It's time!! VRP700 VS MHP. Tuner showdown at Sacto. 10/25/08
10-24-2008, 03:30 AM
#27
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Good point.
This would be a VRP car with a Powerchip tune vs A VRP car with an MHP tune.
Sounds like a couple TV shows , guy wakes up and does not know who he is or which tune he has.
This would be a VRP car with a Powerchip tune vs A VRP car with an MHP tune.
Sounds like a couple TV shows , guy wakes up and does not know who he is or which tune he has.
10-24-2008, 04:07 AM
#28
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10-24-2008, 09:43 AM
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Jim,
I don't know why this didn't pop into my head earlier, but, this morning when I was reading this post it occured to me.
PLEASE.. DO NOT run your car down the 1/4mile with the MHP ECU until you do a dyno pull and verify A/F. The last thing I want to happen is for you to incur damage because of a lean mixture or too much timing.
MHP did a "blind" tune on an ECU without seeing your car and doesn't really know the specs of what is installed. Do you remember when we took out your Kleemann headers and installed our longtubes that the tune went SUPER LEAN and we had to add a bunch of fuel to make it safe and picked up 40rwhp?? I completely forgot about this otherwise I would have warned you sooner..
My advice is put the MHP ECU in, take it to your local Dyno and check the A/F.
I don't know why this didn't pop into my head earlier, but, this morning when I was reading this post it occured to me.
PLEASE.. DO NOT run your car down the 1/4mile with the MHP ECU until you do a dyno pull and verify A/F. The last thing I want to happen is for you to incur damage because of a lean mixture or too much timing.
MHP did a "blind" tune on an ECU without seeing your car and doesn't really know the specs of what is installed. Do you remember when we took out your Kleemann headers and installed our longtubes that the tune went SUPER LEAN and we had to add a bunch of fuel to make it safe and picked up 40rwhp?? I completely forgot about this otherwise I would have warned you sooner..
My advice is put the MHP ECU in, take it to your local Dyno and check the A/F.
10-24-2008, 09:54 AM
#31
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Good luck Jim, this will be an awesome comparison. And as Victor said, I would check afr's asap. The only issue I see is that VRP had the car in their hands to tune and MHP is doing a remote tune, not a fair comparison IMHO
Why do you ask for more miles on the tunes? When my car was tuned on the dyno it showed instant gains after loading the new software. No driving around necessary.
Why do you ask for more miles on the tunes? When my car was tuned on the dyno it showed instant gains after loading the new software. No driving around necessary.
Best of luck Jim and fingers crossed for good prep.
10-24-2008, 10:35 AM
#32
To paraphrase what I think Andy was saying previously, is that you will probably get some immediate gains, but nowhere near the full potential of the tune.
10-24-2008, 12:45 PM
#33
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Jim,
I don't know why this didn't pop into my head earlier, but, this morning when I was reading this post it occured to me.
PLEASE.. DO NOT run your car down the 1/4mile with the MHP ECU until you do a dyno pull and verify A/F. The last thing I want to happen is for you to incur damage because of a lean mixture or too much timing.
MHP did a "blind" tune on an ECU without seeing your car and doesn't really know the specs of what is installed. Do you remember when we took out your Kleemann headers and installed our longtubes that the tune went SUPER LEAN and we had to add a bunch of fuel to make it safe and picked up 40rwhp?? I completely forgot about this otherwise I would have warned you sooner..
My advice is put the MHP ECU in, take it to your local Dyno and check the A/F.
I don't know why this didn't pop into my head earlier, but, this morning when I was reading this post it occured to me.
PLEASE.. DO NOT run your car down the 1/4mile with the MHP ECU until you do a dyno pull and verify A/F. The last thing I want to happen is for you to incur damage because of a lean mixture or too much timing.
MHP did a "blind" tune on an ECU without seeing your car and doesn't really know the specs of what is installed. Do you remember when we took out your Kleemann headers and installed our longtubes that the tune went SUPER LEAN and we had to add a bunch of fuel to make it safe and picked up 40rwhp?? I completely forgot about this otherwise I would have warned you sooner..
My advice is put the MHP ECU in, take it to your local Dyno and check the A/F.
My advice to you would be to mind your own business. You obviously don't have a clue what we can do, though we know what you/PC can't.
Our tune is as safe or safer than yours despite the fact we didn't have the car to tune for weeks on end. I'm now looking forward to the results even more.
In fact I'll put one of our "blind" tunes vs a custom tune done by you/PC all day long. Funny how I catch Wayne (Pres/Owner) of PowerChips calling our initial M6 tester feeding him BS and trying to comp him a tune, now this...
Keep it up.
10-24-2008, 12:50 PM
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There will be immediate gains, but it takes 30-40 miles for WOT to be set and around 200 for part throttle and shifting. It's not just me or MHP tunes, rarfinancial felt the same with his Renntech/CLS63, etc.
10-24-2008, 12:52 PM
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JIM, come on buddy you forget about me so soon?
Remember my great camera work last time? DO NOT give your camera up to any of thoes people. I have 500 things to do tomorrow but for the good of this board I will make it there. PM me or call if you still have my number.
Remember my great camera work last time? DO NOT give your camera up to any of thoes people. I have 500 things to do tomorrow but for the good of this board I will make it there. PM me or call if you still have my number.
10-24-2008, 12:55 PM
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Andy,
Where the heck is this coming from???
I wasnt taking a STAB at you for christ's sake.. All I was saying was that you didnt have the BENEFIT of having the car in front of you so how could you possibly be able to give Jim a proper A/F when you dont even know what we had to do to make his car run.
All I told him to do was take it to a DYNO and VERIFY A/F before his does WOT blasts down the 1/4mile and possibly risks a lean mixture damaging something. YOU THINK THIS IS BAD ADVICE???
The key factor here is that when we tuned Jim's car originally it had Kleemann headers on it.. the minute we switched to our longtubes, A/F went into a very lean mixture and we had to add ALOT of fuel to make it safe.
And one more thing.. VICTOR & VRP are not the same as WAYNE and POWERCHIP. I am my own person and my own company. We happen to CONTRACT Powerchip to do our programming just like alot of other companies so please dont compare what I am doing here with whatever you are speculating Wayne or Powerchip did with you.
Jesus Christ you need to chill out a little bit.. Any little word that is said and you jump like crazy.
Where the heck is this coming from???
I wasnt taking a STAB at you for christ's sake.. All I was saying was that you didnt have the BENEFIT of having the car in front of you so how could you possibly be able to give Jim a proper A/F when you dont even know what we had to do to make his car run.
All I told him to do was take it to a DYNO and VERIFY A/F before his does WOT blasts down the 1/4mile and possibly risks a lean mixture damaging something. YOU THINK THIS IS BAD ADVICE???
The key factor here is that when we tuned Jim's car originally it had Kleemann headers on it.. the minute we switched to our longtubes, A/F went into a very lean mixture and we had to add ALOT of fuel to make it safe.
And one more thing.. VICTOR & VRP are not the same as WAYNE and POWERCHIP. I am my own person and my own company. We happen to CONTRACT Powerchip to do our programming just like alot of other companies so please dont compare what I am doing here with whatever you are speculating Wayne or Powerchip did with you.
Jesus Christ you need to chill out a little bit.. Any little word that is said and you jump like crazy.
Victor,
My advice to you would be to mind your own business. You obviously don't have a clue what we can do, though we know what you/PC can't.
Our tune is as safe or safer than yours despite the fact we didn't have the car to tune for weeks on end. I'm now looking forward to the results even more.
In fact I'll put one of our "blind" tunes vs a custom tune done by you/PC all day long. Funny how I catch Wayne (Pres/Owner) of PowerChips calling our initial M6 tester feeding him BS and trying to comp him a tune, now this...
Keep it up.
My advice to you would be to mind your own business. You obviously don't have a clue what we can do, though we know what you/PC can't.
Our tune is as safe or safer than yours despite the fact we didn't have the car to tune for weeks on end. I'm now looking forward to the results even more.
In fact I'll put one of our "blind" tunes vs a custom tune done by you/PC all day long. Funny how I catch Wayne (Pres/Owner) of PowerChips calling our initial M6 tester feeding him BS and trying to comp him a tune, now this...
Keep it up.
10-24-2008, 01:08 PM
#39
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Im not in the tuning business, I leave that up to reputable people with empirical results but what we can't have here is a sponsor vs. sponsor war.
Im all for Jackpro's testing and I look forward to the results as much as I look forward to Penn State kicking OSU's weak A$$!!!
MHP: I dont see where Victor was attacking you, he clearly was asking Jim to ensure engine saftey based on the mods HE did with YOUR new tune which may or may not be cohesive for engine life. Now if you did the mods that would be a different story since you would have all the dyno sheets and data logs.
Lets keep this as friendly as possible. I am on vacation today and need beer
Im all for Jackpro's testing and I look forward to the results as much as I look forward to Penn State kicking OSU's weak A$$!!!
MHP: I dont see where Victor was attacking you, he clearly was asking Jim to ensure engine saftey based on the mods HE did with YOUR new tune which may or may not be cohesive for engine life. Now if you did the mods that would be a different story since you would have all the dyno sheets and data logs.
Lets keep this as friendly as possible. I am on vacation today and need beer
10-24-2008, 01:14 PM
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Andy,
Where the heck is this coming from???
I wasnt taking a STAB at you for christ's sake.. All I was saying was that you didnt have the BENEFIT of having the car in front of you so how could you possibly be able to give Jim a proper A/F when you dont even know what we had to do to make his car run.
All I told him to do was take it to a DYNO and VERIFY A/F before his does WOT blasts down the 1/4mile and possibly risks a lean mixture damaging something. YOU THINK THIS IS BAD ADVICE???
The key factor here is that when we tuned Jim's car originally it had Kleemann headers on it.. the minute we switched to our longtubes, A/F went into a very lean mixture and we had to add ALOT of fuel to make it safe.
And one more thing.. VICTOR & VRP are not the same as WAYNE and POWERCHIP. I am my own person and my own company. We happen to CONTRACT Powerchip to do our programming just like alot of other companies so please dont compare what I am doing here with whatever you are speculating Wayne or Powerchip did with you.
Jesus Christ you need to chill out a little bit.. Any little word that is said and you jump like crazy.
Where the heck is this coming from???
I wasnt taking a STAB at you for christ's sake.. All I was saying was that you didnt have the BENEFIT of having the car in front of you so how could you possibly be able to give Jim a proper A/F when you dont even know what we had to do to make his car run.
All I told him to do was take it to a DYNO and VERIFY A/F before his does WOT blasts down the 1/4mile and possibly risks a lean mixture damaging something. YOU THINK THIS IS BAD ADVICE???
The key factor here is that when we tuned Jim's car originally it had Kleemann headers on it.. the minute we switched to our longtubes, A/F went into a very lean mixture and we had to add ALOT of fuel to make it safe.
And one more thing.. VICTOR & VRP are not the same as WAYNE and POWERCHIP. I am my own person and my own company. We happen to CONTRACT Powerchip to do our programming just like alot of other companies so please dont compare what I am doing here with whatever you are speculating Wayne or Powerchip did with you.
Jesus Christ you need to chill out a little bit.. Any little word that is said and you jump like crazy.
You don't think we know how to tune for headers, no cats, ported heads, cams, etc? You're kidding me right? That's as basic as it gets.
I think your advice is unsolicited and unwarranted. You have no idea what our cals are like, the time that have gone into them etc. Simply put Jim's tune is safe at 4300' and at sea level. As I've posted in the past, we literally wipe PC tunes off the controllers immediately as there's no use even wasting the time to look at them.
You use PC software to tune as you just reiterated above, that directly links you with Wayne/PC and there is NO speculation involved. I can have copies of my customers phone bill scanned and posted to prove that contact was initiated on PCs end.
Let's just leave it at: You worry about your tune, we'll worry about ours.
Thanks
Andy
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10-24-2008, 01:18 PM
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Im not in the tuning business, I leave that up to reputable people with empirical results but what we can't have here is a sponsor vs. sponsor war.
Im all for Jackpro's testing and I look forward to the results as much as I look forward to Penn State kicking OSU's weak A$$!!!
Im all for Jackpro's testing and I look forward to the results as much as I look forward to Penn State kicking OSU's weak A$$!!!
MHP: I dont see where Victor was attacking you, he clearly was asking Jim to ensure engine saftey based on the mods HE did with YOUR new tune which may or may not be cohesive for engine life. Now if you did the mods that would be a different story since you would have all the dyno sheets and data logs.
Lets keep this as friendly as possible. I am on vacation today and need beer
Lets keep this as friendly as possible. I am on vacation today and need beer
Again, no other entities have a clue what or how we do what we do, so any and all assumptions made by said parties are just that, misinformed/uniformed opinions.
Thanks
10-24-2008, 01:34 PM
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Nittany Lions are going down hardcore bud, sorry.
Every mod that was done to the car was listed by Jim, sent to us, and taken into consideration. Also don't even begin to infer that our tuning is not "cohesive" with durability/longevity. We don't have to put the mods on to know how they affect the tune.
Again, no other entities have a clue what or how we do what we do, so any and all assumptions made by said parties are just that, misinformed/uniformed opinions.
Thanks
Every mod that was done to the car was listed by Jim, sent to us, and taken into consideration. Also don't even begin to infer that our tuning is not "cohesive" with durability/longevity. We don't have to put the mods on to know how they affect the tune.
Again, no other entities have a clue what or how we do what we do, so any and all assumptions made by said parties are just that, misinformed/uniformed opinions.
Thanks
he clearly was asking Jim to ensure engine saftey based on the mods HE did with YOUR new tune which may or may not be cohesive for engine life. Now if you did the mods that would be a different story since you would have all the dyno sheets and data logs.
Lets keep this as friendly as possible. I am on vacation today and need beer
Lets keep this as friendly as possible. I am on vacation today and need beer
No inferring at all, hence my may or may not comment so dont tell me "don't even begin" because I am not here to have you tell me how it is.
Post your product, interact with the members and answer their questions. Just do me a favor before I close this thread and thats keep this discussion professional. The same goes for VRP as well.
I dont care how bad or good either of your tunes are. I have stated this before - the discussions have to remain civil and its a thankless task being a mod. The members and sponsors make up this board and play a critical role in how the board is perceived and actually operated.
10-24-2008, 01:50 PM
#45
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2003 E55 AMG
So what does that mean for me? Because I contract a company to do some work, now if they go and do something that you don't like it is directly tied to me and I am responsible for this????? I have no control or idea what anyone besides me does. I am responsible for my own actions, not someone elses. Understand?
Im not worrying about your tune Andy. I am worrying about my customer and his car and want to make sure he is ok. Telling him to go to a dyno and check his A/F is not out of line so please just drop it.
Ontop of that you encouraging him to go to the track and flog his car when he hasn't dyno'd it is plain irresponsible.
I personally have no problem if Jim runs your tune, my tune, or Company X tune. I want Jim to be happy with what he has and I want to see him enjoy his car. PERIOD.
Im not worrying about your tune Andy. I am worrying about my customer and his car and want to make sure he is ok. Telling him to go to a dyno and check his A/F is not out of line so please just drop it.
Ontop of that you encouraging him to go to the track and flog his car when he hasn't dyno'd it is plain irresponsible.
I personally have no problem if Jim runs your tune, my tune, or Company X tune. I want Jim to be happy with what he has and I want to see him enjoy his car. PERIOD.
You use PC software to tune as you just reiterated above, that directly links you with Wayne/PC and there is NO speculation involved. I can have copies of my customers phone bill scanned and posted to prove that contact was initiated on PCs end.
Let's just leave it at: You worry about your tune, we'll worry about ours.
Thanks
Andy
614 940 9523
Let's just leave it at: You worry about your tune, we'll worry about ours.
Thanks
Andy
614 940 9523
10-24-2008, 01:58 PM
#46
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THIS IS BS! this thread is not about you two and how good or bad your tune is. This thread is about Jackpro comming to Sac for some runs. Start your own dam thread if you guys wanna cry back and forth.
Side note I do belive it is a good idea to check AF after ANY tune.
Side note I do belive it is a good idea to check AF after ANY tune.
10-24-2008, 02:03 PM
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Rocket.. I am not crying bud. I really didnt think me asking Jim to go to the dyno and check A/F was a big deal.. Its just a precaution to make sure everything is ok. That's my last response.
Take it for what it is.
Take it for what it is.
THIS IS BS! this thread is not about you two and how good or bad your tune is. This thread is about Jackpro comming to Sac for some runs. Start your own dam thread if you guys wanna cry back and forth.
Side note I do belive it is a good idea to check AF after ANY tune.
Side note I do belive it is a good idea to check AF after ANY tune.
10-24-2008, 02:09 PM
#49
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You are right Vrus I kinda lumped you in cuzz you were replying back and forth making the hijack of the thread even worse. Your advise is good advise like I already posted, no matter whos tune.
10-24-2008, 02:10 PM
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Jim,
I don't know why this didn't pop into my head earlier, but, this morning when I was reading this post it occured to me.
PLEASE.. DO NOT run your car down the 1/4mile with the MHP ECU until you do a dyno pull and verify A/F. The last thing I want to happen is for you to incur damage because of a lean mixture or too much timing.
MHP did a "blind" tune on an ECU without seeing your car and doesn't really know the specs of what is installed. Do you remember when we took out your Kleemann headers and installed our longtubes that the tune went SUPER LEAN and we had to add a bunch of fuel to make it safe and picked up 40rwhp?? I completely forgot about this otherwise I would have warned you sooner..
My advice is put the MHP ECU in, take it to your local Dyno and check the A/F.
I don't know why this didn't pop into my head earlier, but, this morning when I was reading this post it occured to me.
PLEASE.. DO NOT run your car down the 1/4mile with the MHP ECU until you do a dyno pull and verify A/F. The last thing I want to happen is for you to incur damage because of a lean mixture or too much timing.
MHP did a "blind" tune on an ECU without seeing your car and doesn't really know the specs of what is installed. Do you remember when we took out your Kleemann headers and installed our longtubes that the tune went SUPER LEAN and we had to add a bunch of fuel to make it safe and picked up 40rwhp?? I completely forgot about this otherwise I would have warned you sooner..
My advice is put the MHP ECU in, take it to your local Dyno and check the A/F.
Jim - Please listen to Victor. Do not take your car to the track until you have checked out the new tune in a controlled environment.
With this being a competition, there is a good chance that "extra" changes have been made to your maps. If your car was an out of the box setup, then I would say go ahead and go. VRP did wonders on your car and whatever they recommend is what you should do.
Just my .2
Jerry
