Forrest Gump 9

Yes sir, I hear you. But this option is a lot cheaper than $95k.

Ted Baldwin

......before you throw away your AMG s/c.....wait! Are the Weistec figures not achievable in heavily modded cars with stock s/c? Lets stick with actual figures, not projected theoretical figures. If Weistec thinks there s/c can make more power with more mods, then they can always post actual dyno figures with the additional mods

Ted

GT-ER

I doubt few have any doubt what a 3.0L screw type can produce. I could care less what weistec produces, they have priorities such as carb testing. I care more what forum members can produce with it. 700+whp should be easy.

urbamworm

This is true, there are people making 575whp or 600whp with the stock supercharger using a big crank pulley and cams and or ported/heads.

Now here is the problem with that though, they can only do that using C16 or Q16 race fuel and can only do that for one run with the car cold and/or with a tank full of ice and perhaps with their exhaust missing from the car and then they sit for another 45 minutes with fans and bags of ice all over their engine to achieve that number again. As you see, there were a lot of "ands" in that.

So in a "real world" scenario driving your car as you would daily like a normal person, it just doesn't seem to be possible. Where we have near 600whp being produced on 91 octane with the upgrade with only more room for improvement for the guys that have or are willing to get cams and or ported heads on top of any benefit running a higher octane (93) may also bring to the equation.

So while I definitely see where you are coming from because these numbers from Weistec are nothing amazing and not seen before, at the same time they are when you take in to consideration the things listed above. Over 600whp on pump gas seems easily attainable if you have all the basic mods. Those are my 2 cents.


What I want to know is what the difference was in the car producing the 574whp on the dyno in the video Weistec posted which with the same mods they give us the graph of 534whp? Did they tame back the timing a few degrees, was that high run with ice in the tank? What was done that only a throttle body upgrade made basically the same as the most recent headers/exhaust also added dyno for that video?

AgSilver

Our E55's were more than that in 2004. Remember: Nothing accelerates faster than the depreciation of an AMG! Just check the prices of a year old SLS. A good E55 by the spring of 2015 should still bring $18-20K and I'll bet you can find an E63 TT in the $60's by then. These things will be coming out of Alfalterbach like popcorn. And, thousands upon thousands of standard E Class's are destined as taxis. There's an E63 (big block) taxicab running around Mainz Germany.

e55amgrocket

Great point! My car made a best of 619hp on a dynojet with no ice in the tank and on its second run so it was exactly cold but that was on Q16 but I did run full 3" exhaust. I've done back to back hot laps and dropped 2 tenths just from heat soak and the ice melting. The stock blower can't come close to what a 3.0L blower can do. Part of the reason this blower needs to spin faster (higher boost) is because larger blowers are kind of lazy down low. Something else to think about with the weistec kit is that the tuning might be very conservative to what we are used to with the stock blowers when we are looking for everything we can get out of it.

urbamworm

Yeah, and when asked why the video with only 82mm throttle body showed a higher number (574whp) compared to the graph posted with only 82mm throttle body (534whp) Weistec said:

So if they left 40whp on the table from their advertised number (their graph) and what the car was able to actually do, then what did/could the car do with the headers/exhaust if the advertised number was 575whp? I am pretty sure it would be over 600whp as it sits. I just want to know what the difference was for the two throttle body numbers, was it a tune adjustment?

AgSilver

Probably 800 hp is possible, but at what cost and then what do you have?

Just look at the platform you would be starting with in an E63TT AWD. These are most likely lighter as a result of extensive usage of aluminum and 800 hp is possible just with the ECU. The technology is a light year ahead not to mention the launch control capability. IMO, these are easy 10.0 sec missiles - - - and eventually into the 9's.

My thoughts would be to sell off the E55 to the youngsters in about 18 months and let the development begin on the 63TT's.

PACougar

I've yet to see a ecu tune only 63tt make 600rwhp, where do you come up with 800hp? Now if you mean crank HP, 700-800rwhp in a e55 is not going to be comparable to 800 crank HP in a 63tt. I think if we can get these bigger displacement SC going on full modded cars you'll find out that the 63tt isn't so impressive when 55 are running 9's Also wait until everyone finds out what it cost to actually put larger turbo's on the 63tt, it'll make this SC get look like it was made for a Civic!

Ted Baldwin

....the plus 178HP car has full exhaust including headers, no Cats and an 84mm throttle body and running 17psi of boost. This is already a heavily modified car. For me I've been around the block. Until I see the numbers, it doesn't exist

Ted

Worth the wait

Here ya go:

http://www.weistec.com/m157s1.html

Weistec is well over 600whp with tune only and simply air filter swap.

My guess is that we will see an 800whp TT before we see and 800whp 55K
Hope I'm wrong though

PACougar

Ok, air filter swap is pretty insignificant change to get over 600 at the wheels. This doesn't change the fact that you'll need larger turbos to get anywhere near 800rwhp. I'm telling you changing turbos on these is not like a normal turbo swap, these things are built into the manifolds. The undertaking is going to be huge and so is the cost Albeit not a 55K, this SC on Weistecs BS trapped 144 mph at the track. That says 800+ to the wheels to me is possible. Now it would be nice for some us to actually get our hands on one so we can see what it can really do

Hammer Down

Why don't you keep the 55 and treat it as if were an old school Camaro or Mach 1

Worth the wait

Completely agreed.
There are several companies working on this already.
The TT12 is designed the same way (and just about every other performance turbo car out there now) and there are upgrades available for the V12.

In my mind the bottom line is that these new motors have greater potential for performance than the 55k. Therefore getting turbo upgrades should happen fairly quickly...especially consider the guys in places like UAE throw tons of money at their cars looking for huge numbers.

I think mod for mod: upgraded FI, head work, 20+psi and full bolt ons the TT is going to develop more power.

Oh and add AWD with upgraded drivetrain and she will be stoppable...lol.
Hello 8's :-$

AgSilver

I actually plan to do just that. This is the car that set the standard just as the W109 6.3 did in 1968. Years from now, most of the E55's will have gone to the crusher as they will have become way to expensive to maintain by the owners who could not afford them in the first place. The few that remain will be keepers and still faster than probably 98% of anything else on the road.

My E55 will outlast me as my end is far closer than my beginning.

AgSilver

I was referencing BHP not wheel HP. A 3.6L TT Porsche out-of-the-box makes 600BHP.


If you have not already seen this, you will find it, at the very least, informative. You will also see what tuners have as a base to start from.

stevebez

My thoughts too, I guess given there is now less exhaust back pressure meant more heat was being scavenged away and less heat was being internalised by the "open" exhaust. Less prone to knock onset on 91 fuel, so they could safely up the boost.

Also tells me guys running big pulleys and oem exhaust (or a restrictive one) are looking for a bucket full of broken pistons....

GT-ER

I agree 100%. I've always suspected that heat is what causes the pistons to blow and not hp.

PACougar

To be fair, metal typically melts from heat not the knowledge of how much horsepower they're helping create

GT-ER

obviously, but you can melt a piston with 200whp with ease...you can also have a piston survive a long cool life at 500whp. Timing, AF and Iats are key in this.

Weistec

Gentlemen, our supercharger is configured differently depending on modifications. A free flowing exhaust will drop boost down, but we offset this with a different upper pulley to compensate. Because of the increased efficiency of a high flow exhaust system, we can safely increase the boost pressure. Thanks again!

Weistec Engineering

GT-ER

This is what I wanted to hear. I figured as much.

adianaty

17psi is a 200-205mm crank pulley on our cars boys so keep that in perspective guys.

Weistec, are you at a point where you are using a map clamp or is the ecu still managing ok at these boost levels? Previously anything over 16.5psi was a known cliff in the ecu.

Weistec

Glad to hear! Let us know how we can assist from here..

Weistec Engineering

PACougar

No doubt, I was just messing around. I didn't think you were actually confused about how it works.