How do I develop the performance of my c55 ?
11-25-2010, 02:13 PM
#1
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C55 AMG 2005
How do I develop the performance of my c55 ?
Hello
I'm a fan of more category the AMG
A while ago, and I'm looking for a site talking about AMG But I'm not very good in English Language So I hope to forgive me
I'm from Kuwait and i have Car Deals the C55 AMG 2005 .
I was the only who has the C55 2005 in Kuwait
it is stock and I would like to Improve engine performance and What is the best specialized Tags.
I hope that my words be clear
I'm a fan of more category the AMG
A while ago, and I'm looking for a site talking about AMG But I'm not very good in English Language So I hope to forgive me
I'm from Kuwait and i have Car Deals the C55 AMG 2005 .
I was the only who has the C55 2005 in Kuwait
it is stock and I would like to Improve engine performance and What is the best specialized Tags.I hope that my words be clear
11-25-2010, 02:43 PM
#2
Senior Member
Use the search function after you enter our C55/C32 forums, search for headers, ecu tunes, resonator, superchargers. Our cars dont have alot of upgrades available, it depends on how much money you want to spend. Lightweight wheels and better tires can be a start, you can also have a muffler shop remove your cats and resonator, not sure about kuwait smog laws, then add headers and a ecu tune by renntech or kleeman. That should put you near 400 hp.
11-25-2010, 03:16 PM
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C55 AMG 2005
Thank you for having to participate
When i add headers and a ecu tune by renntech or kleeman did i feel a large margin,How many horses will increase and how much the approximate price of the headers and a ecu tune ,At any site I get them ??
When i add headers and a ecu tune by renntech or kleeman did i feel a large margin,How many horses will increase and how much the approximate price of the headers and a ecu tune ,At any site I get them ??
11-26-2010, 01:45 PM
#4
ECu tune will do nothing or next to nothing for a stock C55. I've seen gains of 5 HP for about $1000 tune. Save your money and do the exhaust unless you want to do a Kleemann SC S7 and that'll run some $$
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11-27-2010, 06:45 PM
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2013 C63 AMG P31, 2014 GMC Sierra (6.2)
Here's a list Hooleyboy made up back in the day:
"C55 performance parts list.
My inbox here at mbworld is getting rather full these day with new C55 owners asking about mods for their car or just general questions about the C55. First off I think its great, as this car becomes more affordable people are snagging them up. As much as I love to talk about AMG's and try to respond to all the emails Just wanted to make a general parts list of performance after maket parts available for the C55 and gear it to the new owners of a C55, as this is most likely these first AMG or Mercedes for that matter. So here we go... And if I miss anything please feel free to add on
Support the Sponsors of this site
There is more options to modding this car than just the big companies. Mbworld.org has a bunch of sponsors on board that make great stuff. Most likely you have never heard of them, as I didn't know when i first joined.
Headers: EVOsport, VRP Tuning, Kleemann, RENNtech, AMS Motorsports, all make headers for the C55
Kleemann headers are the only ones (as far as i know that are not direct bolt ons) I Have Evosport headers and I like them alot. Prices range from about $1600-$5000 just for headers. With gains around 10-20hp
Software/ECU: EVOsport, LET motorsports, VRP tuning, RENNtech, Kleemann, Brabus, Powerchip, all offer some form of ECU upgrade for the C55. expect somewhere around 20hp give or take a few HPs.
Intake/Airbox As far as i know RENNtech and VRPtuning are the only ones who offer Airbox/intake mods for a C55. I think Brabus does too but I think its alot harder to get. VRPtuning has shown dyno gains with running the E55 airbox set up on a C55. expect around 5-15hp gain +/-.
Pulleys: AMS motorsports makes a light weight crank pulley that is much lighter than stock resulting in less rotational mass. It has been show to gain HP in the low and mid range some have even seen peak HP gains as well.
EVOsport offers an underdrive pulley kit for the C55 that is good for about 11hp (so ive heard)
Superchargers: RENNtech, Kleenamm and HPS make superchargers for the C55. Make sure you do your homework when choosing a supercharger thats right for your car. Dont be afraid to ask around or search the boards. VRPtuning along with EVOsport who are sponsors of this forum can help you out with your forced induction needs. I hear you can get a low boost Kleemann charger for around 9k Renntech is around 15K ouch! Some members will even tell you the old Kleemann blower is better than the new one.
Exhaust: Most C55 guys start out with chopping of the resonator and it is known on the board as being called a Res-delete, this is IMO the best $50-$100 you will spend on your car, the sound is amazing. Also You can chop out the secondary cats and pick up some HP along with a very mean sound. Custom dual exhaust in an other option for the C55 any exhaust shop can do this. Be aware the car will sound loud (in a good way) VRPtuning if you are in their area can also do this for you. Supersprint makes mufflers for the C55 but they are very pricey. IMO the stock one sound very good with any variation of exhaust mods.
Air Filters: Most C55 owners like to run K&N or Green filters there are a few other options out there but k&N or Green is the way to go.
Wheels: Not realy going to get into this much. Choosing the right wheel with correct offset and backspacing is like rocket science to me. In most cases Lighter is better, Forged wheels are stronger than cast wheels. Make sure the wheels you buy for your C55 are "hubcentric." Some members will tell you wheel spacers are not the way to go. IMO if you can avoid them just avoid them. However there are members that use then with no problems at all. If you want wheel spacers go with a good name when buying them and dont skimp. H&R and EiBach is a good place to start. Some high end wheels need spacers so it is what it is.
There are many wheel companies on this forum that can help you get the right wheel for your C55.
20 inch wheels will look stupid on a C55 they will kill your performance and rub like hell. stick with 18's or 19's. Its your best bet not to go wider than 9.5 inches in the rear.
LSD(limited slip Differential) for around $1400 some say its a must have for the racer Kleemann, Qauife make some good LSD's from what i hear talk to
James@ACGSD (sponsor) he can get you one. The LSD will help put all your power in the C55 to the ground rather than just spin it away.
Brakes: I wish i could remember their names but there are some sponsors on this forum that can line you up with a set of brakes that will make your head hit the windshield when stopping. Also Bembo make a good set for C55's Im sure some of the sponsors of this site can line you up with brembo brakes if thats what you want. I think RENNtech, Stoptech, and Eurotek all have apps for the C55. just make sure your wheels will clear the calipers as they are in most cases larger than stock.
Also look into some ceramic brake pads I got some at AutoZone and love them.
Suspension: RENNtech, H&R, Bilstien, Eibach all have suspension Compoents for the C55. from Springs to full coil over systems. EVOsports website www.evosport.com has some suspension stuff for the C55.
Tires: If your C55 came stock with Contisports just get rid of them I had them and hated them. Almost anything is an upgrade over the Contisports.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
I hope this helps the New C55 owners that are on this board. Happy modding and be aware its a vicious uncureable sickness this modding game. Remember mixing different parts will yield gains. some better than others"
Some of this is out of date however its a good place to start.
"C55 performance parts list.
My inbox here at mbworld is getting rather full these day with new C55 owners asking about mods for their car or just general questions about the C55. First off I think its great, as this car becomes more affordable people are snagging them up. As much as I love to talk about AMG's and try to respond to all the emails Just wanted to make a general parts list of performance after maket parts available for the C55 and gear it to the new owners of a C55, as this is most likely these first AMG or Mercedes for that matter. So here we go... And if I miss anything please feel free to add on
Support the Sponsors of this site
There is more options to modding this car than just the big companies. Mbworld.org has a bunch of sponsors on board that make great stuff. Most likely you have never heard of them, as I didn't know when i first joined.
Headers: EVOsport, VRP Tuning, Kleemann, RENNtech, AMS Motorsports, all make headers for the C55
Kleemann headers are the only ones (as far as i know that are not direct bolt ons) I Have Evosport headers and I like them alot. Prices range from about $1600-$5000 just for headers. With gains around 10-20hp
Software/ECU: EVOsport, LET motorsports, VRP tuning, RENNtech, Kleemann, Brabus, Powerchip, all offer some form of ECU upgrade for the C55. expect somewhere around 20hp give or take a few HPs.
Intake/Airbox As far as i know RENNtech and VRPtuning are the only ones who offer Airbox/intake mods for a C55. I think Brabus does too but I think its alot harder to get. VRPtuning has shown dyno gains with running the E55 airbox set up on a C55. expect around 5-15hp gain +/-.
Pulleys: AMS motorsports makes a light weight crank pulley that is much lighter than stock resulting in less rotational mass. It has been show to gain HP in the low and mid range some have even seen peak HP gains as well.
EVOsport offers an underdrive pulley kit for the C55 that is good for about 11hp (so ive heard)
Superchargers: RENNtech, Kleenamm and HPS make superchargers for the C55. Make sure you do your homework when choosing a supercharger thats right for your car. Dont be afraid to ask around or search the boards. VRPtuning along with EVOsport who are sponsors of this forum can help you out with your forced induction needs. I hear you can get a low boost Kleemann charger for around 9k Renntech is around 15K ouch! Some members will even tell you the old Kleemann blower is better than the new one.
Exhaust: Most C55 guys start out with chopping of the resonator and it is known on the board as being called a Res-delete, this is IMO the best $50-$100 you will spend on your car, the sound is amazing. Also You can chop out the secondary cats and pick up some HP along with a very mean sound. Custom dual exhaust in an other option for the C55 any exhaust shop can do this. Be aware the car will sound loud (in a good way) VRPtuning if you are in their area can also do this for you. Supersprint makes mufflers for the C55 but they are very pricey. IMO the stock one sound very good with any variation of exhaust mods.
Air Filters: Most C55 owners like to run K&N or Green filters there are a few other options out there but k&N or Green is the way to go.
Wheels: Not realy going to get into this much. Choosing the right wheel with correct offset and backspacing is like rocket science to me. In most cases Lighter is better, Forged wheels are stronger than cast wheels. Make sure the wheels you buy for your C55 are "hubcentric." Some members will tell you wheel spacers are not the way to go. IMO if you can avoid them just avoid them. However there are members that use then with no problems at all. If you want wheel spacers go with a good name when buying them and dont skimp. H&R and EiBach is a good place to start. Some high end wheels need spacers so it is what it is.
There are many wheel companies on this forum that can help you get the right wheel for your C55.
20 inch wheels will look stupid on a C55 they will kill your performance and rub like hell. stick with 18's or 19's. Its your best bet not to go wider than 9.5 inches in the rear.
LSD(limited slip Differential) for around $1400 some say its a must have for the racer Kleemann, Qauife make some good LSD's from what i hear talk to
James@ACGSD (sponsor) he can get you one. The LSD will help put all your power in the C55 to the ground rather than just spin it away.
Brakes: I wish i could remember their names but there are some sponsors on this forum that can line you up with a set of brakes that will make your head hit the windshield when stopping. Also Bembo make a good set for C55's Im sure some of the sponsors of this site can line you up with brembo brakes if thats what you want. I think RENNtech, Stoptech, and Eurotek all have apps for the C55. just make sure your wheels will clear the calipers as they are in most cases larger than stock.
Also look into some ceramic brake pads I got some at AutoZone and love them.
Suspension: RENNtech, H&R, Bilstien, Eibach all have suspension Compoents for the C55. from Springs to full coil over systems. EVOsports website www.evosport.com has some suspension stuff for the C55.
Tires: If your C55 came stock with Contisports just get rid of them I had them and hated them. Almost anything is an upgrade over the Contisports.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
I hope this helps the New C55 owners that are on this board. Happy modding and be aware its a vicious uncureable sickness this modding game. Remember mixing different parts will yield gains. some better than others"
Some of this is out of date however its a good place to start.
The following users liked this post:
idlebumski (04-26-2019)
11-28-2010, 08:15 AM
#9
There is more options to modding this car than just the big companies. Mbworld.org has a bunch of sponsors on board that make great stuff. Most likely you have never heard of them, as I didn't know when i first joined.
Headers: EVOsport, VRP Tuning, Kleemann, RENNtech, AMS Motorsports, all make headers for the C55
Kleemann headers are the only ones (as far as i know that are not direct bolt ons) I Have Evosport headers and I like them alot. Prices range from about $1600-$5000 just for headers. With gains around 10-20hp
** +1 with other exhaust work will give you moderate gains ***^^^^
Software/ECU: EVOsport, LET motorsports, VRP tuning, RENNtech, Kleemann, Brabus, Powerchip, all offer some form of ECU upgrade for the C55. expect somewhere around 20hp give or take a few HPs.
*** Have never ever seen a single dyno showing gains with just a tune?? *** ^^^^^^
Intake/Airbox As far as i know RENNtech and VRPtuning are the only ones who offer Airbox/intake mods for a C55. I think Brabus does too but I think its alot harder to get. VRPtuning has shown dyno gains with running the E55 airbox set up on a C55. expect around 5-15hp gain +/-.
*** +1, very moderate gains ***^^^^
Pulleys: AMS motorsports makes a light weight crank pulley that is much lighter than stock resulting in less rotational mass. It has been show to gain HP in the low and mid range some have even seen peak HP gains as well.
EVOsport offers an underdrive pulley kit for the C55 that is good for about 11hp (so ive heard)
** Never seen an quantitative evidence of gains with this **^^^^
Superchargers: RENNtech, Kleenamm and HPS make superchargers for the C55. Make sure you do your homework when choosing a supercharger thats right for your car. Dont be afraid to ask around or search the boards. VRPtuning along with EVOsport who are sponsors of this forum can help you out with your forced induction needs. I hear you can get a low boost Kleemann charger for around 9k Renntech is around 15K ouch! Some members will even tell you the old Kleemann blower is better than the new one.
** I can personally vouch to the gains on this *** Kleemann S7 package with headers, at least a 100 HP gain or more) and yes, Cory will tell you that the old Autorotor is THE BETTER SC **** ^^^
Exhaust: Most C55 guys start out with chopping of the resonator and it is known on the board as being called a Res-delete, this is IMO the best $50-$100 you will spend on your car, the sound is amazing. Also You can chop out the secondary cats and pick up some HP along with a very mean sound. Custom dual exhaust in an other option for the C55 any exhaust shop can do this. Be aware the car will sound loud (in a good way) VRPtuning if you are in their area can also do this for you. Supersprint makes mufflers for the C55 but they are very pricey. IMO the stock one sound very good with any variation of exhaust mods.
*** Very little gains but nice sound ***^^^
Air Filters: Most C55 owners like to run K&N or Green filters there are a few other options out there but k&N or Green is the way to go.
** Jury is always out on this one ***^^
Wheels: Not realy going to get into this much. Choosing the right wheel with correct offset and backspacing is like rocket science to me. In most cases Lighter is better, Forged wheels are stronger than cast wheels. Make sure the wheels you buy for your C55 are "hubcentric." Some members will tell you wheel spacers are not the way to go. IMO if you can avoid them just avoid them. However there are members that use then with no problems at all. If you want wheel spacers go with a good name when buying them and dont skimp. H&R and EiBach is a good place to start. Some high end wheels need spacers so it is what it is.
There are many wheel companies on this forum that can help you get the right wheel for your C55.
20 inch wheels will look stupid on a C55 they will kill your performance and rub like hell. stick with 18's or 19's. Its your best bet not to go wider than 9.5 inches in the rear.
LSD(limited slip Differential) for around $1400 some say its a must have for the racer Kleemann, Qauife make some good LSD's from what i hear talk to
James@ACGSD (sponsor) he can get you one. The LSD will help put all your power in the C55 to the ground rather than just spin it away.
** +1, getting mine installed this week (Quaife) ***
Brakes: I wish i could remember their names but there are some sponsors on this forum that can line you up with a set of brakes that will make your head hit the windshield when stopping. Also Bembo make a good set for C55's Im sure some of the sponsors of this site can line you up with brembo brakes if thats what you want. I think RENNtech, Stoptech, and Eurotek all have apps for the C55. just make sure your wheels will clear the calipers as they are in most cases larger than stock.
Also look into some ceramic brake pads I got some at AutoZone and love them.
Suspension: RENNtech, H&R, Bilstien, Eibach all have suspension Compoents for the C55. from Springs to full coil over systems. EVOsports website www.evosport.com has some suspension stuff for the C55.
Tires: If your C55 came stock with Contisports just get rid of them I had them and hated them. Almost anything is an upgrade over the Contisports.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
I hope this helps the New C55 owners that are on this board. Happy modding and be aware its a vicious uncureable sickness this modding game. Remember mixing different parts will yield gains. some better than others"
Headers: EVOsport, VRP Tuning, Kleemann, RENNtech, AMS Motorsports, all make headers for the C55
Kleemann headers are the only ones (as far as i know that are not direct bolt ons) I Have Evosport headers and I like them alot. Prices range from about $1600-$5000 just for headers. With gains around 10-20hp
** +1 with other exhaust work will give you moderate gains ***^^^^
Software/ECU: EVOsport, LET motorsports, VRP tuning, RENNtech, Kleemann, Brabus, Powerchip, all offer some form of ECU upgrade for the C55. expect somewhere around 20hp give or take a few HPs.
*** Have never ever seen a single dyno showing gains with just a tune?? *** ^^^^^^
Intake/Airbox As far as i know RENNtech and VRPtuning are the only ones who offer Airbox/intake mods for a C55. I think Brabus does too but I think its alot harder to get. VRPtuning has shown dyno gains with running the E55 airbox set up on a C55. expect around 5-15hp gain +/-.
*** +1, very moderate gains ***^^^^
Pulleys: AMS motorsports makes a light weight crank pulley that is much lighter than stock resulting in less rotational mass. It has been show to gain HP in the low and mid range some have even seen peak HP gains as well.
EVOsport offers an underdrive pulley kit for the C55 that is good for about 11hp (so ive heard)
** Never seen an quantitative evidence of gains with this **^^^^
Superchargers: RENNtech, Kleenamm and HPS make superchargers for the C55. Make sure you do your homework when choosing a supercharger thats right for your car. Dont be afraid to ask around or search the boards. VRPtuning along with EVOsport who are sponsors of this forum can help you out with your forced induction needs. I hear you can get a low boost Kleemann charger for around 9k Renntech is around 15K ouch! Some members will even tell you the old Kleemann blower is better than the new one.
** I can personally vouch to the gains on this
*** Kleemann S7 package with headers, at least a 100 HP gain or more) and yes, Cory will tell you that the old Autorotor is THE BETTER SC **** ^^^Exhaust: Most C55 guys start out with chopping of the resonator and it is known on the board as being called a Res-delete, this is IMO the best $50-$100 you will spend on your car, the sound is amazing. Also You can chop out the secondary cats and pick up some HP along with a very mean sound. Custom dual exhaust in an other option for the C55 any exhaust shop can do this. Be aware the car will sound loud (in a good way) VRPtuning if you are in their area can also do this for you. Supersprint makes mufflers for the C55 but they are very pricey. IMO the stock one sound very good with any variation of exhaust mods.
*** Very little gains but nice sound ***^^^
Air Filters: Most C55 owners like to run K&N or Green filters there are a few other options out there but k&N or Green is the way to go.
** Jury is always out on this one ***^^
Wheels: Not realy going to get into this much. Choosing the right wheel with correct offset and backspacing is like rocket science to me. In most cases Lighter is better, Forged wheels are stronger than cast wheels. Make sure the wheels you buy for your C55 are "hubcentric." Some members will tell you wheel spacers are not the way to go. IMO if you can avoid them just avoid them. However there are members that use then with no problems at all. If you want wheel spacers go with a good name when buying them and dont skimp. H&R and EiBach is a good place to start. Some high end wheels need spacers so it is what it is.
There are many wheel companies on this forum that can help you get the right wheel for your C55.
20 inch wheels will look stupid on a C55 they will kill your performance and rub like hell. stick with 18's or 19's. Its your best bet not to go wider than 9.5 inches in the rear.
LSD(limited slip Differential) for around $1400 some say its a must have for the racer Kleemann, Qauife make some good LSD's from what i hear talk to
James@ACGSD (sponsor) he can get you one. The LSD will help put all your power in the C55 to the ground rather than just spin it away.
** +1, getting mine installed this week (Quaife) ***
Brakes: I wish i could remember their names but there are some sponsors on this forum that can line you up with a set of brakes that will make your head hit the windshield when stopping. Also Bembo make a good set for C55's Im sure some of the sponsors of this site can line you up with brembo brakes if thats what you want. I think RENNtech, Stoptech, and Eurotek all have apps for the C55. just make sure your wheels will clear the calipers as they are in most cases larger than stock.
Also look into some ceramic brake pads I got some at AutoZone and love them.
Suspension: RENNtech, H&R, Bilstien, Eibach all have suspension Compoents for the C55. from Springs to full coil over systems. EVOsports website www.evosport.com has some suspension stuff for the C55.
Tires: If your C55 came stock with Contisports just get rid of them I had them and hated them. Almost anything is an upgrade over the Contisports.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
I hope this helps the New C55 owners that are on this board. Happy modding and be aware its a vicious uncureable sickness this modding game. Remember mixing different parts will yield gains. some better than others"
Last edited by Newzchspy; 11-28-2010 at 08:19 AM.
11-28-2010, 07:42 PM
#11
11-29-2010, 11:39 AM
#13
Nothing happened, BUT the cost of the project versus the gains were phenomenal. This is just my opinion. He did have a wicked fast C55 though!!
An E55 with some mods like pulley, tune and headers would have beat the car though.
Its very hard to mod a C55 for a reasonable cost.
An E55 with some mods like pulley, tune and headers would have beat the car though.
Its very hard to mod a C55 for a reasonable cost.
12-01-2010, 05:16 PM
#15
12-01-2010, 06:13 PM
#16
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2013 C63 AMG P31, 2014 GMC Sierra (6.2)
Just for a reference point, this is the deal that was out there a few years ago:
"I am pleased to announce that KLEEMANN is offering a special on our V8 Kompressor systems for the M113 V8 engine. Starting now, until December 31st, 2008, If you send your vehicle to the KLEEMANN USA headquarters in Colorado, we will install our V8 Kompressor system and a set of our stainless steel headers for an even $10,000. This represents a savings of approx. $4800.00- you are basically getting free installation, and a free set of headers. This offer includes before and after dyno testing. This sale applies to ALL normally aspirated M113 V8 engine cars from a W210 E430 to a R171 SLK55 AMG and everything in between. If you have any questions, just shoot me an email at cory@kleemannusa.com"
https://mbworld.org/forums/group-pur...r-special.html
"I am pleased to announce that KLEEMANN is offering a special on our V8 Kompressor systems for the M113 V8 engine. Starting now, until December 31st, 2008, If you send your vehicle to the KLEEMANN USA headquarters in Colorado, we will install our V8 Kompressor system and a set of our stainless steel headers for an even $10,000. This represents a savings of approx. $4800.00- you are basically getting free installation, and a free set of headers. This offer includes before and after dyno testing. This sale applies to ALL normally aspirated M113 V8 engine cars from a W210 E430 to a R171 SLK55 AMG and everything in between. If you have any questions, just shoot me an email at cory@kleemannusa.com"
https://mbworld.org/forums/group-pur...r-special.html
12-01-2010, 06:17 PM
#17
[QUOTE=wawy;4381068]Just for a reference point, this is the deal that was out there a few years ago:
"I am pleased to announce that KLEEMANN is offering a special on our V8 Kompressor systems for the M113 V8 engine. Starting now, until December 31st, 2008, If you send your vehicle to the KLEEMANN USA headquarters in Colorado, we will install our V8 Kompressor system and a set of our stainless steel headers for an even $10,000. This represents a savings of approx. $4800.00- you are basically getting free installation, and a free set of headers. This offer includes before and after dyno testing. This sale applies to ALL normally aspirated M113 V8 engine cars from a W210 E430 to a R171 SLK55 AMG and everything in between. If you have any questions, just shoot me an email at cory@kleemannusa.com"
*** Good reference. However, thats the newer SC he's installing, not the Autorotor *** I've always wanted to throw a SC in the ML55 (M113) and see how'd she do??
"I am pleased to announce that KLEEMANN is offering a special on our V8 Kompressor systems for the M113 V8 engine. Starting now, until December 31st, 2008, If you send your vehicle to the KLEEMANN USA headquarters in Colorado, we will install our V8 Kompressor system and a set of our stainless steel headers for an even $10,000. This represents a savings of approx. $4800.00- you are basically getting free installation, and a free set of headers. This offer includes before and after dyno testing. This sale applies to ALL normally aspirated M113 V8 engine cars from a W210 E430 to a R171 SLK55 AMG and everything in between. If you have any questions, just shoot me an email at cory@kleemannusa.com"
*** Good reference. However, thats the newer SC he's installing, not the Autorotor *** I've always wanted to throw a SC in the ML55 (M113) and see how'd she do??
12-02-2010, 02:05 PM
#18
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Our USA office has the very last new, old stock Autorotor KLEEMANN kompressor system left in the world. Send your car to me, and I'll let it go for $11K installed. It'll fit ANY car with the M113 N/A engine.
12-03-2010, 03:12 AM
#20
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Join Date: Nov 2009
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C63 507 AMG DA Car #19
From my thread search apparently the auto-rotor was more expensive than the eaton and the autorotor is claimed to be a better unit (from posts of the past) due to better efficiency.
I'm not sure if they both make the same HP at stock boost levels, and then the auto-rotor twin screw stays efficient as you up the boost levels? Or if it is across the board?
got this from a quick search.....
"I heard that the supplier, Autorotor, went out of business or doesn't make them anymore. not sure which is true, but anyway, can only get the Kleemann kit with the autorotor s/c used."
Pulled this off of the Eaton website:
Q: What’s a Twin-Screw supercharger and how is it different from an Eaton roots type supercharger?
A: All Eaton superchargers use the roots type supercharging principle. The roots supercharger is a positive displacement pump that moves air in pockets from the inlet to the outlet of the supercharger with no internal compression. The supercharger creates “boost” by moving more air into the intake manifold than the engine is utilizing, thus creating higher than atmospheric pressures in the intake manifold. When boost is not desired on an Eaton roots supercharger, the bypass valve allows the supercharger to spin with negligible parasitic loss as there is no internal compression. The Eaton roots supercharger uses 3 lobe (“M”) or 4 lobe (“TVS-R”) meshing rotors that are similar (but reversed) in geometry. The rotors operate at a 1:1 speed ratio.
The Twin-Screw type supercharger is also a positive displacement pump in that it moves a fixed amount of air per revolution. The Twin-Screw uses 2 non-similar screw type rotors that mesh together to compress and move the air pocket axially along the rotors. This internal compression ratio will lead to greater parasitic losses when boost is not required as you cannot turn this compression “off” by simply using a bypass valve. These rotors will have different rates of rotation due to their non-similar geometry and lobe quantity. The rotors of a Twin-Screw will commonly operate at 3:5 and 4:6 speed ratios. This means as the drive rotor spins at 15,000 rpm, the driven rotor will rotate at 25,000 rpm with a ratio of 3:5. This limits the Twin-Screw to lower rpm limits than the roots due to bearing life concerns.
There's a calculator on the eaton website:
http://www.eaton.com/EatonCom/Produc...gers/index.htm
Does anyone know if the kleemann eaton is the m112 or the m90?
Looking at the comp maps on the eaton site the m112 flows more air 150cu-m/hr than the m90.
I'm not sure if they both make the same HP at stock boost levels, and then the auto-rotor twin screw stays efficient as you up the boost levels? Or if it is across the board?
got this from a quick search.....
"I heard that the supplier, Autorotor, went out of business or doesn't make them anymore. not sure which is true, but anyway, can only get the Kleemann kit with the autorotor s/c used."
Pulled this off of the Eaton website:
Q: What’s a Twin-Screw supercharger and how is it different from an Eaton roots type supercharger?
A: All Eaton superchargers use the roots type supercharging principle. The roots supercharger is a positive displacement pump that moves air in pockets from the inlet to the outlet of the supercharger with no internal compression. The supercharger creates “boost” by moving more air into the intake manifold than the engine is utilizing, thus creating higher than atmospheric pressures in the intake manifold. When boost is not desired on an Eaton roots supercharger, the bypass valve allows the supercharger to spin with negligible parasitic loss as there is no internal compression. The Eaton roots supercharger uses 3 lobe (“M”) or 4 lobe (“TVS-R”) meshing rotors that are similar (but reversed) in geometry. The rotors operate at a 1:1 speed ratio.
The Twin-Screw type supercharger is also a positive displacement pump in that it moves a fixed amount of air per revolution. The Twin-Screw uses 2 non-similar screw type rotors that mesh together to compress and move the air pocket axially along the rotors. This internal compression ratio will lead to greater parasitic losses when boost is not required as you cannot turn this compression “off” by simply using a bypass valve. These rotors will have different rates of rotation due to their non-similar geometry and lobe quantity. The rotors of a Twin-Screw will commonly operate at 3:5 and 4:6 speed ratios. This means as the drive rotor spins at 15,000 rpm, the driven rotor will rotate at 25,000 rpm with a ratio of 3:5. This limits the Twin-Screw to lower rpm limits than the roots due to bearing life concerns.
There's a calculator on the eaton website:
http://www.eaton.com/EatonCom/Produc...gers/index.htm
Does anyone know if the kleemann eaton is the m112 or the m90?
Looking at the comp maps on the eaton site the m112 flows more air 150cu-m/hr than the m90.
Last edited by betrezra; 12-03-2010 at 04:01 AM.
12-03-2010, 10:50 AM
#21
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The Current KLEEMANN system uses the M112 Eaton supercharger.
Betrezra summed it up pretty well. Screw-type SC's are true compressors by definition so they typically create higher boost pressures at lower RPM which means a broader torque curve. They're also slightly more efficient in terms of discharge temperatures through the operating range. The HP difference is fairly minimal- I just tested a W208 CLK55 with Headers and an autorotor SC and it made 445 WHP. The same setup with an Eaton might make 425 WHP. The biggest difference is the area under the curve- the autorotor makes quite a bit more torque lower in the RPM range and maintains the TQ curve a bit better as the revs climb.
There's also a difference in displacement- the M112 is 1.8L while the autorotor systems were either 2.0L or 2.2L depending on which generation we're talking about.
At the end of the day, they both make fairly comparable power, but the autorotor system is going to perform a little better in the lower RPM range and will maintain higher TQ levels through the RPM range.
Betrezra summed it up pretty well. Screw-type SC's are true compressors by definition so they typically create higher boost pressures at lower RPM which means a broader torque curve. They're also slightly more efficient in terms of discharge temperatures through the operating range. The HP difference is fairly minimal- I just tested a W208 CLK55 with Headers and an autorotor SC and it made 445 WHP. The same setup with an Eaton might make 425 WHP. The biggest difference is the area under the curve- the autorotor makes quite a bit more torque lower in the RPM range and maintains the TQ curve a bit better as the revs climb.
There's also a difference in displacement- the M112 is 1.8L while the autorotor systems were either 2.0L or 2.2L depending on which generation we're talking about.
At the end of the day, they both make fairly comparable power, but the autorotor system is going to perform a little better in the lower RPM range and will maintain higher TQ levels through the RPM range.
12-03-2010, 11:13 AM
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C63 507 AMG DA Car #19
Thanks Cory... man had I known you had another auto-rotor I would have got it instead of the eaton that is going on my ride right now.
Keep me in mind if you come across a good used compressor unit later down the road, and I might be interested in a swap.
This project is by no means done.
Jeff
Another question - is there a company still around that can service the auto-rotor unit bearings, etc... if there are problems down the road?
Also if the auto-rotor does not have a bypass feature will it heatsoak in traffic more readily than the eaton?
Regarding comparing the two there are instances where the tq/rpm band variation help or hurt your 1/4 mile performance depending on chassis setup and traction..... we actually found benefits with cent superchargers in the 1/4 mile because they didn't hammer the tires off the line with all that tq......... of course if you can harness the power with a good suspension and sticky tires you indeed want all the hp/tq under the curve you can get.
THx guru of Kleemann!
Keep me in mind if you come across a good used compressor unit later down the road, and I might be interested in a swap.
This project is by no means done.
Jeff
Another question - is there a company still around that can service the auto-rotor unit bearings, etc... if there are problems down the road?
Also if the auto-rotor does not have a bypass feature will it heatsoak in traffic more readily than the eaton?
Regarding comparing the two there are instances where the tq/rpm band variation help or hurt your 1/4 mile performance depending on chassis setup and traction..... we actually found benefits with cent superchargers in the 1/4 mile because they didn't hammer the tires off the line with all that tq......... of course if you can harness the power with a good suspension and sticky tires you indeed want all the hp/tq under the curve you can get.
THx guru of Kleemann!
Last edited by betrezra; 12-03-2010 at 11:21 AM.
12-03-2010, 11:28 AM
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My pleasure!
Our USA office is still supporting autorotor systems in terms of bearing replacement, but that can turn into a long conversation. There are no more spare parts in terms of rotors, cases, noses, etc. for the autorotors, but simple bearing replacements and rebuilds we still do here.
All generations of KLEEMANN kompressors implement bypass valves- you pretty much need a bypass, otherwise you'd have surging problems coming off boost- it also helps with parasitic loss, and fuel economy. Heat soak doesn't really have anything to do with the bypass, rather it's a function of reduced airflow over the intercooler radiator- bypass or not, any intercooled car is going to heat soak while sitting in traffic on a hot day.
Our USA office is still supporting autorotor systems in terms of bearing replacement, but that can turn into a long conversation. There are no more spare parts in terms of rotors, cases, noses, etc. for the autorotors, but simple bearing replacements and rebuilds we still do here.
All generations of KLEEMANN kompressors implement bypass valves- you pretty much need a bypass, otherwise you'd have surging problems coming off boost- it also helps with parasitic loss, and fuel economy. Heat soak doesn't really have anything to do with the bypass, rather it's a function of reduced airflow over the intercooler radiator- bypass or not, any intercooled car is going to heat soak while sitting in traffic on a hot day.
Thanks Cory... man had I known you had another auto-rotor I would have got it instead of the eaton that is going on my ride right now.
Keep me in mind if you come across a good used compressor unit later down the road, and I might be interested in a swap.
This project is by no means done.
Jeff
Another question - is there a company still around that can service the auto-rotor unit bearings, etc... if there are problems down the road?
Also if the auto-rotor does not have a bypass feature will it heatsoak in traffic more readily than the eaton?
THx guru of Kleemann!
Keep me in mind if you come across a good used compressor unit later down the road, and I might be interested in a swap.
This project is by no means done.
Jeff
Another question - is there a company still around that can service the auto-rotor unit bearings, etc... if there are problems down the road?
Also if the auto-rotor does not have a bypass feature will it heatsoak in traffic more readily than the eaton?
THx guru of Kleemann!
12-03-2010, 11:41 AM
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C63 507 AMG DA Car #19
bypass
Thx for the tech data.
We used to run the centri blower with no bypass if making under 6psi of boost..... however if you make over 9psi when the throttle body shuts on decel or shifts the motor keeps rev-ing pushing boost against the closed throttle body compressing the air in the discharge heating it up and heat soaking the air charge. That was what I was referring too.
Glad to know they all have bypass's.
Thx again sir boost.
We used to run the centri blower with no bypass if making under 6psi of boost..... however if you make over 9psi when the throttle body shuts on decel or shifts the motor keeps rev-ing pushing boost against the closed throttle body compressing the air in the discharge heating it up and heat soaking the air charge. That was what I was referring too.
Glad to know they all have bypass's.
Thx again sir boost.
