Does 27hp really make that big of a difference?
Super Moderator
Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 19,942
Likes: 191
From: Llandudno, Cape Town, South Africa
late 2009 CLK 350 Coupe Elegance, '65 Jaguar S Type wires
Out Of Control!!
Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 10,067
Likes: 11
From: Westwood, NJ
2004 Civic Si. FWD for the Win!
I have no idea why they resolve themselves to being inferior to just about everyone else's transmissions, and giving up a segment that wants to row its own gears. Having said that, I'm still glad I got my manny - even though it's not as good as it should be, it still beats a slushbox.
Super Moderator
Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 19,942
Likes: 191
From: Llandudno, Cape Town, South Africa
late 2009 CLK 350 Coupe Elegance, '65 Jaguar S Type wires
Yeah! who knows. SA is a very MT orientated market but no more than 1% of Mercs sold here are MT & they are 4th best selling car on the market. I always swore I would never drive an auto. Then I lived in the US & the company provided me with a long string of autos - from Nissan Maxima's to Dodge Intrepid's to Lexus to heaven know what all. We hired our cars from Advantage in Dallas so they let us chop & change & drive whatever we wanted. Then I was based in Sydney, Aus & provided with a new 3.8 litre Holden Berlina auto. I got used to it and when I knew I was finally coming home in late 2003 I ordered my C class in auto, because I went to the Sydney dealer & drove both & I though the MT destroyed much of what was nice about the Benz "feel" - as they say the rest is history and I have not been disappointed - Traffic conditions have deteriorated dreadfully as well which makes the auto a lazy alternative.
Thread Starter
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Mar 2009
Posts: 2,136
Likes: 6
From: GA
2016 Chevrolet SS, 2006 Cadillac STS-V
I think I'm definately going to get my car to the dealer soon and get the updates done. I drove that C280 tonight and not even including the extra power from the 3.0L, this car does not deliberate nearly as much as mine. Much quicker to respond off the line and downshifts faster when already moving.
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 8,384
Likes: 800
2019 G70 6MT & 2022 Ford Maverick XL
Matt, if you get a chance to drive that 07 again, try to be much heavier on the throttle and it should perform closer to what your 05 does. Like, I told 91RS though, my car performs so much better after the software flashes, could be the 07 you drove didn't have the updates.
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: May 2002
Posts: 2,916
Likes: 1
From: The blue white rock, third out.
2002 C230 Coupe(M111)
I don't understand your logic. The MB & Honda autos "hang in a gear when you got off the gas" as you put it - because they lock up their torque converters for the sake of efficiency & good handling - i.e. they behave just like a manual when you lift off the throttle - You are hard coupled to the engine & run against compression. All ideal for proper car control. No changing up in the middle of a corner like ****ty old autos of yore.
What do you want. The torque converter clutches to disengage when you lift off the throttle & slip like hell like an old yank tank auto?
Unless you are a completely incompetent driver I'm sure you don't declutch your manual when you lift off the throttle. So I don't get your point.
Modern autos are as close to driving a manual as you get once you learn to drive them. The only decent other option is a double clutch transmission which is great.
Give me a Benz auto long before their clunky manual transmissions & crap clutch action.
What do you want. The torque converter clutches to disengage when you lift off the throttle & slip like hell like an old yank tank auto?
Unless you are a completely incompetent driver I'm sure you don't declutch your manual when you lift off the throttle. So I don't get your point.
Modern autos are as close to driving a manual as you get once you learn to drive them. The only decent other option is a double clutch transmission which is great.
Give me a Benz auto long before their clunky manual transmissions & crap clutch action.
Modern automatics are NOTHING like driving a manual car. You feel attached to the car with a manual. Automatics are like a video game. DSG's and the like are crap as well. The only reason you as the customer are being fed all this crap about automatics is that the manufacturers want you to believe you don't need a manual- and therefore they don't have to offer you one.
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: May 2002
Posts: 2,916
Likes: 1
From: The blue white rock, third out.
2002 C230 Coupe(M111)
Its not just for entry level cars...I read a study not too long ago done by some market research group that noted MB's lack of a manual transmission in its AMG cars was one of the primary reasons that people chose not to buy its cars- additionally, it hurts the brand image. Automatics are associated with the lazy, fat, and inexperienced drivers. Ask BMW what happened when it got out that were going to try to dump the manuals in M cars.
MBworld Guru
Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 22,057
Likes: 18
From: Diamond Bar, CA
W206 PHEV AMG
Its not just for entry level cars...I read a study not too long ago done by some market research group that noted MB's lack of a manual transmission in its AMG cars was one of the primary reasons that people chose not to buy its cars- additionally, it hurts the brand image. Automatics are associated with the lazy, fat, and inexperienced drivers. Ask BMW what happened when it got out that were going to try to dump the manuals in M cars.
AMG surveyed their owners and 95% of the buyer prefer the fast shifting auto.
BMW sold more E46 M3 with SMG then manual world wide. E90/92/93 M3 are also selling more with DCT then manual. people complaint the E60 M5 doesn't have manual and they then made the manual optional and still...no one is buying the manual M5.
plain and simple those marketing research are flawed. They survey why people don't buy AMG because of its manual yet they fail to realize those same consumer are buying Ms with DCT.
sure, automatics general perception is slow, but it's not the truth with modern automatics within the last 7 years. E90/92/93 M3 with DCT is in fact quicker than it's manual counterpart. The only reason manual still exist is for those that simply want to row their own gear and because they're (manual) cheap.
however there is one truth remaining here...Mercedes makes ****ty manual gearbox.
Last edited by FrankW; Oct 11, 2009 at 02:20 AM.
MB World Stories
The Best of Mercedes & AMG
Mercedes SLR McLaren 722 S Is Extremely Rare Example Modified by McLaren
Verdad Gallardo
8 Classic Boxy Mercedes Designs That Have Aged Like Fine Wine
Verdad Gallardo
Flawlessly Restored Mercedes 190E Evo II Heads to Auction
Verdad Gallardo
Electric Mercedes C-Class Unveiled: 11 Things You Need to Know
Verdad Gallardo
Mercedes EQS Gets A Major Update: Everything You Need to Know
Verdad Gallardo
5 Underrated Mercedes-Benz Models That Don't Get the Love They Deserve
Verdad Gallardo
Mercedes 300D Has Pushed Well Past 1 Million Miles and It Ain't Stopping
Verdad Gallardo
10 Most Reliable Mercedes-Benz Models You Can Buy Used
Verdad Gallardo
Mercedes Teases Updated EQS With Steer-By-Wire and a Yoke
Verdad Gallardo
MBworld Guru
Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 22,057
Likes: 18
From: Diamond Bar, CA
W206 PHEV AMG
I generally despise automatics. However, when I am forced to drive one, I want it to drive like one. Hanging onto the gear and causing you to slow dramatically, even if you lift gently is not what I expect from an auto.
Modern automatics are NOTHING like driving a manual car. You feel attached to the car with a manual. Automatics are like a video game. DSG's and the like are crap as well. The only reason you as the customer are being fed all this crap about automatics is that the manufacturers want you to believe you don't need a manual- and therefore they don't have to offer you one.
Modern automatics are NOTHING like driving a manual car. You feel attached to the car with a manual. Automatics are like a video game. DSG's and the like are crap as well. The only reason you as the customer are being fed all this crap about automatics is that the manufacturers want you to believe you don't need a manual- and therefore they don't have to offer you one.
you sound like you are afraid of the technology.
Thread Starter
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Mar 2009
Posts: 2,136
Likes: 6
From: GA
2016 Chevrolet SS, 2006 Cadillac STS-V
I forgot to update this thread! I took my car into the dealer two times for the transmission issue. The first time they just reset the adaptations for the 1-2 shift and the updated the calibrations in the ECM and TCM, well that didn't work. It made the problem worse, at WOT (or just higher RPM) the 1-2 shift was so rough that it felt like something was going to break. So I took it back in and rode with the shop foreman to show him all of my complaints. So then I get the call a few days later that they can't do anything with the transmission until it sets a DTC because Mercedes won't let them touch it. ARGH!
One other concern was the power steering was shuddering when turning the wheel at low speeds (so every day I pulled out of the garage, into a parking spot, etc.). Aparantly they ran with it and started looking at a popping sound. So they replaced the thrust arm bushings in the front and they said while they were checking the torque on everything in the front suspension, they found the engine mounts had been replaced and one of the bolts couldn't be torqued to spec. Oh boy. So now I find out this thing was wrecked so badly the cradle was most likely cracked!
Finding that out, I'm wondering if my transmission problem is that its low on fluid because maybe the cooler lines were disconnected. Of course, I said nothing because then I would have to pay for it to be checked. So I decided I'd had enough, and started shopping. I couldn't find a C350 but one of the saleman I talked to told me I should look at a C55. So I traded my car in and got me a C55! The 170hp does make a big difference by the way!
One other concern was the power steering was shuddering when turning the wheel at low speeds (so every day I pulled out of the garage, into a parking spot, etc.). Aparantly they ran with it and started looking at a popping sound. So they replaced the thrust arm bushings in the front and they said while they were checking the torque on everything in the front suspension, they found the engine mounts had been replaced and one of the bolts couldn't be torqued to spec. Oh boy. So now I find out this thing was wrecked so badly the cradle was most likely cracked!
Finding that out, I'm wondering if my transmission problem is that its low on fluid because maybe the cooler lines were disconnected. Of course, I said nothing because then I would have to pay for it to be checked. So I decided I'd had enough, and started shopping. I couldn't find a C350 but one of the saleman I talked to told me I should look at a C55. So I traded my car in and got me a C55! The 170hp does make a big difference by the way!
Super Moderator
Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 19,942
Likes: 191
From: Llandudno, Cape Town, South Africa
late 2009 CLK 350 Coupe Elegance, '65 Jaguar S Type wires
After driving the SL63 on the track a few months back, you might remember - I simply can't imagine that suberb vehicle with a clunky manual cog swapper.
Manual transmissions belong in heavy duty trucks.
Super Moderator
Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 19,942
Likes: 191
From: Llandudno, Cape Town, South Africa
late 2009 CLK 350 Coupe Elegance, '65 Jaguar S Type wires
I forgot to update this thread! I took my car into the dealer two times for the transmission issue. The first time they just reset the adaptations for the 1-2 shift and the updated the calibrations in the ECM and TCM, well that didn't work. It made the problem worse, at WOT (or just higher RPM) the 1-2 shift was so rough that it felt like something was going to break. So I took it back in and rode with the shop foreman to show him all of my complaints. So then I get the call a few days later that they can't do anything with the transmission until it sets a DTC because Mercedes won't let them touch it. ARGH!
One other concern was the power steering was shuddering when turning the wheel at low speeds (so every day I pulled out of the garage, into a parking spot, etc.). Aparantly they ran with it and started looking at a popping sound. So they replaced the thrust arm bushings in the front and they said while they were checking the torque on everything in the front suspension, they found the engine mounts had been replaced and one of the bolts couldn't be torqued to spec. Oh boy. So now I find out this thing was wrecked so badly the cradle was most likely cracked!
Finding that out, I'm wondering if my transmission problem is that its low on fluid because maybe the cooler lines were disconnected. Of course, I said nothing because then I would have to pay for it to be checked. So I decided I'd had enough, and started shopping. I couldn't find a C350 but one of the saleman I talked to told me I should look at a C55. So I traded my car in and got me a C55! The 170hp does make a big difference by the way!
One other concern was the power steering was shuddering when turning the wheel at low speeds (so every day I pulled out of the garage, into a parking spot, etc.). Aparantly they ran with it and started looking at a popping sound. So they replaced the thrust arm bushings in the front and they said while they were checking the torque on everything in the front suspension, they found the engine mounts had been replaced and one of the bolts couldn't be torqued to spec. Oh boy. So now I find out this thing was wrecked so badly the cradle was most likely cracked!
Finding that out, I'm wondering if my transmission problem is that its low on fluid because maybe the cooler lines were disconnected. Of course, I said nothing because then I would have to pay for it to be checked. So I decided I'd had enough, and started shopping. I couldn't find a C350 but one of the saleman I talked to told me I should look at a C55. So I traded my car in and got me a C55! The 170hp does make a big difference by the way!
I think your old transmission needed a new valve body.
Thread Starter
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Mar 2009
Posts: 2,136
Likes: 6
From: GA
2016 Chevrolet SS, 2006 Cadillac STS-V
I agree, that's even what my service advisor said it probably needed. The last time it was in they said it had the latest version in it, but that still doesn't mean it can't go wrong. So far I'm liking the 5 speed much better, especially how AMG has it setup. Plus, with the 5 speed, I can do my own trans service since it has a dipstick tube.
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 1,441
Likes: 1
From: France, Lebanon
03 c320 coupe
i guess it would be around 0.5sec in the quarter mile...
if you drag from still it will be very close the first couple seconds
if you drag from lets say 60km/h then you will see him fly by
if you drag from still it will be very close the first couple seconds
if you drag from lets say 60km/h then you will see him fly by
Junior Member
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 37
Likes: 0
> I saw a C350 cruising on the highway today. Then out of no where a M5 came flying in. They went for it, and the C350 passed the M5 (or kept up with it, I could not see well). There was mild traffic, so both ended up in the same lane slamming their brakes. And my friend told me that the C300 they took for a test drive was quick, thus the reason they got pulled over. hahah
So my assumption is that the new C-Classes are pretty quick.
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Feb 2009
Posts: 5,537
Likes: 8
2006 C350 Sport 6MT
I killed the new C300 with my C350 (w203). The new C300 is the same as a C280.
Man, the M5 would KILL the C350 like there was no tomorrow. Even the older M5 will kill it.
Maybe it was a 530 that looked like an M5?
By the way the M5 traps my friend's CL600 (BT) on the freeway. Off the line if the CL grips it'll beat the M5 but once that sexy M5 gets moving...Watch out
Man, the M5 would KILL the C350 like there was no tomorrow. Even the older M5 will kill it.
Maybe it was a 530 that looked like an M5?
By the way the M5 traps my friend's CL600 (BT) on the freeway. Off the line if the CL grips it'll beat the M5 but once that sexy M5 gets moving...Watch out
Last edited by W203E35; Oct 12, 2009 at 01:30 AM.
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 8,384
Likes: 800
2019 G70 6MT & 2022 Ford Maverick XL
I...can't...breathe...laughing...too...hard
Maybe the C350 had VTAKKKK? Once it kicked in yo, it was all over and dat C350 done smoked dat M5?
Thanks for the laugh, man.
Last edited by LILBENZ230; Oct 12, 2009 at 01:45 AM.
Thread Starter
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Mar 2009
Posts: 2,136
Likes: 6
From: GA
2016 Chevrolet SS, 2006 Cadillac STS-V
The W204s drive much better than the W203 (or at least the non AMG W203s 
). The throttle response is almost immediate and it does what you want when you want it. I was very impressed with the way the C300 drove compared to my old C230. I just don't like the dash and steering wheel at all on the W204 and I'm not too much on the exterior except for the front end.
). The throttle response is almost immediate and it does what you want when you want it. I was very impressed with the way the C300 drove compared to my old C230. I just don't like the dash and steering wheel at all on the W204 and I'm not too much on the exterior except for the front end.
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 1,441
Likes: 1
From: France, Lebanon
03 c320 coupe
Super Moderator
Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 19,942
Likes: 191
From: Llandudno, Cape Town, South Africa
late 2009 CLK 350 Coupe Elegance, '65 Jaguar S Type wires
The V6 vs I4 is like chalk & cheese. The cars have a totally different character. A V6 W203 is every bit as nice to drive as a W204 - smooth, quiet & powerful if you have a C280 or C350. The baby V6 2.5 & 2.6 litre engines also have a character of their own. Smoothest of the whole lot & very free revving - fun if you rev them.
I'm not knocking the M271 - for an inline 4 it's pretty good but you know you are driving a 4 banger that is working hard & living on the edge.
Banned
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 910
Likes: 2
From: In Kush Land So cal
02 C320 Sedan
> I saw a C350 cruising on the highway today. Then out of no where a M5 came flying in. They went for it, and the C350 passed the M5 (or kept up with it, I could not see well). There was mild traffic, so both ended up in the same lane slamming their brakes. And my friend told me that the C300 they took for a test drive was quick, thus the reason they got pulled over. hahah
So my assumption is that the new C-Classes are pretty quick.
Banned
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 910
Likes: 2
From: In Kush Land So cal
02 C320 Sedan
