Uber Wagon

Your business model of not having any of your own money in these orders is asking for trouble - MANY businesses have gone down this path and quickly into robbing Peter to pay Paul.

But - it's buyer beware and you've sufficiently warned folks with your business model.

emoving

I have a set of Iforged 20s and they are some of the nicest wheels I have owned. They are truly a quality wheel. I have owned DPEs, HREs, BBSs and others. These are right there with quality on all the above.

Oh and everyone arguing with whitepano,,,its little monkeey boy in disguise. So just ignore him.

amdeutsch

Interesting friends you keep. No flame directed at you. But you have to question the fact that they never told you about the new needed bolts issue. Also that they never told you that their wheel load rating could be a detriment to heavy cars like MBs; since they claim light weight.

I guess that is why they also warn you about doing business with friends. You never know where you wind up since friendship can cloud the issues at hand.

$0.02

vegas55amg

.......sounds like more people demanding Saks 5th Avenue service, while they only pay Wal-Mart prices.....

if you get a set of HRE wheels for 5-8 THOUSAND dollars, you have every right to expect top notch I-expect-the-vendor-to-kiss-my-butt-service.

if you get a set of Forgestars for 12-14 HUNDRED dollars, you are being unrealistic, and more than a little unfair, with your expectations.

Those offering business advice, probably don't own a business, and have never owed and ran a business. in this day and age, cash up front is necessary, especially when what you are selling requires an outlay of cash to produce.

mikey33

Hey Vegas how about you leave your snarky comments to yourself if you do not know the history behind the topic at hand. You seem to have an irrational and twisted concept of what business is all about, it does not matter if a set of wheels cost $500 or $10k, the point is, if a claim is made that the wheels will be finished in six to eight weeks than that is what the customer is expecting; you do not order a set of wheels that cost $2000 at discount tire and a week later they say, oh, it will be another two months and also there are no refunds, sorry! No person I have seen on these forums are questioning the quality of the wheels at all, and that is why I bought a set myself. The way which business is being conducted is unprofessional and a refund should have been issued a long time ago. I have had an online business since I was 16 on eBay with over 3000+ sales now and the number one objective I have is to respond to customers within 24 hours; the worst thing a company can do is lie to a customer because it leads to digging a hole which is hard to climb out of. It reminds me of "Bayou" the stock trading company which started out legitimate, but after losing all the clients money by making bad trades they felt it was better to start cooking the books than to confess and move on; now, this is obviously an exaggerated comparison, but the lesson is the same.

Godfather@ONE Autosport

I know where you're coming from. I'm hoping to get an answer by the end of the week for you and go from there. I know you're not trying to be a dbag, believe me when I say I understand.

Why are you inventing issues that I never had with Forgestar, such as their purported purposeful omission to tell me that Forgestar wheels require different style lug bolts? I never said anything about them not telling me, nor that it was an issue I had with them.

As for the wheel load rating, where are you going with that stuff? There is absolutely NOTHING hidden, nor is there any detriment whatsoever.

As a matter of fact, all testing data can be seen here:

http://www.forgestar.com/v1/testdata.php

The test load ratings is about 2000lbs, so I don't know where you're coming from with your invented figures. Seriously, give it a rest and quit trying to chip away at a perfectly respectable company's reputation and quality products.

Also, on that note, I will no longer sponsor MBworld directly beginning in the next month or two because your **** poor attitude is something I should NOT have to tolerate when I am a paying sponsor AND I run a business respectably with dozens of happy customers all around the world. I'm not a Jordan from 360 wheels, or that other idiot with his ghetto tunes (I forgot his name).

I'll still be on the forums under my regular s/n (The Godfather) and I won't conduct business here. People know where to find me, so if they wants stuff from me, they know where to go. It is unfortunate that someone of your stature, a moderator, has to nitpick at essentially what is nothing, for absolutely no reason.

The only issue there is here, is AWOL's set that is lagging, in production, and that is it. One set. One customer. Yes, there were two prior people who got refunds, but their situations were different. Regardless, 100 customers and one unhappy one, and you begin this silly vendetta.

And to the public who reads this, you're smart enough to know what is what. As I have said before, I strive to tell me customers the best possible ETA on wheels, but I never guarantee it, because I simply can't. But when I hear about other vendors giving the canned answer of 6 to 8 weeks, I can't help but to feel sorry for whoever fell for that.

That's all.

mikey33

I hope you are not going to stop sponsoring here on mbworld because of me Godfather. My only point was that a refund should have been given to AWOL a long time ago, and that you should reconsider your terms and policies in regards to refunds with your customers because it makes it seem as though you do not care.

vegas55amg

Mikey I've got just as much right to post my opinions as you. and I certainly don't think my opinions are any more "snarky" than yours. I've never singled out or attacked anybody.


and I know plenty about the history of the topic at hand, I researched Forgestar wheels extensively before ordering mine. I am well aware of the issues many have with the long lead time. and I am able to read this thread for specific members concerns just as well as you.


I am glad you have run a successful Ebay business, more power to you! small business is the backbone and lifeblood of this country. and the fact that you started your business at 16 is commendable. at 16, I was more concerned with skipping school than anything else, that's probably why at 18, I was "wearing Army green" lol!

as far as your assertion that I have "an irrational and twisted concept of what business is all about" - we are just going to have to agree to disagree on that.

my own personal small business has grossed over 1 million dollars revenue annually for the last decade, so I do have at least a cursory understanding of customer service vs. price points.


the concepts I've been touching on are taught in every business school in the country. you can have higher prices and top notch service, or low prices and basic service. you CANNOT have top notch service and really low prices though. think of the 2 retailers I used as examples, Wal-Mart and Saks 5th Avenue. both successful business models. both very different.

Again, I posted because it seems many were beating up on Godfather for things that were beyond his control. I didn't even get my wheels from him (got them from Modbargains - I would've ordered from Godfather but I found out all about the wheels on a BMW website that Modbargains is a big seller on). and I don't even know Godfather, but having read many of his threads (he always comes up when you search good photos - cause he posts lots of 'em), he seems like a straight up guy, and I believe the majority of members in this forum would agree.

it just seemed everybody is "shooting the messenger".

Godfather@ONE Autosport

Nah Mikey, I wouldn't stop sponsoring MBworld because of you. As I said it before, it's because of senseless bickering and "shooting the messenger" as well as moderator's behavior.

Vegas, you seem to be the most educated on the matter and the business in general. Thanks for being the voice of reason!

amdeutsch

I'm confused now. So you knew about the different style bolts being needed and didn't tell your buyers? You even claimed its safe to use OEM bolts when in reality that isn't 100% true.


Link1

That post seems to cover the load rating aspect quite well. There are other posts on this load subject as well on the web.
And I said "could" not "certainty" which you seem to imply with your answer.


And in all this has nothing to do with what you assume about claims, etc. Its all about being up front and informing the buyer. Which includes updates once one is made aware of as in all the posts discussed on here. In the end it will be the buyer's choice, but at least the buyer has the information by then to assist them in their decision. I'm not knocking your business, but assuming your buyers know what you may know can easily turn into a catch 22.

I happen to have read about another vendor on another forum facing these similar issues. When made aware of the bolt issue that vendor immediately made an update to his initial post. When faced with the fact of plastic versus metal hubrings that vendor again stepped up to the plate. As someone on here mentioned pricing, this vendor choose to not worry and provided the same level of service as you could possibly expect from higher end pricing.

bigben320e

Very interesting link. I clicked on the link to read that whole thread and see there are some real issues in regards to quality, warranty, and order fulfillment on that thread. Questions I have:

What exactly is the load rating on Forgestar's? I am seeing two different figures, I am confused.

As mentioned on the other thread, does Forgestar actually have the JWL and VIA certificates?

I have been very leery about buying rims from anywhere, I am sure everyone here knows why judging from the many threads on these same issues that are all over the web. Hell, it took me about two years to finally get some Vossens.

I don't think Godfather is a bad guy, he explained the situation and how he operates, been pretty crystal clear on that. I can see that he wants to resolve the issue. However, Forgestar seems to have some issues themselves, by a cursory glance Bing or Google. We shall see. All in all I hope that the customers orders are filled, but at the end of the day:

1. The orders took too long, deadlines were not met from Forgestar.
2. The matter on lug-bolts and hub rings, something is amiss there. Why the back and forth? Forgestar should have been clear on this issue BEFORE even selling any rims. Customers need to know what they are in store for BEFORE buying to make a choice to purchase or not. JMO.

I run a small business and have for some years, and understand matters like this do come up but the resolve has to be swift and rightfully dealt with, damage control. Word of mouth can make or break a business, even the big ones.

Godfather@ONE Autosport

Actually, I apologize, I only now caught that the rated load and test load were different, I didn't catch that. Either way, things were never hidden. I do recall a customer wanting 18" wheels for his S-Class and when I asked Forgestar for a turnaround time on them they adamantly declined being able to make them due to load ratings and the fact that the S-Class was too heavy for them.

vegas55amg

ummmmmm..... actually, it's having too much of your own money into the supply side of your business which increases your overhead dramatically, both in terms of initial outlay investment (lost opportunity cost of that money which is tied up) and the cost of maintaining an inventory.

MANY businesses have gone down that path and found themselves up a financial sh*t creek without a paddle.........

vegas55amg

Vegas, you seem to be the most educated on the matter and the business in general. Thanks for being the voice of reason![/quote]


GF - thanks for the kind words - I just put myself in your shoes while reading the posts, and considered my own Forgestar experience (long wait, TOTALLY outside the control of the individual vendors, but great wheels totally worth the wait nonetheless).


it'll be interesting to see if Mikey gets his wheels in 6 weeks from Discount Tire (great company BTW, I've bought about 12 sets of tires from them over the last 8 years or so). His posts made him sound like the "de facto expert" on all things Forgestar, when apparently he JUST ordered his wheels 10 DAYS AGO!

That's right, ordered 10 days ago. and 2 days ago he tells me I don't know anything about the "history of the topic at hand".

For the record, I ordered my wheels 6-7 months ago right after they started producing 18" F14's. I paid in full up front (pretty typical on a semi-custom low margin product like these wheels), and I got my wheels just over 3 months from the time I ordered and paid in full. Even late last year the buzz on the internet was great wheels, but ya gotta be patient.

Keep us posted Mike-ster, if you get your wheels before the end of June post some photos and you can resurrect this thread and resume castigating vendors like Godfather, or as I prefer to refer to it, "shooting the messenger".

But if I were you I wouldn't be holding my breath on getting those wheels in 6 weeks.......... we'll be waiting for those photos.....

mikey33

Haha, okay I will post pics in 6-8 weeks! Anyways, when I was speaking of the "topic at hand" I was referring to the group buy that had taken place back in January and the multiple threads and posts which elaborated on buyers experiences; the several buyers which experienced problems were taken care of, but in a round about way. Thus, the reason for posting here on how the Godfather could improve his procedures for orders and policies in regards to refunds.

mikey33

Haha, okay I will post pics in 6-8 weeks! Anyways, when I was speaking of the "topic at hand" I was referring to the group buy that had taken place back in January and the multiple threads and posts which elaborated on buyers experiences; the several buyers which experienced problems were taken care of (except AWOL), but in a round about way. Thus, the reason for posting here on how the Godfather could improve his procedures for orders and policies in regards to refunds.

AWOL

any updates?

pearlpower

To be honest, with all of the bad lip service this thread has provided, I would think Forgestar would step it up a bit to get these wheels shipped out ASAP. I'm sure some business has been lost.

Godfather@ONE Autosport

AWOL you got PM. And for those who want transparency, his set is due to ship out next week.

mikey33

Nice to see you will be getting your wheels AWOL!

AWOL

Well they are for sale as soon as I get them. I wont even open them so if anyone is interested, let me know.

pearlpower

Though I realize the buying experience was not a good one, the wheels themselves are actually pretty good. I like the style, have received considerably more positive comments vs my iForged 20s, etc.

You went through a bit to get these, might as well at least see what they look like on your car. Why go through further hassle of selling them and buying something else?

And since they are 19s, not a single bent wheel-so far-knock on wood, toss the salt.

AWOL

I ordered 18s. I do not want them anymore as the stock wheels are good enough for me now. I dont want to mount and balance tires and whatnot either, so they are definitely for sale

Traffic53

which ones did you order?
color?

AWOL

I ordered 18" f14 in gunmetal.

any word on shipment date?