Van_CLK430

Hi people i am thinking to tune....modify.....etc...my CLK but i was wondering what kind of Tuning will voild my warranty? Ie. Changing the header,Resonator........cam tuning......etc....custom intake box....or even mod chips? Can someone give me any info. Thanx...I think Ben might know the answer...btw i have installed my Eisenmann exhaust.......installed for 2 weeks now and still warming up the exhaust, in a month time i will post some sound clips up......

P.S i have seen someone custom make an Intake pipe with some japppy flow "mushroom" is it possible to do it with my CLK any instruction??? anyone??? THanx in advance......

Ahmed

who cares about warranty!

just go for it!

Mach430

Any kind not performed by us!

It is illegal for any manufacturer to void the warranty of a product simply because it has aftermarket parts. Those parts MUST be proven as the cause of any problem not covered under warranty.

With that in mind, what do you think exhaust would void? It would void your exhaust (It's hard to cover a part not on the car).

My car with it's suspension, brakes, and Kleemann Supercharger, is still under warranty. If I have a problem with my engine, then my dealer will cover it, because they know that I have a reliable low-boost supercharger which will not hurt it. Most dealers won't be as friendly, but they still can not just say your warranty is void because they see a supercharger on it.

As for chip tuning, some is noticeable, some is not. Again, this would fall into the same situation as above.

Thanks

Ben

karl k

Here we go again...

https://mbworld.org/forums/showthrea...0&pagenumber=3

Drew, Attorney and Forum moderator wrote recently, - precisely on this MOD TOPIC:

Regarding Magg-Moss:
Its true that the burden of proof rests with MB to show the aftermarket product
'caused' the failure to be covered under warranty to happen. However, the
standard MB needs to meet to reach its burden of proof is very low or very ease
to show because its one of a 'preponderance of the evidence' or a showing that
the damage was 'more likely than not' a result of the aftermarket addition. The
introduction of statistical evidence showing the number of non-modified vehicles
with warranty claims for that particular damage VS. warranty claims for 'modified
vehicles' for that particular damage under warranty would likely suffice to meet
the burden. Lots of experts; lots of time; lots of money. Its a pretty good bet
that MB has more of all of the above than you or I.

Its all pretty confusing stuff, and a lawsuit in general, particularly under
Magg-Moss, is something to be avoided at all costs. My 2-cents, if your going to
get any aftermarket modifications done, do as Mach says and get an aftermarket
warranty from a rated, reputable company to cover any damage to OEM and the
aftermarket parts that may be attributable to the aftermarket upgrade.

Regarding Insurance/Liability:

While I do think Karl is reaching a bit when he asks about the potential liability
arising from tuning-up your MB ... there are cases similar enough to infer support
on his point:

For Instance: Many people have been involved in shootings in self defense. On
the surface, they appear to have justifiably used deadly force in defense of
imminent danger of death or grave bodily harm (the standard for use of deadly
force in almost every single State in the US). However, once the prosecutor got
a look at the gun they used while defending themselves, the prosecutor noticed
that the owner had some action work done to the gun to make it fire more
quickly; and some ejection-port work done to let the spent casings eject more
quickly to let a new round chamber faster; and even had the rough edges on the
outside of the gun honed-down to make the gun easier to pull out quickly and fire
fast ... they've gotten jammed-up with involuntary manslaugher charges as a
result, instead of getting a medal for their actions as they should have.

Usually, its the actions and intentions of the actor that make him liable or not.
Any good attorney can make an effective circumstantial case around
modifications done to an instrument used as a deadly weapon (intentionally or
not) to infer negligent or reckless behavior on the part of the actor. Whether the
argument is successful or not really depends on how good 'the other' lawyer is.

Regarding Insurance/Property Damage Coverage:

My policy with State Farm specifically 'excludes' coverage for any aftermarket
products damaged or lost as a result of a casualty (covered accident). So, if I
wanted a Kleemann upgrade (or an aftermarket DVD/GPS/TV unit) to be covered
under MY particular property damage policy, I would have to schedule it, and pay
a higher premium, or find a way for the item to be covered under my homeowners
policy.

Ask your insurance agent about the particulars of your policy for answers to your
questions regarding this issue.

That's my 2-cents guys ... for what its worth.

Regards,

__________________

Drew
MBworld Moderator

Van_CLK430

But since this is for US how about for Canada. I have asked my service advisor and he told me anything mods on "things" that is connected to my car will void the warrenty......i mean if i change the cat of cam of my car........the car broke down...engine lights on....etc etc.....MB will not fix it under warrenty they may fix it for me but i will have to pay them big bucks. Is that true? In Canada we do not have a 3rd party warrenty/insurence company that can just insured my parts. It was monopoly by 1 company in my provience. So what can i do if i wanna mod my car for more HP? Do i need to wait until the warrenty ends? and also will changing the ECU void everything? Can i took the ECU out put the regular back in if i am going back to ie. B service? Thanx for all your help

karl k

The solution is inherent in the problem. If you understand the problem, you have the solution.

Ted Baldwin

..............Does anyone have the actual reference to the law regarding this issue. Secondly, can MB refuse to do the regularly scheduled mentainance if there is nothing wrong your car and you have installed a spercharger?

Ted

Newbie

To repeat the answer that has been given dozens of times before:

NO.

Mach430

To answer your question regarding servicing, my dealer loves when I bring my car in for anything! 15 miles to replace a door hinge! And yes, my car is COMPLETLY serviceable.

You can read about the Moss-Magnusson Act here:
Moss-Magnusson Act

karl k

Here is what my favorite Law firm - Click & Clack - has to say on the subject re Magnusson Moss act:

quote:

Dear Tom and Ray:

I am writing in response to a recent letter from the owner of a Dodge Dakota who wanted to add some performance parts to his vehicle:

A K&N air filter, Flowmaster exhaust, performance chip, high-performance plugs, wires, cap and rotor.

Your response was that if he added any of those parts it would void his warranty.

Not only is that untrue, but it is illegal for a warranty to be voided just because an aftermarket part was added to the vehicle. I have enclosed sections of the federal Magnusson-Moss Warranty Act for your edification. -- Cathy

Tom:
We have to stand by our advice, Cathy. The Magnusson-Moss Act says that a manufacturer may not deny warranty coverage solely because a customer has used an aftermarket part.

Ray:
But if the manufacturer determines that the aftermarket part is in some way responsible for the mechanical problem, it absolutely CAN void the warranty. And many of the performance parts this guy wanted to install certainly could be blamed for future mechanical problems.

Tom:
The Magnusson-Moss Act is meant to protect a guy who goes to the Poky Lube down the street and gets a Fram filter instead of a "genuine Dodge filter." In that case, the Dodge dealer can't refuse to fix the engine because the guy used another brand of filter that meets the exact same specifications.

Ray:
But if a guy puts on a free-flow exhaust that lowers the exhaust system's back pressure, and then asks the dealer to fix his burnt valves under warranty, the dealer could certainly point to the modified exhaust system and refuse to cover it.

Tom:
The same is true if a guy puts on a set of humongous wheels and then tries to make a warranty claim for worn-out wheel bearings.

Ray:
In cases like those, the manufacturer would have every justification for denying warranty coverage on those affected parts.

Tom:
Sure, you can always argue with the dealer, but you'll probably have to take it to court to get satisfaction. And believe me, neither Mr. Magnusson nor Mr. Moss is going to show up in small claims court to help you plead your case. And the dealer may very well win.

Ray:
So we think avoiding "high-performance" parts on a new car is generally good advice, Cathy. And we're sticking with it.

http://cartalk.cars.com/Columns/Arch...0/July/04.html

Mach430

Further, regarding the scheduled maintenance. Everything that needs to be serviced at your regular services is left untouched, and COMPLETELY serviceable by the dealer. Likewise, you could change your oil just as you would prior to the supercharger. Warranty would have no conflict here as it is a service, not a debate over who covers what. The only part I wouldn't allow the dealer to service would be the SC, simply because the dealer is not authorized by Kleemann to do so. Mr. Magnusson and Mr. Moss would have no need to be involved here.

Thanks

Ben

awiner

The short and easy answer to this question....

If you modify something you are taking the chance for problems. Wheather right or wrong if you get to the point of mediation due to the Magnuson-Moss Act, you have already lost.

On the other hand, it's you car... Enjoy... I soon may be adding a Kleemann Supercharger to my car... I NEED horsepower.. 500 + hp ! Wheeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee.

otoupalik

I agree with Adam 100% on the point that if you have to sue you have lost.

HOWEVER ....

In my experience with my cars and with over 5000 customers (and as an attorney), the simply words alone are enough to make ALL service managers or regional reps back down. Sure, the local Joe Schmoe might not know WTF it means and stick to his "no warranty" guns, but when you escalate a little, the 'boss' does know. Trust me when I say that the 'boss' will do whatever it takes to make you happy! There have been too many lawsuits over warranty issues and failures that have cost the manufactures way too much $$$ that they will take care of you as it is cheaper, easier and less note-worthy for the media to do so.

This is NOT theoretical, but this is my actual experience with MB and BMW dealers all over the US. It is easy to talk about hypotheticals, but it is far more helpful to deal in reality!

Thanks

Brad

karl k

Under the mfrs. warranty, you have rights under your state's LEMON LAW (don't know about Alberta, Canada).

MODs may void your rights under the LEMON LAW in Florida:

What types of defects are covered?

It covers defects that substantially impair the use, safety, or market value of the vehicle, and that are not the result of an accident, abuse, neglect,

or unauthorized modifications or alterations you may have made to the vehicle.


Check your lemon law by state:

http://cartalk.cars.com/Tools/lemon-states.pl