Diesel Particulate Filter (DPF): When should we replace?
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1989 Toyota Tercel EZ - dyno'd @ 70whp/77wtq
Diesel Particulate Filter (DPF): When should we replace?
Hi,
I have 2008 GL320CDI with approx. 72K miles that I bought CERTIFIED ~1.5 years and 27K miles ago.
The car was sluggish occassionally and the stealership finally told me that my Diesel Particulate Filter (DPF) needs to be replaced. And the part cost...
$3900
And the worst thing is the warranty doesn't cover it.
So my questions:
1. Is it normal to have DPF failed at this mileage?
2. Is it true that MB extended warranty doesn't cover this?
3. Given the car was "recently" purchased as CERTIFIED, would I have a case to complain to MBUSA?
Any directions is greatly appreciated.
Thanks.
I have 2008 GL320CDI with approx. 72K miles that I bought CERTIFIED ~1.5 years and 27K miles ago.
The car was sluggish occassionally and the stealership finally told me that my Diesel Particulate Filter (DPF) needs to be replaced. And the part cost...
$3900
And the worst thing is the warranty doesn't cover it.
So my questions:
1. Is it normal to have DPF failed at this mileage?
2. Is it true that MB extended warranty doesn't cover this?
3. Given the car was "recently" purchased as CERTIFIED, would I have a case to complain to MBUSA?
Any directions is greatly appreciated.
Thanks.
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Are you sure about the price ?
I Goggled " Diesel Particulate Filter " and it seems like this part should not cost more than $300-$400. Have you tried to call to another dealer or independent shop?
I just bought GL and waiting for my car to arrive on Saturday, but if it's true - I will sell it before my factory warranty expires in 4 years. It's ridiculous price.
Good Luck.
P.S. here is the interesting info about DPF
http://www.epa.gov/cleandiesel/documents/420f03017.pdf
I think I was wrong about the price, but it seems like this thing can be cleaned. Why change ?
I Goggled " Diesel Particulate Filter " and it seems like this part should not cost more than $300-$400. Have you tried to call to another dealer or independent shop?
I just bought GL and waiting for my car to arrive on Saturday, but if it's true - I will sell it before my factory warranty expires in 4 years. It's ridiculous price.
Good Luck.
P.S. here is the interesting info about DPF
http://www.epa.gov/cleandiesel/documents/420f03017.pdf
I think I was wrong about the price, but it seems like this thing can be cleaned. Why change ?
Last edited by aeggroup; Apr 5, 2011 at 01:52 PM.
Thread Starter
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1989 Toyota Tercel EZ - dyno'd @ 70whp/77wtq
Thanks... Yeah, if I need to shell $4K+ for this crap, I will certainly sell this POS. FYI, it is NOT covered under warranty - at least according to my SA - so having a warranty or not, doesn't really matter. If this fails and you want to have it repaired, you need to pay
I just sent an email to MBUSA to confirm that:
1. It is normal to have DPF failed at 72K miles (the doc you linked above suggests that it only requires cleaning at 100K miles)
2. It is not covered under warranty - if I need to pay out of pocket, it will really upset me as CPO means crap.
3. The price is really that high. I will certainly check with indy shop and see whether I could get it cheaper.
I just sent an email to MBUSA to confirm that:
1. It is normal to have DPF failed at 72K miles (the doc you linked above suggests that it only requires cleaning at 100K miles)
2. It is not covered under warranty - if I need to pay out of pocket, it will really upset me as CPO means crap.
3. The price is really that high. I will certainly check with indy shop and see whether I could get it cheaper.
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'10 CL550, '12 GL550
NO warranty covers wear items. NO warranty covers filters.
If you'll check your warranty booklet, you'll find the DPF was fully covered until 2yrs/24K miles. This obviously for manufacturing defects.
The Cat converter--by Federal mandate--is warranted for 8 yrs/80K miles, but clearly the Feds don't mandate the same for the DPF. They are two different things, of course.
Oh, and guess again regarding finding an aftermarket DPF. aintgonnahappen.com
The Mercedes part number is 164 490 14 92 and MSRP is $3050.00 and you can get one (pre-freight) for $2287.50 from this dealer selling online
https://www.getmercedesparts.com/oem...des-parts.html
There are various lines that connect to this thing to fuel it, etc., and they could require replacement as well.
EPC contains footnote for this item reading "part is only or also supplied as reconditioned part" so may want to verify this with parts people. I don't find it in the online reman parts catalog, but that doesn't necessarily mean much.
Best bet may be to discuss with an independent Mercedes mechanic. By this, I mean a guy that has VERY RECENT dealership experience. Only. STAR Diagnosis equipment is required to reset CDI control unit when DPF is replaced.
Now, I've seen little on forums regarding anyone else requiring this be replaced. It is, of course, also possible through "user error" to ruin one. Must be ULSD fuel, no more than B5 biodiesel, and correct motor oil (always). Sticker under hood of mine says don't even add a quart of oil between changes that isn't the correct, i.e. low ash oil.
If you'll check your warranty booklet, you'll find the DPF was fully covered until 2yrs/24K miles. This obviously for manufacturing defects.
The Cat converter--by Federal mandate--is warranted for 8 yrs/80K miles, but clearly the Feds don't mandate the same for the DPF. They are two different things, of course.
Oh, and guess again regarding finding an aftermarket DPF. aintgonnahappen.com
The Mercedes part number is 164 490 14 92 and MSRP is $3050.00 and you can get one (pre-freight) for $2287.50 from this dealer selling online
https://www.getmercedesparts.com/oem...des-parts.html
There are various lines that connect to this thing to fuel it, etc., and they could require replacement as well.
EPC contains footnote for this item reading "part is only or also supplied as reconditioned part" so may want to verify this with parts people. I don't find it in the online reman parts catalog, but that doesn't necessarily mean much.
Best bet may be to discuss with an independent Mercedes mechanic. By this, I mean a guy that has VERY RECENT dealership experience. Only. STAR Diagnosis equipment is required to reset CDI control unit when DPF is replaced.
Now, I've seen little on forums regarding anyone else requiring this be replaced. It is, of course, also possible through "user error" to ruin one. Must be ULSD fuel, no more than B5 biodiesel, and correct motor oil (always). Sticker under hood of mine says don't even add a quart of oil between changes that isn't the correct, i.e. low ash oil.
Last edited by lkchris; Apr 5, 2011 at 06:33 PM.
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From: NW corner of CONUS
2008 GL 320 CDI, 2004 VW V10 Touareg TDI
Very unusual for a DPF to require replacement. Usually they can only be messed up from dirty fuel that contaminates the catalyst - typically sulfur. Adds a whole new new meaning to the 'buy clean fuel -KEEP IT CLEAN' mantra!
If the dealer certified it, then you MIGHT be able to argue that most of the contamination existed when you bought, but you better be able to PROVE that ALL the fuel you bought came from impeccable sources, was ALWAYS ULSD, etc, etc.
If the dealer certified it, then you MIGHT be able to argue that most of the contamination existed when you bought, but you better be able to PROVE that ALL the fuel you bought came from impeccable sources, was ALWAYS ULSD, etc, etc.
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From: Woodstock, IL
His 2019 RAM Cummins Turbo Diesel Laramie; Her's 2007 ML320 CDI P3; Mine BMW R1200R
I would think if your DPF failed you should have a check engine light?
Never heard of one failing, and these things are used worldwide in taxis etc. I am sure if they were prone to failure at 70K miles, there would be a lot of postings on forums or the media etc., especially at $4000 a pop. I have over 87000 miles on mine.
From all my research, all I can say that will cause premature failure is Low Sulfur Diesel. No one sell that anymore, as everything is mandated to be ULSD. If the DPF is the cause of your sluggishness, make sure you didn't get a bad tank of fuel from somewhere.
I would say try a different dealer to see what is causing your issues. Bad turbo or vane controller maybe?
Never heard of one failing, and these things are used worldwide in taxis etc. I am sure if they were prone to failure at 70K miles, there would be a lot of postings on forums or the media etc., especially at $4000 a pop. I have over 87000 miles on mine.
From all my research, all I can say that will cause premature failure is Low Sulfur Diesel. No one sell that anymore, as everything is mandated to be ULSD. If the DPF is the cause of your sluggishness, make sure you didn't get a bad tank of fuel from somewhere.
I would say try a different dealer to see what is causing your issues. Bad turbo or vane controller maybe?
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From: Canada
GLK350, GL320CDI
Sounds like previous owner was using home made diesel fuel.
This part should really last long.
Maybe you took some bad fuel somewhere.
Low ash oil is very important as well.
Do you have Shell POWER DIESEL there?
Fuel quality does really matter.
How does the stealership knows it is this whole part and not just one component from it?
Please explain slugish occasionally.
No error lights on the dashboard?
Try to empty the tank as much you can fill up with good fuel and take it on the highway for nice long spin to clean it up.
Check fuel filter as well.
After an service in the stealership my car would smoke on the highway in long trip it was cleaning dfp filter apparently. Truckers were calling me on my radio. It would smoke for couple km's and after that nothing.
Maybe your system didn't clean itself or service was not done at the dealership before.
Many issues could cause this problem.
This part should really last long.
Maybe you took some bad fuel somewhere.
Low ash oil is very important as well.
Do you have Shell POWER DIESEL there?
Fuel quality does really matter.
How does the stealership knows it is this whole part and not just one component from it?
Please explain slugish occasionally.
No error lights on the dashboard?
Try to empty the tank as much you can fill up with good fuel and take it on the highway for nice long spin to clean it up.
Check fuel filter as well.
After an service in the stealership my car would smoke on the highway in long trip it was cleaning dfp filter apparently. Truckers were calling me on my radio. It would smoke for couple km's and after that nothing.
Maybe your system didn't clean itself or service was not done at the dealership before.
Many issues could cause this problem.
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S65
Why not just get a tuning company to turn off the DPF functions, then remove it till you sell the vehicle?
It would be a lot cheaper and the motor will be happier. Now, I don't know what sort of emissions testing you have up there, so this may not work for you unless you just gut the filter guts and reinstall it, to make it look like it's still on, should they do a visual inspection.
It would be a lot cheaper and the motor will be happier. Now, I don't know what sort of emissions testing you have up there, so this may not work for you unless you just gut the filter guts and reinstall it, to make it look like it's still on, should they do a visual inspection.
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e320 Wgn. 98, 08 R320 CDI, 2017 Chrysler Pacifica
DPF cleaning
As a recent purchaser of the R320 with the same DPF in the motor, your post is really scary. Have you checked into getting the DPF cleaned? There are a number of vendors who offer this service, such as: http://www.fsxinc.com/site1/Services/FltCleanPgm.html
good luck & keep us posted.
good luck & keep us posted.
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From: New Jersey
things with and without wheels
Dpf fliters will load up more often if you do a lot of idling or stop and go traffic, try driving it on the highway(60 mph +-) for at least a half hour, that should generate enough heat to burn off the soot and clear itself.
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From: 1 hours drive north of Sydney Australia
2007 W204 220CDI Classic Sedan
I understood that when the differential pressure across the DFP increased to a certain point the engine went into DFP cleaning mode & gave a richer mixture to burn off the carbon & clean the unit.
Can you check check if this mode is happening ?.
$3900 sounds crazy.
I am glad I don't have one & will put up with washing the soot of the rear of the car every 3000 km.
Can you check check if this mode is happening ?.
$3900 sounds crazy.
I am glad I don't have one & will put up with washing the soot of the rear of the car every 3000 km.
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2012 S350 Bluetec 4Matic, Diamond White, P2
Agreed. Also, try to keep the RPMs up too. If the "clean mode" was not being triggered, this would certainly generate a code.
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S65
I really am surprised no one's yanked their DPF out from under their vehicle.
I don't know about the GL's, but on other manufacturers' diesels, the vehicle sees an instant 2 to 3 mpg fuel economy increase.
Only down side is finding a tuning company that can turn the DPF functions off in the ECU.
And in case this gets read by a leaf licker, please, don't even start with the whole Global Warming/climate change bs.
Now, of course, this modification should only be done for an off road vehicle only.
I don't know about the GL's, but on other manufacturers' diesels, the vehicle sees an instant 2 to 3 mpg fuel economy increase.
Only down side is finding a tuning company that can turn the DPF functions off in the ECU.
And in case this gets read by a leaf licker, please, don't even start with the whole Global Warming/climate change bs.
Now, of course, this modification should only be done for an off road vehicle only.
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From: Toronto, Canada
2005 E320 CDI (sold); 2007 R320 CDI (sold); 2008 ML320 CDI; 2014 ML350 Bluetec
If you find somebody in Canada who can relief me 4k $ service, I'm willing to risk that my computer is not going like it
It's all about if it can be disabled through STAR but I don't think it's illegal (illegal is everything related to safety to car, isn't it ?)
A
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S65
In the US, it's illegal because of the Clean Air Act our leaf lickers friends who work for the EPA came up with.
I believe that every diesel engine placed into a road worthy automobile is required to have a DPF installed, as of 2007 or 2008. Sure, lots of older diesels don't have DPF's but none that didn't come with one after 07 or 08.
Problem is that without turning off the DPF functions in the computer, you will get CELs and the vehicle will run like crud. Not to mention the extra fuel that you would still be burning.
Section 203 (a)(3)(b) of the Clean Air Act
(CAA), 42 U.S.C. Sec. 7522(a)(3)(b), prohib*
its the manufacture, selling, or installation of
any device that bypasses, defeats, or renders
inoperative a required element of the vehicle’s
emissions control system.
Section 203 (a)(1) of the same Act also pro*
hibits the sale of motor vehicles or engines that
are not covered by valid certificates of con*
formity.
40 CFR Part 86, Subpart A describes the
regulatory requirements for defeat devices
I believe that every diesel engine placed into a road worthy automobile is required to have a DPF installed, as of 2007 or 2008. Sure, lots of older diesels don't have DPF's but none that didn't come with one after 07 or 08.
Problem is that without turning off the DPF functions in the computer, you will get CELs and the vehicle will run like crud. Not to mention the extra fuel that you would still be burning.
Section 203 (a)(3)(b) of the Clean Air Act
(CAA), 42 U.S.C. Sec. 7522(a)(3)(b), prohib*
its the manufacture, selling, or installation of
any device that bypasses, defeats, or renders
inoperative a required element of the vehicle’s
emissions control system.
Section 203 (a)(1) of the same Act also pro*
hibits the sale of motor vehicles or engines that
are not covered by valid certificates of con*
formity.
40 CFR Part 86, Subpart A describes the
regulatory requirements for defeat devices
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GLK350, GL320CDI
Take it on the highway road trip it will clean it up and trigger the cleaning process.
I was that it needs some time to do. It won't trigger in short city driving.
It should trigger after service done or close to service interval.
Happen to me all the time.
I was that it needs some time to do. It won't trigger in short city driving.
It should trigger after service done or close to service interval.
Happen to me all the time.
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W212 M276 DELA 30 ; W211 M113k, W126 M117, W126 OM617, W211 OM642 ; R107 M117 X2, Sierra 1500 LZ0
How can you tell it's triggered? I commute 20 miles each way every weekday, at an average speed of around 60-70. I'd say 75% of my miles are put on that way, so I'm guessing mine is very unlikely to get clogged anytime soon?
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things with and without wheels
Wow, Why I didnt think of that?
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things with and without wheels
It will not tell you if it's doing it's job, it will only tell you if it can't.
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2012 S350 Bluetec 4Matic, Diamond White, P2
This is not exactly the case. Most Taxis are strictly in-town rides, and, as someone posted above, if the DPF was prone to failure, there would likely be thousands of cases posted. The cleaning is triggered by pressure differences that occur as the filter starts to clog. When the pressure differential triggers the cleaning cycle, the engine switches to a "richer" fuel mixture which literally burns the particulates out of the filter. The filter should be maintenance free. I would recommend to the OP to get a second opinion. A mass air sensor will also cause the symptoms described and these are fairly simple and inexpensive to replace.
