I am in a dilemma.

I am going to buy the Kleemann headers (and delete primaries) and send the ECU to them for tuning/deleting codes.

However, I am not sure whether to stay on the stock pulley or go bigger (and by bigger, I mean their 168 pulley).


I am debating for this main reason:

--I just don't want to be spinning all through 1st gear and make most of 2nd useless. This will basically make the car not as fast from a dig or slow roll, am I right? I want to be able to get the power to the ground.


For those that have just headers with stock pulley, or had that and upgraded to a bigger pulley - advice would be GREATLY appreciated.

I don't want to drop a few grand more and the car is basically spinning with anything more than 1/2 throttle.

Any help would be awesome.

Thanks in advance.

Welcome to the world of high HP.... and cars that need to be "driven".

In a car with maybe 300 - 400HP you can just floor-it and hold on while the car does all the work. When you start talking about cars with more power than that (especially 2WD versions) driver skill becomes a lot more important. Roll into the throttle as hard as the rear tires will allow, constantly reading that feedback from the tires and backpedaling as necessary to get the most possible from the car.

ESP helps from a dig if you are feeling too lazy to really "drive". The real attraction of adding more power than the car can handle in low gear is the way it adds urgency at highway speeds....and beyond. Being able to mash the gas at 75mph and get ferocious acceleration well beyond 100, 120, etc. would be awfully addictive.

-G

Stay with stock pulley and see how the car is after tuned. If you think you need more power, than bump up to 168mm. But try and get a tune from where you can get free tunes/reflashes after more mods are added.

Most of 2nd will not be useless if you have decent tires. My car's 1st is useless but 2nd will only spin a little and pull cleanly all the way to 80mph. Our cars have looooong gearing so it makes it easier to put down 500whp and have it stick.

I say go for it and get a solid pair of tires for the rear (with racing compound). With your alignment set the way it should and a little training of your right foot, you will have no regrets.

Oh yes, that talk of alignment reminded me of a couple additional things:

1. Add a Quaife limited slip out back
2. Add a set of aftermarket toe-links for the rear suspension

Those two things seem to make a big difference (in addition to the alignment and tires) for guys trying to put down big power and also makes the whole system more predictable and easy to handle when the tires DO break loose.

-G

Kleemann tuning

Ill let you know how my car feels as soon as I get a 168 on it.I think Ill make the same top end but loose about 30-50 flb down low.

If I get the Kleemann headers installed, is it safe to drive the car with the Kleemanns headers and without the tuning yet? Since I'd have to set the ECU out to Colorado and I'd have to drive home from my Indy's shop.

Is it safe to drive around with aftermarket headers and no tune?

Yes.

Should be fine to drive, just dont romp on it.. I wouldnt go long without the tune though.

I've got Kleemans and 168 pulley. Im on 20's and traction is a big issue through first gear. My car completely shuts down and falls on its face if I punch the throttle. I've got stock wheels with Nitto drag radials that are going back on shortly, this way I will get to enjoy the added benefit of headers and pulley.

Going with headers usually drops boost by at least 1lb. and YOU MUST TUNE AFTER HEADER INSTALL..my car went from 483hp to 460hp after header install and no tune...after tune 493hp...if your going to do it, do it right.

No...you do not. Will it be better if you do? YES....but you don't HAVE to. There is also no reason to lose power by going with headers and no tune, you may lose 1psi but it's because the engine is more efficient. If you lost power it's because something else was going on.

GT, my car ran extremely rich after the header install. I cant remember the exact #s but, AFRs were very high thus robbing the engine from making the power it could have when tuned properly for headers. I agree you dont have to but why leave 30+ HP on the table not tuning.

Sounds interesting that you lost 20+hp by installing headers, even if it is without a tune.

I think you meant lean

Afr's would be low if they are rich, as mentioned above, a high afr is running lean. Rich takes away power but is safer, lean makes power but detonation becomes a risk.

I've seen other people add headers to a car and gain power with nothing else, it's odd that you would lose so much power. It's not like the car can't adjust it's own tune. But regardless, I agree that a tune would be BETTER.

From MBH post i read, our cars are running pig rich stock from the factory. So adding headers would more lean. You should get a tune, since it will be needed to make sure the o2 senors are 'ready mode' and to clear and CEL codes.

Yes, I stand corrected thank you. My brain relates rich to a higher number, therein lies the mistake.

Headers and tune. Leave the pulley for later.

Header + Pulley + tune ... best bang for buck.