Supercharger kicking out?
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Viking War Ship
Supercharger kicking out?
Hey all. I need some help. I took my E55 out for a quick jaunt today. All was well and good till I got way into the trip. I would be driving along and after some time, the supercharger would refuse to reengage. Of course the car was sluggish and all that as a result. Cycle the power with the key and it would come back for a bit...only to do the same thing again. It would get to a point where I'd only need to wait 2-3 minutes after the power cycle for the car to refuse to use the supercharger.
Has anyone ever had this happen? It's all electronic and no codes are being thrown. I checked codes and there was a pending misfire code on cylinder 8, but I have no idea how old that code was.
IAT's are relatively low as well. It's cold here in Wisconsin...and IAT's were in the 50-70 degree Fahrenheit range. I do have an upgraded CM30 pump anyway.
HELP!
Has anyone ever had this happen? It's all electronic and no codes are being thrown. I checked codes and there was a pending misfire code on cylinder 8, but I have no idea how old that code was.
IAT's are relatively low as well. It's cold here in Wisconsin...and IAT's were in the 50-70 degree Fahrenheit range. I do have an upgraded CM30 pump anyway.
HELP!
Last edited by kjlindgr; Feb 6, 2010 at 05:11 PM.
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Viking War Ship
Not sure how to do this...but I'd have to do it prior to the supercharger kicking out all together. Is there some kind of boost cut-out feature where it'll prevent S/C reengagement once hit? I've got a stock pulley and no tune so I'm guessing things are all within the factory settings.
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Viking War Ship
I did a little scanning of some of those things, but nothing really looks out of the ordinary. I'm not sure what boost hits really, but within 2-3 minutes...after the first time the supercharger kicks in, it won't engage any longer so it doesn't see any boost from then on.
It's definitely something electrical/computer driven. The weird thing is that when the car is cold, it acts fine. Once it warms up, it seems like it gets worse and the S/C disengagement happens much quicker post restart. Very confusing.
Keep the ideas coming guys!
It's definitely something electrical/computer driven. The weird thing is that when the car is cold, it acts fine. Once it warms up, it seems like it gets worse and the S/C disengagement happens much quicker post restart. Very confusing.
Keep the ideas coming guys!
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Viking War Ship
I was thinking about direct wiring it as well...but the 50-70 degree IAT's made me think it was operating normally. Would it kick the S/C off and drastically retard timing with temps this low? When I say the car is slow, I mean it. I get nervous approaching a big hill thinking it won't make it up it. No joke.
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From: Houston
2003 W211 E55, 2003 W220 S600
Yer sc will shut off even if the ambient temp is that low because no coolant is circulating in the system. Some members have had the cm30 go bad on them
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From: Tacoma WA
Bicycle
This sounds so typical of everyone else cars that have had high IAT problems, How often is you data logger sampling the temp? Maybe try bleeding the system to see if there is air in it? Have you split the system from the engine coolant yet? If you can make your own headers this should be cake for you. Other than Iat temps the only other thing i could think of is a malfunction SC clutch but Ive never heard or read of one that had this type of issues. Good luck
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Viking War Ship
I haven't split the IC system because I think I remember reading that you lose the ability to use the A/C for defrost...or something like that? Or am I making all this up?
I'll try to hard-wire the pump and look into the IC system split more to see if that's my issue.
NINJA EDIT: You can't/don't bleed the coolant system in these cars, do you?
I'll try to hard-wire the pump and look into the IC system split more to see if that's my issue.
NINJA EDIT: You can't/don't bleed the coolant system in these cars, do you?
Last edited by kjlindgr; Feb 7, 2010 at 11:47 AM.
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Viking War Ship
Pisssss...I didn't remember rebleeding the system after I removed the S/C last time. OMG I feel retarded. I'm gonna try that now to see if it solves my issue. *****!!!!
Thanks for the help guys. You are definitely the best
Thanks for the help guys. You are definitely the best
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From: Tacoma WA
Bicycle
You can split the system without loss of the heater or AC. There is some write ups but basicaly the system is fed from the bottom hose via a small T. Plug the T make or find a small tank to mount in the engine bay or do a trunk mount system.
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Viking War Ship
Here's an update. I tried to bleed the system and I was a bit confused as to the outcome. I removed the rubber bleeder cap and hooked a clear hose to it, routing it back to the reservoir. I disconnected the IC pump (CM30) and powered it up with a battery charger. The coolant barely moved in the tube and definitely didn't flow far enough to reach the reservoir. I thought I would have expected more of a flow coming out of this pump. I finally did get a constant trickle of fluid coming out of it though. Some air came out, but not too much. I let it run for a while just to make sure it was all out. Still no change. Car acted the same way as before. Dammit. 
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kjlindgr IC pumps bad
IC pumps bad, once the ic temp sensor gets to its setpoint then the ecu will disengage the sc clutch, the ic cools down, when you cycle the key it resets. that pump when on has quite a bit of flow, almost like an open waterhose. believe it or not, those pumps go out more often than you would think.
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Viking War Ship
Hmm...interesting. Here's a bit of news. I clear all codes from the car (no CEL) and take the car for a sprint. Supercharger kicks, I ride it out, then come to a stop. Turn around, punch it and nothing. I come to a stop again and check codes (still no CEL). All sorts of misfire codes on random cylinders plus a P0300 code just indicating random misfire.
Could the car be cutting the S/C when it senses a misfire? I've got brand spankin' new plugs in it but old wires (54K miles). I can certainly get new wires and probably should.
The new I/C failure idea that has come to light makes me curious too though. One item of info on that. The car was cold-cold, went for a spin and I got the S/C to lock out even before the car hit 60 degrees Celsius. The lack of flow makes me wonder though if it's going out. This fking pump only has about 1500 miles on it though. Ugh. Any better ones out there?
Could the car be cutting the S/C when it senses a misfire? I've got brand spankin' new plugs in it but old wires (54K miles). I can certainly get new wires and probably should.
The new I/C failure idea that has come to light makes me curious too though. One item of info on that. The car was cold-cold, went for a spin and I got the S/C to lock out even before the car hit 60 degrees Celsius. The lack of flow makes me wonder though if it's going out. This fking pump only has about 1500 miles on it though. Ugh. Any better ones out there?
Last edited by kjlindgr; Feb 8, 2010 at 12:10 AM.
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From: Philly
997TT, C192 GT63, W464 G550, MS Plaid
Here's an update. I tried to bleed the system and I was a bit confused as to the outcome. I removed the rubber bleeder cap and hooked a clear hose to it, routing it back to the reservoir. I disconnected the IC pump (CM30) and powered it up with a battery charger. The coolant barely moved in the tube and definitely didn't flow far enough to reach the reservoir. I thought I would have expected more of a flow coming out of this pump. I finally did get a constant trickle of fluid coming out of it though. Some air came out, but not too much. I let it run for a while just to make sure it was all out. Still no change. Car acted the same way as before. Dammit.
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Viking War Ship
I didn't, but I thought about it after the fact. It would make sense that the flow wasn't very strong coming out of this small pipe if there was much less restriction running through the big one. I might clamp it off just to see if I can bleed it more.
I'm starting to think I should chase the misfiring issue though now since one seems to directly follow the other (misfiring codes then bad engine running). Here are my next steps, please everyone give me your input:
1. Repeat issue to see if there is a pattern with particular cylinders impacted. I have a hard time believing that 4-5 cylinders developed this issue all of a sudden, but whatever.
2. If I can repeat it on cylinders, swap plug wires and eventually coil packs around to see if I can move the issue and isolate it to plug wires.
3. Purge the fuel rail to make sure that there is no trapped air. I can't believe there is any though. Gasoline has a couple cans of seafoam in it to hopefully clean things out as well.
4. Get a fuel pressure gauge and see if it's a pump pressure failure issue.
5. ???
I did some searching and found that some was attributed to bad cats plugging up the exhaust flow. These cats are brand new...literally 20 miles on them...so that's not the problem.
Thoughts? Anyone else have this issue?
I'm starting to think I should chase the misfiring issue though now since one seems to directly follow the other (misfiring codes then bad engine running). Here are my next steps, please everyone give me your input:
1. Repeat issue to see if there is a pattern with particular cylinders impacted. I have a hard time believing that 4-5 cylinders developed this issue all of a sudden, but whatever.
2. If I can repeat it on cylinders, swap plug wires and eventually coil packs around to see if I can move the issue and isolate it to plug wires.
3. Purge the fuel rail to make sure that there is no trapped air. I can't believe there is any though. Gasoline has a couple cans of seafoam in it to hopefully clean things out as well.
4. Get a fuel pressure gauge and see if it's a pump pressure failure issue.
5. ???
I did some searching and found that some was attributed to bad cats plugging up the exhaust flow. These cats are brand new...literally 20 miles on them...so that's not the problem.
Thoughts? Anyone else have this issue?
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Viking War Ship
Sadly, I did. It just happened much more infrequent. It never throws a CEL, and since it was more infrequent, I never really looked into it. Here's my last post about the issue when I first reported it:
https://mbworld.org/forums/w211-amg/...er-issues.html
https://mbworld.org/forums/w211-amg/...er-issues.html
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Viking War Ship
I just put new Denso IKH22's on the car. I can recheck the gap but I was pretty sure they were gapped right.
Plug wires and coils could be the culprit...but it's hard for me to think that multiple ones could all go at the same time. That just seems way odd to me.
I can also check gaskets again. I did pull the supercharger recently so the upper and lower intake manifold gaskets were taken out. I sprayed them with copper gasket spray and reused them. It idles good which to me would indicate they are sealing fine, but maybe they are leaking a little...I dunno.
That at least gives me a place to start again tonight.
Plug wires and coils could be the culprit...but it's hard for me to think that multiple ones could all go at the same time. That just seems way odd to me.
I can also check gaskets again. I did pull the supercharger recently so the upper and lower intake manifold gaskets were taken out. I sprayed them with copper gasket spray and reused them. It idles good which to me would indicate they are sealing fine, but maybe they are leaking a little...I dunno.
That at least gives me a place to start again tonight.
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From: Philly
997TT, C192 GT63, W464 G550, MS Plaid
I just put new Denso IKH22's on the car. I can recheck the gap but I was pretty sure they were gapped right.
Plug wires and coils could be the culprit...but it's hard for me to think that multiple ones could all go at the same time. That just seems way odd to me.
I can also check gaskets again. I did pull the supercharger recently so the upper and lower intake manifold gaskets were taken out. I sprayed them with copper gasket spray and reused them. It idles good which to me would indicate they are sealing fine, but maybe they are leaking a little...I dunno.
That at least gives me a place to start again tonight.
Plug wires and coils could be the culprit...but it's hard for me to think that multiple ones could all go at the same time. That just seems way odd to me.
I can also check gaskets again. I did pull the supercharger recently so the upper and lower intake manifold gaskets were taken out. I sprayed them with copper gasket spray and reused them. It idles good which to me would indicate they are sealing fine, but maybe they are leaking a little...I dunno.
That at least gives me a place to start again tonight.
Misfires in multiple cylinders that occur together is likely and indication of an air leak, not a 100% thing but def check for that.
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Viking War Ship
I'll do some poking around for an air leak. I would sure think that if there as a vacuum leak, it would idle like complete crap. I've had vacuum leaks before on other cars and they aren't fun...but definitely noticeable and pretty apparent what the issue is.
Anywho, did some more diagnosing today. Not sure I accomplished anything, but I did get a pattern forming. When it cuts out, it typically throws 5 codes...misfire on cylinders 5, 6, 7, 8, and a "random misfire" P0300 code. Seems like it's cutting off that whole bank of cylinders for some reason.
Anyone know what would make it kill an entire side? I have a hard time believing this is all just random and that it just so happen to have a bunch of plug wires go bad and they just so happen to all be on the same side. That makes no sense.
The side that's wrong is the driver's side too and you can't mix the coil pack wires around on that side. The passenger side is different, but cylinder #1 is numbered.
Still at it I guess...
Anywho, did some more diagnosing today. Not sure I accomplished anything, but I did get a pattern forming. When it cuts out, it typically throws 5 codes...misfire on cylinders 5, 6, 7, 8, and a "random misfire" P0300 code. Seems like it's cutting off that whole bank of cylinders for some reason.
Anyone know what would make it kill an entire side? I have a hard time believing this is all just random and that it just so happen to have a bunch of plug wires go bad and they just so happen to all be on the same side. That makes no sense.
The side that's wrong is the driver's side too and you can't mix the coil pack wires around on that side. The passenger side is different, but cylinder #1 is numbered.
Still at it I guess...
Last edited by kjlindgr; Feb 8, 2010 at 10:18 PM.
