W211 or W210
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From: Lexington, MA USA
W211 or W210
Newbie here. In 12-24 months I plan to purchase a 2-3 year old E320. It's either going to be a W211 or W210. Help me decide. Performance and styling are not my hot buttons, but reliability is a biggie, so here's the question:
Is all the moaning I hear about bad reliability and quality of the 211 simply a matter of the first year's manufacturing startup foo-pa's that most manufacturers have? Have the problems in the 03s been resolved in the 04's?
Is too much technology a bad thing? Just more things to break?
Is a tried-and-true W210 a better purchase because most bugs have been shaken out?
I'm buying this car to commute and shuttle a family of five around to soccer games and city events. What I enjoy the most about a car are: heated seats, sunroof, safety, V-6 and all wheel drive. I'm not a gearhead, so in the shop it will go when work is required. I'm driving a Toyota Avalon now and the E is pretty much the same form factor inside and out. It's the perfect size for me. I bought 1st years production of the Avalon without hesitation because they always keep their eyes on the quality ball. Sure enough, no probs.
So what's the skinny? Is the 210 a more reliable and better quality machine than the 211, gadgets aside?
Is all the moaning I hear about bad reliability and quality of the 211 simply a matter of the first year's manufacturing startup foo-pa's that most manufacturers have? Have the problems in the 03s been resolved in the 04's?
Is too much technology a bad thing? Just more things to break?
Is a tried-and-true W210 a better purchase because most bugs have been shaken out?
I'm buying this car to commute and shuttle a family of five around to soccer games and city events. What I enjoy the most about a car are: heated seats, sunroof, safety, V-6 and all wheel drive. I'm not a gearhead, so in the shop it will go when work is required. I'm driving a Toyota Avalon now and the E is pretty much the same form factor inside and out. It's the perfect size for me. I bought 1st years production of the Avalon without hesitation because they always keep their eyes on the quality ball. Sure enough, no probs.
So what's the skinny? Is the 210 a more reliable and better quality machine than the 211, gadgets aside?
Last edited by Billski; Oct 3, 2004 at 03:28 PM.
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From: New York Area
'14 E350 wagon; BMW G12 (2020) G01 (2019)
Originally Posted by Billski
Newbie here. In 12-24 months I plan to purchase a 2-3 year old E320. It's either going to be a W211 or W210. Help me decide. Performance and styling are not my hot buttons, but reliability is a biggie, so here's the question:
Is all the moaning I hear about bad reliability and quality of the 211 simply a matter of the first year's manufacturing startup foo-pa's that most manufacturers have? Have the problems in the 03s been resolved in the 04's?
Is too much technology a bad thing? Just more things to break?
Is a tried-and-true W210 a better purchase because most bugs have been shaken out?
I'm buying this car to commute and shuttle a family of five around to soccer games and city events. What I enjoy the most about a car are: heated seats, sunroof, safety, V-6 and all wheel drive. I'm not a gearhead, so in the shop it will go when work is required. I'm driving a Toyota Avalon now and the E is pretty much the same form factor inside and out. It's the perfect size for me. I bought 1st years production of the Avalon without hesitation because they always keep their eyes on the quality ball. Sure enough, no probs.
So what's the skinny? Is the 210 a more reliable and better quality machine than the 211, gadgets aside?
Is all the moaning I hear about bad reliability and quality of the 211 simply a matter of the first year's manufacturing startup foo-pa's that most manufacturers have? Have the problems in the 03s been resolved in the 04's?
Is too much technology a bad thing? Just more things to break?
Is a tried-and-true W210 a better purchase because most bugs have been shaken out?
I'm buying this car to commute and shuttle a family of five around to soccer games and city events. What I enjoy the most about a car are: heated seats, sunroof, safety, V-6 and all wheel drive. I'm not a gearhead, so in the shop it will go when work is required. I'm driving a Toyota Avalon now and the E is pretty much the same form factor inside and out. It's the perfect size for me. I bought 1st years production of the Avalon without hesitation because they always keep their eyes on the quality ball. Sure enough, no probs.
So what's the skinny? Is the 210 a more reliable and better quality machine than the 211, gadgets aside?
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211 here too
However, you might pose the same question on the W210 thread and get another perspective. I always prefer to buy at the beginning of the model cycle which guarantees that I have a "new" car for at least 4-6 years until the next styling change. I also have observed that Mercedes traditionally applies the trickle down engineering approach to its mid and low range E and C Class such that the innovations in the S get added after being tested and proved in the S.
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From: Ft. Lauderdale Area, USA
2015 ML 350
If esthetics REALLY don't mean anything to you, buy either, BUT don't buy a 2003 E (My personal opinion only).
If esthetics mean ANYTHING at all to you get an '04. The 211's simply look much better from the outside, and are light years ahead on the interior. Light Years ahead.
When you check out the geneology of the E it is immediately apparent that the 210 was the "bridge" car that made the change from the OLD large steering wheeled, squarish, tank like MB's, to todays smart looking fluid design.
My dad has a 210 in Brilliant Silver/Black. I would NEVER have bought that car new. I don't think it has any attractive features about it. None. To me it feels like a commercial vehicle. ...1 wiper arm? Hah! ...and the radio? simply horrid sounding!
If esthetics mean ANYTHING at all to you get an '04. The 211's simply look much better from the outside, and are light years ahead on the interior. Light Years ahead.
When you check out the geneology of the E it is immediately apparent that the 210 was the "bridge" car that made the change from the OLD large steering wheeled, squarish, tank like MB's, to todays smart looking fluid design.
My dad has a 210 in Brilliant Silver/Black. I would NEVER have bought that car new. I don't think it has any attractive features about it. None. To me it feels like a commercial vehicle. ...1 wiper arm? Hah! ...and the radio? simply horrid sounding!
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From: Torquay, England
E-class E300e Estate, Sprinter (stretched limo)
Originally Posted by Barry45RPM
My dad has a 210 in Brilliant Silver/Black. I would NEVER have bought that car new. I don't think it has any attractive features about it. None. To me it feels like a commercial vehicle. ...1 wiper arm? Hah! ...and the radio? simply horrid sounding!
(I hope this icon is polite??)We quite liked our 210, at the time there was nothing better. The 5 series estate was 'titchy' and lacked the power of the 320CDI, but if you can afford the 211 then go for it. A much better vehicle.
Regards,
John
Night-time in Torquay
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From: Sacramento
'08 AM Vantage V8 - '03 E500
Non-scientific sample reliability results: The 6/04 Consumer Reports (yeah, I know, but who else has a larger sample?) calls the reliability of the '03 W211 "dismal" and their 4/04 reliability ratings list it as "worse than average." Of the 14 specific reliability areas listed in 4/04, though, CR calls the '03 W211 "much better than average" in 10, "better than average" in two, "average" in one, and "worse than average" in only one, "power equipment." It's hard to reconcile their specific listings with their overall conclusions. In comparison, CR lists the '01 W210 as "worse than average" in three specific reliability areas (electrical, air conditioning, power equipment) and yet gives it an "average" overall reliability rating.
Anecdotal reliability results: Our early-production W211 has had no significant problems in over one year and 10,000 miles of driving. The dealer applied a software patch to fix a common audio problem and did something to correct spurious "malfunction messages", and that's about it.
You can judge the esthetics of the two cars for yourself, but to me, if the W210 was a bit larger, it could be the shipping crate for a W211.
Anecdotal reliability results: Our early-production W211 has had no significant problems in over one year and 10,000 miles of driving. The dealer applied a software patch to fix a common audio problem and did something to correct spurious "malfunction messages", and that's about it.
You can judge the esthetics of the two cars for yourself, but to me, if the W210 was a bit larger, it could be the shipping crate for a W211.
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From: California
2014 C250 sport
I'd definitely go with the W211. If you're looking for a reasonably quiet and smooth ride for your family, that should be your choice.
To me, the W210 lacks in insulation from the road, resulting in tons of road noise. On the highway, you can barely hear the radio because of all the whooshing and pitter patter from the tires, and the ride is very jiggly and boomy. My mom has a 2000 E320, going on trips in it is very annoying and it's next to impossible to fall asleep in the back seat because of all the noise. As for wind noise,there's only a slight rustle at the windshield at freeway speed.
The W211 definitely has less noise from the road, but it's still there. The ride is still on the firm side, but the chassis is very rigid and doesn't jiggle or boom like the 210. When you're on the freeway, there's some wind noise at the side windows, but barely enough to notice.
If you're going to get the 211, don't get a 2003, they worked out some of the Sensotronic Brake Control problems, and other little problems for 2004.
To me, the W210 lacks in insulation from the road, resulting in tons of road noise. On the highway, you can barely hear the radio because of all the whooshing and pitter patter from the tires, and the ride is very jiggly and boomy. My mom has a 2000 E320, going on trips in it is very annoying and it's next to impossible to fall asleep in the back seat because of all the noise. As for wind noise,there's only a slight rustle at the windshield at freeway speed.
The W211 definitely has less noise from the road, but it's still there. The ride is still on the firm side, but the chassis is very rigid and doesn't jiggle or boom like the 210. When you're on the freeway, there's some wind noise at the side windows, but barely enough to notice.
If you're going to get the 211, don't get a 2003, they worked out some of the Sensotronic Brake Control problems, and other little problems for 2004.
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From: North Scottsdale, AZ
'71 Pinto
If purchase price is on your list of priorities but yet you want the most modern, refined exterior go for the 03 W211. If not, get a 04. As far as unreliability goes plenty here on the forum can attest that their 03 is just as good as the 04 (no offense) including myself. This is, if all software flashing and updates are, in fact, applied. Whether purchased privately or from a dealer it’s just a matter of getting dealer confirmation that all is up to date (free within 4 years / 50,000 miles). As a matter of reference free maintenance is offered for both, the 03 & 04 W211 again 4 years / 50, 000 miles. If navigation is of any concern for a 03 you can have Steve MbenzNL install it for you. Best of luck.
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Out Of Control!!
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From: North Scottsdale, AZ
'71 Pinto
Originally Posted by HELL ONA HARLEY
One word..... Lexus :v
You were offered a new adequately equipped 05 Lexus LS430 or BMW 530I as an even swap (no out of pocket costs including sales tax & registration/title fees) for your current w211 would you do it? And if so, what would be your first and foremost priority going in?
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From: THE NAPA VALLEY, CA
Build date 2-04 E500
Originally Posted by konigstiger
Suppose…
You were offered a new adequately equipped 05 Lexus LS430 or BMW 530I as an even swap (no out of pocket costs including sales tax & registration/title fees) for your current w211 would you do it? And if so, what would be your first and foremost priority going in?
You were offered a new adequately equipped 05 Lexus LS430 or BMW 530I as an even swap (no out of pocket costs including sales tax & registration/title fees) for your current w211 would you do it? And if so, what would be your first and foremost priority going in?
B.T.W. My 04 e500 has been absoutly flawless so far (nearlly 10,000 miles on the clock).
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From: North Scottsdale, AZ
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Originally Posted by HELL ONA HARLEY
Absolutly not!!!!
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From: Lexington, MA USA
Thread Starter replies
Hmm, while I may not be a slave to fashion, I will admit to indulging my midlife crisis with a dose of prestige that MB offers.
That said, I'm willing to forego some amount of Japanese reliability for prestige. I have to agree that the new styling is sure more attractive.
So you think the 210 is noiser than the 211? I've notice on most new cars that as the rubber gaskets begin to harden with age (+2 years) that the wind noise, particularly around the door is much more noticable.
I'm a bit disappointed to hear the back seat is smaller. As my kids have now become teens an are as tall as adults, 3 of them in the back could be an issue.
That said, I'm willing to forego some amount of Japanese reliability for prestige. I have to agree that the new styling is sure more attractive.
So you think the 210 is noiser than the 211? I've notice on most new cars that as the rubber gaskets begin to harden with age (+2 years) that the wind noise, particularly around the door is much more noticable.
I'm a bit disappointed to hear the back seat is smaller. As my kids have now become teens an are as tall as adults, 3 of them in the back could be an issue.
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From: DFW
'05 E320 CDI, ‘10 E63, ‘13 SL63, Sprinter 170
Don't waste a dime on the W210, go get a creampuff W124 if cost IS a concern. I had one, and at the time my wife also had the prior generation 5 series BMW we bought new. The W210 was absolutely the definition of bland compared to the 5, and the new W211. I am glad that the diesel came back and made me re-look at MB as a car. My W211 has so far been the best new car experience I have had to date.
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was '03 E320 - now - '04 S4
The only W210 I've driven was an '01 E55 modified by Renntech.
Kick *** car! Not nearly as good looking as the W211 though.
I drive a pretty early '03 E320 and I love the looks of the car and the star on the hood has an undeniable appeal - but if reliability is the paramount concern - buy a Lexus.
I would under no circumstances own this car without a warranty. Way too many little things have gone wrong already - I cringe at the thought of what it would cost to repair big stuff out of warranty
Kick *** car! Not nearly as good looking as the W211 though.
I drive a pretty early '03 E320 and I love the looks of the car and the star on the hood has an undeniable appeal - but if reliability is the paramount concern - buy a Lexus.
I would under no circumstances own this car without a warranty. Way too many little things have gone wrong already - I cringe at the thought of what it would cost to repair big stuff out of warranty
Last edited by lig; Oct 4, 2004 at 02:18 AM.
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From: California
i535
Theoretically W211 is better. Since you are not in style and look, then difference isn't so significant as some can think. And do not waste time considering Japanese cars, I was under pressure of opinions of some people in the forums like that (certainly undercover Toyota marketing staff) and now I regret that bought Lexus. I'll hopefully rid of it soon. Reliability is thing of luck, I had domestic car and had zero problems (I did only oil change), I sold it at 80k miles and it was like new. So generally you won't be wrong with any E class.
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From: Dedham MA
2015 C300
After the initial "bumps" with the command and audio gateway modules my '03 E320 has performed flawlessly. Just make sure you know the history of the car - if someone held onto it for 30,000+ miles like I have, then chances are it was a pretty good car - they just got rid of it for some other reason. I would buy the W211 without hesitating!
A friend of mine had a 2002 W210 and had all sorts of issues with it - couldn't wait to dump it. (He bought a 2004 XJ8 this summer - that's another story!). I really hate to say this, but if style and form make no difference, then you may be better off looking to the "west" rather than "east". (That's as close as I can come to mentioning the competition from across the Pacific!!).
A friend of mine had a 2002 W210 and had all sorts of issues with it - couldn't wait to dump it. (He bought a 2004 XJ8 this summer - that's another story!). I really hate to say this, but if style and form make no difference, then you may be better off looking to the "west" rather than "east". (That's as close as I can come to mentioning the competition from across the Pacific!!).
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From: Hong Kong
C55AMG W203; 330i E90
Get the W210
All MB cars are reliable.
I used the W210 E320 for 3 years , 38000km. Zero break down.
The only part replaced was the air cond tube.
I 'don't believe' the W211 is less reliable.
If you can find a preowned 2001 E320 W210 mileage ~80000km and three times cheaper than the W211, get the W210 as your first MB, you will enjoy it.
Then, upgrade to the W211 two years later.
If you find a E430 W210, even be better for family.
But the 2001 W210 facelift has much better interior.
cnt
I used the W210 E320 for 3 years , 38000km. Zero break down.
The only part replaced was the air cond tube.
I 'don't believe' the W211 is less reliable.
If you can find a preowned 2001 E320 W210 mileage ~80000km and three times cheaper than the W211, get the W210 as your first MB, you will enjoy it.
Then, upgrade to the W211 two years later.
If you find a E430 W210, even be better for family.
But the 2001 W210 facelift has much better interior.
cnt
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From: Singapore
E200 Kompressor (sold 2008), BMW 7 series (2009), now waiting for the E63
IMHO, any Benz is a good Benz... some are just better than others ... if you have a little spare cash lying about, why not go for the W211? It's interior is much plusher and better built (according to owners of both W210 & W211 cars) and, in my particular case, the W211's Kompressor engine uses a better technology than the old W210's.
But since you're going for the E320, I don't suppose the engine would be an issue.
Good luck with your decision - both choices are good cars.
... if you have a little spare cash lying about, why not go for the W211? It's interior is much plusher and better built (according to owners of both W210 & W211 cars) and, in my particular case, the W211's Kompressor engine uses a better technology than the old W210's. But since you're going for the E320, I don't suppose the engine would be an issue
.Good luck with your decision - both choices are good cars
.
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From: Atlanta, GA
Whichever one is available (1 of 5)
I purchased pre-owned 2003 E500 (W211), had nothing but problems the first three days. I returned it to the dealer for a full refund. I went to my local MB dealer and purchased 2004 E500 (W211). I just loved my new car. I heard a lot problems about first year production of the 2003 E500. So I learned not to purchase first year models.
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From: Singapore
E200 Kompressor (sold 2008), BMW 7 series (2009), now waiting for the E63
You don't say, paulhu ... the present C200K I'm driving is a "first year production model" and it's given me nothing but heartache...
