Hey guys,my headers got too much rust , today i saw the headers cover came off bacause it had tooo much rust. this thing doesn't look good to me, anyone knows where i can find headers???

 

Pick up some high temp exhaust manifold paint, the 1200 degree stuff and paint yours, it will last years and make your manifolds look like new.

 

that's good idea
is there any new ones or aftermarket that it can give me some extra power???

 

http://www.bekkers.com/Merchant2/mer...mheaderexhaust

these are the only i-6 mercedes headers ive seen recently... back when these cars were new there were alot more options...

 

Price: $1,804.11

 

exactly, waste of time & money . You are better off doing every other mod in the book for roughly the same price.

 

like a CP right omey

 

I never said that! I said ALL mods . You can do intake, exhaust, cats, software, pulley, weight reduction, and many other things combined for that kind of money.

Heck, $1800 is almost 25-30% value of an entire C36 these days, That's A LOT.

 

they have Perfomance Chip which makes 295HP and 305 Tourqe and the price is $690

 

You can get a performance ECU upgrade for around $300-350. Contact Oliver @ speedtuningusa.com and he can get yours done very quickly. They even have a stage 2 C36 AMG software retune for an even more aggressive tune for the C36s (redline @ 7000rpm). $690 is a ripoff.

Speedtuningusa.com is one of the best MB tuners out there for the price and countless people on the mb forums have gone through them and been very happy with the results.

 

do u know how much Hp and tourqe will get me?

 

Just checked their website, its $299.

Here is the stage 1 chart, so stage 2 will be a bit more aggressive and rev to 7000rpm.

HP TQ (nm)
before: 280 / 385
after: 303 / 406




hope that helps.

 

will get you a bunch of bent valves,that is what it will get you.$300 or $700 for a chip without doing the improvements to make more power and not just move the power band is sending your old M104 to a quick grave.AMS and I may differ on the power aspect of a light weight pulley(I got a chance to see one of those units and it is fine work)It seems like we agree on the things you could do with some money v.s. the value of the car.5 grand car + 2 grand header = losing proposition. Wire brush and VHT
It's okay though someone just suggested a brembo front big brake kit at $3100 to a member in the w210 section with a 9 grand 2000 E430
Does anyone need to spend 2000 bucks before labor on a header to pick up 25h.p. on a $5000 C36 or $3000 before labor on big brakes to stop a 9k E class?Just my 2 cents on the subject

 

stock redline is 6800, 200rpm will not bend valves, most manufacturers put at least 400-500rpm of safety room on any engine they build. Speedtuningusa has tuned alot of cars on MBworld and seen very positive results, of all the tuning companies out there one of the only ones that actually makes power is the speedtuningusa and customer feedback from oliver has been very positive.

Now, I have a feeling this may only work on 4spds (the stage 2 higher 7000rpm redline) b/c the 5spd is electronic and would probably require modification as well which I doubt anyone does. Yet another reason 4spd is probably better.

just stating based on impressions i've read on forum from numerous members.

 

mods to the cams ,head or valves.The redline might be 6800 rpm take any base line track tested c36 and we have done it time and time again,you can even look at speed tunings chart you posted max torque 4grand max h.p. around 5400 rpm taking it to 7k it is way beyond its power band ,falls on its face and with most of the old girls hitting 150k or greater miles on the valve train, not factory fresh engines His net result will be the sum total of the equation above.
Let him hold it in 1st gear to 7grand and shift that old auto that is most likely on original fluid to 2nd gear and either valves or trans is going to do somethin.I think he needs to baby it,prices are dropping by the day.No need to make it worth any less.
5speed 722.6 if you do your own you can get the rebuild kit to do the valve body or 5grand gets you 800 h.p. capacity with customer spec shift points,hand built torque converter all the bells and whistles.That he can wait on until he gets his zooped up 1999 C43
once again just my 2 cents I do agree on your pulley now and your other great suggestions that other members should jump on way before the more drastic measures that most start out with and regret far to quickly.

 

oh man i dont want my ///AMG gets any problem (when i had BMW i had so much electronic and engine problem whenever driving it hard, because of aftermarket parts and stuff , the engine broke because of too much RPM , i put over 8000 RPM on it and the red line was only 6500 RPM)

 

I prefer to let the evidence do the talking, there is PLENTY of power on top end to sustain up to 7000rpm, especially if you start opening up the intake & exhaust. No offense Ohlord, but you just need to take my word on this... I know C36s (probably better than anyone).

As you can CLEARLY see on the dyno chart. This was done on a completely BONE STOCK C36. The stock specs on the C36s are conservative. There is virtually NO power drop off after peak all the way until redline (roughly 1-2HP at the most). AMG is a great job tuning the car stock BUT there is more power to be had. The airfuel ratios alone are proof of that, I have never seen a stock car dyno so accurately, consistently and have such a steady A/F stock of any car i've ever seen on a dyno. Further more you can see on the last run it ran up to 6800 no problem and had full power. 7000 is not only safe but easy to do. furthermore when I tore my motor apart (for headgasket) and looked at the internals, they are bulletproof and overbuilt & overengineered to the extreme including the valvetrain and the vales themselves, you definitely won't be bending any valves. valve float usually doesn't begin to happen until about 7500rpm anyways.

Do NOT underestimate these motors they are more than capable of handling stress of high rpms and 7000rpm is not extreme by any means at all, but IF you are that worries about it, you can still get a stage 2 software upgrade and just ask for the 6800rpm redline, Oliver can do whatever you ask him to, he's very flexible. Keep in mind, You will need more mods to run a stage 2 software in order to unlock its full potential (intake, exhaust, high flow cats, pulley, etc). Otherwise you might as well just get the normal chip.

2 cents

 

I pointed out
"With no
mods to the cams ,head or valves"
a bone stock C36 is not pulling all the way up to 6800 rpm
mid 5's and it is all down hill And the day we can't pull more than 213 out of an 3.6 M104 is the day I stop racing.The last bone stock factory class I put together 10 years ago pulled 280 at the flywheel on the stand well below 6 grand. If you know more about racing Mercedes than me maybe you can figure out what that would be at the rear wheels

His car is stock, his engine is old,his car is tired,why put a brick on the gas pedal and try to blow it up to prove a point?
I'd just hate to see him blow it up.Especially After his narrow escape from the scam artist that almost hoodwinked him out of it and tried to send it to England
no offence is ever taken . We have a member down in the w210 forum that is turboing his m104 I know what they are capable of,with work,I just don't think the OP is into that kind of effort or money per dollar return on a daily driver,I could be wrong.Is he taking it to the track?

 

Interesting read! I can't help but agree on the outrageous cost of some headers - especially relative to the value of the car. Heck, some of the headers I've looked at are close to $4 grand

 

now my car has about 120k miles on it

wut is about mercedes engine, it's not strong enought. i had bmw with 140k and it was doing fine until the day i did too much rpm on it.

my friend's 99 m3 has about 120k but that things is just fast as hell looks like is has about 260 wrhp (just the ECU upgrader ,7k RPM and Springs and shocks that's it but never had problem with it)
is Mercedes engine weak ?

 

The Mercedes engine ( M103/M104 variants ) is virtually bullet proof providing you maintain its integrity.

Contrary to what "AMS Performance " believes, it is not now or never will be a high RPM motor.

HP peaks in the low to mid 5K RPM range and torque hopefully in the low to mid 4K range.
It's a torque motor versus a horsepower motor.


Why?
Because it was designed with the intent of being ahead of an automatic transmission.
High RPM motors and automatic transmissions are a combination that can't work in a production car.

Notice how the majority of "M" cars are manual whereas the "AMG" have always been primarily automatics.

Short of adding boost you are throwing money away in trying to modify a I6 AMG be it a 3.2L M103-12V SOHC or a 3.4L or 3.6L M104-24V DOHC.

AMG got it as correct as it could be and any additional NA HP you try to squeeze out comes at an extremely high $/HP cost.

"AMS" claims to "know more then anyone else", but I've yet to see any real world performance numbers other then the incessant questionable dyno charts constantly posted.
All "bench racers" make extreme power and say they go fast, but yet can't show any rubber to the road numbers

Live with what you have and remember the old hot rodders theme...

"Speed costs money...how fast do you want to go ??? "

 

go as far as to say
"combination that can't work"
Plenty of 2 speed power glides lived long and happy lives behind some high revvin small block chevys
But show me an unmodified 722.424 with 120,000 miles on it with a 3.6 churning 7grand on a dyno that does not puke its guts

 

why everyone keeps saying power peaks in the mid 5k rpm range is just not true, my dyno just proved that power peaks right at redline on a stock engine, meaning you have plenty of more power in the power band should you choose to bump up the redline, but again its not necessary since the C36 4spd gearing is so long anyways, you don't have to do it, but again its an option if you want to you can.

HP peaking around 6500 and TQ peaking around 4500 is NOT a low rpm motor, it is certianly is capable of being a high revving motor, especially once you start to unlock its potential (which is quite a bit). Getting these 3.6L AMG motors to 240-250 wheel HP/tq mark (300-320ish) is not that difficult at all, it just takes the right mods to get there.

I don't have problem putting alot of money into a C36, its a fantastic car and it deserves some attention, but I just don't think spending $1800 on headers is a wise investment when you can do 4-5 other mods for the same price which will yield MUCH greater results. Thats the only point I'm trying to make.

 

Is that you?



Old school!

 

I just showed you one with 6800, 200 rpm isn't that big of a difference. The tranny can handle it no problem, (at least i know the 4spds can). 5spd honestly is such a weak tranny its hard to know exactly what it can and can't handle b/c they break so often. You may be right on 5spd, but the 4spds can handle it no problem at all.