SleeperX

I thought this might be the case as well, particuarly for cars with after market pullies. However, yesterday I came up with another explanation. Belt slippage. Does the A/f ratio become rich because the ECU is dumping fuel or because the belt is slipping causing the car to suck in less air. I believe both would cause the A/F ratio to become rich.

SSM AMG

I also think this is the reason, that is why the the VRP belt wrap kit is needed.

SleeperX

We shall soon find out..

jparch

one of my first upgrades was a Kleemann pulley without any software upgrade. It made a big difference and a/f was still ok, with no evidence of belt slippage. S/C whine much more noticeable, sounded great btw, my car had the "reflash" and still ran strong stock and after the pulley mods...

TopGun32

I have ran both my AMG's with no ECU and aftermarket pullies.. no issues with engine codes ect..

I do agree, the ASP pulley is a great, but cooling mods should be 2nd in line vs the ECU.

jangy

I personally do not think that the ECU tune will make the jerkiness any milder. That is simply a side effect of having a larger pulley working against the engagement and disengagement of the clutch. You could have the ECU tuned so that it would do the engagement and disengagement at varying times, making it seem less jerky, but you'll lose power that way.

I don't think that even the ASP pulley is big enough to cause fuel dump. The car runs rich OEM. With a pulley, it actually runs slightly less so, but still rich. If the pulley were causing the dump, you'd be seeing A/F dumping AFTER the pulley and that is not what I see.

I personally do not want the ASP for 2 reasons. 1st, I am scared of the re-machined OEM part concept for high speed parts. Second, I see that size as going beyond diminishing returns. The added boost is minimal and the added weight is NOT.

For me, I'd love to find a nicely engineered 170mm with weight reduction.

None of this has anything to do with ECU, but again I say show me the data. Why has nobody EVER posted the gains from a stage 1 ECU tune, especially on an '06 (made in '06)?

AgSilver

At any price, gas is cheaper than valves and pistons

DFW01E55

That's exactly what I see, the exhaust tips are more fouled than ever before the pulley went on. Can't even blame it on summer blend gas. The A/F ratio on before and after dynos was < 10. Just awful, but the Dynojet doesn't measure below 10, so I'm flatlined at 5k rpm's.

Is that based on your experience with the "name" brand stuff? Was the problem finally determined to be parts or installation?

Beg to differ, size does matter!
Explain the "added weight" issue to me, I'm not clear on that at all.