CharlestonN

My ABC pump finally gave in on me, i have been getting the ABC 'visit workshop' notice since i bought the car over a year ago but other than the car dropping after sitting overnight and having to top off the fluid every few months it hasn't been an issue but a few weeks ago it finally gave out

So i ordered a rebuilt replacement which ended up being defective then i was sent ANOTHER replacement which i just found out yesterday was also no good

I finally just got fed up and payed to get a new pump which should be installed and ready to go on Monday

The total cost ended up being around $1,430 ($850 for the new pump and $580 for labor, flush, fluid, filter and rodeo)

I had to spend a bit more since i had to pay for labor twice due the part being defective but all in all not as much as i have heard other people in the forums having to spend

In total i have been without my car for almost a month and a half and i can tell you i am having withdraws!

As soon as i get her back i am taking her to have the resonators replaced with straight pipes at renntech and having the supercharger pulley bearing replaced as well with other mods to follow early next year

radride

I know your pain. My car came off the train slammed. I thought it had a renntech lowering module on it. Turns out it was the ABC pump. $3000 later and its good to go.

R.K.

Jud Chapin

Your having to top it of every few months should have been a signal to you that the system had a leak and needed to be repaired, not to mention the warning light and the car dropping overnight.. Running low on fluid is probably what killed the pump. Have the entire system checked for leaks BEFORE running with the new pump. If the system still leaks after it's installed, you might find yourself with another wiped out pump.

John CL500

Why doesn't MB do something about this??? Like issue a recall on the damn pumps!

Jud Chapin

John, I doubt the pump is the problem in this case. It more than likely ran low on fluid and burnt up. He mentioned he had to periodically top the system off. He had ample (3) warnings that something was wrong, all of which he ignored. The problem could have been as simple as a loose line fitting or a leaking hose, both of which are easy and inexpensive repairs. I think this is how the ABC system gets a bad name. Just my 2 cents.

John CL500

Jud, I re-read the op's post and you are absolutely correct....sounds like it may have been avoided. I check my fluid regularly and If I ever got an ABC message on the dash, I would get it checked out immediately.

Jud Chapin

I think all CL owners on this Forum should take the time to read the various ABC posts to get an understanding of how the system works, what to look out for, and do some preventative maintenance. If they would do this, I think there would be a lot less ABC bashing. I'm sure that these same individuals would do what you say you would do above if their engine temp or oil warning light were to come on.

radride

In my case the pump itself was leaking. Nothing else. It was 100% pump failure.

R.K.

maxwerks

Isnt it possible to have all ABC related posts / info /etc in a sticky for all CL W215 members .. it sure seems like quite a major and common issue

John CL500

I think that would be a great idea. In fact, I would volunteer to set this up for us. With the Moderators approval.

CharlestonN

I didn't ignore the problem, it just wasn't a severe enough problem to have addressed until now

As soon as i bought the car i had it checked out by my mechanic who told me the pump was leaking extremely slowly behind the pulley and was a bar or so below optimal pressure, he said had about a year before it completely went out and that's exactly what happened

I never let the system run dry, i checked it every day and only topped it up when the level was lower than it should be

When i had the new pump put in i had the entire system checked and it is fine, only the pump failed

Anyway, it's now got about 105K miles on the ODO and other than a leaky AC line no major issues until this and still for $1,400 i don't consider this an inordinately major repair bill

Jud Chapin

Have a look.

http://www.benzworld.org/forums/w215...bc-issues.html

John CL500

Great info over there.....I am a Member of Benzworld also.

maxwerks

THats the most comprehensive list of the ABC saga I have seen thank you

calgary

Jud: It appears to me that you are always blaming the owner or technicians for the problems with the ABC system. I realize the weather and highways in Florida are quite different from most parts of the continent, and this could affect the ABC system. For the number of CLs sold, it appears that a very high number of problems occur. See statistics: 50% no problems, 50% major problems. I have been driving MBs for more than 40 years - more than 10 different models - mostly coupes - the 2001 W215 is the most unreliable that I have owned.

Jud Chapin

Perhaps you are right. I'm only going by what MB techs and service mgrs. tell me, my own experience with my '02 CL, and the description of ABC problems as posted by CL owners in various forums.
As far as the 50% statistics go, I don't know how accurate they are. One thing to keep in mind is that these MB forums are comprised mostly of owners with problems. I've always asked myself that if the ABC system is so bad, why hasn't there been a class action law suit initiated? MB has certainly been in many such law suits, the latest of which is very recent and involves the CL (and S model) and pertains to water intrusion resulting from clog reed valves in the cowling. The valve gets clogged from leaves and other debris allowing water to back up and enter the interior wiping out various electronics, carpet, and other interior parts. It seems to me the reason for no such legal action involving the ABC is there aren't enough claimants ($) to whet the appetite of the legal profession. If anyone here thinks otherwise, contact the legal firm that is handling the reed valve suit. Here's a link:

http://www.topclassactions.com/lawsu...on-settlement-

One last thing. I agree 100% with you that the quality of the MB W215 is lacking and I personally will never buy another Mercedes as a result.

John CL500

I would have to agree with both of you. Never thought about the fact that some forum members are here because of problems.

I truly would like to see some factual statistics of failure rates. See my post from 10.21

https://mbworld.org/forums/cl-class-...ar-models.html

I am concerned about this potential problem with my car. However, I am here to learn more about Mercedes Benz as well as my particular model,

I am committed to do all that I can to ensure I dont have a major ABC problem (i.e. Check Fluid, Inspect hoses, Flush/Fill Fluid, etc.).

That being said, If the failure rate of the ABC system is truly that bad, I am considering selling the vehicle and finding another (more reliable) car. Im not sure that Class Action is the way to go, although I have thought about it.. We all know how long and drawn out that process could be and I personally would rather cut my losses (or in my case gains since I got a tremendous deal on my CL) than fight it out with Corporate America.

John CL500

More research reveals another recent problem.....

http://www.benzworld.org/forums/r230...uck-fully.html

Jud Chapin

What a politician you are, John.

John CL500

Vote for John in your next election!

Arian CL 500

Hello Guys,

I am new to this forum but should certainly mention , THAT ABC is one of the most problematic with this car. in most of the cases u need to replace hydrolic pump but better get it with warranty, SInce i am owner of the workshop i dont pay labour charges so it will cost you around 800 $.

saintz

Guys, you are driving a $100k car with 100k miles. Obviously, stuff breaks. If you want a more reliable car, first don't get one with so many gizmos. A spring and strut suspension is obviously the way to go, but even that would wear out after 100k miles. Second, don't buy a car with 100k miles. If you bought a new C class, you wouldn't have these issues. If you want a 2 ton car to handle like it's on air (and only want to pay $20k for it) you have to live with the engineering tradeoffs and costs associated with a hydraulic suspension (and the maintenance associated with an older car).

You won't buy a Mercedes again because you bought an old, high mile, complex model and something broke? Stuff breaks on every car. If you want reliable, buy a new Toyota. Compared to other cars in the same league as a CL, the CL is a maintenance dream. Do you think people with Ferrari 456s and Aston Martin DB7s have $1k repairs? No, they have $10k repairs, on cars with a tenth the miles. The fact that you can drive a car like this for a few thousand dollars in maintenance is incredible. Most comparable cars will cost 10 to 100 times as much in depreciation and maintenance. An oil change on a Ferrari (or Ferrari powered Maserati) is in the $2k range. That means when nothing is broken, it costs $2k to keep it from not breaking. We should be so lucky to spend $100 on an oil change and $2k on a repair. Again, what we pay in repairs is less than what other high end cars pay in regular maintenance. What we pay in depreciation on 2005 and older cars is nothing compared to other comparable cars.

CL600CK60

While I agree on perspective (pay to play), I feel like MB is not providing service advisories that could keep these complex cars running smoothly. If it costs $5K per 60k miles to maintain, make it "official".


For MB to say that high-pressure hydraulics system does not need maintenance falls nothing short of insulting the intelligence of its customers. Seals, lines, valves, pumps, all mechanical parts working under extreme pressure will break down and will require maintenance or replacement - not the denial mb is serving up in its manual.

Ferrari and Maserati say openly that you will need a new clutch every other day. Porsche is very open about maintenance costs (probably the lowest among luxury brands overall).

With that said, where can I get spaceship-grade hoses and where I can find an abc pump (tandem pump?) at a "normal" price?

240M3SRT

My ABC light came on this morning. First it was the regular color so i pulled over and topped it off, maybe slightly overfull. Came back out and started the car, this time it was the red message and the car handled poorly as a result so i took it into the shop. The only thing i can think of that i did yesterday was filled all the wheels from 30 psi to the 44 rear and 40 front that Brabus recommends.

The service mgr told me that MB is covering ABC failures on some cars with under 100k miles and less than 10 years old. If this is true im very suprised that no one on here knew about this and mentioned it. Anyhow they are diagnosing it so we will see what they find.

saintz

That high tire pressure is probably putting more shock on the ABC system when you hit a bump. Not sure if that is related, but that could cause issues.

In terms of maintenance, there isn't much to do. When the system breaks, you fix it. If you want to do maintenance, the big item would be replacing the accumulators. They are the pressure relief safe guards of the system. Following that, preemptively changing the hoses may save you an unexpected repair, but if your accumulators are good, you are much less likely to pop a hose. My guess is Mercedes doesn't advise preemptively changing hoses because most people would baulk at replacing a part that may or may not break, instead of just replacing it if/when it breaks. Finally, keep the reservoir full.

Anyone who did 5 minutes of research prior to buying one of these cars would know the ABC system can be problematic. It's not like Mercedes is keeping it a secret. They don't know exactly when or what will break, so they can't tell you what it will cost to own. If you want predictable ownership like that, then buy new or CPO with a Mercedes warranty. When you buy out of warranty, you can't expect the car manufacturer to tell you how reliable or expensive your car will be. If you want to buy out of warranty, your cost will be somewhere between zero (me, so far) and $6k (roughly the cost of 4 new struts, new hoses, and new pump) every few years. If you can't live with that variance, buy new or CPO, buy a warranty, or buy virtually any other Mercedes model. If you can live with that, you can drive a supercar for pennies on the dollar.

While Ferrari and Porsche and others advertise high maintenance costs, that is just the beginning. Yes, Ferrari tells you that you will need a $2k oil change and $10k engine out overhaul every X miles. What they don't tell you is that the engine will grenade itself every X miles and will cost well into the 5 figures. Ditto for Porsche. And ditto even for BMW, particularly with the M3 and 335 motors.