1. HOW-TO GUIDE FOR CELL PHONE UPGRADES, PLUG-IN AND BLUETOOTH
04-25-2008, 02:54 PM
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2005 S500 4-Matic, 1978 450SL
1. HOW-TO GUIDE FOR CELL PHONE UPGRADES, PLUG-IN AND BLUETOOTH
This is a re-posted and updated version of a string that was accidentally deleted after a contributor posted some copyrighted material to it. Unfortunately, I do not have all of the wonderful information that was posted in response by readers - but I had captured some of them, and have incorporated them in the associated string. Without those contributions, this string would not have been nearly as accurate or comprehensive, so I thank those who took the time to post.
This string addresses the following cell phone upgrade issues for U.S. specification Mercedes cars: 1) Prewiring, version coding, and where to get parts; 2) How to add a compatible plug-in phone to replace StarTacs or TimePorts or V60 phones when a service provider will no longer register them; 3) How to convert a StarTac, TimePort, or V60 system to Bluetooth, or to add a Bluetooth system from scratch, in a Model Year ’00 through ’03 Benz; 4) How to add a cell phone to an ’03-’04 E-Class or ’04 S-Class; and 5) Cell phone options for plug-in and Bluetooth for MHI equipped cars (’05 and later). It also briefly addresses 6) compatibility issues and 7) a Tele-Aid digital replacement. So that one does not have to read through useless information, each of the six matters is addressed by a subsequent, same-numbered post in this string.
I have updated this post as of late April 2008 to account for new equipment such as the "Universal PSE" and the "Cradle eliminator" cable that will aid owners of 2000-2003 cars in equipping their cars for the many new state "hands free" laws. The new equipment will eliminate the need to find older equipment such as "Autosense" PSEs and V60 cradles, which are sometimes in short supply. I thank the contributors who took the time to bring these new devices to my attention.
Covering such a broad set of topics and address each class and type of vehicle would result in a monstrously long post – this will be long enough as it is. Therefore I will discuss a process for determining specific needs for your vehicle, using information posted by Paul H. Dick on his superb website, http://home.earthlink.net/~phdwebsit..._bulletins.htm. I will use my personal experience with the S-Class as an example, but point out that other classes will differ in physical location of equipment and may differ in part numbers; those differences are available on Paul’s site. I will also add that Paul’s knowledge of the ML far surpasses mine, and suggest that many questions about the ML are better addressed there.
I must also ask your forbearance regarding private messages or e-mails regarding specific cell phones. If I haven’t mentioned it, I haven’t seen it, and cannot answer specific questions on how to get it to work with your system. I address how to configure your car’s equipment, and point you to sources of cell phones that it will work with. I cannot go further. I also do not address 3rd party retrofits other than the MikBox, and have no experience with them. My installation experience is limited to my own S-Class cars, so I have not seen all of the wiring and connectors in each model - for that I rely on Paul H. Dick's site for the detailed phone bulletins.
That said, here we go.
A WORD ABOUT PRE-WIRING:
“Pre-wired for hands free communication” (or phone) means that the connecting wire and fiber optic harnesses are in place. It does NOT mean that the electronics such as the PSE and cradle, or any other components are present. Cars from the ’00 through ’05 model years were prewired for phone systems, so that adding the required components was simple (so much so that it’s do-it-yourself, except for the version coding of the fiber optics). However, beginning in the ’06 model year MB began omitting the pre-wiring in some models; I do not have a list of which, and have seen it mentioned only for some models. If your car is not pre-wired for phone, then extensive and expensive work must be done to install the wire harnesses before other equipment can be added.
WHAT IS VERSION CODING
Simply stated, Version Coding is programming the fiber optics controller in your car to tell it that certain electronics are present on the fiber optics bus, and allowing the controller to fully implement all of the features of the electronics. It is done by a dealer or independent technician using the "STAR" diagnostics computer (a laptop with Mercedes Benz proprietary software). If your car had an original equipment hands free phone system installed, and you are upgrading it, you need not have additional version coding done. The new equipment will work fine. If you are installing a phone system (or other equipment that operates on the fiber optics bus) for the first time, the car must be version coded to assure full operation of the new components.
WHERE TO GET PARTS
Your dealer is a good place to start, of course (and don't believe any of them who tell you that what follows cannot be done). This string will provide you the part numbers you need, in most cases. It also provides you links to Paul H. Dick's site, a wonderful reference for phone information including part numbers. You can find more on part numbers (and a wealth of other information on Mercedes systems) at Mercedes Electronics upgrades, installation and retrofits. However (with the exception of the new Universal PSE and the Cradle Eliminator) dealer parts tend to be expensive. You can try ebay; 3rd party suppliers such as USA MBDoctor Mercedes Benz OEM electronics parts and devices. or Mercedes Bluetooth (a Google search will reveal more); and quality salvage yards such as Potomac German Auto, Potomac German Auto : Nation's Largest Since 1979. My inclusion of these sources is merely representative, and is not intended to exclude others, which may be as good or better.
Mercedes has announced "end of life" for many of the older hands free kits - however, this simply means they can no longer be ordered by a kit part number. The individual components of the kit can be ordered under their own part numbers. Some dealers have told owners the parts were discontinued and no longer available, and were not aware that the individual components could still be ordered.
This string addresses the following cell phone upgrade issues for U.S. specification Mercedes cars: 1) Prewiring, version coding, and where to get parts; 2) How to add a compatible plug-in phone to replace StarTacs or TimePorts or V60 phones when a service provider will no longer register them; 3) How to convert a StarTac, TimePort, or V60 system to Bluetooth, or to add a Bluetooth system from scratch, in a Model Year ’00 through ’03 Benz; 4) How to add a cell phone to an ’03-’04 E-Class or ’04 S-Class; and 5) Cell phone options for plug-in and Bluetooth for MHI equipped cars (’05 and later). It also briefly addresses 6) compatibility issues and 7) a Tele-Aid digital replacement. So that one does not have to read through useless information, each of the six matters is addressed by a subsequent, same-numbered post in this string.
I have updated this post as of late April 2008 to account for new equipment such as the "Universal PSE" and the "Cradle eliminator" cable that will aid owners of 2000-2003 cars in equipping their cars for the many new state "hands free" laws. The new equipment will eliminate the need to find older equipment such as "Autosense" PSEs and V60 cradles, which are sometimes in short supply. I thank the contributors who took the time to bring these new devices to my attention.
Covering such a broad set of topics and address each class and type of vehicle would result in a monstrously long post – this will be long enough as it is. Therefore I will discuss a process for determining specific needs for your vehicle, using information posted by Paul H. Dick on his superb website, http://home.earthlink.net/~phdwebsit..._bulletins.htm. I will use my personal experience with the S-Class as an example, but point out that other classes will differ in physical location of equipment and may differ in part numbers; those differences are available on Paul’s site. I will also add that Paul’s knowledge of the ML far surpasses mine, and suggest that many questions about the ML are better addressed there.
I must also ask your forbearance regarding private messages or e-mails regarding specific cell phones. If I haven’t mentioned it, I haven’t seen it, and cannot answer specific questions on how to get it to work with your system. I address how to configure your car’s equipment, and point you to sources of cell phones that it will work with. I cannot go further. I also do not address 3rd party retrofits other than the MikBox, and have no experience with them. My installation experience is limited to my own S-Class cars, so I have not seen all of the wiring and connectors in each model - for that I rely on Paul H. Dick's site for the detailed phone bulletins.
That said, here we go.
A WORD ABOUT PRE-WIRING:
“Pre-wired for hands free communication” (or phone) means that the connecting wire and fiber optic harnesses are in place. It does NOT mean that the electronics such as the PSE and cradle, or any other components are present. Cars from the ’00 through ’05 model years were prewired for phone systems, so that adding the required components was simple (so much so that it’s do-it-yourself, except for the version coding of the fiber optics). However, beginning in the ’06 model year MB began omitting the pre-wiring in some models; I do not have a list of which, and have seen it mentioned only for some models. If your car is not pre-wired for phone, then extensive and expensive work must be done to install the wire harnesses before other equipment can be added.
WHAT IS VERSION CODING
Simply stated, Version Coding is programming the fiber optics controller in your car to tell it that certain electronics are present on the fiber optics bus, and allowing the controller to fully implement all of the features of the electronics. It is done by a dealer or independent technician using the "STAR" diagnostics computer (a laptop with Mercedes Benz proprietary software). If your car had an original equipment hands free phone system installed, and you are upgrading it, you need not have additional version coding done. The new equipment will work fine. If you are installing a phone system (or other equipment that operates on the fiber optics bus) for the first time, the car must be version coded to assure full operation of the new components.
WHERE TO GET PARTS
Your dealer is a good place to start, of course (and don't believe any of them who tell you that what follows cannot be done). This string will provide you the part numbers you need, in most cases. It also provides you links to Paul H. Dick's site, a wonderful reference for phone information including part numbers. You can find more on part numbers (and a wealth of other information on Mercedes systems) at Mercedes Electronics upgrades, installation and retrofits. However (with the exception of the new Universal PSE and the Cradle Eliminator) dealer parts tend to be expensive. You can try ebay; 3rd party suppliers such as USA MBDoctor Mercedes Benz OEM electronics parts and devices. or Mercedes Bluetooth (a Google search will reveal more); and quality salvage yards such as Potomac German Auto, Potomac German Auto : Nation's Largest Since 1979. My inclusion of these sources is merely representative, and is not intended to exclude others, which may be as good or better.
Mercedes has announced "end of life" for many of the older hands free kits - however, this simply means they can no longer be ordered by a kit part number. The individual components of the kit can be ordered under their own part numbers. Some dealers have told owners the parts were discontinued and no longer available, and were not aware that the individual components could still be ordered.
Last edited by Skylaw; 04-25-2008 at 11:29 PM.
04-25-2008, 02:55 PM
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2005 S500 4-Matic, 1978 450SL
2. REPLACING A STARTAC OR TIMEPORT WITH A NEWER PLUG-IN PHONE
Mercedes began using the analog/digital StarTac in MY ‘00, succeeding it with the TimePort in MY ’01. The Portable Support Electronics Equipment (PSE) was similar between the two, with the TimePort offering caller ID. During MY ’02, and for ’03, the TimePort was replaced by the Autosense PSE, which could be used with either the TimePort or the V60, by installing the proper cradle. Cars equipped with the D2B fiber optic bus continued to use the Autosense PSE into MY ’04.
Because federal law requires cell phones to be E911 compliant (that is, be able to transmit your location when you place a 911 call), the StarTac, TimePort, and V60 phones older than the V60S model can no longer be used on U.S. cellular systems.
The StarTac, TimePort, and V60 PSEs (including Autosense) plug-in systems required Mercedes-branded cell phones that had firmware developed specifically to integrate with the COMAND or other audio system through the fiber optic network. As a result, these phones were very expensive; and identical phones not supplied by Mercedes would simply be turned off by the system if plugged in.
There are two approaches to solving this: Upgrade to a V60S phone configuration, or install a MikBox. MIK is no longer developing the MikBox, but is still selling existing inventory.
THE V60S SOLUTION:
Whether your car has a phone system installed, or you are adding one for the first time, the necessary equipment is the same. The difference is that if you never had a phone system, your car will have to be “version coded” after the equipment is installed; and you may have to install brackets, and fuses. Version coding tells the fiber optic bus that the equipment is present; this is done by a dealer (and some independents) with a STAR diagnostics computer (a laptop with proprietary MB software).
The short version of the upgrade path for these cars is that you will replace the PSE with an Autosense version (if you don’t already have one), and then install the Mercedes V60 cradle kit (not an aftermarket cradle) for your car. Then, add the V60S (Verizon only) phone - see AWS (Welcome to AWS for Mercedes-Benz). Older V60 phones than the V60S cannot be used; they are not E911 compliant and will not be accepted by any U.S. service provider.
The first step when upgrading is to check the equipment you already have, including the Portable Support Electronics (PSE) and the phone cradle. If you purchased a preowned car, prior owners may have made changes. The most important part of the upgrade is the PSE. The PSE part numbers are as follows: StarTac PSE has part numbers Q 682 0460 or 9460, SYN 0234 A or B; the TimePort PSE has Q 682 0648 or 9648 (I don't know its SYN); and an Autosense has numbers Q 682 0754, SYN 9266A or B. The straight V60 PSE had numbers Q 682 0845, or 0886, SYN 9266B. The "Q" numbers may also show "BQ" (BQ 682 etc.) Since MB often upgrades equipment midstream in a production year, the best way to determine what you have is to take it out and look at it, per the phone bulletins. If you have a StarTac or Timeport PSE, you will have to replace your PSE with the “Autosense” version.
Contributor Vrodman tells us that the Autosense PSE PN Q682 0754 has been replaced by a "Universal PSE" PN Q682 0971 priced at $208. However, if your later-production '02 or '03 model already has an Autosense PSE (Q 682 0754, SYN 9266A or B) you may continue to use it.
You will need a V60 cradle, but there are several approaches. The newest cradle, part # BQ 682 0925 (thanks, BigMel), was made for the V60S phone. The V60S phone was larger than other V60 models, and required a larger cradle. Contributors have reported that in some cases, use of the older cradles caused poor contact with the V60 puck, resulting in echo and sometimes dropped calls. However, the cradle is made with FAKRA connectors that do not fit the connectors in the '00-'02 models. Mercedes has begun supplying adapters with that kit, so if you have one of those models, be sure to get one that has them.
The other kits for the '03 and '04 models (in most cases this is part number Q 682 0724; but please check the phone bulletins on Paul H. Dick’s site, Phone Bulletins) may also work. If your car did not have a phone system installed, you may also need fuses, brackets, and other miscellaneous small items - you will need the kit, not just the cradle, because it contains the holder necessary for the cradle.
Vrodman also tells us that there is now a V60 Cradle Eliminator Cable PN Q682 0976. It goes for $160.... Vrodman says "This cable requires no adapters or anything else. It is actually marketed to be used for the BT puck solution," and that one may be able to plug a V60S directly into it, instead of the BT puck - but plugging a V60S into it was not something Vrodman had tested. We would appreciate any feedback on whether this new "cradle eliminator" can be used successfully with a V60S phone. Also note that in some Mercedes literature, the V60 puck is called the "V60 cradle adapter." They are one and the same.
Original equipment plug-in systems and the MikBox each use the car’s external antenna, not the cell phone’s. MY ’00 cars were by and large equipped with single-band linear compensators and antenna switches. The linear compensator is a low-powered amplifier that makes up for signal loss in the system, and the antenna switch connects the Tele-Aid system to the car’s external antenna when it is in use. The linear compensator should be replaced with the dual-band version from the ’01 model year or later. The antenna switch need not be replaced; the analog Tele-Aid system is being discontinued this calendar year because the FCC has reallocated its frequencies. The antenna leads can be wired direct, bypassing the antenna switch. The car’s external antenna does not have to be replaced (no matter what the dealer says)!!!
Dual band linear compensators are available on e-Bay, periodically, for about $50-$75 (perhaps less). So are dual band antenna switches. Both are available from dealers as individual components (last time I checked, compensators were about $400 and antenna switches about $150 from my dealer). In most cases, the compensators and antenna switches are the same among different classes, with only the mounting bracket being different.
MY ’01 and later cars had dual band equipment installed in the first place, so no change is required. MBWorld contributor Vrodman has also informed is that his dealer says linear compensators are no longer available from MB, and the recommendation is for owners to use a bluetooth solution instead. (Note: This is a problem only if you are upgrading a '00 or if you are installing a phone system for the first time).
THE MIKBOX SOLUTION
To overcome this problem, MIK Automotive (The MikBox Mercedes Handsfree Solution) developed the MikBox for Motorola plug-in phones, which permits use of any modern non-MB branded Motorola plug-in phone (not a RAZR or other BT-only phone). It is a very simple and inexpensive add-on, and the phone will integrate with COMAND or your audio system very much the way your original MB branded phone did. See the tech pub on the installation in my '00 S500 at http://www.benzworld.org/tech.html?id=317 MIK’s site lists the phones that his equipment supports and discusses the functions available.
The MikBox is not a Bluetooth option. The advantage is you can change phones and service providers easily (you may need a new cradle for a new phone, but they aren't expensive). MIK supplies cradles to replace the StarTac, Timeport, and V60 cradles, modified for your MB jack and the antenna connection in your armrest, which your service provider probably would not. You can do the update in less than 15 minutes with a screwdriver. MIK has advised that getting cradles for older phones is becoming more problematic; you may e-mail him through his site.
You may have to change the linear compensator as discussed above. Because the analog Tele-Aid system originally installed in these cars can no longer be used, the antenna switch should be bypassed completely, and need not be replaced.
The phone bulletins on Paul H. Dick’s website, Phone Bulletins contain installation instructions, diagrams, photographs, and part number listings. They tell you what kind of fiber optic bus your car has, cover installation of the voice control unit and CD changer, version coding of the fiber optic bus – and on the last page, provides the part numbers for PSEs, brackets, and cradle kits.
NOTE 1: Contributor MWAti has done a superb job documenting his installation of OE cell equipment from scratch, bringing a 2002 C-Class and a 2003 SLK to the V-60 configuration. His pdf file is a wonderful "How to" guide for these cars, with photos, installation instructions; and part numbers for the equipment. A really great job! See http://www.benzworld.org/forums/audi...coupe-slk.html
IMPORTANT: One must also be aware that the over-the-air update feature of some service providers can overwrite the Mercedes firmware, rendering the phone useless with the car when plugged in. The car will shut the phone down. This applies to Verizon's *228 Option 1 programming feature, for example; using *228 Option 1 will overwrite the MB proprietary firmware. Using *228 Option 2 updates roaming information, and does not have any ill effects on an MB branded phone, at least under Verizon's current OTA programming. Be certain to verify with your cell provider that you are not overwriting the firmware!!
The same applies if a firmware update is flashed to an MB branded phone in-store.
AWS can provide the proper code for activation of the phones to get past this problem, but you must first provide them with certain information.
The advantage of using a plug-in phone, instead of Bluetooth, is that one is assured of compatibility with the car's system; and the phone can be left in the car, and a second line used with a second phone that can be changed whenever desired, without compatibility worries. Using no-answer call forwarding on one of the phones assures that all calls are received.
Because federal law requires cell phones to be E911 compliant (that is, be able to transmit your location when you place a 911 call), the StarTac, TimePort, and V60 phones older than the V60S model can no longer be used on U.S. cellular systems.
The StarTac, TimePort, and V60 PSEs (including Autosense) plug-in systems required Mercedes-branded cell phones that had firmware developed specifically to integrate with the COMAND or other audio system through the fiber optic network. As a result, these phones were very expensive; and identical phones not supplied by Mercedes would simply be turned off by the system if plugged in.
There are two approaches to solving this: Upgrade to a V60S phone configuration, or install a MikBox. MIK is no longer developing the MikBox, but is still selling existing inventory.
THE V60S SOLUTION:
Whether your car has a phone system installed, or you are adding one for the first time, the necessary equipment is the same. The difference is that if you never had a phone system, your car will have to be “version coded” after the equipment is installed; and you may have to install brackets, and fuses. Version coding tells the fiber optic bus that the equipment is present; this is done by a dealer (and some independents) with a STAR diagnostics computer (a laptop with proprietary MB software).
The short version of the upgrade path for these cars is that you will replace the PSE with an Autosense version (if you don’t already have one), and then install the Mercedes V60 cradle kit (not an aftermarket cradle) for your car. Then, add the V60S (Verizon only) phone - see AWS (Welcome to AWS for Mercedes-Benz). Older V60 phones than the V60S cannot be used; they are not E911 compliant and will not be accepted by any U.S. service provider.
The first step when upgrading is to check the equipment you already have, including the Portable Support Electronics (PSE) and the phone cradle. If you purchased a preowned car, prior owners may have made changes. The most important part of the upgrade is the PSE. The PSE part numbers are as follows: StarTac PSE has part numbers Q 682 0460 or 9460, SYN 0234 A or B; the TimePort PSE has Q 682 0648 or 9648 (I don't know its SYN); and an Autosense has numbers Q 682 0754, SYN 9266A or B. The straight V60 PSE had numbers Q 682 0845, or 0886, SYN 9266B. The "Q" numbers may also show "BQ" (BQ 682 etc.) Since MB often upgrades equipment midstream in a production year, the best way to determine what you have is to take it out and look at it, per the phone bulletins. If you have a StarTac or Timeport PSE, you will have to replace your PSE with the “Autosense” version.
Contributor Vrodman tells us that the Autosense PSE PN Q682 0754 has been replaced by a "Universal PSE" PN Q682 0971 priced at $208. However, if your later-production '02 or '03 model already has an Autosense PSE (Q 682 0754, SYN 9266A or B) you may continue to use it.
You will need a V60 cradle, but there are several approaches. The newest cradle, part # BQ 682 0925 (thanks, BigMel), was made for the V60S phone. The V60S phone was larger than other V60 models, and required a larger cradle. Contributors have reported that in some cases, use of the older cradles caused poor contact with the V60 puck, resulting in echo and sometimes dropped calls. However, the cradle is made with FAKRA connectors that do not fit the connectors in the '00-'02 models. Mercedes has begun supplying adapters with that kit, so if you have one of those models, be sure to get one that has them.
The other kits for the '03 and '04 models (in most cases this is part number Q 682 0724; but please check the phone bulletins on Paul H. Dick’s site, Phone Bulletins) may also work. If your car did not have a phone system installed, you may also need fuses, brackets, and other miscellaneous small items - you will need the kit, not just the cradle, because it contains the holder necessary for the cradle.
Vrodman also tells us that there is now a V60 Cradle Eliminator Cable PN Q682 0976. It goes for $160.... Vrodman says "This cable requires no adapters or anything else. It is actually marketed to be used for the BT puck solution," and that one may be able to plug a V60S directly into it, instead of the BT puck - but plugging a V60S into it was not something Vrodman had tested. We would appreciate any feedback on whether this new "cradle eliminator" can be used successfully with a V60S phone. Also note that in some Mercedes literature, the V60 puck is called the "V60 cradle adapter." They are one and the same.
Original equipment plug-in systems and the MikBox each use the car’s external antenna, not the cell phone’s. MY ’00 cars were by and large equipped with single-band linear compensators and antenna switches. The linear compensator is a low-powered amplifier that makes up for signal loss in the system, and the antenna switch connects the Tele-Aid system to the car’s external antenna when it is in use. The linear compensator should be replaced with the dual-band version from the ’01 model year or later. The antenna switch need not be replaced; the analog Tele-Aid system is being discontinued this calendar year because the FCC has reallocated its frequencies. The antenna leads can be wired direct, bypassing the antenna switch. The car’s external antenna does not have to be replaced (no matter what the dealer says)!!!
Dual band linear compensators are available on e-Bay, periodically, for about $50-$75 (perhaps less). So are dual band antenna switches. Both are available from dealers as individual components (last time I checked, compensators were about $400 and antenna switches about $150 from my dealer). In most cases, the compensators and antenna switches are the same among different classes, with only the mounting bracket being different.
MY ’01 and later cars had dual band equipment installed in the first place, so no change is required. MBWorld contributor Vrodman has also informed is that his dealer says linear compensators are no longer available from MB, and the recommendation is for owners to use a bluetooth solution instead. (Note: This is a problem only if you are upgrading a '00 or if you are installing a phone system for the first time).
THE MIKBOX SOLUTION
To overcome this problem, MIK Automotive (The MikBox Mercedes Handsfree Solution) developed the MikBox for Motorola plug-in phones, which permits use of any modern non-MB branded Motorola plug-in phone (not a RAZR or other BT-only phone). It is a very simple and inexpensive add-on, and the phone will integrate with COMAND or your audio system very much the way your original MB branded phone did. See the tech pub on the installation in my '00 S500 at http://www.benzworld.org/tech.html?id=317 MIK’s site lists the phones that his equipment supports and discusses the functions available.
The MikBox is not a Bluetooth option. The advantage is you can change phones and service providers easily (you may need a new cradle for a new phone, but they aren't expensive). MIK supplies cradles to replace the StarTac, Timeport, and V60 cradles, modified for your MB jack and the antenna connection in your armrest, which your service provider probably would not. You can do the update in less than 15 minutes with a screwdriver. MIK has advised that getting cradles for older phones is becoming more problematic; you may e-mail him through his site.
You may have to change the linear compensator as discussed above. Because the analog Tele-Aid system originally installed in these cars can no longer be used, the antenna switch should be bypassed completely, and need not be replaced.
The phone bulletins on Paul H. Dick’s website, Phone Bulletins contain installation instructions, diagrams, photographs, and part number listings. They tell you what kind of fiber optic bus your car has, cover installation of the voice control unit and CD changer, version coding of the fiber optic bus – and on the last page, provides the part numbers for PSEs, brackets, and cradle kits.
NOTE 1: Contributor MWAti has done a superb job documenting his installation of OE cell equipment from scratch, bringing a 2002 C-Class and a 2003 SLK to the V-60 configuration. His pdf file is a wonderful "How to" guide for these cars, with photos, installation instructions; and part numbers for the equipment. A really great job! See http://www.benzworld.org/forums/audi...coupe-slk.html
IMPORTANT: One must also be aware that the over-the-air update feature of some service providers can overwrite the Mercedes firmware, rendering the phone useless with the car when plugged in. The car will shut the phone down. This applies to Verizon's *228 Option 1 programming feature, for example; using *228 Option 1 will overwrite the MB proprietary firmware. Using *228 Option 2 updates roaming information, and does not have any ill effects on an MB branded phone, at least under Verizon's current OTA programming. Be certain to verify with your cell provider that you are not overwriting the firmware!!
The same applies if a firmware update is flashed to an MB branded phone in-store.
AWS can provide the proper code for activation of the phones to get past this problem, but you must first provide them with certain information.
The advantage of using a plug-in phone, instead of Bluetooth, is that one is assured of compatibility with the car's system; and the phone can be left in the car, and a second line used with a second phone that can be changed whenever desired, without compatibility worries. Using no-answer call forwarding on one of the phones assures that all calls are received.
Last edited by Skylaw; 04-25-2008 at 11:34 PM.
04-25-2008, 02:56 PM
#3
MBWorld Fanatic!
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Join Date: Dec 2004
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Posts: 3,063
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Received 22 Likes
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2005 S500 4-Matic, 1978 450SL
3. CONVERTING TO BLUETOOTH, MY ‘00- ’04 (except ’03-’04 E and ’04 S-Classes)
Whether your car has a phone system installed, or you are adding one for the first time, the necessary equipment is the same. The difference is that if you never had a phone system, your car will have to be “version coded” after the equipment is installed; and you may have to install brackets, and fuses.
The short version of the upgrade path for these cars is that you will replace the PSE with an Autosense version (if you don’t already have one), and then install the Mercedes V60 cradle kit (not an aftermarket cradle) for your car (alternatively, you may install the new Universal PSE mentioned below, with the "Cradle eliminator" cord). Then, add the Bluetooth puck from AWS (Welcome to AWS for Mercedes-Benz). Note that some Mercedes literature refers to the "puck" as the "V60 cradle adapter." They are one and the same.
The first step when upgrading is to check the equipment you already have, including the Portable Support Electronics (PSE) and the phone cradle. If you purchased a preowned car, prior owners may have made changes. The most important part of the upgrade is the PSE. The PSE part numbers are as follows: StarTac PSE has part numbers Q 682 0460 or 9460, SYN 0234 A or B; the TimePort PSE has Q 682 0648 or 9648 (I don't know its SYN); and an Autosense has numbers Q 682 0754, SYN 9266A or B. The straight V60 PSE had numbers Q 682 0845, or 0886, SYN 9266B. The "Q" numbers may also show "BQ" (BQ 682 etc.) Since MB often upgrades equipment midstream in a production year, the best way to determine what you have is to take it out and look at it, per the phone bulletins. If you have a StarTac or Timeport PSE, you will have to replace your PSE with the “Autosense” version.
Contributor Vrodman tells us that the Autosense PSE PN Q682 0754 has been replaced by a "Universal PSE" PN Q682 0971 and it was only $208. You may use this new PSE instead of the Autosense PSE - and it costs much less.
You will need a V60 cradle (or the new Cradle Eliminator, below). If you decide on a cradle, there are several approaches. The most successful is to use the newest cradle, part # BQ 682 0925, made for the V60S phone. The V60S phone was larger than other V60 models, and required a larger cradle. Contributors have reported that in some cases, use of the older cradles caused poor contact with the V60 puck, resulting in echo and sometimes dropped calls. However, the cradle is made with FAKRA connectors that do not fit the connectors in the '00-'02 models. Mercedes has begun supplying adapters with that kit, so if you have one of those models, be sure to get one that has them.
The other kits for the '03 and '04 models (in most cases this is part number Q 682 0724; but please check the phone bulletins on Paul H. Dick’s site, Phone Bulletins) may also work. If your car did not have a phone system installed, you may also need fuses, brackets, and other miscellaneous small items - you will need the kit, not just the cradle, because it contains the holder necessary for the cradle.
Vrodman also tells us that there is now a V60 Cradle Eliminator Cable PN Q682 0976. It goes for $160.... Vrodman says "This cable requires no adapters or anything else. It is actually marketed to be used for the BT puck solution." Use of this cable would do what its name implies.
If you have an ’03 or an ‘04 model with an OE phone installation, (except the ’03-’04 E Class and the ’04 S-Class) you are home free. You should already have the V60 “Autosense” PSE, and the V60 cradle.
All you need now is a V60 Bluetooth puck (also known as a "cradle adapter" from AWS (Welcome to AWS for Mercedes-Benz) or other source. It plugs into the cradle or the Cradle Eliminator. It's about $390. Mate a compatible Bluetooth phone (not necessarily one purchased from AWS – but see compatibility notes, later), and you're done.
For all models discussed, however, be aware that your V60 Bluetooth installation will use your cell phone’s antenna for communication with cell towers (it uses Bluetooth only to communicate with your COMAND or phone/audio system). The glass in MB cars has metallic IR coatings molded into it, which will reduce the signal between the phone and the tower. This may be worse where additional metallic films have been added.
But there is a solution. SmoothTalker sells cradles for a variety of Bluetooth phones and PDAs (at this time, Motorola, Nokia, and Blackberry) that will again connect your Bluetooth phone to the car’s external antenna, and allow charging as well. See Smoothtalker Hands Free Car Kits Holders and Cradles for use with Motorola Hands Free Devices.
If you have a ’00 and use this option, however, you may need to upgrade your linear compensator to a dual band model; see the discussion on replacing StarTacs and Timeports with a plug-in phone, above. Note that Vrodman has also informed is that his dealer says linear compensators are no longer available from MB, and the recommendation is for owners to use a bluetooth solution instead. (Note: This is a problem only if you are upgrading a '00 or if you are installing a phone system for the first time). Ebay or a salvage yard may soon be the only source for dual band linear compensators.
Now, of course, you must decide: Why do I want to upgrade to Bluetooth at all, if I have to plug the phone in? Why not just use a plug-in phone (the MikBox solution)? The answer depends on your particular needs. You have greater latitude in your phone choice with Bluetooth; and if you live in an area with a lot of good signal coverage, you may not need the plug-in cradle at all.
It is possible to wire direct from a cradle to the car's external antenna and bypass those components; however, signal strength will be significantly improved with a linear compensator; and an antenna switch is necessary if Tele-aid is to be kept functional.
NOTE: Forum contributor MWAti has done a superb job documenting his installation of OE cell equipment from scratch, bringing a 2002 C-Class and a 2003 SLK to the V-60 configuration - the first step in this process if you have no phone equipment or must update an older system. His pdf file is a wonderful "How to" guide for these cars, with photos, installation instructions; and part numbers for the equipment. A really great job! See http://www.benzworld.org/forums/audi...coupe-slk.html
The short version of the upgrade path for these cars is that you will replace the PSE with an Autosense version (if you don’t already have one), and then install the Mercedes V60 cradle kit (not an aftermarket cradle) for your car (alternatively, you may install the new Universal PSE mentioned below, with the "Cradle eliminator" cord). Then, add the Bluetooth puck from AWS (Welcome to AWS for Mercedes-Benz). Note that some Mercedes literature refers to the "puck" as the "V60 cradle adapter." They are one and the same.
The first step when upgrading is to check the equipment you already have, including the Portable Support Electronics (PSE) and the phone cradle. If you purchased a preowned car, prior owners may have made changes. The most important part of the upgrade is the PSE. The PSE part numbers are as follows: StarTac PSE has part numbers Q 682 0460 or 9460, SYN 0234 A or B; the TimePort PSE has Q 682 0648 or 9648 (I don't know its SYN); and an Autosense has numbers Q 682 0754, SYN 9266A or B. The straight V60 PSE had numbers Q 682 0845, or 0886, SYN 9266B. The "Q" numbers may also show "BQ" (BQ 682 etc.) Since MB often upgrades equipment midstream in a production year, the best way to determine what you have is to take it out and look at it, per the phone bulletins. If you have a StarTac or Timeport PSE, you will have to replace your PSE with the “Autosense” version.
Contributor Vrodman tells us that the Autosense PSE PN Q682 0754 has been replaced by a "Universal PSE" PN Q682 0971 and it was only $208. You may use this new PSE instead of the Autosense PSE - and it costs much less.
You will need a V60 cradle (or the new Cradle Eliminator, below). If you decide on a cradle, there are several approaches. The most successful is to use the newest cradle, part # BQ 682 0925, made for the V60S phone. The V60S phone was larger than other V60 models, and required a larger cradle. Contributors have reported that in some cases, use of the older cradles caused poor contact with the V60 puck, resulting in echo and sometimes dropped calls. However, the cradle is made with FAKRA connectors that do not fit the connectors in the '00-'02 models. Mercedes has begun supplying adapters with that kit, so if you have one of those models, be sure to get one that has them.
The other kits for the '03 and '04 models (in most cases this is part number Q 682 0724; but please check the phone bulletins on Paul H. Dick’s site, Phone Bulletins) may also work. If your car did not have a phone system installed, you may also need fuses, brackets, and other miscellaneous small items - you will need the kit, not just the cradle, because it contains the holder necessary for the cradle.
Vrodman also tells us that there is now a V60 Cradle Eliminator Cable PN Q682 0976. It goes for $160.... Vrodman says "This cable requires no adapters or anything else. It is actually marketed to be used for the BT puck solution." Use of this cable would do what its name implies.
If you have an ’03 or an ‘04 model with an OE phone installation, (except the ’03-’04 E Class and the ’04 S-Class) you are home free. You should already have the V60 “Autosense” PSE, and the V60 cradle.
All you need now is a V60 Bluetooth puck (also known as a "cradle adapter" from AWS (Welcome to AWS for Mercedes-Benz) or other source. It plugs into the cradle or the Cradle Eliminator. It's about $390. Mate a compatible Bluetooth phone (not necessarily one purchased from AWS – but see compatibility notes, later), and you're done.
For all models discussed, however, be aware that your V60 Bluetooth installation will use your cell phone’s antenna for communication with cell towers (it uses Bluetooth only to communicate with your COMAND or phone/audio system). The glass in MB cars has metallic IR coatings molded into it, which will reduce the signal between the phone and the tower. This may be worse where additional metallic films have been added.
But there is a solution. SmoothTalker sells cradles for a variety of Bluetooth phones and PDAs (at this time, Motorola, Nokia, and Blackberry) that will again connect your Bluetooth phone to the car’s external antenna, and allow charging as well. See Smoothtalker Hands Free Car Kits Holders and Cradles for use with Motorola Hands Free Devices.
If you have a ’00 and use this option, however, you may need to upgrade your linear compensator to a dual band model; see the discussion on replacing StarTacs and Timeports with a plug-in phone, above. Note that Vrodman has also informed is that his dealer says linear compensators are no longer available from MB, and the recommendation is for owners to use a bluetooth solution instead. (Note: This is a problem only if you are upgrading a '00 or if you are installing a phone system for the first time). Ebay or a salvage yard may soon be the only source for dual band linear compensators.
Now, of course, you must decide: Why do I want to upgrade to Bluetooth at all, if I have to plug the phone in? Why not just use a plug-in phone (the MikBox solution)? The answer depends on your particular needs. You have greater latitude in your phone choice with Bluetooth; and if you live in an area with a lot of good signal coverage, you may not need the plug-in cradle at all.
It is possible to wire direct from a cradle to the car's external antenna and bypass those components; however, signal strength will be significantly improved with a linear compensator; and an antenna switch is necessary if Tele-aid is to be kept functional.
NOTE: Forum contributor MWAti has done a superb job documenting his installation of OE cell equipment from scratch, bringing a 2002 C-Class and a 2003 SLK to the V-60 configuration - the first step in this process if you have no phone equipment or must update an older system. His pdf file is a wonderful "How to" guide for these cars, with photos, installation instructions; and part numbers for the equipment. A really great job! See http://www.benzworld.org/forums/audi...coupe-slk.html
Last edited by Skylaw; 04-25-2008 at 11:18 PM.
04-25-2008, 02:57 PM
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4. THE SPECIAL CASE: MY ’03-’04 E-CLASS and ‘04 S-CLASS
The following information is what I have been able to glean from other contributor’s posts; I have not seen this done myself, and would welcome any feedback.
The MY ’03-’04 E Class and ’04 S-Class were equipped with a PSE that combined the Tele-Aid and cell phone support equipment into one unit called the CP-211. All that is necessary in these cars is to “activate” the cell option with STAR diagnosis, and add the proper V60 cradle (kit Q 682 0882 for the S-Class; Q 682 0828 for the ’03 or ’04 E-Class). In addition, the E-Class phone bulletins indicate that a linear compensator and cable are necessary (only for plug-in operation, I would add), and the ’03 E-Class requires an Audio 50 firmware update.
Once the activation is done, a Bluetooth “Puck with Tail” is used. This puck differs from the puck used in other ’00-04 cars.
A caveat for owners of cars other than the E-Class and S-Class discussed in this section: The V60 cradle for the '03-'04 E-Class and '04 S-Class does not use the same connectors as the V-60 cradle for other models, and it should not be substituted unless you can get the adapters that are necessary. In addition, I have no idea what the outcome of adding a CP-211 PSE to an earlier car that still had its original Tele-Aid equipment in place. Although it may be possible to take the OE Tele-Aid out of the fiber optic loop, I don’t know if the CP-211 can be made to work in installations for which it was not designed.
The MY ’03-’04 E Class and ’04 S-Class were equipped with a PSE that combined the Tele-Aid and cell phone support equipment into one unit called the CP-211. All that is necessary in these cars is to “activate” the cell option with STAR diagnosis, and add the proper V60 cradle (kit Q 682 0882 for the S-Class; Q 682 0828 for the ’03 or ’04 E-Class). In addition, the E-Class phone bulletins indicate that a linear compensator and cable are necessary (only for plug-in operation, I would add), and the ’03 E-Class requires an Audio 50 firmware update.
Once the activation is done, a Bluetooth “Puck with Tail” is used. This puck differs from the puck used in other ’00-04 cars.
A caveat for owners of cars other than the E-Class and S-Class discussed in this section: The V60 cradle for the '03-'04 E-Class and '04 S-Class does not use the same connectors as the V-60 cradle for other models, and it should not be substituted unless you can get the adapters that are necessary. In addition, I have no idea what the outcome of adding a CP-211 PSE to an earlier car that still had its original Tele-Aid equipment in place. Although it may be possible to take the OE Tele-Aid out of the fiber optic loop, I don’t know if the CP-211 can be made to work in installations for which it was not designed.
Last edited by Skylaw; 04-25-2008 at 03:25 PM.
04-25-2008, 02:57 PM
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5. UPGRADE OF CARS WITH MULTIPLE HANDSET INTERFACE (MHI – MY ’05 and later)
The MHI system is used in U.S. specification cars equipped with the MOST fiber optic bus from model year ’05 on. This covers all models except for the G-Class and the ML, which remain equipped with a D2B fiber optic bus and continue to use an Autosense PSE. The V60 upgrade path set out above will not work with the ’05 and later cars except the ML and G Class (which use later versions of the Autosense PSE than discussed above). I apologize to R-Class and Unimog owners; I have no information on them.
MHI equipped cars can use either a cradle for a Mercedes-branded plug-in phone that offers full integration; or a Bluetooth puck that replaces the plug-in cradle; and works with different kinds of Bluetooth phones; or a phone-specific Bluetooth/cradle combination that connects the phone (or PDA) to the car’s external antenna. The AWS website at Home covers all of these options with a vehicle equipment compatibility matrix and a phone compatibility page for your car.
The plug-in phones offered by AWS for MHI are still expensive, because they still use the MB proprietary firmware for integration. Non MB branded plug-in phones still will not work with MHI in a plugged-in mode (non-MB branded plug-in phones such as the Motorola V710 that also have Bluetooth capability can be used with the MB Bluetooth unit, subject to the equipment and firmware limitations discussed earlier).
The Bluetooth puck for MHI can be used with a variety of non-MB branded Bluetooth phones, subject to the same limitations as those discussed for the V60 puck for earlier models. The MHI puck also uses the phone’s antenna, not the car’s, in the Bluetooth mode, unless one purchases either a cradle such as the SmoothTalker (Smoothtalker Hands Free Car Kits Holders and Cradles for use with Motorola Hands Free Devices) or one of the AWS cradle/Bluetooth combination units listed on their site. The advantage of such a combination unit is that one can connect to the car’s external antenna for greater signal strength (stronger signal, fewer dropped calls, less static, and sometimes better voice quality) than one gets using only the phone’s antenna; but where signal strength is satisfactory, the phone need not be plugged in. The combo units also allow charging of the phone in the car.
The equipment necessary to add an MHI system if none was installed is shown in the phone bulletins at http://home.earthlink.net/~phdwebsit..._bulletins.htm they consist primarily of an MHI control module (akin to the PSE in earlier systems), a contact plate for attaching a cradle or puck, and the plug-in cradle or Bluetooth puck or puck/cradle combination, and some minor wiring for final connections. If you are going to use a plug-in phone or a Bluetooth puck/cradle combo, together with Tele-Aid, you will also need a linear compensator and an antenna switch. If you will not use Tele-Aid, you can omit the antenna switch.
The fastest way to determine whether your car has an MHI installation is to check your center console for the "contact plate" into which a cradle or a Bluetooth puck will slide. The phone bulletins have photographs of the console and the contact plate location for each model. If you have the contact plate, you probably have the rest of the supporting electronics. If not, you probably need to buy and install it. Part numbers of necessary equipment are in the phone bulletins (usually).
MHI equipped cars can use either a cradle for a Mercedes-branded plug-in phone that offers full integration; or a Bluetooth puck that replaces the plug-in cradle; and works with different kinds of Bluetooth phones; or a phone-specific Bluetooth/cradle combination that connects the phone (or PDA) to the car’s external antenna. The AWS website at Home covers all of these options with a vehicle equipment compatibility matrix and a phone compatibility page for your car.
The plug-in phones offered by AWS for MHI are still expensive, because they still use the MB proprietary firmware for integration. Non MB branded plug-in phones still will not work with MHI in a plugged-in mode (non-MB branded plug-in phones such as the Motorola V710 that also have Bluetooth capability can be used with the MB Bluetooth unit, subject to the equipment and firmware limitations discussed earlier).
The Bluetooth puck for MHI can be used with a variety of non-MB branded Bluetooth phones, subject to the same limitations as those discussed for the V60 puck for earlier models. The MHI puck also uses the phone’s antenna, not the car’s, in the Bluetooth mode, unless one purchases either a cradle such as the SmoothTalker (Smoothtalker Hands Free Car Kits Holders and Cradles for use with Motorola Hands Free Devices) or one of the AWS cradle/Bluetooth combination units listed on their site. The advantage of such a combination unit is that one can connect to the car’s external antenna for greater signal strength (stronger signal, fewer dropped calls, less static, and sometimes better voice quality) than one gets using only the phone’s antenna; but where signal strength is satisfactory, the phone need not be plugged in. The combo units also allow charging of the phone in the car.
The equipment necessary to add an MHI system if none was installed is shown in the phone bulletins at http://home.earthlink.net/~phdwebsit..._bulletins.htm they consist primarily of an MHI control module (akin to the PSE in earlier systems), a contact plate for attaching a cradle or puck, and the plug-in cradle or Bluetooth puck or puck/cradle combination, and some minor wiring for final connections. If you are going to use a plug-in phone or a Bluetooth puck/cradle combo, together with Tele-Aid, you will also need a linear compensator and an antenna switch. If you will not use Tele-Aid, you can omit the antenna switch.
The fastest way to determine whether your car has an MHI installation is to check your center console for the "contact plate" into which a cradle or a Bluetooth puck will slide. The phone bulletins have photographs of the console and the contact plate location for each model. If you have the contact plate, you probably have the rest of the supporting electronics. If not, you probably need to buy and install it. Part numbers of necessary equipment are in the phone bulletins (usually).
Last edited by Skylaw; 04-25-2008 at 11:36 PM.
04-25-2008, 03:01 PM
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6. COMPATIBILITY ISSUES
The following compatibility issues apply to all current MB Bluetooth units, regardless of whether they are V60 pucks, MHI pucks, or MHI cradle/Bluetooth combo units.
According to American Wireless Solutions, the cell phone sales unit that Mercedes has partnered with for wireless communication in its vehicles, compatibility issues are twofold: 1) equipment compatibility, and 2) firmware compatibility. AWS tests both phones and firmware for compatibility with the Peiker-manufactured MB Bluetooth equipment. They test phones in addition to those that they sell, and firmware other than that used in phones that they sell. However, firmware is provided by individual cell providers; AWS has no control over it, and does not write the firmware. The AWS website has a compatibility matrix for vehicles and Bluetooth equipment on its site; and the phones it sells are compatible (“approved”). AWS uses a 90-day test period for phones and firmware. Before you purchase a phone from a source other than AWS, you should check with them when you buy your Bluetooth equipment to see if the phone and firmware you are buying is compatible. In some cases, AWS will not ship the equipment unless you verify that you have a compatible phone and firmware.
The compatibility issues manifest themselves in freeze-ups of COMAND, failure to properly download phone books, dropped calls or disconnects from the Bluetooth unit, and poor voice quality. For more on these issues, see:
1) Bluetooth Voice Quality - assessment of RAZR V3 cradle combo - MBWorld.org Forums for a discussion of compatibility and connectivity issues; it deals with the RAZR V3, but is applicable to most phones.
2) Partial Solution to Partial BT Phone Book Downloads - MBWorld.org Forums for a discussion on some phone book download problems not caused by firmware conflicts, that may appear as conflicts.
AWS advises me that some folks are able to get phone book downloads, etc. with unapproved firmware, but eventually they run into problems with system freezes, inability to download features they could in the past, and they may experience poor voice quality. I have no personal experience with this. Some folks have no problem with some unapproved firmware, AWS says, because their phones have firmware that is compatible in fact, but that has not been tested (after it is tested, and works, it is "approved"). The test is a 3-month trial process.
Some recurrent compatibility problems: Sprint firmware; TREO PDAs.
A new Bluetooth puck has just been advertised in Europe for the UHI system. I believe the puck implements the Bluetooth 2.0 protocol, which will improve compatibility and will hopefully allow easier use of a wider variety of phones. I also anticipate that a newer puck for MHI will be developed, probably following the European version much as the MHI pucks followed the UHI. I do not know what the precise capabilities of the new puck are (or will be) at this time.
NOTE - Update, June 26 2007: Some folks are reporting success using the Treo 680 with the new Bluetooth puck - part number part # B 6 787 5878. No information yet on other Treo models, or on service providers or firmware versions that are successful. Carpersn reports success with the Treo 680, Firmware is MW01.50 and Cingular (ATT) software version is 1.04-ROW.
Phone and Firmware Compatibility: AWS lists MB approved phone and firmware combinations at http://www.wireless4mb.com/MB.pdf. In addition, AWS now lists the iPhone as approved.
STILL ANOTHER SOLUTION
If a Bluetooth installation will not meet your needs, but the phone you wish to carry is Bluetooth only, consider a two-line solution. Use a plug-in phone in your car; sign up for a family plan, and get a second number, and assign that number to the phone you carry. Give out only one number, and set that number for no-answer call forwarding (if your carrier offers this feature). Regardless of which phone you elect to carry, you will always receive calls in your car on a phone that is fully integrated with it, and through which all of the design features of the car’s system are available (including display on COMAND or other audio system, better signal strength, full phone book download, and the like). And, you can carry whatever phone you like. This is especially affordable if you are already on a family plan.
According to American Wireless Solutions, the cell phone sales unit that Mercedes has partnered with for wireless communication in its vehicles, compatibility issues are twofold: 1) equipment compatibility, and 2) firmware compatibility. AWS tests both phones and firmware for compatibility with the Peiker-manufactured MB Bluetooth equipment. They test phones in addition to those that they sell, and firmware other than that used in phones that they sell. However, firmware is provided by individual cell providers; AWS has no control over it, and does not write the firmware. The AWS website has a compatibility matrix for vehicles and Bluetooth equipment on its site; and the phones it sells are compatible (“approved”). AWS uses a 90-day test period for phones and firmware. Before you purchase a phone from a source other than AWS, you should check with them when you buy your Bluetooth equipment to see if the phone and firmware you are buying is compatible. In some cases, AWS will not ship the equipment unless you verify that you have a compatible phone and firmware.
The compatibility issues manifest themselves in freeze-ups of COMAND, failure to properly download phone books, dropped calls or disconnects from the Bluetooth unit, and poor voice quality. For more on these issues, see:
1) Bluetooth Voice Quality - assessment of RAZR V3 cradle combo - MBWorld.org Forums for a discussion of compatibility and connectivity issues; it deals with the RAZR V3, but is applicable to most phones.
2) Partial Solution to Partial BT Phone Book Downloads - MBWorld.org Forums for a discussion on some phone book download problems not caused by firmware conflicts, that may appear as conflicts.
AWS advises me that some folks are able to get phone book downloads, etc. with unapproved firmware, but eventually they run into problems with system freezes, inability to download features they could in the past, and they may experience poor voice quality. I have no personal experience with this. Some folks have no problem with some unapproved firmware, AWS says, because their phones have firmware that is compatible in fact, but that has not been tested (after it is tested, and works, it is "approved"). The test is a 3-month trial process.
Some recurrent compatibility problems: Sprint firmware; TREO PDAs.
A new Bluetooth puck has just been advertised in Europe for the UHI system. I believe the puck implements the Bluetooth 2.0 protocol, which will improve compatibility and will hopefully allow easier use of a wider variety of phones. I also anticipate that a newer puck for MHI will be developed, probably following the European version much as the MHI pucks followed the UHI. I do not know what the precise capabilities of the new puck are (or will be) at this time.
NOTE - Update, June 26 2007: Some folks are reporting success using the Treo 680 with the new Bluetooth puck - part number part # B 6 787 5878. No information yet on other Treo models, or on service providers or firmware versions that are successful. Carpersn reports success with the Treo 680, Firmware is MW01.50 and Cingular (ATT) software version is 1.04-ROW.
Phone and Firmware Compatibility: AWS lists MB approved phone and firmware combinations at http://www.wireless4mb.com/MB.pdf. In addition, AWS now lists the iPhone as approved.
STILL ANOTHER SOLUTION
If a Bluetooth installation will not meet your needs, but the phone you wish to carry is Bluetooth only, consider a two-line solution. Use a plug-in phone in your car; sign up for a family plan, and get a second number, and assign that number to the phone you carry. Give out only one number, and set that number for no-answer call forwarding (if your carrier offers this feature). Regardless of which phone you elect to carry, you will always receive calls in your car on a phone that is fully integrated with it, and through which all of the design features of the car’s system are available (including display on COMAND or other audio system, better signal strength, full phone book download, and the like). And, you can carry whatever phone you like. This is especially affordable if you are already on a family plan.
Last edited by Skylaw; 04-25-2008 at 11:36 PM.
04-25-2008, 03:02 PM
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7. Tele-aid Upgrade To Digital
The U.S. FCC has reallocated the frequencies used by the analog Tele-Aid system in early 2008, and MB is discontinuing its analog Tele-Aid service by February 2008, according to correspondence I had with them.
With respect to Tele-Aid, Wolfgang has posted some information on an analog-to-digital upgrade for older cars. I don't know how this upgrade will affect the equipment required as discussed here, if at all. See Wolfgang's Telematics page. One contributor has reported that he had the Tele-Aid upgrade done; Cost for the new Tele-Aid unit is $600; plus $294 for 1 year of service; or plus $548 for 2 years of service. These are MB MSRP, but the dealer is free to set its own price. Prices do not include labor.
The MBUSA website indicates that some MY '00 S-Class cars may not be able to be retrofitted; others may be able. Later models can be retrofitted.
With respect to Tele-Aid, Wolfgang has posted some information on an analog-to-digital upgrade for older cars. I don't know how this upgrade will affect the equipment required as discussed here, if at all. See Wolfgang's Telematics page. One contributor has reported that he had the Tele-Aid upgrade done; Cost for the new Tele-Aid unit is $600; plus $294 for 1 year of service; or plus $548 for 2 years of service. These are MB MSRP, but the dealer is free to set its own price. Prices do not include labor.
The MBUSA website indicates that some MY '00 S-Class cars may not be able to be retrofitted; others may be able. Later models can be retrofitted.
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04-25-2008, 03:04 PM
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8. Update: Bluetooth Version 2
Mercedes announced Version 2 of its MHI pucks, and also has indicated a new part number for the V60 puck, possibly indicating that Version 2 has been extended there as well. The Version 2 pucks are compatible with a wider range of phones than the version 1 pucks.
Bonesb has posted a very nice rundown on how a number of different phones work with the old puck, and the differences when used with the new puck, at https://mbworld.org/forums/showthrea...=142015&page=5.
The Mercedes announcement released the following information:
Mercedes has provided information concerning the new Version 2 pucks (V-60 puck Part # B 6 787 5878 among them) and their extended capabilities:
The new telephone module with HFP software complements the factory-fitted solutions currently offered and is available for virtually every Mercedes model series. Sending and receiving e-mails, making phone calls, checking pictures and presentations – the new Mercedes-Benz Bluetooth® (HFP) telephone module allows BlackBerry® 8700g, 8700v and 8707v are compatible.
The module has a single button, used to activate the pairing process, where the mobile phone or BlackBerry® is connected to the module for the first time. Once pairing has taken place, connection is always automatic. Integration on board also allows safe, intuitive control of the telephone functions via the multifunction steering wheel, the audio system and the central instrument cluster display.
The Bluetooth® (HFP) telephone module for UHI, (optional extra Code 386), is also suitable for Motorola PEBL U6, Nokia 6131, Nokia 6111, Nokia N70, Sony Ericsson K610i, Sony Ericsson W550i and BenQ-Siemens EF81 mobile phones.
The version 2 SAP module for UHI offers even more possibilities.
The Bluetooth® telephone module with SAP (SIM Access Profile) technology can now also be used with the Nokia business-optimised E60, E61 and E70 mobile phones. Up to four telephones can be paired with the module. Once a device has been paired, the module instantly recognises it as soon as it is within range and automatically establishes a connection. The SIM card PIN (Personal Identification Number) can now be stored too, making the system even more convenient to use.
Alternative for mobile phones without Bluetooth®: genuine mobile-phone holders from Mercedes-Benz
Mobile phone cradles from MB allow non-Bluetooth mobile phones to be operated using the multifunction steering wheel, and the telephone status is indicated in the multifunction display. The mobile’s battery is also charged. Before you can use one of these holders, your vehicle must be fitted with the optional extra pre-installation for mobile phone with interface (Code 386) or with the optional extra Mercedes-Benz mobile phone (Code 388).
The following phones should be compatible (note: The AWS compatibility list for the U.S. is at http://www.wireless4mb.com/MB.pdf - the MB release did not break down the compatibilities between UHI and MHI systems).
Nokia 3120, 6020, 6021, 6100, 6210, 6220, 6230, 6230i, 6310, 6310i, 6610, 6610i, 6820, 6822, 7250i
Siemens S65, SP65, SK65, CX65, CXT65, CX65V, CX70, CXT70, CX70V, CX75, M75, ME75, S75, SL75
SonyEricsson T610, T630, K600i, K750i, W800, W800i, W810i
Samsung SGH-D600 and SGH-E720
Motorola RAZR V3, V3i and SLVR L7
Bonesb has posted a very nice rundown on how a number of different phones work with the old puck, and the differences when used with the new puck, at https://mbworld.org/forums/showthrea...=142015&page=5.
The Mercedes announcement released the following information:
Mercedes has provided information concerning the new Version 2 pucks (V-60 puck Part # B 6 787 5878 among them) and their extended capabilities:
The new telephone module with HFP software complements the factory-fitted solutions currently offered and is available for virtually every Mercedes model series. Sending and receiving e-mails, making phone calls, checking pictures and presentations – the new Mercedes-Benz Bluetooth® (HFP) telephone module allows BlackBerry® 8700g, 8700v and 8707v are compatible.
The module has a single button, used to activate the pairing process, where the mobile phone or BlackBerry® is connected to the module for the first time. Once pairing has taken place, connection is always automatic. Integration on board also allows safe, intuitive control of the telephone functions via the multifunction steering wheel, the audio system and the central instrument cluster display.
The Bluetooth® (HFP) telephone module for UHI, (optional extra Code 386), is also suitable for Motorola PEBL U6, Nokia 6131, Nokia 6111, Nokia N70, Sony Ericsson K610i, Sony Ericsson W550i and BenQ-Siemens EF81 mobile phones.
The version 2 SAP module for UHI offers even more possibilities.
The Bluetooth® telephone module with SAP (SIM Access Profile) technology can now also be used with the Nokia business-optimised E60, E61 and E70 mobile phones. Up to four telephones can be paired with the module. Once a device has been paired, the module instantly recognises it as soon as it is within range and automatically establishes a connection. The SIM card PIN (Personal Identification Number) can now be stored too, making the system even more convenient to use.
Alternative for mobile phones without Bluetooth®: genuine mobile-phone holders from Mercedes-Benz
Mobile phone cradles from MB allow non-Bluetooth mobile phones to be operated using the multifunction steering wheel, and the telephone status is indicated in the multifunction display. The mobile’s battery is also charged. Before you can use one of these holders, your vehicle must be fitted with the optional extra pre-installation for mobile phone with interface (Code 386) or with the optional extra Mercedes-Benz mobile phone (Code 388).
The following phones should be compatible (note: The AWS compatibility list for the U.S. is at http://www.wireless4mb.com/MB.pdf - the MB release did not break down the compatibilities between UHI and MHI systems).
Nokia 3120, 6020, 6021, 6100, 6210, 6220, 6230, 6230i, 6310, 6310i, 6610, 6610i, 6820, 6822, 7250i
Siemens S65, SP65, SK65, CX65, CXT65, CX65V, CX70, CXT70, CX70V, CX75, M75, ME75, S75, SL75
SonyEricsson T610, T630, K600i, K750i, W800, W800i, W810i
Samsung SGH-D600 and SGH-E720
Motorola RAZR V3, V3i and SLVR L7
Last edited by Skylaw; 04-25-2008 at 06:12 PM.
04-28-2008, 02:09 PM
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2008 S550 4matic
OK, so I have an iPhone, assuming I installed the Gateway 500 rather than the factory MB iPod connection kit for the better sound quality, would I still be able to use the MHI cradle? If I get a call while the iPod is playing will it pause the iPod to answer the phone just as if it were the CD Changer? Thanks!
04-28-2008, 05:58 PM
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2005 S500 4-Matic, 1978 450SL
OK, so I have an iPhone, assuming I installed the Gateway 500 rather than the factory MB iPod connection kit for the better sound quality, would I still be able to use the MHI cradle? If I get a call while the iPod is playing will it pause the iPod to answer the phone just as if it were the CD Changer? Thanks!
As I said in the beginning, I can't answer questions about specific phones - since I have direct experience only with two of my own. Neither is an iPhone.
iPhone owners, please correct me if I'm wrong.
Last edited by Skylaw; 04-29-2008 at 07:22 AM.
05-11-2008, 04:51 PM
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2001 S-430
2001 S-430 Upgrade to Bluetooth
Hello,
From what I've read can you tell me if I'm correct.
I have a 2001 S-430, with Comand, Voice and Startac/Timeport Integrated Phone. If I want to go to bluetooth, do I only need the following:
V60 Cradle
V60 Bluetooth Puck.
I don't need Argos or Mik-Box as the above should accomplish the full integration. I have a T-Mobile T-Dash (HTC) Smartphone.
Thanks
From what I've read can you tell me if I'm correct.
I have a 2001 S-430, with Comand, Voice and Startac/Timeport Integrated Phone. If I want to go to bluetooth, do I only need the following:
V60 Cradle
V60 Bluetooth Puck.
I don't need Argos or Mik-Box as the above should accomplish the full integration. I have a T-Mobile T-Dash (HTC) Smartphone.
Thanks
05-12-2008, 06:57 AM
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2005 S500 4-Matic, 1978 450SL
Hello,
From what I've read can you tell me if I'm correct.
I have a 2001 S-430, with Comand, Voice and Startac/Timeport Integrated Phone. If I want to go to bluetooth, do I only need the following:
V60 Cradle
V60 Bluetooth Puck.
I don't need Argos or Mik-Box as the above should accomplish the full integration. I have a T-Mobile T-Dash (HTC) Smartphone.
Thanks
From what I've read can you tell me if I'm correct.
I have a 2001 S-430, with Comand, Voice and Startac/Timeport Integrated Phone. If I want to go to bluetooth, do I only need the following:
V60 Cradle
V60 Bluetooth Puck.
I don't need Argos or Mik-Box as the above should accomplish the full integration. I have a T-Mobile T-Dash (HTC) Smartphone.
Thanks
With that, you do not need a MikBox or an Argos kit.
I suggest you re-read Post #3 and post #6 above. The information on the AWS site for which links were provided will allow you to determine compatibility of your phone.
Last edited by Skylaw; 05-12-2008 at 07:33 AM.
05-12-2008, 04:50 PM
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2005 S500 4-Matic, 1978 450SL
The cost of an Autosense/V60S cradle depends largely on what you can get them for on ebay, or from an MB salvage dealer. Post #1 in the string gave you some suggestions. The V60 Bluetooth puck is occasionally available on ebay, but may be an older version. The price of the newer one with greater compatibility is listed on the AWS site, or your dealer can give you a quote.
I listed prices for the new Universal PSE and for the cradle eliminator in the writeup; dealers can vary prices, that's what one contributor was quoted. The V60 puck information remains the same. Do the math.
The Argos unit costs around $800, then you either install it yourself or pay someone to.
I cannot address reliability with any specificity. Used electronics from ebay or a salvage yard will contain some element of risk. New equipment from MB or Argos will have some level of warranty and confidence.
Last edited by Skylaw; 05-12-2008 at 04:54 PM.
05-18-2008, 03:51 AM
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2000 E320 2009 E550
CRADLE MODEL YEAR 2008
First, the MikBox is for plug-in phones only. Its function is to emulate the firmware in MB-branded Motorola phones using the the P2K chipset, so that non-Mercedes branded plug-in phones could be used. It is not a Bluetooth device, and has no function in a Bluetooth system. That should have been pretty clear from post #2 in this string.
The cost of an Autosense/V60S cradle depends largely on what you can get them for on ebay, or from an MB salvage dealer. Post #1 in the string gave you some suggestions. The V60 Bluetooth puck is occasionally available on ebay, but may be an older version. The price of the newer one with greater compatibility is listed on the AWS site, or your dealer can give you a quote.
I listed prices for the new Universal PSE and for the cradle eliminator in the writeup; dealers can vary prices, that's what one contributor was quoted. The V60 puck information remains the same. Do the math.
The Argos unit costs around $800, then you either install it yourself or pay someone to.
I cannot address reliability with any specificity. Used electronics from ebay or a salvage yard will contain some element of risk. New equipment from MB or Argos will have some level of warranty and confidence.
The cost of an Autosense/V60S cradle depends largely on what you can get them for on ebay, or from an MB salvage dealer. Post #1 in the string gave you some suggestions. The V60 Bluetooth puck is occasionally available on ebay, but may be an older version. The price of the newer one with greater compatibility is listed on the AWS site, or your dealer can give you a quote.
I listed prices for the new Universal PSE and for the cradle eliminator in the writeup; dealers can vary prices, that's what one contributor was quoted. The V60 puck information remains the same. Do the math.
The Argos unit costs around $800, then you either install it yourself or pay someone to.
I cannot address reliability with any specificity. Used electronics from ebay or a salvage yard will contain some element of risk. New equipment from MB or Argos will have some level of warranty and confidence.
05-18-2008, 12:47 PM
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2005 S500 4-Matic, 1978 450SL
E2233,
The OEM (Original Equipment Manufacturer) cradle for MHI phone systems is made under contract for MB. It is available only through dealers or through AWS (MB's partner in the U.S. for handsfree communication), or second hand. Normally, OEM devices made under such contracts are "restricted distribution" and are available only through MB-approved outlets. There is no "aftermarket" cradle of which I am aware, although SmoothTalker makes cradles that can be used in conjunction with a Bluetooth setup to allow the phone to be charged and also to connect to the car's external antenna. It is not a replacement for the OEM MB cradle.
A cradle is necessary only if you are going to use a plug-in phone. Either your dealer or AWS can advise you what will fit your '08. The AWS website will tell you if you select the Connectivity Options tab and your model and year.
However, in addition to a cradle option, yiu may choose to use a Bluetooth option. There is a Bluetooth puck that will connect exactly where a cradle would have in your car. If you use the puck (for MHI systems '05 and on), no cradle is required. The AWS site will also tell you which service providers have compatible phones for the OEM puck, and which firmware is compatible from those providers.
In the U.S. the only cars that required a cradle in order to use a Bluetooth puck are those that had the predecessor to the MHI phone system - 2004 models and earlier. However, MB recently released the "cradle eliminator," a cord that plugs into the V60 Bluetooth puck originally designed for the V60 cradle. The cradle eliminator can be used with the Autosense PSE, the straight V60 PSE, or with the new "Universal" PSE that is designed to replace the StarTac and TimePort PSEs in older cars.
The OEM (Original Equipment Manufacturer) cradle for MHI phone systems is made under contract for MB. It is available only through dealers or through AWS (MB's partner in the U.S. for handsfree communication), or second hand. Normally, OEM devices made under such contracts are "restricted distribution" and are available only through MB-approved outlets. There is no "aftermarket" cradle of which I am aware, although SmoothTalker makes cradles that can be used in conjunction with a Bluetooth setup to allow the phone to be charged and also to connect to the car's external antenna. It is not a replacement for the OEM MB cradle.
A cradle is necessary only if you are going to use a plug-in phone. Either your dealer or AWS can advise you what will fit your '08. The AWS website will tell you if you select the Connectivity Options tab and your model and year.
However, in addition to a cradle option, yiu may choose to use a Bluetooth option. There is a Bluetooth puck that will connect exactly where a cradle would have in your car. If you use the puck (for MHI systems '05 and on), no cradle is required. The AWS site will also tell you which service providers have compatible phones for the OEM puck, and which firmware is compatible from those providers.
In the U.S. the only cars that required a cradle in order to use a Bluetooth puck are those that had the predecessor to the MHI phone system - 2004 models and earlier. However, MB recently released the "cradle eliminator," a cord that plugs into the V60 Bluetooth puck originally designed for the V60 cradle. The cradle eliminator can be used with the Autosense PSE, the straight V60 PSE, or with the new "Universal" PSE that is designed to replace the StarTac and TimePort PSEs in older cars.
Last edited by Skylaw; 05-18-2008 at 12:55 PM.
05-18-2008, 03:22 PM
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2000 E320 2009 E550
HAND-FREE Communication E CLASS YEAR 2008
The Web stite shows under 2008 Accessories Hands-Free Communication System-Bluetooth Interface Module. I called MB Wireless and the representative said I needed a cradle. I take it this is in addition to the Voice Control one of the options that I have selected. I have my own cell phone from ATT Wireless. I would like to use it with the features in the vehicle. Is the Bluetooh Interface Module a dealer only item?
05-19-2008, 08:09 AM
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e2233,
You are asking me detailed questions on a car I have never worked with, and where the AWS site plainly shows a Bluetooth puck option as well as a cradle option for the car. I have no idea of the content of the conversation between you and AWS that would result in their going against the information posted on their site.
If your phone is Bluetooth and has compatible firmware as AWS lists on its site for the '08, you can use the MB Bluetooth puck with it. Whether you have voice control or not doesn't matter, as far as I know. It certainly isn't a limiting factor in any other model using an MHI system.
You can get the Bluetooth puck from either the dealer or AWS.
If AWS has limited you to a cradle option, it would be because you limited them to a particular phone, which may work only with a cradle. And, for that, it would have to be a Mercedes-branded phone.
There is no reason your '08 won't give you a satisfactory experience with a cell phone if you select from compatible equipment. I have already addressed compatibility as well as what your purchase options are in the initial string.
You are asking me detailed questions on a car I have never worked with, and where the AWS site plainly shows a Bluetooth puck option as well as a cradle option for the car. I have no idea of the content of the conversation between you and AWS that would result in their going against the information posted on their site.
If your phone is Bluetooth and has compatible firmware as AWS lists on its site for the '08, you can use the MB Bluetooth puck with it. Whether you have voice control or not doesn't matter, as far as I know. It certainly isn't a limiting factor in any other model using an MHI system.
You can get the Bluetooth puck from either the dealer or AWS.
If AWS has limited you to a cradle option, it would be because you limited them to a particular phone, which may work only with a cradle. And, for that, it would have to be a Mercedes-branded phone.
There is no reason your '08 won't give you a satisfactory experience with a cell phone if you select from compatible equipment. I have already addressed compatibility as well as what your purchase options are in the initial string.
Last edited by Skylaw; 05-19-2008 at 08:12 AM.
05-19-2008, 09:47 PM
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2000 E320 2009 E550
Bluetooth puck option as well as a cradle option for Cell Phones
e2233,
You are asking me detailed questions on a car I have never worked with, and where the AWS site plainly shows a Bluetooth puck option as well as a cradle option for the car. I have no idea of the content of the conversation between you and AWS that would result in their going against the information posted on their site.
If your phone is Bluetooth and has compatible firmware as AWS lists on its site for the '08, you can use the MB Bluetooth puck with it. Whether you have voice control or not doesn't matter, as far as I know. It certainly isn't a limiting factor in any other model using an MHI system.
You can get the Bluetooth puck from either the dealer or AWS.
If AWS has limited you to a cradle option, it would be because you limited them to a particular phone, which may work only with a cradle. And, for that, it would have to be a Mercedes-branded phone.
There is no reason your '08 won't give you a satisfactory experience with a cell phone if you select from compatible equipment. I have already addressed compatibility as well as what your purchase options are in the initial string.
You are asking me detailed questions on a car I have never worked with, and where the AWS site plainly shows a Bluetooth puck option as well as a cradle option for the car. I have no idea of the content of the conversation between you and AWS that would result in their going against the information posted on their site.
If your phone is Bluetooth and has compatible firmware as AWS lists on its site for the '08, you can use the MB Bluetooth puck with it. Whether you have voice control or not doesn't matter, as far as I know. It certainly isn't a limiting factor in any other model using an MHI system.
You can get the Bluetooth puck from either the dealer or AWS.
If AWS has limited you to a cradle option, it would be because you limited them to a particular phone, which may work only with a cradle. And, for that, it would have to be a Mercedes-branded phone.
There is no reason your '08 won't give you a satisfactory experience with a cell phone if you select from compatible equipment. I have already addressed compatibility as well as what your purchase options are in the initial string.
06-04-2008, 01:29 PM
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Converting to BT puck from MIK box
About 3 years ago, I converted my V60 system in my 2002 C32 to the MIK Box. In the process, I had to add the box into my PSE connections in trunk and then download updates into the system from MIK box website.
I now am interested in going the Bluetooth Puck route to use new iphone when it comes out in next week or two. I kept the old v60 cradle and can easily retrofit that back in. Will I need to do anything else such as remove the MIK Box or reflash PSE?
I now am interested in going the Bluetooth Puck route to use new iphone when it comes out in next week or two. I kept the old v60 cradle and can easily retrofit that back in. Will I need to do anything else such as remove the MIK Box or reflash PSE?
06-04-2008, 09:55 PM
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I don't know for certain whether removing the MikBox is required; but if I were doing it to my own car, I would remove it. You would not need to "reflash" the PSE or version code your fiber optics controller (HU). Without doubt, you have an "autosense" PSE, which will work fine with the V60 puck.
The only problem you might experience is a tight fit between your old V60 cradle and the puck. This sometimes caused poor contact, resulting in echo, poor voice quality, dropped calls, and the like. Give it a try, and if you don't have these problems, you're in great shape.
If you do have the problem, change out the old V60 cradle for a V60S cradle (pay attention to the part numbers - be sure you get one with adapters for your car). Alternatively, you could get one of the new "cradle eliminator" cables for use with the puck.
The only problem you might experience is a tight fit between your old V60 cradle and the puck. This sometimes caused poor contact, resulting in echo, poor voice quality, dropped calls, and the like. Give it a try, and if you don't have these problems, you're in great shape.
If you do have the problem, change out the old V60 cradle for a V60S cradle (pay attention to the part numbers - be sure you get one with adapters for your car). Alternatively, you could get one of the new "cradle eliminator" cables for use with the puck.
Last edited by Skylaw; 06-05-2008 at 06:48 AM.
06-06-2008, 05:07 PM
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Hi I have a question I have a 2004 S55. I have the V60S cradle factory installed and I have the bluetooth puck I got at the dealership around a year ago. The bluetooth works sometimes. It gets annoying so I usually just take the puck out. The dealership says my phone LG VX8700 is not on the compatability list so they dont want to know anything about it. When it works its good but no phonebook download. Sometimes when I cant get it to work I open the cradle cover and press the button on the puck and it will initiate. Other times I open the cover and the light will come on by itself which makes me think there is an issue with the cradle or the puck itself. Anyone have any insight into this?
Thanks,
Will
Thanks,
Will
