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E55 Harman Kardon + Aftermarket Android HU WITH FIBER OPTIC
Hey guys, just bought a 2004 E55 with the HK system and would like to replace it with a CarPlay head unit. I know the general thought atleast as of 2014 was to get the RCA to fiber adapter to retain the HK amp, but with that setup you’re splitting the front audio between all and losing fader ability. I get that if you aren’t running 7.1 wav files you won’t take full advantage of the 7.1 anyways, but I would like to be able to use the fader.
I see several of these head units that have a Toslink fiber port on the back- can I use this to go directly into the stock wiring and retain full stock functionality? I haven’t been able to find a thread that discusses that yet.
I have attached an example of the back of one that has the optical + regular plug for RCAs
I'm not sure what that manufacturer advertises but virtually all car audio is 2 channel; as in, no front/back. The backs are almost always just a copy of front, with different time delay. I do remember being able to fade when I had the AVIN usa head unit.
Another option is to install aftermarket amps, but keep the speakers and speaker locations. You could leave the stock AGW for things like phone calls or whatever else... and use the new amps for your audio signal.
I'm not sure what that manufacturer advertises but virtually all car audio is 2 channel; as in, no front/back. The backs are almost always just a copy of front, with different time delay. I do remember being able to fade when I had the AVIN usa head unit.
Another option is to install aftermarket amps, but keep the speakers and speaker locations. You could leave the stock AGW for things like phone calls or whatever else... and use the new amps for your audio signal.
yeah you do make a good point, I was thinking that as well it’s normally 2 channel. Guess fader depends on the model you use. Not ready to switch the amp yet so I’ll just get the head unit and if it bothers me maybe go from there. Guessing since the HK amp is present it’ll still do all of the meaningful tuning.
I would recommend just getting a 4 channel aftermarket amp. Sounds better. You won't get 4 channels with an aftermarket adapter or radio unless it is specifically designed for the MB fibre optic. Toslink is not the same. I had an adapter for a long time but it never sounded as good.
TOSLink does not communicate with the proprietary MOST audio optical interface. If you'd like to keep your factory MOST system, the ONLY solution is going with a mObridge 8.1 which can take the factory MOST signal from a factory head unit. https://mobridge.us/product/mobridge...audi-mercedes/
if you want to convert to aftermarket like I have done for head unit and amplifier to utilize TOSLink, you'll need an all in one like i have or separate DSP and amplifer. I use a Helix V-Twelve which is has additional speaker outputs which was overkill. https://www.audiotec-fischer.de/en/h...twelve-dsp-mk2 . could go with a Helix V-Eight for lower cost as our vehicles only have 7.1 audio.
moving to a digital output (toslink or coax) you will lose volume control from your head unit as any digital output from a head unit unless its through USB is essentially line level volume with zero adjustment in volume. so you'll then need to run volume control from your DSP or amplifier to the front of the vehicle.
my whole setup is, head unit mounting kit from enfig, Joying 13.1 inch android head unit (older version of linked below with different specifications and screen), Helix V-Tweleve DSP with Amplifer, Helix Director Audio Control head unit. i decided on this because the factory speakers are very good and i wanted the ability to fully tune, frequency, and time adjust all speakers in the vehicle.
as stated above, all car audio is 2 channel. the DSP will then split the L and R signal to all of the channels with processing applied. the same applies for digital car audio; two channel that is processed by the DSP. digital in home or pro theater audio can support upwards of 10 channels but not in car audio. using a 2 channel MOST audio converter i'm not sure if this will then be processed into all 7.1 speakers. I initially ran wiring to bypass the factory amplifier to 4 speakers directly from head unit using a plug in harness to the factory speakers connector off the factory amplifier. this cleaned up audio quality as the factory amplifier is muddy sounding, but the soundstage was not ideal as only using 4 of the 7.1 speakers.
the kit you linked looks decent. it includes the harness that runs back to the factory amplifier location, but bypasses and plugs directly into the speaker harness as I ran initially. the sound quality will be good but you'll lose quality in the sound stage and room filling.
Last edited by eightysixtuned; May 24, 2024 at 12:58 PM.
TOSLink does not communicate with the proprietary MOST audio optical interface. If you'd like to keep your factory MOST system, the ONLY solution is going with a mObridge 8.1 which can take the factory MOST signal from a factory head unit. https://mobridge.us/product/mobridge...audi-mercedes/
if you want to convert to aftermarket like I have done for head unit and amplifier to utilize TOSLink, you'll need an all in one like i have or separate DSP and amplifer. I use a Helix V Twelve which is has additional speaker outputs which was overkill. https://www.audiotec-fischer.de/en/h...twelve-dsp-mk2
moving to a standard optical output you will lose volume control from your head unit as any digital output from a head unit unless its through USB is essentially line level volume with zero adjustment in volume. so you'll then need to run volume control from your DSP or amplifier to the front of the vehicle.
my whole setup is, head unit mounting kit from enfig, Joying 13.1 inch android head unit (older version of linked below with different specifications and screen), Helix V-Tweleve DSP with Amplifer, Helix Director Audio Control head unit.
as stated above, all car audio is 2 channel. the DSP will then split the L and R signal to all of the channels with processing applied. the same applies for digital car audio; two channel that is processed by the DSP. digital in home or pro theater audio can support upwards of 10 channels but not in car audio.
TOSLink does not communicate with the proprietary MOST audio optical interface. If you'd like to keep your factory MOST system, the ONLY solution is going with a mObridge 8.1 which can take the factory MOST signal from a factory head unit. https://mobridge.us/product/mobridge...audi-mercedes/
if you want to convert to aftermarket like I have done for head unit and amplifier to utilize TOSLink, you'll need an all in one like i have or separate DSP and amplifer. I use a Helix V-Twelve which is has additional speaker outputs which was overkill. https://www.audiotec-fischer.de/en/h...twelve-dsp-mk2 . could go with a Helix V-Eight for lower cost as our vehicles only have 7.1 audio.
moving to a digital output (toslink or coax) you will lose volume control from your head unit as any digital output from a head unit unless its through USB is essentially line level volume with zero adjustment in volume. so you'll then need to run volume control from your DSP or amplifier to the front of the vehicle.
my whole setup is, head unit mounting kit from enfig, Joying 13.1 inch android head unit (older version of linked below with different specifications and screen), Helix V-Tweleve DSP with Amplifer, Helix Director Audio Control head unit. i decided on this because the factory speakers are very good and i wanted the ability to fully tune, frequency, and time adjust all speakers in the vehicle.
as stated above, all car audio is 2 channel. the DSP will then split the L and R signal to all of the channels with processing applied. the same applies for digital car audio; two channel that is processed by the DSP. digital in home or pro theater audio can support upwards of 10 channels but not in car audio. using a 2 channel MOST audio converter i'm not sure if this will then be processed into all 7.1 speakers. I initially ran wiring to bypass the factory amplifier to 4 speakers directly from head unit using a plug in harness to the factory speakers connector off the factory amplifier. this cleaned up audio quality as the factory amplifier is muddy sounding, but the soundstage was not ideal as only using 4 of the 7.1 speakers.
the kit you linked looks decent. it includes the harness that runs back to the factory amplifier location, but bypasses and plugs directly into the speaker harness as I ran initially. the sound quality will be good but you'll lose quality in the sound stage and room filling.
thank you for all of the info, I think I’ll end up going your route, seems like the only correct way to do it. In the mean time, I am on my 2nd most converter to no avail, and I have a third with the acc wire coming tomorrow. Headunit and Canbus works perfectly but no audio. The fiber light is steady on inside the box, but DAS Star doesn’t pick it up as a control unit. It does complete the loop though. I have no clue how to get this thing working- if the third box doesn’t then I’m returning all of them and getting an amp.
TOSLink does not communicate with the proprietary MOST audio optical interface. If you'd like to keep your factory MOST system, the ONLY solution is going with a mObridge 8.1 which can take the factory MOST signal from a factory head unit. https://mobridge.us/product/mobridge...audi-mercedes/
if you want to convert to aftermarket like I have done for head unit and amplifier to utilize TOSLink, you'll need an all in one like i have or separate DSP and amplifer. I use a Helix V-Twelve which is has additional speaker outputs which was overkill. https://www.audiotec-fischer.de/en/h...twelve-dsp-mk2 . could go with a Helix V-Eight for lower cost as our vehicles only have 7.1 audio.
moving to a digital output (toslink or coax) you will lose volume control from your head unit as any digital output from a head unit unless its through USB is essentially line level volume with zero adjustment in volume. so you'll then need to run volume control from your DSP or amplifier to the front of the vehicle.
my whole setup is, head unit mounting kit from enfig, Joying 13.1 inch android head unit (older version of linked below with different specifications and screen), Helix V-Tweleve DSP with Amplifer, Helix Director Audio Control head unit. i decided on this because the factory speakers are very good and i wanted the ability to fully tune, frequency, and time adjust all speakers in the vehicle.
as stated above, all car audio is 2 channel. the DSP will then split the L and R signal to all of the channels with processing applied. the same applies for digital car audio; two channel that is processed by the DSP. digital in home or pro theater audio can support upwards of 10 channels but not in car audio. using a 2 channel MOST audio converter i'm not sure if this will then be processed into all 7.1 speakers. I initially ran wiring to bypass the factory amplifier to 4 speakers directly from head unit using a plug in harness to the factory speakers connector off the factory amplifier. this cleaned up audio quality as the factory amplifier is muddy sounding, but the soundstage was not ideal as only using 4 of the 7.1 speakers.
the kit you linked looks decent. it includes the harness that runs back to the factory amplifier location, but bypasses and plugs directly into the speaker harness as I ran initially. the sound quality will be good but you'll lose quality in the sound stage and room filling.
of course the third box didn’t work, so I said f—- it and am going to buy an amp like your setup. Bought a Audison AP F8.9bit, seems pretty good for the money. I’ve never installed an audio system before, any tips? Also I just want to add a knob for volume and not add their screen, do you know if that kind of thing is universal? Can’t find too much for that.
of course the third box didn’t work, so I said f—- it and am going to buy an amp like your setup. Bought a Audison AP F8.9bit, seems pretty good for the money. I’ve never installed an audio system before, any tips? Also I just want to add a knob for volume and not add their screen, do you know if that kind of thing is universal? Can’t find too much for that.
The Audison AP F8.9bit looks like a great unit. Audio heads will always say Helix as its pro grade, but Audison makes a great product as well. Most likely you'll run into the same situation as me where you'll need an external audio control knob. You can buy a dummy knob without a screen usually. I have both, but the screen will allow me to switch audio profiles for different music. What the interwebs don't tell you is that once you get into pro-sumer pro level audio, your equalizer configurations will be vastly different for different genre's of music or even same genre but different generation of music. rock music from the 80's won't work on the same EQ as rock music from the 2000's. so then if you don't plan to have different audio profiles for each, you'll end up having to settle with somewhere in the middle which won't sound as good. the audio control knob usually is configurable to what the user prefers, subwoofer gain, audio profile map, volume, input selection, etc.
pain in the azz, but its the truth.
oh and i have yet to mount the Helix Director audio control screen. I'll eventually install within the ashtray.
Last edited by eightysixtuned; May 29, 2024 at 02:16 PM.
X-Trons is a good company. they do lock down their devices though to only use their proprietary add ons, but overall fit and finish and install is well thought out. i have an xtrons in my 957 Cayenne...there are good things and bad things about it. best thing is they've ensured steering wheel controls work with their head unit. my joying unit does not as they do not have a W211 canbus interface and i'm using another brand's canbus interface to translate, but i would have eventually lost steering wheel control anyway for volume after install of the Helix V-Tweleve.
Last edited by eightysixtuned; May 29, 2024 at 02:23 PM.
The Audison AP F8.9bit looks like a great unit. Audio heads will always say Helix as its pro grade, but Audison makes a great product as well. Most likely you'll run into the same situation as me where you'll need an external audio control knob. You can buy a dummy knob without a screen usually. I have both, but the screen will allow me to switch audio profiles for different music. What the interwebs don't tell you is that once you get into pro-sumer pro level audio, your equalizer configurations will be vastly different for different genre's of music or even same genre but different generation of music. rock music from the 80's won't work on the same EQ as rock music from the 2000's. so then if you don't plan to have different audio profiles for each, you'll end up having to settle with somewhere in the middle which won't sound as good. the audio control knob usually is configurable to what the user prefers, subwoofer gain, audio profile map, volume, input selection, etc.
pain in the azz, but its the truth.
oh and i have yet to mount the Helix Director audio control screen. I'll eventually install within the ashtray.
that’s a good point with the different profiles. I don’t like the screens because it doesn’t match the interior imo, and the screen on the oem ones are terrible- I’d be more okay with it if it was a nice high res oled. Maybe I’ll look into making a raspberry pi one. Ash tray is a nice idea definitely out of the way. Wonder if I can maybe take the signals the headunit sends out for volume and use them go to into a pi then that sends it to the amp…
as far as we tested
there is nothing faster than ATOTO
as fast as a Iphone if you want to go for Asian Android
the one I got is an 8core with 8gb ram 128rom, seems very nice so far very responsive. I have seen good reviews is the atoto as well. I’ll be interested to see how this one ages in a few years
The Audison AP F8.9bit looks like a great unit. Audio heads will always say Helix as its pro grade, but Audison makes a great product as well. Most likely you'll run into the same situation as me where you'll need an external audio control knob. You can buy a dummy knob without a screen usually. I have both, but the screen will allow me to switch audio profiles for different music. What the interwebs don't tell you is that once you get into pro-sumer pro level audio, your equalizer configurations will be vastly different for different genre's of music or even same genre but different generation of music. rock music from the 80's won't work on the same EQ as rock music from the 2000's. so then if you don't plan to have different audio profiles for each, you'll end up having to settle with somewhere in the middle which won't sound as good. the audio control knob usually is configurable to what the user prefers, subwoofer gain, audio profile map, volume, input selection, etc.
pain in the azz, but its the truth.
oh and i have yet to mount the Helix Director audio control screen. I'll eventually install within the ashtray.
I decided to go minidsp with Dirac live and haven't been disappointed one bit...but I scrapped the idea of a head unit altogether. I bought a joying unit with the floating screen and while I like that it updated the look of the interior, it just didn't have the functionality I needed. I'm now using only my android phone for audio. I connect to a USB hub, Samsung Dex takes over and sends video to a screen, and audio to my DSP. I love it... Now I just need to find a way to get android supported backup camera software and I'm golden.
oh, ya i did feel the same as the phone call integration with the factory head unit is the best. just navigation was poor and i use it much more than the phone calling, but great that you are able to blue tooth into your DSP, that means full quality as supported by whichever bluetooth version and codecs it supports.
i believe there are wifi bluetooth camera's that work just as long as you have the app up. launching of the app automatically isn't possible without a custom android rom like an android head unit would have, so not automatic video popup support generally speaking.
Mercedes SLR McLaren 722 S Is Extremely Rare Example Modified by McLaren
Slideshow: A one-of-one U.S.-spec Mercedes-Benz SLR McLaren Roadster became even rarer after a factory-backed transformation at McLaren's headquarters.
