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0 t0 62 in 7 Seconds.201 BHP 359 Ft Lbs Torque @ 1600 RPM..

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0 t0 62 in 7 Seconds.201 BHP 359 Ft Lbs Torque @ 1600 RPM..

 
Old 11-24-2011, 02:55 PM
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0 t0 62 in 7 Seconds.201 BHP 359 Ft Lbs Torque @ 1600 RPM..

Interesting, 224 views & 1 USA comment .on the 250 Diesel winning Drive Car of the Year in Australia.

There always seems to be a stunned silence when the word diesel is mentioned on this forum . (No offence meant)

Is there anything you do not like about diesels ?.What are the reasons why Americans do not buy diesels?

Would you consider a diesel if more were available in the USA?

http://www.carmagazine.co.uk/Drives/...11-CAR-review/

http://news.drive.com.au/drive/new-c...707-1h327.html

http://www.fastestlaps.com/cars/merc...250_cdi_t.html

Last edited by Carsy; 11-24-2011 at 03:03 PM.
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Old 11-24-2011, 03:18 PM
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Nothing wrong with diesels. Let's hear from our US friends. In some places in the US filling up a diesel can be a challenge unless you go to truck stops.
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Old 11-24-2011, 04:34 PM
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I mean, if anything I would be more than happy to get a diesel. Plenty of torque, good get-up-and-go, fairly quiet engine, clean emissions, etc. The only downside these days that STILL cause people to go for gasoline over diesel would be cost and some twisted form of pride/ego that thinks gasoline/displacement reigns supreme over eco-friendly alternatives. While in Southern California, a gallon of regular gas (87 octane) goes for $4.00/gallon, a gallon of diesel costs like $4.50-4.70 (Not entirely sure on this, it's a rough estimate). That and the cost of diesel cars have a premium over gasoline as well.

I'd be more than happy to get a diesel car, once again. The new ML350 Bluetec has so much torque that it makes me look like Rowan Atkinson when I think of flooring it. And despite what I said about diesels having a premium over cars with gasoline engines, the thing is, because they don't sell well enough, dealers often have them leftover from the previous model years and result in drastically reduced costs on those cars leftover. So the thing is, people CAN get diesels, and there's more than enough incentive that they should. They just don't. It's America. We're free to do as we choose, or as I see it, free to conform with what is still the norm in our beloved country. >_>
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Old 11-24-2011, 06:45 PM
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Originally Posted by Carsy View Post
Interesting, 224 views & 1 USA comment on the 250 Diesel winning Drive Car of the Year in Australia.

There always seems to be a stunned silence when the word diesel is mentioned on this forum. (No offence meant)
I think it's historically cheap gas in the US, and no need for better mpg's. In some Euro Countries, they have had high gasoline taxes that drove the need for diesels. In the US, no Press't or member of congress had the necessary pair of spheres to do the same. Diesels were associated with stinky busses blasting black clouds of exhaust.

For me, the E-Class turbo-diesel with 0-60 in about 6-7 sec's first caught my eye, and with recent gas price increases, VW Turbo Diesels give you 40 mpg's.

.

Last edited by kevink2; 11-24-2011 at 07:15 PM.
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Old 11-24-2011, 07:32 PM
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I'm a convert. I don't have the latest (twin turbo) 2.2 CDI engine they put in the C250 but my 2.2 CDI has been remapped to 212 bhp and 360 lbs ft of torque (from 170 bhp and 305 ft lbs).

Its awesome, no black smoke, very fast and good mileage - over 44 mpg (imperial galls not US galls). Its the way to go fellas - lobby your dealer!
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Old 11-25-2011, 01:16 AM
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Originally Posted by Carsy View Post
Interesting, 224 views & 1 USA comment .on the 250 Diesel winning Drive Car of the Year in Australia.

There always seems to be a stunned silence when the word diesel is mentioned on this forum . (No offence meant)

Is there anything you do not like about diesels ?.What are the reasons why Americans do not buy diesels?

Would you consider a diesel if more were available in the USA?

http://www.carmagazine.co.uk/Drives/...11-CAR-review/

http://news.drive.com.au/drive/new-c...707-1h327.html

http://www.fastestlaps.com/cars/merc...250_cdi_t.html
It has been said that the GM passenger car diesels soured the US market for diesels and that was long ago. But, they were terrible cars with their gas V-8s converted to diesel.

As to current diesel sales here, there are VW built diesels (Golf, Passat etc.) all over the place here and they darned good cars. A friend has a 2010 Golf diesel and he routinely sees 42-44 mpg hwy with it. And of course all Sprinter vans are diesels and they are everywhere. Plus the MB R, GL and GLK.

As far as MB diesels go here, the E320 Bluetec was introduced as a decontented E320 but with an added cost of $1000. And it comes with homely 16" wheels. I am speaking specifically of a 2007 owned by a friend.

And, diesel fuel still costs more than premium gas so where is the savings? And don't even think about bio-diesel which is much more costly.
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Old 11-25-2011, 02:56 AM
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I think it's historically cheap gas in the US

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Old 11-25-2011, 04:07 AM
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Originally Posted by RLE View Post

And, diesel fuel still costs more than premium gas so where is the savings? And don't even think about bio-diesel which is much more costly.
Av Petrol price in USA 21 Nov $3.37
Av Diesel price in USA 21 Nov $4.01

A 64 cent difference ie 19%.

Typically diesels are 30 % more efficient than petrol ( gas)

RLE , there is your savings.

http://38.96.246.204/oog/info/gdu/gasdiesel.asp

If diesel govt tax & distrubution costs were the same as petrol , diesel would be almost the same price. Meaning if there was more general useage as in other parts of the world , cost would fall.

In May /June this year gas & diesel were the same price & for 2009 /2010 there was only a few cents differential all year.

Diesels with their high torque at low revs make for a very comfortable & relaxed driving style. It is the whole driving package that is benificial ,not just the economy. No high voltage coils, spark plugs, rusting exhaust systems !!
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Old 11-25-2011, 05:41 AM
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Yes - in SA Diesel & gas prices are almost identical give or take a few cents & traditionally diesel has been cheaper than gas as it should be in refining cost. Farmers used to get low excise duty diesel for on-farm diesel use only but guess what went in their Mercs! At present high fuel costs there is an even larger swing to diesels.
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Old 11-25-2011, 02:20 PM
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I like diesels. I just wish that someone would figure out why its more expensive than regular gas. Isn't it a byproduct ignthe gas refinement process? I have never understood that. I really like the 335d. I would buy one if the price was right. I like the A3 too. From Los Angeles to the Grand Canyon on one tank of diesel is a good deal if you ask me.
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Old 11-25-2011, 03:09 PM
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Well, the reason why diesels aren't popular here isn't so much for the stigmata of diesel trucks, etc (at least my generation of 20-30 year olds). I think its the chracteristics of a diesel that younger people don't like. They aren't high-revving, or nice sounding. You don't hear people putting performance exhaust on a diesel, unless its a large truck. They just don't sound very luxurious (sounds like a big rig) and I am not very familiar with them...

By the time you factor in the fuel savings (which in the U.S. is minimal, as diesel is more than premium gas). The added headaches (less horsepower, but more torque) plus a new engine that I am not familiar with how it works, I'm not wiling to make the change. Plus, after actually looking at which stations have diesel, it isn't as widely available in the U.S. as one might assume.

I suspect that the main reason why people should get diesel (fuel savings) is negligible in the U.S. and if they were THAT concerned with gas, they could make up for the same fuel economy savings by switiching to a car that takes premium to one that takes regular and is slightly better on gas.

Plus not many models are offered in diesel drivetrains, and if they are, sometimes they are more expensive and/or not as good looking.
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Old 11-25-2011, 03:48 PM
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Originally Posted by Carsy View Post
Av Petrol price in USA 21 Nov $3.37
Av Diesel price in USA 21 Nov $4.01
A 64 cent difference ie 19%.
Typically diesels are 30 % more efficient than petrol ( gas)
I hate to categorize them like this, but your average American doesn't think like this. They look at the price at the pump and let that dictate their choice with no other thought behind it.

It's like the people who complain about the smart requiring premium ($0.20/gallon more over regular) when the car holds 8 gallons on a fillup. That, or the people who buy a Prius for the savings - when they could have spent less on a less economical car and seen a greater return over time.

Diesels have a reputation for being slow, belching smoke and smelling - when it just isn't the case any more. Add to that the fact that ULS Diesel wasn't available here until like 5 years ago - and advanced diesel technology just wasn't prolific.
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Old 11-25-2011, 05:38 PM
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[QUOTE=jctevere;4932788]

I suspect that the main reason why people should get diesel (fuel savings) is negligible in the U.S. and if they were THAT concerned with gas, they could make up for the same fuel economy savings by switiching to a car that takes premium to one that takes regular and is slightly better on gas.

QUOTE]

The next question could be, what car would that be? Would it have the engineering ,handling , size & comfort of the MB diesel?

The very hard to please UK's Top Gear write up :-

http://www.topgear.com/uk/mercedes-b...blueefficiency
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Old 11-26-2011, 12:28 AM
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Originally Posted by Carsy View Post
Av Petrol price in USA 21 Nov $3.37
Av Diesel price in USA 21 Nov $4.01

A 64 cent difference ie 19%.

Typically diesels are 30 % more efficient than petrol ( gas)

RLE , there is your savings.

http://38.96.246.204/oog/info/gdu/gasdiesel.asp

If diesel govt tax & distribution costs were the same as petrol , diesel would be almost the same price. Meaning if there was more general useage as in other parts of the world , cost would fall.

In May /June this year gas & diesel were the same price & for 2009 /2010 there was only a few cents differential all year.

Diesels with their high torque at low revs make for a very comfortable & relaxed driving style. It is the whole driving package that is benificial ,not just the economy. No high voltage coils, spark plugs, rusting exhaust systems !!
First of all, the average US gas price you quote is for 87 octane regular, not premium which is what modern MBs require. I filled up this week and paid $4.00 per gallon for premium (ethanol-free Chevron). It has been higher.

As to comparative maintenance costs, the diesel engine is the only component that is different from the gas cars and every one of those other parts will fail eventually, no matter what's under the hood. Being diesel powered doesn't make the AC or the brakes or anything else last longer.

As to rusting exhaust systems, my car's is stainless, front to back.

And I owned a diesel MB (yes, 1936 technology) and drove it 120K miles. And I might well have ordered a diesel W204 had the V-6 Bluetec been available here, even if the E-Class diesel add-on cost of $1000 was applied.

Lastly, the hiway fuel economy of an E-Class Bluetec vs a C300 is only 5 to 6 mpg different which ain't 30%.
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Old 11-26-2011, 01:17 AM
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Originally Posted by RLE View Post
First of all, the average US gas price you quote is for 87 octane regular, not premium which is what modern MBs require. I filled up this week and paid $4.00 per gallon for premium (ethanol-free Chevron). It has been higher.

So less of a differential price therefore adds to my arguement( discussion).

As to comparative maintenance costs, the diesel engine is the only component that is different from the gas cars and every one of those other parts will fail eventually, no matter what's under the hood. Being diesel powered doesn't make the AC or the brakes or anything else last longer.

Agreed, but what single item has the most moving parts apart from the GB?

As to rusting exhaust systems, my car's is stainless, front to back.

I did not know that . Well done MB.

And I owned a diesel MB (yes, 1936 technology) and drove it 120K miles. And I might well have ordered a diesel W204 had the V-6 Bluetec been available here, even if the E-Class diesel add-on cost of $1000 was applied.

Good on you.

Lastly, the hiway fuel economy of an E-Class Bluetec vs a C300 is only 5 to 6 mpg different which ain't 30%.
The comparison must be between the same model car.

A good discussion. Thank you.
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Old 11-26-2011, 09:34 AM
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Originally Posted by jctevere View Post
Well, the reason why diesels aren't popular here isn't so much for the stigmata of diesel trucks, etc (at least my generation of 20-30 year olds). I think its the chracteristics of a diesel that younger people don't like. They aren't high-revving, or nice sounding. You don't hear people putting performance exhaust on a diesel....
Hey man, like, it's about like diesels man, like saving the earth. See what I'm sayin' ?

Sorry, I guess I was watching too much OWS thing ... not that there's any thing wrong with that. Thanks for the younger, valid opinion.

I also wonder if Clinton's VP Al Gore had anything to do with any extra diesel taxes ... he was anti diesel a while back.

Originally Posted by RLE
Lastly, the hiway fuel economy of an E-Class Bluetec vs a C300 is only 5 to 6 mpg different which ain't 30%.
The E350 3L diesel has a mfg rated 0-60 in 6.7 sec, thanks to the wide mega torque range, while the C300's 0-60 is 7.1 sec with 322 lbs less wt. If MB had a smaller diesel V6, that matched that 7.1 sec in performance, the difference in gas milage would be much greater.

.
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Old 11-27-2011, 07:45 PM
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Here in Canada diesels are usually more expensive to purchase in the first place. I wanted to buy the new Touareg in a diesel and it was $7000 more and priced in line with the hybrid. Malarkey. So I didn't buy one at all as the 6banger is useless for towing.
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