Went to Lexus and MB today...
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From: Naples, FL
2025 AMG CLE53, 2025 Range Rover P550E, 2025 Ford F150 Raptor
Originally Posted by zam2000
At least 1/2 of the car in the lot are the C, cost not much than a Camry XLE, and drive like a piece of crap (and feel so too).
Ouch!
Geez, So I guess since I drive 2 Dodges as our daily drivers (my wife is migrating towards the E more and more
), we are lowlife scum who need to change our oil in the parking lot of Walmart, huh? I'm contemplating purchasing a C class in a few years, driving it for 5 and then giving it to my daughter as a graduation present. Relax, every car dealer makes top o' the line and bottom o' the line autos. Same thing with wines, beers, steak, riding lawnmowers (got one of those too...what do you think about John Deere's...how do they ride?).
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From: THE NAPA VALLEY, CA
Build date 2-04 E500
Originally Posted by CE750
well said Zam... I love many things, including my wife and Kids.. but I'll be the first to say that my wife could lose a few pounds
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2005 C320wz
Originally Posted by PHXATC
Ouch!
Geez, So I guess since I drive 2 Dodges as our daily drivers (my wife is migrating towards the E more and more ), we are lowlife scum who need to change our oil in the parking lot of Walmart, huh? I'm contemplating purchasing a C class in a few years, driving it for 5 and then giving it to my daughter as a graduation present.
Relax, every car dealer makes top o' the line and bottom o' the line autos. Same thing with wines, beers, steak, riding lawnmowers (got one of those too...what do you think about John Deere's...how do they ride?).
Geez, So I guess since I drive 2 Dodges as our daily drivers (my wife is migrating towards the E more and more
), we are lowlife scum who need to change our oil in the parking lot of Walmart, huh? I'm contemplating purchasing a C class in a few years, driving it for 5 and then giving it to my daughter as a graduation present. Relax, every car dealer makes top o' the line and bottom o' the line autos. Same thing with wines, beers, steak, riding lawnmowers (got one of those too...what do you think about John Deere's...how do they ride?).
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From: FL410
'05 E320 CDI, '08 BMW X5 4.8i, '11 Duramax 2500HD
Originally Posted by HELL ONA HARLEY
Yea.... Talk is cheap on the puter... I would love to be there when you inform her of your findings...
. though she's not quite as defensive as some of you in the MB cheering squad when someone finds a short coming in our lovely E. 
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From: FL410
'05 E320 CDI, '08 BMW X5 4.8i, '11 Duramax 2500HD
Actually for a $30K car, the C is the best Benz for the buck out there... It's the $53K + E that's been the victim of the cost cutters at DC... I just read of a $4.95 rubber mat that no longer comes with the E as of 2005. I've said it before, and I'll say it again.. I would have been more than happy to have them tack on a 10% to the MSRP if I didn't have to get stuck with Vinyl seats in the back of my car, and a **** poor radio that I have to pay $2000 to upgrade now. My fault ultimately for assuming the E was a premium sedan comparable to similar priced Lexus, Audi, etc in standard equipment.
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From: THE NAPA VALLEY, CA
Build date 2-04 E500
Originally Posted by CE750
though she's not quite as defensive as some of you in the MB cheering squad when someone finds a short coming in our lovely E.
Short comings???? Sorry not my car. Its been a near perfect experience. Of coarse your probably talking about something you didn't get standard in your car and didn't realize it until you got home (due to lack of homework).... and then came here and joined this forum (after) you bought your car to complain about it....
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From: FL410
'05 E320 CDI, '08 BMW X5 4.8i, '11 Duramax 2500HD
Originally Posted by HELL ONA HARLEY
Short comings???? Sorry not my car. Its been a near perfect experience. Of coarse your probably talking about something you didn't get standard in your car and didn't realize it until you got home (due to lack of homework).... and then came here and joined this forum (after) you bought your car to complain about it....
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From: THE NAPA VALLEY, CA
Build date 2-04 E500
Yes Sam..... Your posts about the short comings of your car are what make this nation (USA) so great..... You can blindly go in a dealership and plop down 60+K on a car that you did no research or comparisons on, take it home to see that its not what you expected, then join a forum to cry about it...... Go USA, Go......
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From: FL410
'05 E320 CDI, '08 BMW X5 4.8i, '11 Duramax 2500HD
the point I think that is more important than whether I was bright enough to study the car as diligently as you, is the FACT that the car has those short comings, and my knowing about them before plopping down the cash wouldn't have changed any of that one bit.
There is a large plurality on this forum who seem to agree with me that $55K sticker cars shouldn't come with vinyl seats.. as to whether I did research on that.. go to the MBUSA.com site and the vehicle comparison, and tell me if they state that the seats are MBTEX in the CDI vs. comparison? Furthermore, go into, or call one of 100 dealers across the nation (I called 6 to confirm my suspicion) and see how many of them know that MB removed the leather inserts from the rear seats of the E class as standard in 2005... 0 of 5 knew it, when I called, they all said that it was leather inserts front and back as standard, and for an extra $1500 you get leather full seating, and door trim, which I saw no need for if I was getting the surfaces (which I wasn't in the rear!).
So, lets take a look at the facts.. MBUSA.com say's it's leather, the salesman says it's leather... but guess what? It's not.. Should I not "Cry" about that?
At what point will you just admit that MB is cutting costs where they shouldn't be.
I am paying Steve (MBenzNL) to add the HK stereo, and park assist (which I didn't see on any CDI's at the time I bought).. as well as folding mirrors.. So it's not like I didn't have the extra $6000 cash for those upgrades. It's that I was misled by a combination of my blindness to the 3-pointed start mark, and the misinformation on the MBUSA website and at the dealer.
...
There is a large plurality on this forum who seem to agree with me that $55K sticker cars shouldn't come with vinyl seats.. as to whether I did research on that.. go to the MBUSA.com site and the vehicle comparison, and tell me if they state that the seats are MBTEX in the CDI vs. comparison? Furthermore, go into, or call one of 100 dealers across the nation (I called 6 to confirm my suspicion) and see how many of them know that MB removed the leather inserts from the rear seats of the E class as standard in 2005... 0 of 5 knew it, when I called, they all said that it was leather inserts front and back as standard, and for an extra $1500 you get leather full seating, and door trim, which I saw no need for if I was getting the surfaces (which I wasn't in the rear!).
So, lets take a look at the facts.. MBUSA.com say's it's leather, the salesman says it's leather... but guess what? It's not.. Should I not "Cry" about that?
At what point will you just admit that MB is cutting costs where they shouldn't be.
I am paying Steve (MBenzNL) to add the HK stereo, and park assist (which I didn't see on any CDI's at the time I bought).. as well as folding mirrors.. So it's not like I didn't have the extra $6000 cash for those upgrades. It's that I was misled by a combination of my blindness to the 3-pointed start mark, and the misinformation on the MBUSA website and at the dealer.
...
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From: THE NAPA VALLEY, CA
Build date 2-04 E500
Originally Posted by CE750
the point I think that is more important than whether I was bright enough to study the car as diligently as you, is the FACT that the car has those short comings, and my knowing about them before plopping down the cash wouldn't have changed any of that one bit.
There is a large plurality on this forum who seem to agree with me that $55K sticker cars shouldn't come with vinyl seats.. as to whether I did research on that.. go to the MBUSA.com site and the vehicle comparison, and tell me if they state that the seats are MBTEX in the CDI vs. comparison? Furthermore, go into, or call one of 100 dealers across the nation (I called 6 to confirm my suspicion) and see how many of them know that MB removed the leather inserts from the rear seats of the E class as standard in 2005... 0 of 5 knew it, when I called, they all said that it was leather inserts front and back as standard, and for an extra $1500 you get leather full seating, and door trim, which I saw no need for if I was getting the surfaces (which I wasn't in the rear!).
So, lets take a look at the facts.. MBUSA.com say's it's leather, the salesman says it's leather... but guess what? It's not.. Should I not "Cry" about that?
At what point will you just admit that MB is cutting costs where they shouldn't be.
I am paying Steve (MBenzNL) to add the HK stereo, and park assist (which I didn't see on any CDI's at the time I bought).. as well as folding mirrors.. So it's not like I didn't have the extra $6000 cash for those upgrades. It's that I was misled by a combination of my blindness to the 3-pointed start mark, and the misinformation on the MBUSA website and at the dealer.
...
There is a large plurality on this forum who seem to agree with me that $55K sticker cars shouldn't come with vinyl seats.. as to whether I did research on that.. go to the MBUSA.com site and the vehicle comparison, and tell me if they state that the seats are MBTEX in the CDI vs. comparison? Furthermore, go into, or call one of 100 dealers across the nation (I called 6 to confirm my suspicion) and see how many of them know that MB removed the leather inserts from the rear seats of the E class as standard in 2005... 0 of 5 knew it, when I called, they all said that it was leather inserts front and back as standard, and for an extra $1500 you get leather full seating, and door trim, which I saw no need for if I was getting the surfaces (which I wasn't in the rear!).
So, lets take a look at the facts.. MBUSA.com say's it's leather, the salesman says it's leather... but guess what? It's not.. Should I not "Cry" about that?
At what point will you just admit that MB is cutting costs where they shouldn't be.
I am paying Steve (MBenzNL) to add the HK stereo, and park assist (which I didn't see on any CDI's at the time I bought).. as well as folding mirrors.. So it's not like I didn't have the extra $6000 cash for those upgrades. It's that I was misled by a combination of my blindness to the 3-pointed start mark, and the misinformation on the MBUSA website and at the dealer.
...
You may be correct on all points about the short comings on YOUR car.....My car shows no decontenting of any kind, But the fact is YOU have two eyes and a brain. If you didn't like what you saw you in your car you could've simply walked away as I did when my first car (ordered) didn't come in with "active" xenon lights... I mean did you not look at the car before driving away???? Did the salesman have the death grip on you???? I guess my point is why cry AFTER the fact????? Suck it up and admit you made a mistake and sell it if you hate your car so much. After-all, this is a free country.... If you think the car has short comings DON"T BUY IT......
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From: FL410
'05 E320 CDI, '08 BMW X5 4.8i, '11 Duramax 2500HD
Originally Posted by HELL ONA HARLEY
You may be correct on all points about the short comings on YOUR car.....My car shows no decontenting of any kind, But the fact is YOU have two eyes and a brain. If you didn't like what you saw you in your car you could've simply walked away as I did when my first car (ordered) didn't come in with "active" xenon lights... I mean did you not look at the car before driving away???? Did the salesman have the death grip on you???? I guess my point is why cry AFTER the fact????? Suck it up and admit you made a mistake and sell it if you hate your car so much. After-all, this is a free country.... If you think the car has short comings DON"T BUY IT......
The fact that you spend the extra $5000 on a 500 means you didn't have to deal with that since you get standard full leather on that car. The stereo without RDS, and volume control is on both of our cars, but you apparently don't care about the latest technology that's avaliable on even $20,000 Honda's, or Xenon's that are standard on a $40K Infiniti, etc.. and lastly... I still like my car enough to overlook these items until I sell it (at some point to be determined).. I like it because I love that diesel engine, and I love the safety engineering, I added the Xenons, and in the process of adding HK, folding mirrors (like was standard on my Volvo) and park-assist... BUT THAT DOESN'T MEAN I CANNOT COMPLAIN ABOUT VYNIL SEATS that were sold to me as LEATHER! GET IT? Please, please.. say yes!
Do you work for MBUSA? common, now.. be honest! Cause you sure love the flavor of their Koolaid!
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From: USA
Multiple
Originally Posted by CE750
There is a large plurality on this forum who seem to agree with me that $55K sticker cars shouldn't come with vinyl seats.. as to whether I did research on that.. go to the MBUSA.com site and the vehicle comparison, and tell me if they state that the seats are MBTEX...At what point will you just admit that MB is cutting costs where they shouldn't be...It's that I was misled by a combination of my blindness to the 3-pointed start mark, and the misinformation on the MBUSA website and at the dealer....
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From: SF Bay Area, CA
11 W212 E350 Sport, sold 06 W211 E350
Ah, but the tradeoff in a Lexus LS is a very boxy, generic looking car, that has no zip in its design and drives like a sofa. You could get an even cheaper car by buying the new Avalon and it rates almost as highly as the LS and is certainly a better value pound for pound and option for option. My point is panache, design, desireability and value are in the eye of the beholder and desirability and design account for more than the most features for the lowest price.
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I dunno, have you seen the mild facelift after 2004? It just looks hella nice, and I wouldn't say at all it's boxy or generic. If I turn on sport mode on the air suspension that never fails... it turns in as well as my X5, and that's saying quite a lot.
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was '03 E320 - now - '04 S4
I thought the C320 I had as a loaner a few times was a pretty nice car to drive. It had a better steering feel and brake feel than my E320.
My dealer (Phil Smart) in Seattle has free coffee, a nice waiting area and has always taken good care of me.
Richard Hull is a great Service Advisor - I would definitely recommend him to anyone in the area.
Bellevue Lexus has been good to deal with as well.
So far University Audi has been great as well. The shop foreman was driving/diagnosing a goofy sound within 10 minutes of my arrival (and I had called them about the sound only 30 minutes prior to that! ) Very impressive, IMO.
My dealer (Phil Smart) in Seattle has free coffee, a nice waiting area and has always taken good care of me.
Richard Hull is a great Service Advisor - I would definitely recommend him to anyone in the area.
Bellevue Lexus has been good to deal with as well.
So far University Audi has been great as well. The shop foreman was driving/diagnosing a goofy sound within 10 minutes of my arrival (and I had called them about the sound only 30 minutes prior to that! ) Very impressive, IMO.
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From: OC
AMG E55, Stage 1, Strait Pipe from Primary Cats
Originally Posted by Brian McL
.....it seems to me that the kraut in my diet has been giving me the ****s for quite awhile.... time to change to something a little easier to swallow.
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Originally Posted by zam2000
FJ in Newport Beach is not different than a cheap GM dealer. At any morning, you have a long line of cheapo who willing to wait for couple hours to have a free car wash. Sitting in the waiting room and act as if they belong to an exclusive club in society. The amount of car in the lot waiting for service or car lot is like a college parking lot in Monday morning: a big mess. At least 1/2 of the car in the lot are the C, cost not much than a Camry XLE, and drive like a piece of crap (and feel so too).
I bought cars at Fletcher Jones and you're right they do have a elegant facade. On the surface they look very elegant but the masses of cheap asses getting their car washed is really annoying. Plus, they do a terrible job I think they just hose it down and wipe it partially dry. They half *** their service as well, everytime I go there to get something repaired I often always have to go back for a second time to get it fix correctly. I try to find mid size dealers for warranty fixes such as Penske in West Covina, which is closer to my work to do a better job and for better service.
Originally Posted by zam2000
Part of the "owning experice" is the service at dealer, beside the driving & quality of the car. I don't see anything wrong w/ having lousy service, and have to kiss it up just because it's a Mercedes dealer.
That's why I prefer buying BMWs I seem to have a better experience with their dealers and services. Its probably all about location. :p
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Originally Posted by MB-JIM
Drive a 2006 C350 and it will change your mind about the C Class. It is one fine automobile.
For $40K it better be... but we can leave that discussing for the C class forum.
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kitty litter
The proof is in the pudding....and only time will tell. MB has lost most all of it's hard won decades of reliability over the last 10 years. Do you really think they are going to turn it around in one model year....do you ? The last two E class cars I bought I thought, "well, maybe this time it'll be like the OLDE days" NOT!!!! These cars have become a cross between the pathetic Cadillac's of the 80's and the Jaguar's since...well,....the beginning.
I think it is time we all realized that MB has changed it's market approach and it's demographic....they are not going to return to producing a quality product that would reinstate their claim to "Best of the Best". It isn't going to happen. The VP's at MB must get no end of enjoyment reading these forums and the debates that go on, seemingly endlessly, about what has happened to MB and why. The point is they HAVE changed the product and the service with malice of forethought and they ain't going back to the way it was. New business plan and that plan doesn't include those of us who loved the car, in my case since the 70's. It's a hard pill to swallow....but if it walks like a duck, quacks like a duck and ****s like a duck...IT'S A DUCK! And in my books Mercedes Benz is a dead duck, a company that cooked it's own goose. Hell even they see the the value of Japanese technology just look at the "Made In Japan" labels on so many of the major components in their cars.
I'm sick of making apologies for MB to my neighbours when they see the courtesy bus drop me off at home, yet again...the car is just what they want it to be ...no more no less....and we are the fools for trying to convince ourselves that it is more....it isn't!!!
I think it is time we all realized that MB has changed it's market approach and it's demographic....they are not going to return to producing a quality product that would reinstate their claim to "Best of the Best". It isn't going to happen. The VP's at MB must get no end of enjoyment reading these forums and the debates that go on, seemingly endlessly, about what has happened to MB and why. The point is they HAVE changed the product and the service with malice of forethought and they ain't going back to the way it was. New business plan and that plan doesn't include those of us who loved the car, in my case since the 70's. It's a hard pill to swallow....but if it walks like a duck, quacks like a duck and ****s like a duck...IT'S A DUCK! And in my books Mercedes Benz is a dead duck, a company that cooked it's own goose. Hell even they see the the value of Japanese technology just look at the "Made In Japan" labels on so many of the major components in their cars.
I'm sick of making apologies for MB to my neighbours when they see the courtesy bus drop me off at home, yet again...the car is just what they want it to be ...no more no less....and we are the fools for trying to convince ourselves that it is more....it isn't!!!
Last edited by Brian McL; Aug 22, 2005 at 06:23 PM.
