sprint booster
12-18-2009, 01:59 AM
#51
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2004 Mazda6, 1993 RX7
Me and Glyn have read EVERYTHING about this. It DOES NOT improve throttle response. It amplifies it.
The time it takes for the car to respond to your throttle input is the same. I don't understand how you can disagree with those facts based on the hard data (the graphs) in the white paper.
What does it do ... improves the throttle vs pedal response curve. Put the car on a Mustang dyno, and measure steady state power or torque at 1/4, 3/8, 1/2, or 2/3 max throttle, and the wheel power values will be much higher than w/o the booster.
From a stop, in an atx, snap throttle to any of these pedal positions, and the car will accellerate quicker with the booster.
Some like more power at lower pedal displacements, giving the feel of a higher powered car. Before DBW, GM used eccentric cam pulleys on the carbs to give the same high gain at small pedal motion, and the feel of a larger engine, but little added power was available above 70% pedal stroke, like the Booster.
I might like the fact that the Booter negates the need to use the last ~15% of pedal stroke which has high resistance to motion .... nothing spoils a nice gas pedal feel like a step function change in resistance to travel.
Also, unless the sprintbooster has been redesigned and is now forwarding the redundant throttle signals that MB designed the vehicle with, then it is also a safety concern to be using it. I have also posted about this before.
For those who want to comment but still have not read this white paper allow me to post the most important part for you. This is a direct quote:
"What does this mean? Basically, the Sprint Booster makes the accelerator pedal
about 30% more sensitive. A side effect, which can readily be seen in the graphs
in Figure 3 and Figure 4, is that the accelerator pedal becomes dead beyond about
two thirds travel with Sprint Booster.
It is important to note that any accelerator signal into the ECU using a Sprint
Booster can be duplicated exactly by a driver without a Sprint Booster, merely by
pressing the accelerator pedal a greater distance."
"What does this mean? Basically, the Sprint Booster makes the accelerator pedal
about 30% more sensitive. A side effect, which can readily be seen in the graphs
in Figure 3 and Figure 4, is that the accelerator pedal becomes dead beyond about
two thirds travel with Sprint Booster.
It is important to note that any accelerator signal into the ECU using a Sprint
Booster can be duplicated exactly by a driver without a Sprint Booster, merely by
pressing the accelerator pedal a greater distance."
I would suggest the SB simply improves part throttle response.
Last edited by kevink2; 12-19-2009 at 02:38 PM.
12-18-2009, 02:05 AM
#52
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2012 C300 4Matic
I realize that if I take a car, without sprintbooster, and push the throttle 1/4 of the way down, and then do the exact same thing with sprintbooster installed, that car will accelerate faster.
This is because the SB is simply telling the computer that I pushed the throttle further than I actually did. You can just press the throttle further without the SB and achieve the exact same result, with the exact same lag.
The downside to the sprint booster is that since it is "lying" about the throttle position, once you get past 70% throttle, your gas pedal isn't actually doing anything - you are already at full throttle and have a huge dead spot. What good is this? Look at this graph from the sprintbooster website SHOWING the dead area that it creates in your throttle -
The device does not reduce lag. I honestly wish there were a device this simple that could reduce the horrible lag that Mercedes engineers into their cars.
This is because the SB is simply telling the computer that I pushed the throttle further than I actually did. You can just press the throttle further without the SB and achieve the exact same result, with the exact same lag.
The downside to the sprint booster is that since it is "lying" about the throttle position, once you get past 70% throttle, your gas pedal isn't actually doing anything - you are already at full throttle and have a huge dead spot. What good is this? Look at this graph from the sprintbooster website SHOWING the dead area that it creates in your throttle -
The device does not reduce lag. I honestly wish there were a device this simple that could reduce the horrible lag that Mercedes engineers into their cars.
12-18-2009, 02:09 AM
#53
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What does it do ... improves the throttle vs pedal response curve. Put the car on a Mustang dyno, and measure steady state power or torque at 1/4, 3/8, 1/2, or 2/3 max throttle, and the wheel power values will be much higher than w/o the booster.
From a stop, in an atx, snap throttle to any of these pedal positions, and the car will accellerate quicker with the booster.
Some like more power at lower pedal displacements, giving the feel of a higher powered car.
From a stop, in an atx, snap throttle to any of these pedal positions, and the car will accellerate quicker with the booster.
Some like more power at lower pedal displacements, giving the feel of a higher powered car.
12-18-2009, 02:12 AM
#54
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2004 Mazda6, 1993 RX7
The white paper showed true lag, with or w/o Booster, as minimal ( Fig2, Fig4, and Fig5 )
Fig1 shows lag by design, as the %throttle position curve is well below the % pedal position curve. This lag in expected reponse is fixed by clever use of op-amps.
Last edited by kevink2; 12-19-2009 at 02:47 PM.
12-18-2009, 03:15 AM
#55
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Yes - depends what is considered minimal
Experience tells me that true lag is not negligible & is programmed in - as with the TCU & many other Benz devices including the aircon.
It also tells me that that all ECUs are not set up the same dependent on market where the car is sold.
The first thing ECU tuners do in this country is delete the lag. I've sat down with a young Prof. at one of our local universities & watched him do it on a Benz V6 ECU. It is also interesting that the ECU tune on a Merc is pretty much optimised. It's difficult to improve on. You gain in some areas & loose in others. Some tunes can threaten engine longevity.
acr - I want out of this thread. It bores me to death. That's it.
Experience tells me that true lag is not negligible & is programmed in - as with the TCU & many other Benz devices including the aircon.
It also tells me that that all ECUs are not set up the same dependent on market where the car is sold.
The first thing ECU tuners do in this country is delete the lag. I've sat down with a young Prof. at one of our local universities & watched him do it on a Benz V6 ECU. It is also interesting that the ECU tune on a Merc is pretty much optimised. It's difficult to improve on. You gain in some areas & loose in others. Some tunes can threaten engine longevity.
acr - I want out of this thread. It bores me to death. That's it.
12-18-2009, 04:25 AM
#56
MBWorld Fanatic!
otherwise we have to baklei 
So dont be so befoeterd
about the kappie, in The Netherlands we dont have a kappie on the e
We also havent a deurtrekkertjie here, we call it string
Enjoy your naweek
I love those south african words...
12-18-2009, 04:29 AM
#57
MBWorld Fanatic!
So for now im done with this thread, i have told my experiences and thats it...
The power throttle is ready to order, Euro 399,00 + shipping costs
If you want to know more pm me.
The power throttle is ready to order, Euro 399,00 + shipping costs
If you want to know more pm me.
12-18-2009, 04:51 AM
#58
Super Moderator
Geen bakleiery of geskreeuery of slanery/aanranding nie.
12-18-2009, 03:14 PM
#59
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12-19-2009, 11:11 AM
#60
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2004 Mazda6, 1993 RX7
As I had said in prior post, only benefit of that top-end WOT flat spot would be elimination of nasty hard spot in pedal travel, I prefer linear pedal feel.
Last edited by kevink2; 12-19-2009 at 02:24 PM.
12-19-2009, 03:39 PM
#62
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2004 Mazda6, 1993 RX7
The first thing ECU tuners do in this country is delete the lag. I've sat down with a young Prof. at one of our local universities & watched him do it on a Benz V6 ECU....
09-20-2010, 01:41 PM
#63
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C 63 2008
Sprintbooster
Have none of you seen the white paper on the sprint booster or the huge thread about it? It was scientifically PROVEN that it does absolutely nothing to throttle response or power. It simply decreases the pedal travel. With it installed, once you push the pedal past ~3/4 you get no more acceleration because you are already at full throttle. A lot of people even with it installed are unfortunately fooled by this. There are also questions regarding the safety of the SB because it does not (unless its been updated) forward the redundant gas pedal position signal. Without that redundant signal you could get stranded, or worse, the throttle could get "stuck" (electronically ofcourse.) Please go read that thread. There's always someone who will respond now and say that I'm wrong. I'm not going to respond to that because the white paper clearly states the facts.
because i am about to install to my C63 2008 AMG and i not sure should i do it or not? after reading what you wrote i am now having second thought?
09-20-2010, 02:23 PM
#64
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2008 C300 Sport, RWD, US
There was also a thread about using an alternate procedure with your gas pedal reset where it doesn't require as much travel to acquire the same amount of speed.
Seems like the thread was titled something about free sprintbooster.
Seems like the thread was titled something about free sprintbooster.
