63 tuners and mods

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Oct 4, 2008 | 01:32 PM

richtor

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Ford 4x4, daily

63 tuners and mods

i am looking for a new sports sedan and the c63 has me very intrigued. specially with the amount of n/a power these merc dohc 6.2 motors are putting down with a little bit of work.

my personal want is for a very fun daily driver with good power/weight ratio. after seeing more than a few threads on various mods and tuners i am getting the feeling that 430-450rwhp is possible with tune and full exhaust.

evosport - c63/ecu tune: 435rwhp, 396rwtq
vrp - cls63/vr530: 443rwhp
powerchip - ml63/ecu tune: 423rwhp, 390rwtq
kleeman - c63/ecu tune: 424rwhp
renntech - c63/v1 tune: 431rwhp, 387rwtq
mhp - c63/tcu and ecu v1 tune: 427rwhp, 394rwtq

i cant wait for the mir tuner showdown to actually see how these cars and tunes perform same day same track! the results will be more conclusive than the stats above. it may even be more interesting for those who dont show up?

please add and comment on the info that is above to help me make the best informed decision i can. thanks!

Oct 4, 2008 | 01:36 PM

Sincity

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From: Vegas and Vancouver, BC

Evosport for being closer to me.

MHP for a new (to AMG scene) homegrown US tuner making impressive numbers.

Oct 5, 2008 | 09:10 AM

C63 AMG

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C63AMG

don't forget the vaeth 585hp (don't know about the true rwhp)
http://www.gosportscar.com/2008/06/1...-amg-to-585hp/

Last edited by C63 AMG; Oct 5, 2008 at 09:12 AM.

Oct 5, 2008 | 09:19 AM

AMGC60-3

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From: N.Jersey and New York, stationed in Germany

W164 ML500,SMART For two,1994 C280(5speed manual) 1999 C230k station wagon

Quote:

Originally Posted by C63 AMG

don't forget the vaeth 585hp (don't know about the true rwhp)
http://www.gosportscar.com/2008/06/1...-amg-to-585hp/

Yeah, those guys have been around for a while and have some damn good numbers but they are pretty expensive $$$.

Oct 5, 2008 | 09:22 AM

C63 AMG

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C63AMG

around 13000€ i guess, only for the engine-tuning

Oct 5, 2008 | 09:35 AM

AMGC60-3

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From: N.Jersey and New York, stationed in Germany

W164 ML500,SMART For two,1994 C280(5speed manual) 1999 C230k station wagon

Quote:

Originally Posted by C63 AMG

around 13000€ i guess, only for the engine-tuning

Thats pretty damn crazy, with todays exchange rate thats over $20k.For us Americans that's over 1/3 of the base price C63.

Oct 5, 2008 | 11:46 AM

richtor

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Ford 4x4, daily

Quote:

Originally Posted by C63 AMG

don't forget the vaeth 585hp (don't know about the true rwhp)
http://www.gosportscar.com/2008/06/1...-amg-to-585hp/

do they sell just the tune and exhaust by itself without the body kit and wheels? i would like to stay under 5/6k for the tune and long tubes.

over the years i have heard a lot of good things from renntech and evosport. i believe evosport is a little less expensive. currently the evosport crew has yet to answer my questions in their thread. and most recently mhp has caught my eye. this is why i am waiting patiently for the tuner shootout at mir!

is there any experience with client/customer service with any of these tuners?

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Oct 6, 2008 | 08:35 PM

gravedgr

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2009 C63 Capri Blue

Most of us just got our C63's. Mine only has 450 miles so far.

Oct 6, 2008 | 09:26 PM

#10

paulGT3

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AMG C63

that Vaeth system sounds cool but thats too expensive for this car.
125K Euros puts the C63 in the GT3 RS and 430 range. thats missing the point

Oct 10, 2008 | 09:42 PM

#11

gravedgr

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2009 C63 Capri Blue

Quote:

Originally Posted by richtor

I put this information together today based on the latest round of threads. The goal was to show not just reported max numbers, but reported gains.

=================================================

VRP (10/10/08)
$1999

Stock RWHP: 371 / Tune RWHP: 429 / Gain: 58 RWHP
Stock RWTQ: ??? / Tune RWTQ: ??? / Gain: 47 RWTQ

(torque numbers not provided, only gain)

$34.47/RWHP gain

=================================================

MHP (10/06/08)
$4000 [revised 10/10/08, 10/10/08] (money back guarantee)

Stock RWHP: 372 / Tune RWHP: 427 / Gain: 55 RWHP
Stock RWTQ: 372 / Tune RWTQ: 394 / Gain: 22 RWTQ

$72.73/RWHP gain

=================================================

Kleeman (10/02/08 - Danny Boy)
$1495

Stock RWHP: 356 / Tune RWHP: 406 / Gain: 50 RWHP
Stock RWTQ: 348 / Tune RWTQ: 366 / Gain: 18 RWTQ

$29.90/RWHP gain

=================================================

Kleeman (10/05/08 - E63PWR)
$1495

Stock RWHP: 378 / Tune RWHP: 424 / Gain: 46 RWHP
Stock RWTQ: ??? / Tune RWTQ: ??? / Gain: ?? RWTQ

$32.50/RWHP gain

=================================================

Evosport [09/30/08]
$1990 (14 day money back satisfaction guarantee)

Stock RWHP: 371 / Tune RWHP: 435 / Gain: 64 RWHP
Stock RWTQ: 365 / Tune RWTQ: 396 / Gain: 31 RWTQ

$31.09/RWHP gain

=================================================

RENNTECH
$3495

Stock RWHP: 369 / Tune RWHP: 419 / Gain: 50 RWHP
Stock RWTQ: 363 / Tune RWTQ: 393 / Gain: 30 RWTQ

(claimed crank #'s x .82)

$69.90/RWHP gain

=================================================

Last edited by gravedgr; Oct 11, 2008 at 10:29 AM.

Oct 11, 2008 | 04:23 AM

#12

AMGC60-3

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From: N.Jersey and New York, stationed in Germany

W164 ML500,SMART For two,1994 C280(5speed manual) 1999 C230k station wagon

Quote:

Originally Posted by gravedgr

I put this information together today based on the latest round of threads. The goal was to show not just reported max numbers, but reported gains.

=================================================

VRP (10/10/08)
$1999

Stock RWHP: 371 / Tune RWHP: 429 / Gain: 58 RWHP
Stock RWTQ: ??? / Tune RWTQ: ??? / Gain: 47 RWTQ

(torque numbers not provided, only gain)

$34.47/RWHP gain

=================================================

MHP (10/06/08)
$3800 [revised 10/10/08] (money back guarantee)

Stock RWHP: 372 / Tune RWHP: 427 / Gain: 55 RWHP
Stock RWTQ: 372 / Tune RWTQ: 394 / Gain: 22 RWTQ

$69.09/RWHP gain

=================================================

Kleeman (10/02/08 - Danny Boy)
$1495

Stock RWHP: 356 / Tune RWHP: 406 / Gain: 50 RWHP
Stock RWTQ: 348 / Tune RWTQ: 366 / Gain: 18 RWTQ

$29.90/RWHP gain

=================================================

Kleeman (10/05/08 - E63PWR)
$1495

Stock RWHP: 378 / Tune RWHP: 424 / Gain: 46 RWHP
Stock RWTQ: ??? / Tune RWTQ: ??? / Gain: ?? RWTQ

$32.50/RWHP gain

=================================================

Evosport [09/30/08]
$1990 (14 day money back satisfaction guarantee)

Stock RWHP: 371 / Tune RWHP: 435 / Gain: 64 RWHP
Stock RWTQ: 365 / Tune RWTQ: 396 / Gain: 31 RWTQ

$31.09/RWHP gain

=================================================

RENNTECH
$3495

Stock RWHP: 369 / Tune RWHP: 419 / Gain: 50 RWHP
Stock RWTQ: 363 / Tune RWTQ: 393 / Gain: 30 RWTQ

(claimed crank #'s x .82)

$69.90/RWHP gain

=================================================

Well, I guess that sort of puts it into perspective...

Oct 11, 2008 | 07:19 AM

#13

Timeless

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From: South Carolina

2005 E55 ///AMG

VRP would be my choice if I had a C63....Powerchips has been doing ECU tuning for a long time and with VRP helping it is a great relationship for all.

Oct 11, 2008 | 10:30 AM

#14

gravedgr

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2009 C63 Capri Blue

Quote:

Originally Posted by AMGC60-3

Well, I guess that sort of puts it into perspective...

I know for me personally, I like to have everything I might possibly compare all on one screen and I thought others might be the same. BTW, I revised it again with MHP's updated pricing.

Oct 11, 2008 | 01:23 PM

#15

MHP

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'09 C63 AMG

Keep in mind guys that we're the only ones in the world that do TCU as well as ECU so everyone else's pricing is just for ECU (which is only 50% of driveline tuning).
We're also the only ones with track testing to prove our results. Last night we went 12.029@118.18 actual/11.94@118.99 corrected and 12.024@118.78 actual/11.97@119.31 corrected with v2. Dyno #s coming on Monday.

Thanks
Andy

Oct 11, 2008 | 01:59 PM

#16

MB_Forever

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From: California, USA

E63 P30, CL500 Sport

Quote:

Originally Posted by richtor

Please remember that MHP provided 5th gear dynos (1:1 on C63), which reads 6 to 8 rwhp lower than 4th gear. So you're numbers should be adjusted accordingly.

Oct 11, 2008 | 02:30 PM

#17

RM-6302

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2009 Black C63 AMG

Quote:

Originally Posted by gravedgr

Thank you gravedgr.

I for one think a chart / table like this makes your tuner choice a much easier decision. The effort you put into this is a benefit to any forum member who is considering an ECU/TCU tune. Thanks again!

Oct 11, 2008 | 05:47 PM

#18

gravedgr

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2009 C63 Capri Blue

Quote:

Originally Posted by MHP

Andy - understood, but that is qualatative information and not so quantatative, so its hard to include for comparison. If we could figure out how much of a difference the TCU tune makes on a 1/4 mile run vs. just an ECU tune (done by you), it would be easier to measure value.

Quote:

Originally Posted by RM-6302

Thank you gravedgr.

I'm one of those guys, so it was no problem.

Last edited by gravedgr; Oct 11, 2008 at 09:36 PM.

Oct 11, 2008 | 06:09 PM

#19

MHP

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'09 C63 AMG

Quote:

Originally Posted by gravedgr

Andy - understood, but that is qualatative information and not so quantative, so its hard to include for comparison. If we could figure out how much of a difference the TCU tune makes on a 1/4 mile run vs. just an ECU tune (done by you), it would be easier to measure value.

Understood, but the thing is the benefits of a TCU reflash aren't only seen in the quarter mile. Everytime you drive the car you'll feel the beneift whether it be at part or WOT. I know, not quantitative, but all it takes is one drive to know it's there.

To put it another way: Would you rather have a peanut butter sandwich, a jelly sandwich, or a PB + J sandwich?

Last edited by MHP; Oct 11, 2008 at 06:12 PM.

Oct 11, 2008 | 09:45 PM

#20

gravedgr

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2009 C63 Capri Blue

Quote:

Originally Posted by MHP

To put it another way: Would you rather have a peanut butter sandwich, a jelly sandwich, or a PB + J sandwich?

I'd put it a different way - you're a restaurant and you make a steak with a special sauce; everyone else just has plain steak. If someone is trying to decide where to eat, do they go to another restaurant (where all steaks are relatively the same quality and price) or to your restaurant (where the steak is supposedly better than anywhere else, but costs twice as much)? Are they willing to pay twice as much not knowing whether they'll like the special sauce, or need the special sauce?

Oct 11, 2008 | 11:38 PM

#21

Timeless

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From: South Carolina

2005 E55 ///AMG

Quote:

Originally Posted by MHP

Imagine the slam dunk if you offered your tune that includes the TCU for only SLIGHTLY more than the competitions ECU tune alone.

Making it cost CONSIDERABLY more brings doubt into question as to its worth.

Oct 12, 2008 | 12:44 AM

#22

MHP

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'09 C63 AMG

Quote:

Originally Posted by gravedgr

There's no supposedly about it

Remember that the trans is half the driveline so you can't simply call it a sauce. Plus quality steaks don't need sauce.

My answer to that question would be yes, it's worth the price--I'm a big fan of wagyu/kobe.

At my favorite local steakhouse (Hyde Park) I can have a 16-18 oz bone in fillet for ~$50 or a 6 oz Kobe strip for $120. Since I love red meat and eat a LOT I usually get both.

Last edited by MHP; Oct 12, 2008 at 12:57 AM.

Oct 12, 2008 | 12:44 AM

#23

MHP

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'09 C63 AMG

Quote:

Originally Posted by Timeless

Again, I don't think anyone really understands how much time it takes to properly code a TCU. We're the only ones in the world that can do it, which should tell you something about it.

Oct 12, 2008 | 01:04 AM

#24

gravedgr

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2009 C63 Capri Blue

Quote:

Originally Posted by MHP

There's no supposedly about it

Remember that the trans is half the driveline so you can't simply call it a sauce.

My answer to that question would be yes, it's worth the price--I'm a big fan of wagyu/kobe.

At my favorite local steakhouse (Hyde Park) I can have a 16-18 oz bone in fillet for ~$50 or a 6 oz Kobe strip for $120. Since I love red meat and eat a LOT I usually get both.

My point was that even a novice can compare cuts of meat, or the weight. But its hard to put a value on something you can't measure. And I said "supposedly" because no one is going believe 100% until they try it for themselves. I wish you could seed a mule somewhere down here in the Southeast, but I'm still not sure I could make myself part with $3500-4000 for a tune (wheels maybe, since I could resell them).

BTW - the only steak I eat out is @ the local churrascaria joints. For an actual steak, nothing beats what I can cook at home for about $20.

Oct 12, 2008 | 01:13 AM

#25

MHP

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'09 C63 AMG

Quote:

Originally Posted by gravedgr

BTW - the only steak I eat out is @ the local churrascaria joints. For an actual steak, nothing beats what I can cook at home for about $20.

I wish you could drive a car tuned by us as well. I don't think you'd bat an eye at the price of admission afterwards, but that's just MHO.

You can resell the tune as part of the car, personally I think an extra 55rw+ (v1 results, redynoing v2 Monday, maybe Tues if my yaw sensor comes in Mon) over stock is a good selling point.