jangy

No, I think I get it. have fun.

chiromikey

since vrp knows the specs of their own cams, i would think they should be able to get a pretty darn close tune for ahmad then.

SLK55R

while VRP knows the specs of their own cams ... I don't think they have tuned a NA 5.4 motor or one that has been supercharged with VRP cams. Seriously the CLK has been modified a LOT as a result no cookie cutter tune is gonna be perfect. It SHOULD be custom tuned.

Give VRP a break.

My only take on this would have been VRP stating that they havent tested in that configuration and can't guarantee a RWHP benefit without a custom tune.

If it was me I would have gotten Kleemann cams on a Kleemann car. On my car I would use Renntech cams(which I would again get another custom tune) or test VRP's only if I got a custom tune for it.

chiromikey

i'm not coming down on vrp and vic knows that! my comment was simply that if they're going to custom tune amgsc's car and his car has basically the same set up as ahmad's car except vrp's cams, all they need to do is make a few adjustments for the specs of their cams and ahmads got a tune to start with. hopefully you can see my point.

i TOTALLY disagree with having to get locked into one tuner just because you started with some of their parts. if the product performs as promised, you buy the best product/service for the best price...period.

ProjectC55

This is exactly what I'm saying!

SLK55R

I completely agree. Its why I have Supersprint headers, cats, xpipe instead of renntech headers ... I wanted something different that they couldn't provide.

At the same time you must have a tuner that is willing to tune your car with other parts on it. Also warranty their parts even though its a mix and match. IMHO thats the hard part.

ProjectC55

Maybe not perfect ,but damn sure close. For instance,did'nt Renntech flash your ECU for your car or did you drive it from Cali to Florida? Where do you think they get there software from? You want me to tell you! Dude,cams are cams regardless of who makes them. The difference would be whether the cams are made for F/I or not ,based on overlap and lift.. If the cams don't have too much overlap they can generally be used on any stck F/I,F/I kit ,Renntech or Kleemann, no matter who makes the cams. That goes for the programming as well.

SLK55R

Yes Renntech flashed my ECU and flew out here and custom tuned my car on a dyno and on multiple WOT runs(several times). Whats your point??? And yes my car was tuned by Oliver so Evotech when they were partnered with Renntech. Again whats your point?


Okay if thats the case then shouldn't he just send his datalogged info to Kleemann and get a new tune? If the cams are all so close ... whats the issue here? (seems to me they clearly are NOT)

Btw I don't have a single VRUS product ... so I have no reason to stand up for them.

ProjectC55

It's not a big deal man! Whether you use VRP's new Long tube headers of Supersprints Long tube headers,I guarantee you if the SW has been programmed for long tube headers there will be no issue.

Nice how my 5.5L motor works in my C43 when the original motor was a 4.3L motor. No SW upgrade was needed at all even though I had it done(Superchips),computer did all the adaptations on it's own. Just plug and play.
Chged the entire exh system ,Kleemann headers on down to the muffler and the car runs even more like a wild animal. Did not have to upgrade the SW still as a result.

ProjectC55

So you think that Renntech goes to everyone's house who purchases their components and custom tunes their car for them? I don't think so and What's your point?


Hmmm maybe we could ask Sleeper X if Oliver or Renntech came to NYC from Germany and Fla! Nope did'nt happen.

blackbenzz

Here is my take on this...

I bought the cams expecting similar results as Albert but didn't get it. After I saw the results I was willing to get a custom tune. Cory was nice enough to offer to do a custom tune on my car (YES, with VRP cams!!!) so I just wanted the specs on the cams to give him so he could get agressive with the tune. VRP did NOT offer to do a custom tune for my car and I was told that I needed to ship my car to Cali if I wanted a tune. Not until just recently (see above) has VRP offered to do a tune.

I STRONGLY disagree that I should stick to one tuner. I will go with whatever suits my needs the best. I considered Kleemann cams but wanted something more agressive, enter VRP. I have an eisenmann exhaust, brembo brakes, DPE wheels, KW suspension... all kinds of different stuff on my car. I buy what I think is best for me, not because it has some name on it.

Chicago X- Funny you should mention that, I sent them an email earlier today.

I have yet to datalog the car since I am doing a couple more mods in the next week or two and THEN I will be ready to talk to someone about a custom tune.

AMGSC

Yes that's true but when you combine different mods from different makes then the tiny differences between each mod causes the variables to multiply exponentially.

That's why Vadim not only dyno tuned my car for countless hours and multiple sessions, he also road tunes it for several days to make sure the power is available/usable in daily driving conditons (up various grades, part throttle, stop and go, weather conditions, etc..). Maybe I'm not knowledgable enough but I just don't think ECU programming by mail is a complete solution for cars with multiple mods from different manufacturers and slightly different specs. I've heard stuff like FI is FI but I've always felt better having tuners take my car for days or even weeks to get it right (on the dyno but more importantly on the road). VRP's rates for doing this is very fair.

I know it's a hassle to leave your car with a tuner for weeks sometimes like I did but it eventually pays off especially if you don't need your car for commuting during that time.

theeddie

you nailed it

I laugh when people just get a tune on a dyno

if the tuner doesnt take the car out then whats the point

ProjectC55

What r you talking about? Ahmad does not have multiple mods! He has the Kleeman kit with their headers and placed the VRP cams in the car,where are the multiple mods? Jeez!!!!

What the heck are you guys calling multiple mods?

Since VRP wants to advertise these cams, then tell us where we can go locally in our areas across the US to tune our cars then if we purchase the cams. How's that!

The great thing about Activeautowerks is that if I have Schrick cams in my M3 and supporting mods(inj,exh,etc),I just mail them my ECU with my mods and it's a wrap. I don't have to drive my car all the way down to Fla if I don't want to. They have been doing this for yrs. If there is a problem they tell you to mail the ECU back and they make more adjustments. Car runs like a beast!!

SLK55R

I was under the impression he didn't just have a Kleemann supercharger and Eisenmann exhaust.

Regardless I've made my point ... you can get all excited as much as you want.

ProjectC55

You made your pt that your a clown! Dude I could care less about you, and your stupid comments. We are trying to have a discussion that matters to most of us who live on the other side of the US and are interested in VRP's merchandise, so respectfully ,just butt out. Thank you! From here on verbal jousting with you is dead. Your weak replies serve me no purpose when I'm trying to spend my $$! So runaway!

Your a clown and you go on the ignore list! Have a nice day in your convertible and your latte in your hand.

SLK55R

down to throwing insults I see ... so sad.

Vadim @ FD

Gents, come on, lets settle down.

Read my earlier posts and I will repeat this again.

The cams that Ahmad bought second hand were designed by Shrick to work on 55 Kompressor engines. Even if they did release the specs to Victor, my guess they are not exactly true. The only way to find out is to put them on CamDoctor and measure them.

Now, why do we need to know the specs? Is there a line in the software that you enter the cam specs? No.

To tune the car, one needs to know data, like A/F ratio vs. rpm. Timing vs. RPM, boost, engine temperature, air temperature and so on. Than based upon this data a tuner can adjust corresponding values in the data tables and hopefully get it close, as the values in the table use modifiers and are in metric format. In other words it is a pain that takes numerous iterations to perfect.

Obviously having a car at ones disposal and data logging it makes tuners life a lot simpler.

The problem with Ahmad's CLK is that it is a MAF car. At around 350 HP, MAF runs out of air flow and a voltage clamp flat lines MAF output and defaults to a map. A map that is likely has a fixed value. In addition Kleemann FMU adds fuel pressure vs. boost to keep A/F ratio safe. Very likely car is very rich with very retarded timing.

On Kompressor cars, the maps end at around 800HP aiflow.

So now you see why his car did not pick up the same numbers that Albert's car did.

In addition there are possibly other airflow/exhaust restrictions that we might not be aware off.

This is why his car needs tuning more than Kompressor 55s.

chiromikey

that's what eddy current dyno's are for...

Vadim @ FD

The problem with eddy current dynoes is lack of airflow. Short of $1,000,000,000 wind tunnel, Home Depot fans will not create 130 MPH airlfow.

blackbenzz

Why was none of this said BEFORE I bought the cams???

Didn't you recently say you tuned a Kleemann sc C55 (437whp) and you tuned AMGSC's kleemann sc C55 (510whp)? Neither of which are 55k motors. What makes my car so much harder to tune? It will take you longer than 30 hours to tune my car because it took you that long to tune a 55k car? If I was to go with a VRP tune, what steps would I need to take?

Vadim @ FD

You bought the cams from second party. He originally bought them for E55K.

No, AMGSC car made 433RWHP with very mild Kleemann cams. To get driveability and power out of this car I have close to 40 hours of tuning in it. Car had HPS blower and a maltitude of other problems that had to be addressed before it ran right.

Way too many variables and unknowns on your car for a mail tune. It might work or it might not.

blackbenzz

What does me buying cams from a second party have to do with anything? They were brand new. Would you like me to post the pms I sent directly to you asking about VRP cams in my specific car and your response??? None of this stuff you are saying now was mentioned. You said it was a drop in and nothing special was neccessary. "solid 20whp"

So basically you are telling me no mail tune... thanks for the support

Vadim @ FD

Ahmad, you are asking me to do a half-assed job.

Why? Is that what you think you and your CLK deserve?

chiromikey

lol, that's not a problem specific to eddy current dynos so please don't try to imply it is. besides, if eddy current dyno's suffer from this, dynojets would be worse since they're only good for wot blasts.

btw, good dyno shops don't buy their fans at home depot and you don't need a billion dollar wind tunnel or 130mph airflow to map driveability... but you should at least start with an eddy current dyno.

you know better than to make misleading blanket statements like that.