Damaged MK113 crankshaft snout:
#1
Junior Member
Thread Starter
Damaged MK113 crankshaft snout:
So my harmonic original balancer had the drive pulley for the supercharged come apart from it. I purchased a new balancer from FCP Euro and had a local shop install it (I also supplied a new crank pulley bolt). After getting my car back from the shop I made it about 5 miles before this happened (see photo below). It looks like the snout of the crankshaft has been damaged. Anyone had/seen a similar situation? I am assuming the worst with this one.
Last edited by Scottjuly79; 04-18-2020 at 07:31 PM.
#2
MBWorld Fanatic!
Another case of improper torque of the bolt. Ask them how they did it and what specs they used BEFORE you tell them it fell off.
Seeing this really pisses me off because there is no reason for it ....AT ALL !!!!
Is the key still on the crank snout ? That's what's important.
Seeing this really pisses me off because there is no reason for it ....AT ALL !!!!
Is the key still on the crank snout ? That's what's important.
Last edited by SICAMG; 04-18-2020 at 11:29 PM.
#4
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Wrong and they are responsible for it. All you have to do is look in ALLDATA like any good mechanic that never did a certain job before and you would know. That bolt requires a special holding fixture and around 250lbs of torque on a "Torque to yield" bolt. They owe you a new crank, pulley and labor on this job now since it was there failure to do it correctly.
The engine has to come out to do it and that opens a whole new can of worms if they are that stupid to begin with.
The engine has to come out to do it and that opens a whole new can of worms if they are that stupid to begin with.
Last edited by SICAMG; 04-19-2020 at 07:13 AM.
#5
Junior Member
Thread Starter
Just hoping to god that the keyway is still intact on the crank snout. I’m assuming the gouging towards the front end of the crank likely occurred as the pulley (and possibly key) walked their way off of the crank.
#7
Junior Member
Thread Starter
I’ll grab a picture of it once the radiator fan is out and I can get in there for a better look. I’m assuming the only way to repair a damaged keyway is to remove the crank and have it welded/machined. At that point I think it’s fair to say that the repair shop just bought themselves an E55 parts car because the repair is likely more costly than the value of the car.
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#9
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There are cases where after careful prep, a file here a dremel there and pinning it you can fix it , , I did it where I carefully installed another key,pinned it and ARP bolt never a problem and it ran true , others have done it if you search on here , however , I don’t know if you want that guy doing it after what just happened
#10
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2003 W211 E55, 2003 W220 S600
Bolt was not torqued down.
Key way and new pulley will be damaged.
Crank shaft will have to come out to fix it the right way.
You can try using the pin kit we sell to fix it without removing the crank but I don't think so it will work.
Key way and new pulley will be damaged.
Crank shaft will have to come out to fix it the right way.
You can try using the pin kit we sell to fix it without removing the crank but I don't think so it will work.
#11
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#12
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Thread Starter
Update: the installer is trying to blame the failure
on the crank pulley bolt which I had purchased through Amazon from a company called “Stuttgart Auto parts”. I was in there today and had my phone recording the conversation in which he clearly states that he used an impact breaker bar to install the bolt and that it produces “about enough torque, if not more” to install the crank pulley bolt. When asked why he did not follow Mercedes procedure for
torquing the bolt he says “I didn’t have any way of keeping the engine from turning” and also pulls out his standard torque wrench showing me that it only goes up to 60 ft/lbs... Attached is a photo of the bolt I purchased. Is anyone familiar with this particular vendor and/or the authenticity of their products? They seem to have quite an extensive offering of “genuine Mercedes” parts through both Amazon as well as EBay.
on the crank pulley bolt which I had purchased through Amazon from a company called “Stuttgart Auto parts”. I was in there today and had my phone recording the conversation in which he clearly states that he used an impact breaker bar to install the bolt and that it produces “about enough torque, if not more” to install the crank pulley bolt. When asked why he did not follow Mercedes procedure for
torquing the bolt he says “I didn’t have any way of keeping the engine from turning” and also pulls out his standard torque wrench showing me that it only goes up to 60 ft/lbs... Attached is a photo of the bolt I purchased. Is anyone familiar with this particular vendor and/or the authenticity of their products? They seem to have quite an extensive offering of “genuine Mercedes” parts through both Amazon as well as EBay.
#14
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I also noticed you're from BC? Let me know what shop this is...
#15
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This place is a joke.
Most shops don't have the proper tools for this job. It simply was not installed tight enough. You need about a 5 foot long 1" drive ratchet for this job. When tightening with the proper tool you really feel like the bolt is about to snap. That's how tight it feels when removing/installing. It's a stretch to yield bolt. The bolt you showed on Amazon looks like the OEM bolt and they said it's OEM. I replaced my crank pulley a few years ago with an ASP 175mm pulley....and yes I used that 5 foot long ratchet after my torque wrench to tighten to spec. Several years now, and no problems. I changed hundreds of similar pulley's in the early 2000's as MB had a problem with the pulley's separating and grinding into the oil pan and front timing cover on the 210 E-class, 163 M-class and others. I never had a failure. The problem you now face is that the shop you had install it doesn't seem competent to repair the new problem. I hope there isn't an MB dealership near you and you cheaped out on a back alley shop to save a few bucks. The skill level of dealership tech's does vary, but they have the financial resources to fix their screw-ups too.
Last edited by E55Greasemonkey; 04-20-2020 at 08:12 PM.
#16
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This topic can be chased all over the place but the bottom line is......Read post 4 again, that's all you need to know.
Get a lawyer, it sucks but there is nothing you can do at this point unless you pay out of pocket. Good luck.
Get a lawyer, it sucks but there is nothing you can do at this point unless you pay out of pocket. Good luck.
Last edited by SICAMG; 04-20-2020 at 11:02 PM.
#17
Senior Member
Wrong and they are responsible for it. All you have to do is look in ALLDATA like any good mechanic that never did a certain job before and you would know. That bolt requires a special holding fixture and around 250lbs of torque on a "Torque to yield" bolt. They owe you a new crank, pulley and labor on this job now since it was there failure to do it correctly.
The engine has to come out to do it and that opens a whole new can of worms if they are that stupid to begin with.
The engine has to come out to do it and that opens a whole new can of worms if they are that stupid to begin with.
#18
MBWorld Fanatic!
Holy **** ***** did the shop admit to torquing it with a rattle gun??
WTF???
I dont know the torque spec on these engines but I have done a S320 CDI before and those bolts are done up RIDICULOUSLY TIGHT.
I had pipe extensions on thick solid power bars and a home made welded crank/pulley brace and was lifting the entire front end of a S class clean off the ground and was still struggling to get it to the 180deg mark or whatever it was after torqing to some ridiculous number. A mechanics shop rattle gun isnt even going to come remotely close to this unless its one of those latest 1500nm jobbies and even then its not the way to do it.
WTF???
I dont know the torque spec on these engines but I have done a S320 CDI before and those bolts are done up RIDICULOUSLY TIGHT.
I had pipe extensions on thick solid power bars and a home made welded crank/pulley brace and was lifting the entire front end of a S class clean off the ground and was still struggling to get it to the 180deg mark or whatever it was after torqing to some ridiculous number. A mechanics shop rattle gun isnt even going to come remotely close to this unless its one of those latest 1500nm jobbies and even then its not the way to do it.
Last edited by austingtir; 04-21-2020 at 08:53 PM.
#19
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Thread Starter
My first visit in there he says impact gun, then when I returned the second time (with my phone recording the conversation) he says impact bar and then walks me over to his tool box and show me what looks
like some sort of 3’ long bar with about a 30’ bend halfway down it and an open ended wrench style working end. Apparently it has some sort
of an impact function to it. I don’t see any possible way the it could produce more than 50-60 ft/lbs without turning the engine.
like some sort of 3’ long bar with about a 30’ bend halfway down it and an open ended wrench style working end. Apparently it has some sort
of an impact function to it. I don’t see any possible way the it could produce more than 50-60 ft/lbs without turning the engine.
#20
MBWorld Fanatic!
My first visit in there he says impact gun, then when I returned the second time (with my phone recording the conversation) he says impact bar and then walks me over to his tool box and show me what looks
like some sort of 3’ long bar with about a 30’ bend halfway down it and an open ended wrench style working end. Apparently it has some sort
of an impact function to it. I don’t see any possible way the it could produce more than 50-60 ft/lbs without turning the engine.
like some sort of 3’ long bar with about a 30’ bend halfway down it and an open ended wrench style working end. Apparently it has some sort
of an impact function to it. I don’t see any possible way the it could produce more than 50-60 ft/lbs without turning the engine.
And from what you've said he's clearly just rattled it on there.
Last edited by austingtir; 04-21-2020 at 08:51 PM.
#22
Junior Member
Thread Starter
UPDATE:
The shop has admitted fault and since purchased a new pulley, oil seal, woodruff key, etc my installation into the car. My problem: the condition of the keyway (see attached photo). What are everyone’s thoughts/opinions as to whether simply reinstalling a new key and pulley into this keyway in its current condition is going to hold together or not?
#23
MBWorld Fanatic!
Looks terminal to me.
The photo is very average but the old pulley would of clearly spun on the crank she's a wright off in 9 out of 10 cases I would say.
Even if the old surface was ok which I doubt it is you'd probably still want to double/tripple pin it to make sure.
The photo is very average but the old pulley would of clearly spun on the crank she's a wright off in 9 out of 10 cases I would say.
Even if the old surface was ok which I doubt it is you'd probably still want to double/tripple pin it to make sure.
Last edited by austingtir; 05-06-2020 at 05:24 PM.
#24
MBWorld Fanatic!
First off they are full of s**t thinking they are going to fix it. The timing gear has to come off to get a new key in there and clean up the crank. How do they plan to do that ??? Front cover has to come off to do it correctly. And what austingir said.....extra key in there to help the issue. Everyone thinks the key is there to hold it in place...and it does to a certain extent. So an extra keyway does help but it is the bolt torque or tightness that really holds it in place, which you have unfortunatly have seen.
The timing gear has to come off to do it correctly.How do they plan on doing that????
The timing gear has to come off to do it correctly.How do they plan on doing that????
#25
Senior Member
I literally just did this to fix my front seal, and while I have a Snap-on torque wrench that goes up to 250 ft-lbs (which does angles) it required my 1/2" breaker bar, and the 5' long pipe handle from my jack to properly make the 90 degree turn of the bolt. I just marked it and rotated it after the initial torque.
You need to fix the keyway properly in my opinion.
You need to fix the keyway properly in my opinion.