try m3

Hey guys I just got my boost logic down pipes in and was getting ready to have them installed is there any gaskets or things I should have replaced while doing this? Is there a gasket between the bridge pipe and turbo if so do you guys have a part number?

Thanks

Vrodman

Sorry, no answer to this. But out of curiosity, do you have to pull the engine to install the new down pipes?

try m3

My car is a 2013 rwd so I don't believe I need to drop the engine for install but the awd cars you have to drop the engine.

T_Cob

Did you ever get your pipes installed? Any pics?

Siegmann

@try m3

How did this work out?

CerBErusM113

I would appreciate an answer as well, as Im doing these on my AWD 14 when I get my new engine mounts installed, any dyno #s also?

nyc_amg

I dont believe you have to drop the engine to do downpipes.

Savage212

You don't have to drop the engine for "downpipes" on AWD cars.... However you do need to drop the motor for a "bridge pipe" .

There's a short section that comes out of the turbo and turns down by the transmission, the "downpipes" couple up after that on a awd.

Not sure if there is a ton to gain, if the motors out just do turbos!

5soko

you are 100% correct, there is absolutely 0 to be gained with these pipes..

Mikeki7

But you get that sweet sweet turbo spool sound, worth it just for that. My car is rwd so was much easier to install, though I would agree on awd cars you might as well improve the turbos.

Cifdig

I’m srry but this is 100% incorrect. I had a dyno done with a stage 1 ec tune. Then gutted my cats dynoed about a week after hitting my cats at picked up almost 23 hp 26tq. Then I got a retune for stage 2. Your egt is lower, your spoil up times is faster. Which me power builds quicker even if it’s only 200rpm quicker

5soko

I was specifically speaking on the “bridge pipes” that was mentioned by savage.
That bolt to the turbos and to the cat pipes.
These pipes have no restriction, dont change sound, and yield no power gains. As much as some of these companies may try to make you believe. .

Removing the cats.. ill leave that for another discussion... psi for psi if you raced a similar car, i think you may be VERY surprised by the results. Cat flow technology of todays cars has gotten extremely good compared to many myths of years ago.

good article:
https://f87.bimmerpost.com/forums/sh...php?p=24603457

Savage212

The "bridge pipe" and Cattless down pipes are different.

Cifdig

Srry thought you meant cat less down pipes. Also I’m not into articles. I can find an article that says removing cats shows gains. I’m just speaking from my personal real world experience. And also you can’t compare 2 cars with the exact same mod. They can act entirely different not all cars are identical even the same year make model with matching mod and matching miles. When you remove cats you are creating efficiency , removing heat faster, removing unwanted back pressure. As I agree some back pressure is needed to create a form of exhaust scavenging, but that’s mainly for NA motors where scavenging has a greater affect. I have had many cars. Mod my own vehicles from piston to gearing and diff, except tuning. Also I dyno after every mod on the same dyno same temp within a week from each other . I promise if I lost power removing my cats I would have re installed them without hesitation . Search my post, the last thing I would want to do is miss lead any of my fellow enthusiasts. Maybe Jon doe removed his cats and lost power I’m sure it may happen. But the ratio for gain to loss on much higher then loss to gain on removing cats. Just like everyone who keeps dumping tons of meth with huge nozzles right before the intercooler to show minimal gains. While I mist meth pre turbo with great gain without tuning

5soko

I believe all your efforts have been strong and effective, im sure of it..
And by all means i encourage all members to enjoy their cars and mods, that is what we are all here for right.
but i have seen numerous times a diff outcome in real world runs( cat vs catless, then catless vs catless, same cars) backing many of these claims today how well these new cats flow. Just sharing my experience. You can DM me, maybe we can even meet in person and try it out and talk more about this.

Savage212

Forget the gains, the sounds and smell of victory is what I am after.

Savage212

After reading the article cited here, there are some points of debate. Copied from other Post

" Some facts- Mclaren catbypass pipes will give you a Check Engine light P420/P430 code on these cars. Often you can use simulators to keep the light off BUT its not guaranteed. The car runs 100% fine but you get a small light on the dash. Simulators give you a 50% chance of eliminating a CEL light.

Fabspeed Motorsport has awesome record setting safe tunes for all these McLaren cars for stock, with highflow cats and also No Cats RACE system with no CEL Lights 100% guaranteed. All of our tunes are set up safely for 92 to 93 octane pump fuel.

Point of interest- in virtually all of our testing super highflow German imported Extra large diameter HJS 200 cell Catalytic converters make more absolute power and torque all across the RPM band than catbypass pipes. The HJS Catalytic converters FLOW 93% of a straight pipe and the cars don't go into overboost/ spike and the ECU doesn't try to trim and pull everything back as what happens when you install a catbypass pipes.

Fabspeed Motorsport has tunes for all catted or no cat Mclaren cars. Whats interesting is that the power increase/ difference in ONLY +5HP by going tuned and catless. In our years of back to back dyno testing since 2010 with these cars catbypass pipes/competition pipes and with a tune you get only an additional +5HP more than a Mclaren with HJS German sport race cats with a tune on "same day same weather". "

First, if you do not tune for catless, I'd agree zero or negative gains. Second, what Mclaren owner would do some dumb *** 02 sims? That is a lame way to "correct" the oxygen sensors, any respectable tuner can fix this in the tune. No simulators necessary. After all that it goes on to say there is in fact a gain... however minimal.

Cifdig

Keep in mind we do not have 200 cell high flow cats as a stock option . Inside our cats there is 2 speperated cells one at the very beginning and small half inch space and another. And that’s per side . So a total of 4 cells. Now I’m assuming we are not talking high flow 200 cell cats because they do flow extremely well. And my statement is based on standard flow cats which is what we have

Das_it16

You're incorrect. There are power gains. How do I know? We actually tested it in person. Here's the video:


CLS63s: Weistec turbo backs
E63s: kept the factory bridge pipes and had MBH catless down pipes

5soko

Glad you had a different experience and tested it but,
Those bus length difference looks like a 100hp gain tbh....

I did not witness this result in person in my experience.
Might wanna check to make sure that one car is actually tuned,
since your saying a catless bridge pipe with a different bend picked up bus lengths when compared to the oem catless bridge pipe. Lol

Das_it16

Both are tuned by the same tuner and had all the work done by the same shop. We noticed better iats with the CLS63s up top due to the extra flow.

5soko

Not sure if you are associated with the tuner or maybe someone was not clear in one of the races with their mods but NO aftermarket bridge pipes will gain that much power and lengths as shown in the video, i am sorry.
That video is more of a tune vs NON tune video by the huge gap that was put on so quickly. The gap in that race is massive amount of WHP difference.

The oem bridge pipes are actually hydroformed which flow actually very well with no restriction. The oem bridge pipe width is offset by their height, volume is still there in flow because of this. Not sure where this major restriction is coming from to gain so much power, and free so much up you were able to have cooler IAT's? Interesting.

Different experiences i guess. Glad it worked out for you.

Das_it16

Both of them are very close friends of mine. I helped them pick out their mods, where to order, where to go for install and the tunes themselves. My friend with the E63s didn’t want to drop the motor to fit the turbo backs and wanted a more simple route so we found a set of MBH down pipes and a stage 2 tune for 91 pump gas. We don’t have 93 out here in Vegas. Before the down pipes he started with a stage 1 tune only and we hit our local track LVMS. DA was 4500 and it did a 11.8 at 120mph. He spun ever pass since the track can get dusty from the desert winds out here and no track prep aka glue didn’t help either. He was on 20s as well.

Now my friend that owns the CLS63s didn’t care what it takes he just wanted the most gains. He started with a stage 1 tune as well. Went to the track and had a similar time as the E63s except he had a better 60ft and got 11.7 at 119mph but the DA was higher at 5000. After that we went with the Weistec turbo backs and the stage 2 tune on 91 pump gas. Both with the same amount of timing and boost. Both are tuned by Anthony Lawshee aka Tony from Race IQ Performance. I saw them both get flashed at our local Race IQ dealer called Silver Arrows Motors in Las Vegas.

This is what we experienced out here with these mods.


Here’s both them in front of the shop.




Oem motor mount on the left Weistec billet engine mounts to fit the turbo backs

Stock vs turbo back

Das_it16

The MBH down pipes on the 2015 E63s

MBH motorsports

I think the "bridge pipe" makes some power. However it also comes in at a higher price. Our downpipes are at the $1500-1700 price point pending sales discounts. We could very easily make a "bridge pipe" But that would include machining cost , and more build labor. Inturn making our downpipes cost more. We wanted to keep this simple, Our downpipes only take 20 minutes to install and if you want to reinstall your OEM system that only take about 20 min as well. This will save a person many hours of install time ($$$) Weistec makes nice stuff, but we believe we doo as well. Our construction is 16 gauge 304 stainless, Id imagine the same as our friends over at Weistec use. We just dont to the bridge pipe, but if someone wanted it we would make it for them.
To be fair, that weistec engine with the red pipe from weistec is the there water methanol injection setup. That on a car is worth a bunch of power.