I.T. Guy

Curious if the rods are same as stock design just stronger, or, if they are now pin floating and beefier/wider on the journals so they can't move around as much?

GMBALL

They are about the same size and width/depth (max 10% more), but much stronger. Also, the bottom part is wider than the OEM, which had that design flaw that Tasos always mentioned.

I.T. Guy

Thanks!!!

I.T. Guy

I sat on this for 4 years in disbelief MB covered it. I did not want to jinx anything. Now that I'm selling the car and doing full disclosure to buyers I might as well post it here too.

@GMBALL our stories on how it happened and how we were driving are very similar.

Mine seized around 75,000 kms which is 46,000 miles. Same symptoms. Loss of power, engine still turning over but couldn't get the rev's up, couldn't accelerate. I was cruising for an extended period of time 150-165mph range depending on road conditions. I'd slow down to 90-100mph when I saw taillights ahead to safely pass without giving people too much of a heart attack, then immediately floor it back up to 150+. Rinse and repeat. Once when bringing it back up to cruising speed the car started stuttering and popping and acting like it was running out of battery. Similar to a dead alternator. But I had full electrics?! It kept missing, hesitating, shuddering etc. more and more until I couldn't maintain even 60pmh speed no matter how much throttle input I gave it. I tried to keep going because I was in BFNW and it was 3am. No smell and no check engine lights or anything out of the ordinary. No smoke, nothing. Just running like absolute ****. Then the rev's wouldn't go above 3,000, 2000, 1000, slowing down while putting my foot in it trying to keep it alive it finally stalled out and stopped running completely. Still no CEL or anything wrong on the dash. I was finally near an exit <relief> I coasted off the Interstate and made it almost all the way to a Waffle House. It was a few hundred meters away so after making sure there were no axe murderers lurking about I sprinted to the restaurant. Chose a seat with my back to the wall. It was an interesting night.

The whole engine dying process took less then a minute from first stuttering to no turning over. No loud pops or explosions, no hard bang/knocking sounds, nothing huge. Just a sudden imbalance coming off of WOT. A shuddering and loss of power. Everything was "normal" until it stopped running. Even after shut down no engine lights, no warning, nothing "wrong" except it wouldn't crank. The starter would engage "CLICK" but not move even one degree. "Click". "Click". I ordered some bacon and eggs, ate that first, then called Roadside assistance. I managed to not get murdered until the tow truck showed up at 5:00am. There was a tense moment when I had to go to the washroom, all eyes on me, I spent a long time deciding if I should risk going down the hall of no escape. It worked out. We get the car loaded 4-5 am and dropped off at the nearest dealer, then he dropped me at a hotel.

The next day I go to the dealer and the initial inspection experience was horrible. The dealer was refusing to honor the Mercedes Benz North American Warranty and wouldn't even look at the car without up front payment. The MB Roadside assistance people were no help either after the tow. When I called to complain the dealer was not helping they just redirected me back to the dealer. "We just get you to the nearest dealer, our job's done". So I called my service advisor at my home dealer and he said "Don't worry. Pay whatever bills they give you to get on the road again, send me all the invoices, and we'll cover it. No sweat".

So I paid for the inspection. It was taking a long time. I went to a cigar bar, killed some time, they still weren't done. I had to stay at the hotel another night. The next day I sat in the dealer hounding them. They finally came back with a quote for USD$93,000 full engine replacement. "We don't know what happened. Engine is toast." I called my home SA "Are you sure you want me to pay the invoice? It's US$93k." He laughed and said "Yeah, we don't expect you to front that. Let's have the car towed here and we'll take care of it." Mercedes paid for my hotels, meals, tow back to Canada. I gave them the Xentry printouts and estimate from the US dealer. There was nothing bad listed anywhere. We went through all the diagnostic papers the US did, then they did their own. The computer still had no idea what happened except mechanically it was seized and would not turn over. They sent Germany a bunch of requested diagnostics files and we waited a week for an answer.

Germany approved a brand new engine!

It was the best feeling ever. I still remember where I was on that day lol and still feel elated when I drive by that spot.

To get the engine my dealer had to ship the old engine to Germany, whole, not taken apart, and Germany sent us a new crate. The whole procedure was really painless except for the run around by the first dealer in the USA.

I asked my dealer what the problem was and they said "We don't know and don't take them apart. Germany does that and they never tell us what it was. Probably bent rods. We do at least one of these a month."
One a month?! LOL!

While they had it apart they did lots of "while we are in there" work waiting on the crate to arrive. They replaced the coolant lines, drive axels, both batteries, tons of seals and grommets, all kinds of stuff. I basically got back a car with a new drivetrain, and all the things that usually break on these cars preemptively replaced. The bill it was $108,000. All covered under CPO and factory warranty.

My guess: Bad gas. All I can piece together is I bought gas from a less than reputable looking backwoods place. Since then I do not lean on the car if the gas is not from a busy good brand name station; and, if I'm forced to buy gas somewhere like that I just splash and go and wait to fill up at the next good brand name at the next busy interchange.


It's out!




It's Christmas


Oh baby



Old one was missing the star anyhow!



The hard way to get a new engine cover. Oh and new spark plugs! :P


All fixed up

GMBALL

My crankshaft as of now:
https://youtube.com/shorts/CLHDxsogqFU?feature=share

https://youtube.com/shorts/iVfI8EMEt7A?feature=share

https://youtube.com/shorts/HNH3EeDDAHg?feature=share

GMBALL

Next week sleeves will be installed. I am having a dedicated performance workshop doing this install for me. Afterwards I am bringing the block to my local workshop where we will begin to assemble the engine. I will upload some photos. If all goes well, probably in a month it should be ready. Cost wise - I am right now hovering at around 30k USD.

GMBALL

Sleeves are installed, the block is now ready for assembly. Will keep you posted.

GMBALL

Of course I experienced delays. Still waiting for the crankshaft to arrive from the machine shop. Here are some photos from the process of head polishing.

I.T. Guy

Man the backside of those valves!

I.T. Guy

I stole your valves pic for a new thread here
https://mbworld.org/forums/w213-amg/...ml#post8817833

GMBALL

So the local engine shop doesn't have the equipment to do the crankshaft balancing, they did straighten it up, but can't do the balanacing. So I was (again) forced to send it to the specialized AMG workshop in Germany, should have it back in about a week and afterwards the assembly begins. So car will be ready end of August, meaning, the entire summer season from April until September it was in the workshop, which is amazing. As a matter of fact, I am so upset about the whole thing and costs, that I will probably sell it anyways after I get it back. I just don't want to deal with this car anymore, it has drained my wallet and I don't have any emotional attachment to it.

I.T. Guy

Wait until the first cold start and drive.
I bet you smile.
Buy winter tires.

GMBALL

First cold start will probably be done by the mechanic, without me around. But I know what you mean. I will forever have a feeling of being afraid of doing WOT since it blew up last time....

kenneyd

Man, I would have picked up a nice low mile used long block from a wrecked E63, thrown it in there and enjoy it stock.

PeterUbers

it'll be fine ... just drive it a bit and you'll get over that.

kevm14

This is NOT an "I told you so post" but for me, part of why I rolled the dice on my 04 E55 back in 2020 was because, out of the box, it offered things that I could never fully achieve building up a vehicle I had at the time (even though that was always my dream). And when I was thinking maybe I should upgrade my E55, I thought maybe I should just buy an E63 instead and enjoy it stock, so I did and I am. So applying that same logic here I'd be looking to satisfy the urge with something stock. If that doesn't exist then that is a pickle.

PeterUbers

CarlosAMGBR

I am also of the opinion, that Stock is better than Tuned, or whatever stage of upgrades you are at. When you begin tuning, you are a beta tester essentially as the manufacturer has done a TON of stress testing to decide what parameters the engine should operate at.

I have owned a ton of fast cars prior to my M157 CLS 63 with PP. I owned a W213 E 63 S, a M5 F90, a 911 Turbo, and trust me at no point have I driven my car and thought (oh its slow). I get frustrated with the MCT Gearbox (funny how slow the MCT was in this gen compared to the new gen), nonetheless, the car is fast as hell. For me it doesn't even have the chassis or brakes to cope with the performance upgrade.

I love my CLS (I think its one of the most beautiful cars ever built. Period).

I do understand the thrills of driving a Stage 2 or Stage 3 M157 though. Must be something amazing (given how insane it already is at stock level)

CarlosAMGBR

Gmball if you feel comfortable could you please share the prices and parts you used for the rebuild (if not publicly at least through private messaging). I am planning on making my M157 CLS reliable switching all that can go wrong with it (cylinder head and wall because of scoring, camshaft sensors, tensioners and timing chains), and I found the rods and cylinder wall and heads you used interesting. I am in Brazil, so things here are a little ****ty (there has been no reported incident of M157 failure here thus far, therefore Mercedes dealers and Indy shops are clueless to what can be done well).

GMBALL

I am at about 30k USD mark:
forged pistons/rods ~ 8k USD (ItalianRP)
sleeves ~ 1850 USD (Darton MID)
new oem engine parts ~ 11k USD (about 220 small parts + fuel pumps + injectors)
labor ~ 7k USD (dissasembly, assembly of the engine once it's sleeved)
sleeving the engine ~ 3k USD (outsourced)
total = 30 850 USD

I will pay something for crankshaft straightening and balancing (about 1000 USD)
I will pay something for heads polishing etc (?? price)

So at the end it will be even more, the labor costs are not yet paid, once they finish all the work we will see. Some was outsourced.
All in all, for that price I could buy a low mileage, really nice CL63 AMG on top of my car. I am extremely pissed, mostly, because for these money I wlll practically receive the same car I had before, but with new engine internals.

CarlosAMGBR

Did you switch out timing chain and tensioners?

GMBALL

Yes, I consider these to be “small parts” Fuel pressure pumps replaced as well. Literally everything new besides turbochargers and crankshaft.

billvp218

I'd put upgraded turbos in it, etc., after an internal build like that. Otherwise, I agree with those that said they'd just try to find a decent condition used engine from a wreck and have it installed for much cheaper.

I.T. Guy

1000 turbos. You have all the right stuff to have the bottom end last, and can be happy you are not getting the same car back. You will be getting back a hyper-car.

JohnLane

Internals done right deserves upsized turbos and enhanced charge cooling for more fun per mile when applying the loud pedal.

Engine management will of course have to be flashed to match.