What's the deal with the TCU on these cars?
11-21-2016, 07:23 AM
#76
Super Member
Thread Starter
11-21-2016, 07:31 AM
#77
11-21-2016, 09:03 AM
#78
Super Member
Thread Starter
11-21-2016, 11:12 AM
#79
You get my point though... your setup wasn't maxed out but still didn't work out. It's unfortunate and I feel bad for what you had to go through, but the way I see it... W3 kit being reliable = no significant power gains (clearly from that video against the M5)... and W3 kit with significant power gains = no reliability. Am I wrong?
11-23-2016, 04:34 PM
#80
Senior Member
Weistec's own claim
stock turbo with exhaust: 647.46whp on 91 Octane
W.3 turbo with FULL SUPPORTING UPGRADES: 660rwhp on 91
That 660 number was not posted to their website until after I bought the W3 package which I was told would give me 734 to the wheels on pump gas. In reality you get 12.5whp? Those extra horsepower could well be coming from the extra supporting upgrades.
Whatever tricks you might have up your sleeve that others don't to improve the results of the W3 Turbo you could use the same tricks on a stock turbo and you will get the same result.
The facts are painfully clear. There's nobody left who looks at these facts and still thinks that W3 has any benefit as ypu can see from multiple responses.
My desire is simple I want to warn people not to make the same mistake I did. The bottom line is this: if you buy a w3 and ask a shop to install it and send your ecm to weistec for a tune you will walk away with the same horsepower as a stock Turbo with identical supporting upgrades.
The revised numbers published by weistec confirm this truth. Multiple recorded races also confirm this. User Sam E63 got his w3 dyno tuned. He put down same numbers as stock turbo with custom Dyno tune. Maxed out 670whp dynojet with race has tune, w3 and full supporting upgrades.
If people know all this and still want to go and buy a W3 that's their choice. If I have saved one person from being a sucker like myself then I have done what I wish someone else had done for me.
stock turbo with exhaust: 647.46whp on 91 Octane
W.3 turbo with FULL SUPPORTING UPGRADES: 660rwhp on 91
That 660 number was not posted to their website until after I bought the W3 package which I was told would give me 734 to the wheels on pump gas. In reality you get 12.5whp? Those extra horsepower could well be coming from the extra supporting upgrades.
Whatever tricks you might have up your sleeve that others don't to improve the results of the W3 Turbo you could use the same tricks on a stock turbo and you will get the same result.
The facts are painfully clear. There's nobody left who looks at these facts and still thinks that W3 has any benefit as ypu can see from multiple responses.
My desire is simple I want to warn people not to make the same mistake I did. The bottom line is this: if you buy a w3 and ask a shop to install it and send your ecm to weistec for a tune you will walk away with the same horsepower as a stock Turbo with identical supporting upgrades.
The revised numbers published by weistec confirm this truth. Multiple recorded races also confirm this. User Sam E63 got his w3 dyno tuned. He put down same numbers as stock turbo with custom Dyno tune. Maxed out 670whp dynojet with race has tune, w3 and full supporting upgrades.
If people know all this and still want to go and buy a W3 that's their choice. If I have saved one person from being a sucker like myself then I have done what I wish someone else had done for me.
Last edited by e65; 11-23-2016 at 08:53 PM.
The following 4 users liked this post by e65:
11-24-2016, 08:12 AM
#81
MBWorld Fanatic!
Weistec's own claim
stock turbo with exhaust: 647.46whp on 91 Octane
W.3 turbo with FULL SUPPORTING UPGRADES: 660rwhp on 91
That 660 number was not posted to their website until after I bought the W3 package which I was told would give me 734 to the wheels on pump gas. In reality you get 12.5whp? Those extra horsepower could well be coming from the extra supporting upgrades.
Whatever tricks you might have up your sleeve that others don't to improve the results of the W3 Turbo you could use the same tricks on a stock turbo and you will get the same result.
The facts are painfully clear. There's nobody left who looks at these facts and still thinks that W3 has any benefit as ypu can see from multiple responses.
My desire is simple I want to warn people not to make the same mistake I did. The bottom line is this: if you buy a w3 and ask a shop to install it and send your ecm to weistec for a tune you will walk away with the same horsepower as a stock Turbo with identical supporting upgrades.
The revised numbers published by weistec confirm this truth. Multiple recorded races also confirm this. User Sam E63 got his w3 dyno tuned. He put down same numbers as stock turbo with custom Dyno tune. Maxed out 670whp dynojet with race has tune, w3 and full supporting upgrades.
If people know all this and still want to go and buy a W3 that's their choice. If I have saved one person from being a sucker like myself then I have done what I wish someone else had done for me.
stock turbo with exhaust: 647.46whp on 91 Octane
W.3 turbo with FULL SUPPORTING UPGRADES: 660rwhp on 91
That 660 number was not posted to their website until after I bought the W3 package which I was told would give me 734 to the wheels on pump gas. In reality you get 12.5whp? Those extra horsepower could well be coming from the extra supporting upgrades.
Whatever tricks you might have up your sleeve that others don't to improve the results of the W3 Turbo you could use the same tricks on a stock turbo and you will get the same result.
The facts are painfully clear. There's nobody left who looks at these facts and still thinks that W3 has any benefit as ypu can see from multiple responses.
My desire is simple I want to warn people not to make the same mistake I did. The bottom line is this: if you buy a w3 and ask a shop to install it and send your ecm to weistec for a tune you will walk away with the same horsepower as a stock Turbo with identical supporting upgrades.
The revised numbers published by weistec confirm this truth. Multiple recorded races also confirm this. User Sam E63 got his w3 dyno tuned. He put down same numbers as stock turbo with custom Dyno tune. Maxed out 670whp dynojet with race has tune, w3 and full supporting upgrades.
If people know all this and still want to go and buy a W3 that's their choice. If I have saved one person from being a sucker like myself then I have done what I wish someone else had done for me.
11-24-2016, 11:51 AM
#83
Super Member
Thread Starter
Weistec's own claim
stock turbo with exhaust: 647.46whp on 91 Octane
W.3 turbo with FULL SUPPORTING UPGRADES: 660rwhp on 91
That 660 number was not posted to their website until after I bought the W3 package which I was told would give me 734 to the wheels on pump gas. In reality you get 12.5whp? Those extra horsepower could well be coming from the extra supporting upgrades.
Whatever tricks you might have up your sleeve that others don't to improve the results of the W3 Turbo you could use the same tricks on a stock turbo and you will get the same result.
The facts are painfully clear. There's nobody left who looks at these facts and still thinks that W3 has any benefit as ypu can see from multiple responses.
My desire is simple I want to warn people not to make the same mistake I did. The bottom line is this: if you buy a w3 and ask a shop to install it and send your ecm to weistec for a tune you will walk away with the same horsepower as a stock Turbo with identical supporting upgrades.
The revised numbers published by weistec confirm this truth. Multiple recorded races also confirm this. User Sam E63 got his w3 dyno tuned. He put down same numbers as stock turbo with custom Dyno tune. Maxed out 670whp dynojet with race has tune, w3 and full supporting upgrades.
If people know all this and still want to go and buy a W3 that's their choice. If I have saved one person from being a sucker like myself then I have done what I wish someone else had done for me.
stock turbo with exhaust: 647.46whp on 91 Octane
W.3 turbo with FULL SUPPORTING UPGRADES: 660rwhp on 91
That 660 number was not posted to their website until after I bought the W3 package which I was told would give me 734 to the wheels on pump gas. In reality you get 12.5whp? Those extra horsepower could well be coming from the extra supporting upgrades.
Whatever tricks you might have up your sleeve that others don't to improve the results of the W3 Turbo you could use the same tricks on a stock turbo and you will get the same result.
The facts are painfully clear. There's nobody left who looks at these facts and still thinks that W3 has any benefit as ypu can see from multiple responses.
My desire is simple I want to warn people not to make the same mistake I did. The bottom line is this: if you buy a w3 and ask a shop to install it and send your ecm to weistec for a tune you will walk away with the same horsepower as a stock Turbo with identical supporting upgrades.
The revised numbers published by weistec confirm this truth. Multiple recorded races also confirm this. User Sam E63 got his w3 dyno tuned. He put down same numbers as stock turbo with custom Dyno tune. Maxed out 670whp dynojet with race has tune, w3 and full supporting upgrades.
If people know all this and still want to go and buy a W3 that's their choice. If I have saved one person from being a sucker like myself then I have done what I wish someone else had done for me.
11-24-2016, 12:50 PM
#85
MBWorld Fanatic!
Weistec's own claim
stock turbo with exhaust: 647.46whp on 91 Octane
W.3 turbo with FULL SUPPORTING UPGRADES: 660rwhp on 91
That 660 number was not posted to their website until after I bought the W3 package which I was told would give me 734 to the wheels on pump gas. In reality you get 12.5whp? Those extra horsepower could well be coming from the extra supporting upgrades.
Whatever tricks you might have up your sleeve that others don't to improve the results of the W3 Turbo you could use the same tricks on a stock turbo and you will get the same result.
The facts are painfully clear. There's nobody left who looks at these facts and still thinks that W3 has any benefit as ypu can see from multiple responses.
My desire is simple I want to warn people not to make the same mistake I did. The bottom line is this: if you buy a w3 and ask a shop to install it and send your ecm to weistec for a tune you will walk away with the same horsepower as a stock Turbo with identical supporting upgrades.
The revised numbers published by weistec confirm this truth. Multiple recorded races also confirm this. User Sam E63 got his w3 dyno tuned. He put down same numbers as stock turbo with custom Dyno tune. Maxed out 670whp dynojet with race has tune, w3 and full supporting upgrades.
If people know all this and still want to go and buy a W3 that's their choice. If I have saved one person from being a sucker like myself then I have done what I wish someone else had done for me.
stock turbo with exhaust: 647.46whp on 91 Octane
W.3 turbo with FULL SUPPORTING UPGRADES: 660rwhp on 91
That 660 number was not posted to their website until after I bought the W3 package which I was told would give me 734 to the wheels on pump gas. In reality you get 12.5whp? Those extra horsepower could well be coming from the extra supporting upgrades.
Whatever tricks you might have up your sleeve that others don't to improve the results of the W3 Turbo you could use the same tricks on a stock turbo and you will get the same result.
The facts are painfully clear. There's nobody left who looks at these facts and still thinks that W3 has any benefit as ypu can see from multiple responses.
My desire is simple I want to warn people not to make the same mistake I did. The bottom line is this: if you buy a w3 and ask a shop to install it and send your ecm to weistec for a tune you will walk away with the same horsepower as a stock Turbo with identical supporting upgrades.
The revised numbers published by weistec confirm this truth. Multiple recorded races also confirm this. User Sam E63 got his w3 dyno tuned. He put down same numbers as stock turbo with custom Dyno tune. Maxed out 670whp dynojet with race has tune, w3 and full supporting upgrades.
If people know all this and still want to go and buy a W3 that's their choice. If I have saved one person from being a sucker like myself then I have done what I wish someone else had done for me.
M157 on race gas tune is maxing out at 670whp, a bit disappointing as I thought its got more in there, but what about torque? Seems like that's the main strength of this engine as it excels there.
11-24-2016, 12:51 PM
#86
MBWorld Fanatic!
11-24-2016, 01:05 PM
#88
11-24-2016, 08:32 PM
#89
Senior Member
So WHP numbers look the same with stock vs W3 as you say, but what about torque? no change there at all?
M157 on race gas tune is maxing out at 670whp, a bit disappointing as I thought its got more in there, but what about torque? Seems like that's the main strength of this engine as it excels there.
M157 on race gas tune is maxing out at 670whp, a bit disappointing as I thought its got more in there, but what about torque? Seems like that's the main strength of this engine as it excels there.
AMS turbo upgrade according to their website published numbers also results in lower Peak torque but the torque is maintained at higher RPM thus more hp.
The only Turbo upgrade I've seen that actually increases peak torque is from Gad Motors.
Not everyone has published before and after peak torque so there may well be other turbo upgrades that also increase peak torque.
Last edited by e65; 11-24-2016 at 08:36 PM.
11-25-2016, 01:55 AM
#90
MBWorld Fanatic!
A lot of turbo upgrade dyno charts on vendor websites show less peak torque with the turbo upgrades. Weistecs published numbers show 766tq on stock turbo and 730 peak torque on race gas with w.3 turbo.
AMS turbo upgrade according to their website published numbers also results in lower Peak torque but the torque is maintained at higher RPM thus more hp.
The only Turbo upgrade I've seen that actually increases peak torque is from Gad Motors.
Not everyone has published before and after peak torque so there may well be other turbo upgrades that also increase peak torque.
AMS turbo upgrade according to their website published numbers also results in lower Peak torque but the torque is maintained at higher RPM thus more hp.
The only Turbo upgrade I've seen that actually increases peak torque is from Gad Motors.
Not everyone has published before and after peak torque so there may well be other turbo upgrades that also increase peak torque.
11-25-2016, 06:10 AM
#91
11-25-2016, 01:36 PM
#92
Senior Member
In any case if you rely on weistec calibration you will not get those times. Why else would Fairbird have to recalibrate on his own??
2 weistec e63s, 1 shop car and another customer car, both lost to renntech intermediate tune + down pipes e64 at shift sector 1/2 mile roll event. Renntech e63 did not have the full exhaust like weistec e63, renntech car had severely restrictive factory turboback pipes+ rado downpipe and pump gas tune. Weistec cars has ice tank, intake full Boltons. Weistec exhaust replaces the restrictive Factory turbo back pipes with much bigger pipes that don't even fit with the factory motor mounts requiring their own low profile motor mount
Now somebody explain that to me
Last edited by e65; 11-25-2016 at 01:43 PM.
11-25-2016, 01:45 PM
#93
Numbers obtained by vbox not on a track. Could be going downhill. Could be that he has figured out how to do his w.3 to actually work. An actual track time would be much more convincing - there's no potential for other variables.
In any case if you rely on weistec calibration you will not get those times. Why else would Fairbird have to recalibrate on his own??
2 weistec e63s, 1 shop car and another customer car, both lost to renntech intermediate tune + down pipes e64 at shift sector 1/2 mile roll event. Renntech e63 did not have the full exhaust like weistec e63, renntech car had severely restrictive factory turboback pipes+ rado downpipe and pump gas tune. Weistec cars has ice tank, intake full Boltons. Weistec exhaust replaces the restrictive Factory turbo back pipes with much bigger pipes that don't even fit with the factory motor mounts requiring their own low profile motor mount
Now somebody explain that to me
In any case if you rely on weistec calibration you will not get those times. Why else would Fairbird have to recalibrate on his own??
2 weistec e63s, 1 shop car and another customer car, both lost to renntech intermediate tune + down pipes e64 at shift sector 1/2 mile roll event. Renntech e63 did not have the full exhaust like weistec e63, renntech car had severely restrictive factory turboback pipes+ rado downpipe and pump gas tune. Weistec cars has ice tank, intake full Boltons. Weistec exhaust replaces the restrictive Factory turbo back pipes with much bigger pipes that don't even fit with the factory motor mounts requiring their own low profile motor mount
Now somebody explain that to me
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e65 (11-25-2016)
11-25-2016, 01:57 PM
#94
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Join Date: Feb 2011
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2014 E63s amg 4matic, 2009 C63, 2006 E55 AMG , 2001.5 AUDI S4 stg 3+ w/meth
funny all this talk about the W3 kit and now price is down to 6,499 
http://weistec.com/all/e/e-63/2014-p...rade-m157.html
http://weistec.com/all/e/e-63/2014-p...rade-m157.html
11-25-2016, 02:21 PM
#95
Senior Member
If what you say is correct then we should see better times on the quarter-mile track and we should w3 cars beating stock turbo cars instead pf losing to them now that you have fixed their tune.
The idea of a customer telling weistec how to tune their own turbo after they have sold so many of them is surreal. I hope they don't need your help to fix their W-4 calibration after selling dozens of those.
They've already lost my trust by selling me something that they knew was not going to increase performance as advertised
Last edited by e65; 11-25-2016 at 02:25 PM.
11-25-2016, 02:35 PM
#96
Senior Member
11-25-2016, 03:15 PM
#97
how they can update if my car wasn't on the dyno ? any shop who do the install need to log the car and see what happens and talk to weistec , they know how to fix the issue they supply base tune and this is right , if the car in colorado ? if the car on 91 octane ? weistec will be responsible for it ? my shop does it , any w3 car will come out tuned the right way . you can't build 1 tune good for everyone and client don't know that , dealer or installer should know !
11-25-2016, 03:59 PM
#98
Senior Member
how they can update if my car wasn't on the dyno ? any shop who do the install need to log the car and see what happens and talk to weistec , they know how to fix the issue they supply base tune and this is right , if the car in colorado ? if the car on 91 octane ? weistec will be responsible for it ? my shop does it , any w3 car will come out tuned the right way . you can't build 1 tune good for everyone and client don't know that , dealer or installer should know !
11-25-2016, 05:48 PM
#99
Super Member
Thread Starter
this guy understands what I meant in the other thread I created about the stock turbo m6 running 10.3. Upgraded turbos are all hype at this point.
11-25-2016, 06:34 PM
#100
Senior Member
730whp e63 should destroy a 630whp e63 in a 1/2 mile race. Either Weistec lied about 730whp w.3 or efrench lied about his car having 630whp. For me it's not about hype it's dishonesty.
