ahmad0658

Hello all,

Well, I would like to know how many nozzles should I used and where are the locations of the nozzles and sizes?

I have seen Shardul post with pics on other forum, from the pics, I could understood that the nozzles are placed after the S/C IC right?

No nozzle should be placed before S/C?

I need to know this information as soon as possible please.

urbamworm

Generally the most common areas to place a nozzle is right before the throttle body or slightly upstream of it. Then when using dual nozzles one right after the intercooler and one right at the throttle body.

With the supercharged E55 though and how the throttle body and supercharger arrangement are you would want to not place the nozzle before the throttle since it would be compressed in the charger. When running pre turbo or supercharger you want to use a very small nozzle and it helps to make the compressor map a little fatter and have them run more efficient. On the other hand you aren't going to get as good of a result as if you were to run a larger nozzle after the supercharger in these cars though since with the larger nozzle you will have a greater chance of cooling the intake air temps right before it enter the cylinders as well as injecting more methanol into the combustion chambers.

You want to be sure that the nozzle(s) are before the intake air temp sensor though to get the benefits of not only having the engine run cooler and safer from detontation protection, but also gain the performance of the ecu increasing ignition timing due to the temperature sensor reading cooler intake temps.

So in conclusion you want your nozzle to be after the supercharger and before the intake air temp sensor and typically they would be placed after the intercooler setup which in these cars gives very little room and options since the intake temp sensor is so close after the intercooler.

GT-ER

I was thinking about this and believe that placing it right before the intercooler would be the best bet. This might be my next mod so I've been looking into it.

TTMotorsports

The ideal location for a dual nozzle set up is in the top of the tb housing and before the intercooler fins. If the nozzle is placed after the intercooler the MAP and IAT are too close to the nozzle to get proper atomization/mixture. It is only about 4" from the IAT and directly across from the MAP since where you can put the nozzle is very limited after the intercooler.

GT-ER

What size nozzles would you recommend for a setup such as mine?

urbamworm

I would disagree that 4" is not enough space before the intake air temp sensor. In my Audi world meth injection systems are a dime a dozen and I have been running it for 5 years.

Mine personally is about 8" before my throttle body (the IAT sensor is in the intake manifold immediately after the throttle body housing). Many many others all run theirs literally right before the throttle body and even in special plates that bolt behind the throttle body about 1" before the sensor with great success. Here is an example of the plate (doing it this way behind the throttle body is recommended to use a solenoid to keep from syphoning under vacuum) and the sensor is that black thing right behind the plate on the right side of the manifold inlet hiding under the red hose.



So as you can see that type of setup is only 1" away from the sensor and works perfectly so 4" is obviously better and sufficient in my book. In my opinion the channels of the intercooler would interfere with atomization and cause the water to want to stick more instead.

As for nozzle sizes, I have a little over 400whp (all wheel drive) in my Audi and run a 625cc nozzle and some guys running around 500 or just over even run as high as the 900cc range. My car with the meth turned off has trouble with rising intake air temps and with it on is dramatically different so I believe with something in the 600-700cc range on an E55 with similar power levels of 400-500whp you will have great results.

I am out of town for work at the moment and when I get back plan on installing a kit on the E55.

ahmad0658

So, I have to run dual nozzles and both before IC? What are the sizes?

Now it is tricky and hesitating, coz the guys are running directly after IC and on the surge tank (The one that has the word AMG).

That's confusing

urbamworm

I think you are confused about the surge tank. I assume you are looking at pics from Shardul and they tapped the surge tank for a boost reference point for the meth injection kit. That is not the actual nozzle location. There was only one nozzle and it was right after the intercooler and right before the intake air temp sensor in the housing before it Ys out to then go up to the surge tanks.

TTMotorsports

M3 in the tb housing and a M7 before the intercooler. That has worked awesome in the many meth systems that I have done to the M113k's!

ahmad0658

Thank you very much Bruce for your info, I will go that way.

adianaty

Thanks Bruce for the info. Do you have a picture of the locations that you have used?

ahmad0658

What if Put one after TB and one after IC? Should I give it a try

stevebez

Honestly only two locations are possible. One ahead of the I/C just after the S/C outlet and one just after the I/C ahead of the IAT sensor. You cannot go ahead of the S/C screws, and you cannot go after the IAT/ MAP sensors.

Location 1 to me is best as atomisation is best and also this is where heat is the highest in the ar flow, and this is where you get best cooling effect.

Location 2 also works but you are directly opposite the MAP sensor and I am concerned this could lead to erratic MAP readings when you are pulsing. The IAT sensor also has chance to get wet and wet bulb read could mess up things as well, also atomisation is less efficient here....

Using Aquamist HFS6 with one 0.8mm jet at 130PSI, kicks in at 70% IDC and ramps up to max fow at 95% IDC. I am thinking of adding some curve for MAP as well now.

If anyone need to know the ECU pinpouts for connections its like this...

Socket 3, location 27 for IDC
Socket 5, location 9 for ignition on (prime)
Socket 3, pin 10 for MAP

ahmad0658

stevebez, thanx a lot I was just searching for those information about wiring connections.

If you have some photos that might help too

viper04

Here is a good read on where you can position Water/meth nozzles.

Link: http://www.alcoholinjectionsystems.c...icle_info.html


Hope this helps

stevebez

here we go...

ahmad0658

Very nice, thanx a lot

sneakyneon

Ive been running water/meth for over a year, I think I was the first success story that I remember seeing.
Ive tried one nozzle and two, Ive had it pre IC and post and my current is a M3 pre TB and a #7 pre IC. the difference is around 30 degrees having it pre IC vs Post, I moved mine for 2 reasons, one I wanted a more accurate picture of IAT temps and also I had gone through 2 map sensors in a years time frame.

stevebez

what do youmean by the bold bit? Are u runing dual nozzles?

ahmad0658

Well, I installed the nozzle (yeah only one) in AEM kit and this ****ing nozzle is tall !!! and could not be set after IC, so I installed it before IC right after S/C and pointing toward IC.

Size of the nozzle is 550 cc and I don't know if that's enough or not but at least i am getting something.

TTMotorsports

What was that saying Nick(sneakyneon)? You can lead a horse to water but you can't make it drink.

Nick and I have worked very closely progressing his meth set up and, considering the amount of meth kits I have done, this is the best nozzle location. M3 in the tb housing and M7 before the intercooler.

Guys- this is not speculation like a couple of the posts in this thread, These are tried and true solutions to the dual nozzle placement location.

alltrac

so you have one nozzle pre throttle body? I want to do a water/meth setup but using only just one nozzle. Im not a die hard racer so i dont need the "uber" cooling setup, but a little extra cooling cant hurt. I was thinking of setting up a small nozzle pre-throttle body just to drop intake temps a bit and not having to pull off the supercharger. Do you have pics of your current setup...specifically the placement of your pre-tb nozzle?

ahmad0658

I don't know, but the hot air that is not diserable is coming right after the supercharger, which means you must have one nozzle somewhere after SC whether before IC or after IC but you MUST have nozzle there. You can have pre TB (there will be some vaccum so you need to compensate for it) or Post TB nozzle but if you don't have a nozzle after SC then hot air is still there ...

Bottom of the line, one nozzle = either before IC or after IC.

Please someone corrects if i am wrong.

stevebez

Well I dunno I certainly would not want to be spraying meth & water into the S/C screws...

I use one 0.8mm jet ahead of I/C, in the elbow after the s/c outlet. This is the best location for one jet.

YMMV.

Ali_E55

so the meth wont harm S/C screws ??