Test Drive of 05 Acura TL, NO big whoop!
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From: san francisco
C32
Originally Posted by TA-9FF
LOL he sounds like he doesn't have an MB......
But again, this statement is assuming that the MB is the end all to all things car related, which is ironic considering you've named the other cars (i.e. Zonda, etc.)
I must step back however, if I've struck a nerve but it's just going to be another keyboard rumble to talk about quality issues, German car feel, etc. between MB and Acura, Lexus, etc. I don't promote Acura or any other makes.
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From: asdfasdf
One with 4 wheels
Originally Posted by ultraseven
Maybe I don't, maybe I do. I believe proving one's wealth or whatever car they have on the internet is really a waste of time. Afterall, do you really believe what the other person says?
But again, this statement is assuming that the MB is the end all to all things car related, which is ironic considering you've named the other cars (i.e. Zonda, etc.)
I must step back however, if I've struck a nerve but it's just going to be another keyboard rumble to talk about quality issues, German car feel, etc. between MB and Acura, Lexus, etc. I don't promote Acura or any other makes.
But again, this statement is assuming that the MB is the end all to all things car related, which is ironic considering you've named the other cars (i.e. Zonda, etc.)
I must step back however, if I've struck a nerve but it's just going to be another keyboard rumble to talk about quality issues, German car feel, etc. between MB and Acura, Lexus, etc. I don't promote Acura or any other makes.
I appreciate your frankness, and I also appreciate your replies. I also didn't mean to have struck any nerves.........I'm too opinionated for my own good. I'm glad this didn't turn out to be a "Butchen" thread (type "Butchen" in the search to see what I mean) where we yell immature profanity at each other like idiots. And I agree, proving one's wealth on the internet is a waste of time. And as much as I love my C, I def don't think it's the best car in the world, but I do think it's better than an Acura TL, IMHO, which was what the original thread was about. But that's just my opinion, which everyone is entitled to. I'm sure TL owners love their cars just as I love my car, which is how it's supposed to be.
You really should check out the Butchen thread. LOL
Junior Member
Joined: Apr 2006
Posts: 26
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From: Dominican Republic
2006 C230 Sport
Originally Posted by davis449
I've driven the new C-class, I actually like it and think it's a BEAUTIFUL car (especially the Sport editions).
So you guys better stop complaining about expensive.
More data? My 2001 Softail Deuce? USD 29,000.. That is expensive.
Viva the Caribbean!
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From: Eastern Ontario
2001 ML320 E, 2003 C230K Sport Sedan
Originally Posted by ultraseven
No offense, but don't forget a lot of C230K owners on this board are led to believe they own the best cars in the world. It's easy to start bashing other makes, Japanese, British, etc., after feeding the bottom ladder of the 3 pointed star club.
You're right....I don't make a hockey player cash.......
But I do have 2 Mercs.......Guess I'm at the bottom of 2 ladders, or something like that.
And I don't slam all cars....Mostly Just Japanese....and not all Japanese either, just the ones "dressed" up as something they aren't. The fakes. I would easily take some American luxery "Iron" before Japanese Tin. It's rugged, durable, original, safe, and not just a "3 dressed up as a 9".
And by the way, Some go through life not ever finding the ladder.
Ed.
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Joined: Mar 2004
Posts: 165
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From: Eastern Ontario
2001 ML320 E, 2003 C230K Sport Sedan
Originally Posted by anonymouse
Mercedes invented perforated leather?
.
.
That and ESP, on-Star, Voice recog, integrated phone, and a whole raft of other stuff that are now recently on Japanese models (been in the Mercs for about 10 or 15 years). Don't think the Japanese have added brake assist or distronic on anything yet, but if the do....you know where it came from......Mercedes had it about 10 years earlier. Just wait, some day soon you will see a Japanese car with a really bizare windshield wiper systen too. That way they can get the degree of coverage from the Wiper the way Mercedes does.
As a matter of fact, I could get more in a 1997 C230 than the New loaded TL has today.
As a matter of fact .....Here try this....
Merc will always have it first....or it shouldn't be in a car...... Don't give me the TL Luxery crap....Honda doesn't know what a proper car is!!!!!. Still to cheap to put a full set of air bags in it.......
Just Kidding....(sort of).
Ed.
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From: SF Bay Area, CA
2006 E55 and 2002 E320
I've never driven the current TL, however, I have driven the previous generation CL Type-S from Acura.
It is in my opinion that I absolutely cannot stand front wheel drive cars. Moreover, the more power you have on a front wheel drive car, the worst it behaves.
Acura's quality (and even Lexus' quality) is somewhat sub-par nowadays. The previous generation TL and CL 3.2 Type-S cars had major transmission problems but no recall. I am referring to the automatic transmission. The transmission which was an extremely low revving transmission would sometimes fail, many cars had their transmissions fail before 100k miles.
If I were to ever buy a front wheel drive car, it'd be something with a very small engine. FWD cars feel faster and they give you that whiplash sensation every single time it takes off. However, they're much slower and difficult to handle.
It is in my opinion that I absolutely cannot stand front wheel drive cars. Moreover, the more power you have on a front wheel drive car, the worst it behaves.
Acura's quality (and even Lexus' quality) is somewhat sub-par nowadays. The previous generation TL and CL 3.2 Type-S cars had major transmission problems but no recall. I am referring to the automatic transmission. The transmission which was an extremely low revving transmission would sometimes fail, many cars had their transmissions fail before 100k miles.
If I were to ever buy a front wheel drive car, it'd be something with a very small engine. FWD cars feel faster and they give you that whiplash sensation every single time it takes off. However, they're much slower and difficult to handle.
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From: asdfasdf
One with 4 wheels
Originally Posted by patrick_y
I've never driven the current TL, however, I have driven the previous generation CL Type-S from Acura.
It is in my opinion that I absolutely cannot stand front wheel drive cars. Moreover, the more power you have on a front wheel drive car, the worst it behaves.
Acura's quality (and even Lexus' quality) is somewhat sub-par nowadays. The previous generation TL and CL 3.2 Type-S cars had major transmission problems but no recall. I am referring to the automatic transmission. The transmission which was an extremely low revving transmission would sometimes fail, many cars had their transmissions fail before 100k miles.
If I were to ever buy a front wheel drive car, it'd be something with a very small engine. FWD cars feel faster and they give you that whiplash sensation every single time it takes off. However, they're much slower and difficult to handle.
It is in my opinion that I absolutely cannot stand front wheel drive cars. Moreover, the more power you have on a front wheel drive car, the worst it behaves.
Acura's quality (and even Lexus' quality) is somewhat sub-par nowadays. The previous generation TL and CL 3.2 Type-S cars had major transmission problems but no recall. I am referring to the automatic transmission. The transmission which was an extremely low revving transmission would sometimes fail, many cars had their transmissions fail before 100k miles.
If I were to ever buy a front wheel drive car, it'd be something with a very small engine. FWD cars feel faster and they give you that whiplash sensation every single time it takes off. However, they're much slower and difficult to handle.
Senior Member
Joined: Mar 2002
Posts: 321
Likes: 36
From: Nappanee Indiana
2026 E450
Originally Posted by nicedeboy
I didn't like how my local Acura dealership doesn't allow buyers to test drive cars. You have to take their demo car out and order it. They have one demo car and you really can't judge the car you will buy from just driving the demo car. Every car feels different.
how do you know it wasnt you? a lot of salespeople will be restrictive if they dont like your vibe.
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Joined: Mar 2002
Posts: 321
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From: Nappanee Indiana
2026 E450
Originally Posted by fasteddie
Problem is the TL is such a POS by comparison.
1) FWD ... POS.
2) No belly pan?
3) Bumper paint doesn't match the rest of the cat - poor quality!
4) All the door gaskets/rubbers are **** compared to the Mercs!
5) What the hell is the storey on that shi**y gas door opener thing.
6) etc, etc.
What do you call that? Not Quality - that's for sure.
You gotta realize that the Merc is a solid platform, with the fiber optics, main computers that track window positions, seat positions, occupancy, etc, etc, not like the Accord, which is made up of a bag of bits and pieces from other much cheeper vehicles. Just look at all the Glued on plastic bits. The back doors don't even match the contour of the glued on crap.
It's built much more like a well outfitted Pontiac (especially with the plastic sh*t), and should be compared with such! Say a G6?
Ed.
1) FWD ... POS.
2) No belly pan?
3) Bumper paint doesn't match the rest of the cat - poor quality!
4) All the door gaskets/rubbers are **** compared to the Mercs!
5) What the hell is the storey on that shi**y gas door opener thing.
6) etc, etc.
What do you call that? Not Quality - that's for sure.
You gotta realize that the Merc is a solid platform, with the fiber optics, main computers that track window positions, seat positions, occupancy, etc, etc, not like the Accord, which is made up of a bag of bits and pieces from other much cheeper vehicles. Just look at all the Glued on plastic bits. The back doors don't even match the contour of the glued on crap.
It's built much more like a well outfitted Pontiac (especially with the plastic sh*t), and should be compared with such! Say a G6?
Ed.
I owned an 04 TL. your car is a piece of **** by comparison. yeah fwd sucks and there is too much accord in the TL but you would have to be a moron to believe the **** youve said. the TL is a far better car than the C class.
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Joined: Mar 2002
Posts: 321
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From: Nappanee Indiana
2026 E450
Originally Posted by Jim Banville
WHY ON EARTH would a "senior member" of MBworld come to this forum to praise his Honda and trash our C's?! 
probably because every review and critique of 'your C' has. the facts are facts.
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Joined: Mar 2004
Posts: 165
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From: Eastern Ontario
2001 ML320 E, 2003 C230K Sport Sedan
Originally Posted by digital_b
I owned an 04 TL. your car is a piece of **** by comparison. yeah fwd sucks and there is too much accord in the TL but you would have to be a moron to believe the **** youve said. the TL is a far better car than the C class.
TL is junk...Compare it to any decent car....Like this IS from Lexus. TL is Junk. Honda went cheep, left out all the detail, can't even match the bumpers, still FWD. Look close...half of the body seals aren't there. The Areo Kit is a .....I don't know what but not to par......Sorry but it is not in the league, ...it is a nice Honda, and that is all.
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From: Los Angeles
2014 Audi S5 Cabriolet 3.0T
Alright, I am on my second Benz (Used 1999 ML>>2006 C) and I am 20. There is no question in the world that I am lucky. My parents both have Benzos (06 S 550 and 03 SL 500) and let me tell you, I looked at the TL when I was evacuated from New Orleans (I go to Tulane) for Katrina (that bi***) since my car was totaled due to the flood. The TL was $3,000 more before taxes than the C after taxes. The TL is not in the same league as far as safety is concerned and by no means feels as strong on the road. Sure, maybe you can get to 60 faster, but try to turn, or get over 80. The bottom line is that yes, Benz is a name that you pay a premium for, but at least its not renamed to glorify a lesser brand.
Don't flame me to much...
Mike
Don't flame me to much...
Mike
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From: asdfasdf
One with 4 wheels
Originally Posted by digital_b
I owned an 04 TL. your car is a piece of **** by comparison. yeah fwd sucks and there is too much accord in the TL but you would have to be a moron to believe the **** youve said. the TL is a far better car than the C class.
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It's not really possible to compare reliability from car to car using the information publicly available right now.
I'm going to fix that.
My suspicion is that the differences are much smaller than most people think they are. Last fall CR stopped using an absolute scale to report problem rates, in part because the pecentages got too small and red dots were becoming too common.
My editorial on this: http://www.truedelta.com/pieces/newdots.php
As for the TL and C-Class, I've observed that many people buy Acuras because they feel they're going to be reliable, the engines are good, and they like getting a lot of features standard for a relatively low price. And not necessarily in that order.
I visit plenty of forums, and probably hear more talk of "I like my Acura because it has XYZ standard" on Acura forums than perhaps all the others put together. Are people buying something to drive or an entertainment and communications system?
I think the TL has a great engine, though the new MB 3.5 pretty much closes that gap. The handling leaves a lot to be desired, though.
I'm going to fix that.
My suspicion is that the differences are much smaller than most people think they are. Last fall CR stopped using an absolute scale to report problem rates, in part because the pecentages got too small and red dots were becoming too common.
My editorial on this: http://www.truedelta.com/pieces/newdots.php
As for the TL and C-Class, I've observed that many people buy Acuras because they feel they're going to be reliable, the engines are good, and they like getting a lot of features standard for a relatively low price. And not necessarily in that order.
I visit plenty of forums, and probably hear more talk of "I like my Acura because it has XYZ standard" on Acura forums than perhaps all the others put together. Are people buying something to drive or an entertainment and communications system?
I think the TL has a great engine, though the new MB 3.5 pretty much closes that gap. The handling leaves a lot to be desired, though.
Senior Member
Joined: Mar 2002
Posts: 321
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From: Nappanee Indiana
2026 E450
Originally Posted by TA-9FF
This is coming from someone that drives a Japanese car.....how are you liking your Toyota Altezza? Or are you still hiding behind the "Lexus" badge.
please learn SOMETHING current about cars. please? the lexus IS is a lexus IS everywhere jackass. the previous IS was an altezza ok? now go to your room.
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From: Twin Cities
Too many to list
Originally Posted by digital_b
please learn SOMETHING current about cars. please? the lexus IS is a lexus IS everywhere jackass. the previous IS was an altezza ok? now go to your room.
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From: Eastern Ontario
2001 ML320 E, 2003 C230K Sport Sedan
Originally Posted by digital_b
please learn SOMETHING current about cars. please? the lexus IS is a lexus IS everywhere jackass. the previous IS was an altezza ok? now go to your room.
Sooo.... where do you think they got the name Lexus from? Kiichiro Toyoda's cat or Hooker?
Ed
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Posts: 653
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From: Twin Cities
Too many to list
Originally Posted by fasteddie
Sooo.... where do you think they got the name Lexus from? Kiichiro Toyoda's cat or Hooker?
Ed
Ed
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lexus
"The Lexus Brand
Lexus was inspired by the success of the Toyota Supra sports car and the luxury Toyota Cressida models. Both the Supra and Cressida were rear wheel drive cars with a powerful 7M-GE/7M-GTE engine. The first Lexus-badged models, the V-8 powered LS 400 and the smaller, Toyota Camry-based ES 250, appeared in 1989.
The Lexus marque was launched in the United States in 1989, prompted by the successful launch of the Acura marque three years prior. Lexus launched later in Great Britain, Canada and Australia, in 1990.
An image consulting firm presented a list of 219 names, from which Vectre, Verone, Chaparel, Calibre and Alexis were top candidates. While Alexis quickly became the front runner (possibly due to the association with the Alexis Carrington character on the popular 1980s primetime drama Dynasty) and later morphed to Lexus, the name has been attributed to the combination of the words "luxury" and "elegance." According to Toyota, however, the name had no meaning and was just meant to be pleasing and easy to remember. Just prior to the release of the first vehicles, the database service LexisNexis obtained a temporary injunction forbidding the name Lexus from being used as they stated it might cause confusion. Upon reflection, the court lifted the injunction, deciding that there was a low likelihood of confusion between the two products.
Another theory has surfaced, claiming that the Lexus name was given to the project by Toyota in the mid-80s, as an acronym for Luxury EXport United States.
Hunter Communications, the agency who designed the "L" logo and also presented the name to Toyota management, says Lexus was born of the "LE" on the automaker's luxury edition vehicles, which created the acronym "Luxury Edition for the United States" or "LEUS" with the "x" from "luxury" added to form "LEXUS".
The marque was finally introduced to the Japanese market on July 26, 2005. The compact IS 250\IS 350, convertible SC 430, and midsize GS 350/GS 430 will all be available in Japan in the 2006 model year.
In some countries, like New Zealand, Ireland, and the UK, where there is a market in grey imports of Japanese cars, some equivalent Toyota models have been retro-fitted with Lexus badges, although they still differ from officially imported Lexus models.
Lexus directly competes with such luxury brands as the Europe's Audi, BMW, Jaguar, Mercedes-Benz, Porsche, and Volvo, the American Cadillac and Lincoln, and Japanese peers Acura, which launched three years before, and Infiniti which started later in the same year."
I personally like Lexus' name origination better than Mercedes.
Last edited by diamondblak05; May 1, 2006 at 04:14 PM.
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Joined: Dec 2002
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From: Los Angeles
2014 Audi S5 Cabriolet 3.0T
In the end, the star is soooo much cooler than a "L" with a oval. But yeah, everyone here is biased. My best friend has a IS and it is nice, he loves it. I dont personally like the look so much, but everyone has their own choice. There are many people in this world who can afford anything they want, but drive certain cars.
Mike
Mike
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Joined: Mar 2004
Posts: 165
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From: Eastern Ontario
2001 ML320 E, 2003 C230K Sport Sedan
Originally Posted by diamondblak05
Here's the story behind the name "LEXUS": .................................................. .................................................. .......................... badges, although they still differ from officially imported Lexus models............................................ ...............................which launched three years before, and Infiniti which started later in the same year."[/B]
I personally like Lexus' name origination better than Mercedes.
I personally like Lexus' name origination better than Mercedes.
Personally;
I think it's a bunch of B.S.. Don't get me wrong, I don't mind Lexus. Overall they produce a not to bad car, and force other manufacturers to try to stay ahead.
However, Lexus lacks in originality. Not so much in the design of the individual vehicle, but more in the design concepts. It seems that they have not started with fresh concepts or looked for new market segments, but instead are trying to match other manufacturers vehicles. Not comming up with new alternatives.
Merc has an SL, Lexus has an SC;
Merc has an S, Lexus has LS
Right down the line....
I don't think it is any coincedance that Toyota has given the line of cars a name such as Lexus. But then again, without Mercedes we probably wouldn't have Lexus either - no footsteps to follow in.
Maybe that is a bit harsh....or maybe not.
Ed.
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From: asdfasdf
One with 4 wheels
Originally Posted by fasteddie
Personally;
I think it's a bunch of B.S.. Don't get me wrong, I don't mind Lexus. Overall they produce a not to bad car, and force other manufacturers to try to stay ahead.
However, Lexus lacks in originality. Not so much in the design of the individual vehicle, but more in the design concepts. It seems that they have not started with fresh concepts or looked for new market segments, but instead are trying to match other manufacturers vehicles. Not comming up with new alternatives.
Merc has an SL, Lexus has an SC;
Merc has an S, Lexus has LS
Right down the line....
I don't think it is any coincedance that Toyota has given the line of cars a name such as Lexus. But then again, without Mercedes we probably wouldn't have Lexus either - no footsteps to follow in.
Maybe that is a bit harsh....or maybe not.
Ed.
I think it's a bunch of B.S.. Don't get me wrong, I don't mind Lexus. Overall they produce a not to bad car, and force other manufacturers to try to stay ahead.
However, Lexus lacks in originality. Not so much in the design of the individual vehicle, but more in the design concepts. It seems that they have not started with fresh concepts or looked for new market segments, but instead are trying to match other manufacturers vehicles. Not comming up with new alternatives.
Merc has an SL, Lexus has an SC;
Merc has an S, Lexus has LS
Right down the line....
I don't think it is any coincedance that Toyota has given the line of cars a name such as Lexus. But then again, without Mercedes we probably wouldn't have Lexus either - no footsteps to follow in.
Maybe that is a bit harsh....or maybe not.
Ed.
Last edited by TA-9FF; May 2, 2006 at 11:28 AM.
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From: SF Bay Area, CA
2006 E55 and 2002 E320
Originally Posted by Outland
Audi!? Give me a farking break! Vdubs and Audis have had entire columns in mainstream publications and enthusiast sites dedicated to the quality and reliability problems of VW/audi mechanicals and electronics.
The same company may be making some of the parts used on both, but that doesn't mean the parts are the same- even if its the same type of part. Things like wire connectors, bolt patterns, form factors, all are often different- even though the parts serve the same function. Then there's 'which supplier plant is it made in' because not all are just as good under the same supplier, how much the OEM is paying for the part, and who owns rejects, defects, and inthe field failures( this really makes a difference), and if the OEM is supporting the vendor with SQE's and SCA's.
The same company may be making some of the parts used on both, but that doesn't mean the parts are the same- even if its the same type of part. Things like wire connectors, bolt patterns, form factors, all are often different- even though the parts serve the same function. Then there's 'which supplier plant is it made in' because not all are just as good under the same supplier, how much the OEM is paying for the part, and who owns rejects, defects, and inthe field failures( this really makes a difference), and if the OEM is supporting the vendor with SQE's and SCA's.
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From: SF Bay Area, CA
2006 E55 and 2002 E320
Originally Posted by ultraseven
No offense, but don't forget a lot of C230K owners on this board are led to believe they own the best cars in the world. It's easy to start bashing other makes, Japanese, British, etc., after feeding the bottom ladder of the 3 pointed star club.
Some people, as you may understand, especially since you live in the city (the person I'm quoting lives in San Francisco), like to have smaller cars for their own personal reasons. Many C230 owners are very young (I'm probably one of those particularly young ones).
Think of it this way. Think of it like buying a Montblanc pen (this is too complicated so I'm going to go to a wristwatch). Think of it as buying a wristwatch, my favourite wristwatch company is Jaeger LeCoultre and Patek. A C Class can be a Patek wristwatch, but it's just a stainless steel version, when your S Class, that's the solid gold version. Still, the inner workings are similiar, it's just what do you want or need.
I hope that's an understandable analogy.
As the youngest in the family, nobody drives my C230 for fear of embarassment since they're older and think they need at least an E to escape criticism. While this may be somewhat true, that doesn't mean the C230 is any less of a car.
Lastly, as a C Class owner, I don't think that my car is the best in the world. But, for the money, I think it is, and that's probably why I got it. Naturally, I considered Japanese cars prior to my acquisition. And when some people comment upon these cars (sometimes commenting can be interpreted as bashing) they are trying to say why they didn't buy that car and they bought this car. Or why they think this one or the other is better.
