Uh oh...New Generation 5er
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The front of the E IMO is slightly more aggressive and dynamic while the rest of the 5 has the E class licked IMO. The side is more dynamic or better flow and the rear definitely looks better. This segment is going to be very competitive. New A6 in 2012, and it looks also pretty good.
http://www.autospies.com/news/Next-G...i-A6-C7-47753/
The A6 looks more aggressive than the 5 but not as aggressive as the E. But the side profile looks nice from the rendering.
An E was following me the other day and the front looked really really nice. But as it passed it went from nice german car to nice looking japanese/korean. Sorry the rear and side profile just doesn't do it for me. Definitely this E is more polarizing than previous designs.
http://www.autospies.com/news/Next-G...i-A6-C7-47753/
The A6 looks more aggressive than the 5 but not as aggressive as the E. But the side profile looks nice from the rendering.
An E was following me the other day and the front looked really really nice. But as it passed it went from nice german car to nice looking japanese/korean. Sorry the rear and side profile just doesn't do it for me. Definitely this E is more polarizing than previous designs.
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...24 GLE53
It looks good but certainly resembles the 3 series. I expected to see a more revolutionary model change. They decided to play it safe with nothing outside the box. It certainly won't turn anyone off and will probably satisfy their base but I wish they had been a little more adventurous.
Last edited by petee1997; Nov 24, 2009 at 05:46 PM.
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fwiw, earlier BMW design philosophy has always been to be consistent over all the models.
i.e., the designs are similar to each other except for scale. They are returning to that philosophy in the current post-Bangle era. They even released a press release noting this yesterday.
You can see it clearly in the BB models (Before Bangle.) This all might seem conservative to some people who want to stand out in the crowd, but their return to their early design paradigm with the real emphasis being on chassis and engine design has been welcomed by the majority of BMW enthusiasts.
i.e., the designs are similar to each other except for scale. They are returning to that philosophy in the current post-Bangle era. They even released a press release noting this yesterday.
You can see it clearly in the BB models (Before Bangle.) This all might seem conservative to some people who want to stand out in the crowd, but their return to their early design paradigm with the real emphasis being on chassis and engine design has been welcomed by the majority of BMW enthusiasts.
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No one has commented significantly on the hardware.
I think it will be ahead of MB in the areas of engine and suspension, match it in safety, and beat it with interior materials/design. I still find Audi's interiors more interesting though. The 4 wheel steering, adaptive drive, turbo motors will be difficult to match - let alone beat. It's disappointing that they took a step back in the use of Aluminum - less in the new car than the current one. Clearly a cost cutting measure.
However, the car looks like it will be marginally more expensive than the outgoing car - meaning MB will have a clear price advantage. It will be interesting to see if folks will pay the premium, especially given the current financial state of affairs. The BMW faithful will, and the MB fans won't get it - but it's the customers who are on the fence who will drive anything they fancy at the time, that will decide how successful it is (or not).
I think it will be ahead of MB in the areas of engine and suspension, match it in safety, and beat it with interior materials/design. I still find Audi's interiors more interesting though. The 4 wheel steering, adaptive drive, turbo motors will be difficult to match - let alone beat. It's disappointing that they took a step back in the use of Aluminum - less in the new car than the current one. Clearly a cost cutting measure.
However, the car looks like it will be marginally more expensive than the outgoing car - meaning MB will have a clear price advantage. It will be interesting to see if folks will pay the premium, especially given the current financial state of affairs. The BMW faithful will, and the MB fans won't get it - but it's the customers who are on the fence who will drive anything they fancy at the time, that will decide how successful it is (or not).
Last edited by mbchris; Nov 24, 2009 at 03:07 PM.
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2010 E350
My first thought was, man, that center console is just wacky. Why is with the iDrive controller way over there? I didn't like the shifter when I tested the 2010 model and it looks like it remains. Thumbs down on that. The wood on the dash looks nice, but it doesn't look as good on the center console (might just be the lighting). Thought I'd seen something about digital instrument display (a la the S class), but that's clearly not present. Shame.
The front end looks disproportionate (bottom of grille sits farther back than top), but I guess that's more how it used to look (1st, 2nd, 4th gen in pic 6). I'm not a BMW connoisseur, though, so I may not know what I'm talking about. Either way, the side view (pic 21) isn't very flattering.
I think the rear is an improvement over the last version (it'd be hard to make it worse haha). However, the taillights aren't cohesive. Why don't the lines from the bottom lights continue all the way to the top? The bottom of the lights flow smoothly to the trunk, but the top lights don't flow with anything.
I dunno. Those things are probably just nit-picky. The overall design doesn't do much to excite one way or another. It's better than the last one, but, again, that's a low bar. It's definitely in line with their other models. I still prefer the design of the 3 series from the early 2000's (E46, according to wikipedia). In my opinion, BMW's exterior design peaked with that one.
The front end looks disproportionate (bottom of grille sits farther back than top), but I guess that's more how it used to look (1st, 2nd, 4th gen in pic 6). I'm not a BMW connoisseur, though, so I may not know what I'm talking about. Either way, the side view (pic 21) isn't very flattering.
I think the rear is an improvement over the last version (it'd be hard to make it worse haha). However, the taillights aren't cohesive. Why don't the lines from the bottom lights continue all the way to the top? The bottom of the lights flow smoothly to the trunk, but the top lights don't flow with anything.
I dunno. Those things are probably just nit-picky. The overall design doesn't do much to excite one way or another. It's better than the last one, but, again, that's a low bar. It's definitely in line with their other models. I still prefer the design of the 3 series from the early 2000's (E46, according to wikipedia). In my opinion, BMW's exterior design peaked with that one.
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I dont think the new 5 is a great car but not bad by any means. Remember BMW's are usually better in the corners and MB's are a nicer drive for comfort. Both are great cars, but do you want a more inspired sort of drive or a great cruiser. Then there is a question of looks... well thats up to you. I cant tell anyone what car looks better to them only what looks better to me. Dont be a bone head and buy a car because someone else like the look of one over another. For me I like the drive of a MB everyday that I would go with MB. But dont get me wrong I would love to rip around in a BMW for fun somedays. MB does have that covered with the AMG's too. I personaly like the rear of the new 5 better then the E. But then the Front of the new E is far better then the 5. $ 4 $... well we need to see what happens with the pricing of the 5, but right now its a no brainer for me.
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2010 E550.. Gone but never forgotton - E63 AMG..
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2010 E350
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The front of the E IMO is slightly more aggressive and dynamic while the rest of the 5 has the E class licked IMO. The side is more dynamic or better flow and the rear definitely looks better. This segment is going to be very competitive. New A6 in 2012, and it looks also pretty good.
http://www.autospies.com/news/Next-G...i-A6-C7-47753/
The A6 looks more aggressive than the 5 but not as aggressive as the E. But the side profile looks nice from the rendering.
An E was following me the other day and the front looked really really nice. But as it passed it went from nice german car to nice looking japanese/korean. Sorry the rear and side profile just doesn't do it for me. Definitely this E is more polarizing than previous designs.
http://www.autospies.com/news/Next-G...i-A6-C7-47753/
The A6 looks more aggressive than the 5 but not as aggressive as the E. But the side profile looks nice from the rendering.
An E was following me the other day and the front looked really really nice. But as it passed it went from nice german car to nice looking japanese/korean. Sorry the rear and side profile just doesn't do it for me. Definitely this E is more polarizing than previous designs.
Sorry, I'm trying to understand why everyone is so smitten with the exterior styling of the new 5-series. The front hood is kind of strange. And I honestly don't see how the rear of the new 5 series flows better than the E. Where the E class has adopted bold, angular styling, BMW has retained its familiar soft look.
IMHO it appears that they studied the Toyota Avalon for inspiration!
Last edited by mm9351; Nov 25, 2009 at 05:03 PM.
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...24 GLE53
Looking at those pictures again I don't see a new car design. It's a five year old larger 3 series. I'm sure there will be many technical improvements but I don't think it's what I want to see for another seven years. I liked the w210 and W211 but seven years of each one was enough. The W212 gives us something different for the next seven years instead of BMW's same O,same O. I'm certainly happy about my choice.
PS For those of you that find the rear of the W212 a little too Japanese will not find relief in the 5 series. Don't despair. There is hope for you. There is a world class manufacturer from India that will accomodate your discriminating taste. The Tata Jaguar awaits your refined asses.
PS For those of you that find the rear of the W212 a little too Japanese will not find relief in the 5 series. Don't despair. There is hope for you. There is a world class manufacturer from India that will accomodate your discriminating taste. The Tata Jaguar awaits your refined asses.
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2001 BMW 530i
The new 5 looks pretty good in pictures and, like the E Class, it may well look even better in the flesh. Will have to wait and see. I had pretty well decided to switch to MB for my next car but now I'm not sure. The real determinant will be the price. If BMW doesn't match MB pricing I'll make the move to the E Class. That said, both cars look damn good. I actually prefer the rear on the MB. There's still some leftover Bangle in that 5er rear end and I'm sick of it.
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PS For those of you that find the rear of the W212 a little too Japanese will not find relief in the 5 series. Don't despair. There is hope for you. There is a world class manufacturer from India that will accomodate your discriminating taste. The Tata Jaguar awaits your refined asses.
Well, guess what? Daimler AG and Tata have had a long time partnership themselves. Tata built it's first vehicle as a joint venture with Daimler-Benz in 1954. Ever since then they've had a close relationship. Daimler AG is an investor of Tata owns 7 percent of the company. All the Mercedes Benzes assembled in India (yes, that's India) are painted by Tata in their factory. That first MB production (1995) in India was also a joint venture with Tata. MBI (MB India) now has a 100 acre plant in Pune.
Hey Pops, maybe some of your W212 parts are made in India.
As long as Tata has the management and money, then I hope they do better with Jaguar and Land Rover then Ford did. I'm happy they bought JLR instead of Ford running it.
And as long as it's still hands-off with Coventry as the research and design center and the cars are continued to be manufactured in Birmingham and Liverpool, then I'm fine with Tata just bankrolling the venture. After all, they just want to be profitable.
Just like I'm fine with Aston Martin being bankrolled by Kuwati's Dar and Adeem investments (and Sinders.) And it's still in Warwickshire. Hey, at least Aston is no longer sharing parts with Ford's Volvo parts bins any more.
And yep, the 2010 Jag XKR is a hot looking car with a Roots SC V8 cranking out 461 ft lbs of torque.
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I'm being sarcastic in return to his own sarcasm: "the Tata Jaguar awaits your refined asses."
The reality is that if it's supposedly "inferior" that JLR is Tata/Indian owned, the irony here is that MB has a relationship with Tata themselves.
Hey, who knows, there could easily be Indian blood in the E Class. Which therefore should mean: there's nothing wrong with JLR and it's Tata India ownership just like there's nothing wrong with MB because of it's own Tata India connection.....
The reality is that if it's supposedly "inferior" that JLR is Tata/Indian owned, the irony here is that MB has a relationship with Tata themselves.
Hey, who knows, there could easily be Indian blood in the E Class. Which therefore should mean: there's nothing wrong with JLR and it's Tata India ownership just like there's nothing wrong with MB because of it's own Tata India connection.....
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...24 GLE53
220S I had you in mind for the Tata Jag. With your vast knowledge of all things unimportant you could offer your services to Tata's marketing dept. and try to solve Jaguar sales deficiency. That being said, are you lost again? Aren't you normally tutoring on the past model W211 AMG forum. Keep up the good work. You are the "Google" of this forum.
PS 220S I've always pictured Jaguars with a tow truck in front. I don't know why!!! Maybe it's for same reason that I find you such an amusing little man.
PS 220S I've always pictured Jaguars with a tow truck in front. I don't know why!!! Maybe it's for same reason that I find you such an amusing little man.
Last edited by petee1997; Nov 26, 2009 at 12:06 PM.
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mercedes cls550
i like both cars. the only problem in looks i have is with the new e class. the hood sits on top of the side fenders and if u look from side it feels like its either open or miss aligned. specially where the hood crease meets the headlamps . in bmw 5 u cannot see the hood crease from side ,which is more clean styling.
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It's a winner in my book. My friend had a previous gen 530i and ewww i didn't like it. They refined it a little with the facelift (especially the 550i with the M sport package, that was nice).
Ya, like 220S said, I would love to see a 535 or 550 with the M sport package. If it looks like a 3 series then good, I love the current gen 3 series. However, I don't like the 7 series at all.
Ya, it was a good idea for Ford to get rid of JLR and Aston Martin. They didn't know how to market the cars at all. Hopefully, they will do better now.
Ya, like 220S said, I would love to see a 535 or 550 with the M sport package. If it looks like a 3 series then good, I love the current gen 3 series. However, I don't like the 7 series at all.
Ya, it was a good idea for Ford to get rid of JLR and Aston Martin. They didn't know how to market the cars at all. Hopefully, they will do better now.
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From the pics the new 5 series is a HUGE improvement over the current car. I'm actually starting to like the new E sedan and like the looks with the 350 sport rims vs the 550's amg styled wheels (not one of AMG's best efforts imo)...I will be curious to see the new 5 in the flesh before I make any final judgements but so far so good. I've also seen pics/renderings of the new 6 series which if hold's true it would be an improvement over the current car and it appears to have a folding hard top.
Ya, I don't know what MB was smoking to keep a soft top for the E convertible, they should have gone hard top.
Last edited by gaazmon; Nov 26, 2009 at 02:30 PM.
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Not a big fan of that, if that is what the new 6 will look like. Too Z roadster looking. If the new 6 comes with a hard top though, MB better watch out. Hard top convertible, with 4 seats, and lower price point... I smell an SL beater.
Ya, I don't know what MB was smoking to keep a soft top for the E convertible, they should have gone hard top.
Ya, I don't know what MB was smoking to keep a soft top for the E convertible, they should have gone hard top.
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Sorry, I'm trying to understand why everyone is so smitten with the exterior styling of the new 5-series. The front hood is kind of strange. And I honestly don't see how the rear of the new 5 series flows better than the E. Where the E class has adopted bold, angular styling, BMW has retained its familiar soft look.
IMHO it appears that they studied the Toyota Avalon for inspiration!
IMHO it appears that they studied the Toyota Avalon for inspiration!
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Sorry guys but BMW owns the next 7 years in the mid-size segment, this time around it's them who have the more respectable, and eye pleasing design on a grand scale. E's in big trouble, and with BMW going the elegant/timeless route and M-B going the frills/conservative-majorly angular mix route, the 5 will widen its lead as each year passes. MHO of course. 
Basing off the reactions by many people on car enthusiast Boards, etc., the 5's reception is looking far more positive as well.
To me it's the other way around. When you refine and evolve a design, it makes the old one look like the ugly version. The W212 looks nothing like a 211, doesn't look like a "newer version" of the same car, just looks like a different car, which to me, helps the W211 look non-dated, while the E60 is going to look even uglier and more awkward than it did before.
Basing off the reactions by many people on car enthusiast Boards, etc., the 5's reception is looking far more positive as well.
l of the out going model, but breathed in some new needed fresh air. Enough so that owners of the W211 would feel that their cars look dated enough to want newer models. I don't see that with the new 5, maybe its because I'm just a casual BMW fan, but I don't see that much difference between the new and the old model to justify purchasing one.
