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Anyone got WIS 05-7211 - Camshaft Adjuster DIY

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Anyone got WIS 05-7211 - Camshaft Adjuster DIY

 
Old 08-27-2015, 04:13 PM
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C63 2012 M156
Anyone got WIS 05-7211 - Camshaft Adjuster DIY

Hi folks,

I am looking for the related WIS for M156 camshaft adjuster replacement and any good DIY threads.

WIS: 05-7211
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Old 08-27-2015, 10:01 PM
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Originally Posted by Missionary View Post
Hi folks,

I am looking for the related WIS for M156 camshaft adjuster replacement and any good DIY threads.

WIS: 05-7211
Thought your dealer said it was normal just like mine did? Trying to tackle it yourself just so you know been 5k miles sounds has not changed or gotten worse no issues at all if that helps
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Old 08-27-2015, 10:36 PM
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Yes actually the dealer came back and said that there was an issue. The insurance company is the blocker at the moment.

The fact that there it is only one or two that have the issue is a bit of a smoking gun and the noise matches the sound recordings in the SB S-B-05.20/20b.

I replaced the seals in my BMWs VANOS system with higher quality Viton ones and modified them to reduce the amount of oil loss. Stopped this noise flat and gave a decent amount of low end power back as well.

The noise is the camshaft adjusters smacking back and forth from full advance to full retard un-dampened.

Anyone pulled on of these apart and could share the how they could be modded to sort this? Also do the M156 ones have magnates? I wonder if they could be a point of failure.

I have driven plenty of these cars now that don't suffer from that noise hot, cold or ever.

Still waiting for my WIS EPC install so anyone with 05-7211 handy ?

Last edited by Missionary; 08-29-2015 at 02:35 AM.
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Old 08-27-2015, 10:54 PM
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Its easy with the tools. Both banks have to be timed though even if you have one side apart.
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Old 08-27-2015, 11:16 PM
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This is what I did to my BMWs adjusters.

http://www.beisansystems.com/procedu..._procedure.htm

I wonder if there is something similar for the M156, there must be a reason why the are a known issue even with the late number engines.
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Old 08-28-2015, 12:48 AM
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Put the engine to 40degrees. Put the flat edge in the back of the cams, put the holder on the top front. Put the cam phaser on then the adjusting plate over it to set the phaser at the right position. Torque phaser bolt.
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Old 08-28-2015, 01:11 AM
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Originally Posted by Merc63 View Post
Put the engine to 40degrees. Put the flat edge in the back of the cams, put the holder on the top front. Put the cam phaser on then the adjusting plate over it to set the phaser at the right position. Torque phaser bolt.
Done it before I see. I still need all the torque settings. Any tricks regarding chain tension or which direction to take up slack. Also is there any slack in the cam holders? Do I need to remove the plugs?

Not got the WIS doc?
No one done a DIY on this?

Still interested to hear about a mod that might stop the issue from happening in the first place.

Do we think this is magnet or seal failures causing the issue?
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Old 08-28-2015, 10:00 AM
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You don't touch the chains, you don't even see them. There is another gear that spins both cams. You need the torque on the cam phaser bolt. Get arp bolts from Weistec, they will tell you the torque. That is the only bolt you will be touching beside valve cover.

There is no slack or anything. With the tools holding the cams and the engine at 40degrees, it's impossible to do it wrong with the tools, they hold everything perfectly.

I'm not sure what the issue is, but I've had two of these engines and both needed new adjusters around 60,000km. I have a noise again and think I might need new ones again or either I have a noisy pulley, I haven't located it yet.
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Old 08-28-2015, 10:58 AM
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Originally Posted by Missionary View Post
Hi folks,
When you say insurance won't cover you mean warrenty? What warrenty company and why won't they cover it if it is deemed bad by the dealer
I am looking for the related WIS for M156 camshaft adjuster replacement and any good DIY threads.



WIS: 05-7211
When you say insurance won't cover you mean warrenty? What warrenty company and why won't they cover it if it is deemed bad by the dealer
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Old 08-28-2015, 02:22 PM
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Originally Posted by AMGonFire View Post
When you say insurance won't cover you mean warrenty? What warrenty company and why won't they cover it if it is deemed bad by the dealer
You have to wonder...

Merc63, my engine falls outside the affected range for the head-bolt and follower hardening issue. Still worth getting the arp studs?

Et al, there must be a reason why these damn things keep failing. Anyone got a failed one the could pull apart and see if the seals have flattened?

I really do need this WIS document before Monday to help talk sense into the warranty company... anyone

Last edited by Missionary; 08-28-2015 at 02:27 PM.
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Old 08-28-2015, 07:15 PM
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Merc63's instructions are perfect. The cars I have seen have engine vins that fall outside of the effected range, but they have had the issue.

The torque spec is 45NM and a 90* on an OEM bolt. That is directly from WIS.

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Old 08-28-2015, 08:11 PM
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Great info in these posts guys. Subbed for when I do mine.
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Old 08-29-2015, 01:28 AM
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Originally Posted by Missionary View Post
You have to wonder...

Merc63, my engine falls outside the affected range for the head-bolt and follower hardening issue. Still worth getting the arp studs?

Et al, there must be a reason why these damn things keep failing. Anyone got a failed one the could pull apart and see if the seals have flattened?

I really do need this WIS document before Monday to help talk sense into the warranty company... anyone
I wouldn't do studs unless you're in the affected range and going to a blower. For Na the revised bolts are 1/8th the price and will do the job.
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Old 08-29-2015, 02:39 AM
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Old 08-29-2015, 02:43 AM
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Interesting conversation with an ex MB Forman for 8 years. He has set up his own shop and said something about there being a kit for these camshaft adjusters that included replacing the camshaft with forged items. He might have been talking about the old 1560503147 kit for pre 60 001177 motors but he did say that MB still did suffer from the camshaft adjuster fault issue after at least the follower and camshaft hardening was fixed. Maybe ware on the camshafts is also a contributing factor?

Does anyone have any old faulty adjusters that they can see where the oil leak back might be coming from?

Could this also be a weak magnet not closing the oil supply off fully on shut down?

Last edited by Missionary; 08-29-2015 at 02:46 AM.
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Old 08-29-2015, 10:18 AM
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Haven't even seen a car with any cam shaft issues. I am not worried about that at all.

Just replace your adjusters and be done with it.
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Old 08-29-2015, 12:11 PM
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I have seen two in the last three months. My car has 106,000 on it with no issues yet. When you hear tapping from the valve train you know what it is. I have a good exhaust cam and a bad intake cam at my house. I called a cam shop to see if it could be repaired but he said they did not have the tooling.
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Old 08-29-2015, 12:34 PM
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Unless you have the full document number that number doesn't really help me unless you give me your vin thru pm then I can look at all the documents for that specific car.

I think this pdf is what your looking for maybe?
Attached Files
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Old 08-29-2015, 05:16 PM
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Andrew, you are a rock*!



Points of interest:

lazyie12g/Merc63, are you doing this?





It looks like the C class has different camshaft solenoids. Could THIS be why we see this issue more on Cs that other classes!





Do some camshaft adjusters for the M156 have threads in the bore and some do not? I understood that they are the same across the range. Could this be an exhaust/intake variation?

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Old 08-29-2015, 11:52 PM
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I never replaced the adjuster. I just removed cams a few times.

The phaser gears need to be locked, some have threads for a bolt to lock them or some are thread less and you need the mb tool on it.
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Old 08-30-2015, 12:22 AM
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Originally Posted by Merc63 View Post
I never replaced the adjuster. I just removed cams a few times.

The phaser gears need to be locked, some have threads for a bolt to lock them or some are thread less and you need the mb tool on it.
Good to know, thanks.

Do we know which engine number MB started using forged camshafts rather than cast nodular iron? Was that post #60658 as per the head bolt issue?

My engine number is 72157. Anyone sure if it will have the forged camshafts?
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Old 09-07-2015, 06:16 AM
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Does anyone have a link to an explanation on how the M156 camshaft adjusters actually work? I am trying to figure out what exactly goes wrong with these. Is it seals, springs, bearings of sorts, solenoid seals, solenoids, rings on the timing bushing?

Are these the vane type adjusted by solenoid duty cycle?
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Old 09-07-2015, 09:27 PM
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Probably a seal would be my guess.
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Old 09-08-2015, 09:15 PM
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Originally Posted by Merc63 View Post
Probably a seal would be my guess.
Picking up my car Tom missionary. They just replaced the affected side intake and exhaust camshaft adjusters. Supposedly the sound is gone. We will see I hope it stays that way. I will keep you informed.
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Old 09-09-2015, 05:21 PM
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Originally Posted by AMGonFire View Post
Picking up my car Tom missionary. They just replaced the affected side intake and exhaust camshaft adjusters. Supposedly the sound is gone. We will see I hope it stays that way. I will keep you informed.

Great news. Do you think you could pick up the faulty ones so that we can do a post mortem on them and see what it is that actually fails on these things.

Happy to do a skype session to walk you through if needed.
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