rol607

How many of you are running staggered wheels on your E550 4Matics? Does it void warranty?

xxGenericSNxx

Staggered is fine on 4matic in terms of mechanics.

Never heard about it voiding warranty before...

pdjv

Interesting - the MBUSA site is mute on this. I know my (non-4Matic) 2011 E550 came with staggered 18" AMG wheels. Maybe staggered fitments cause problems with 4Matic. Sadly, model year 2012 E550 buyers are stuck with 4Matic.

Karl901

Does not the CLS 550 4matic come standard with staggered wheels?

BadBlack550

Spoke to my MB tech and he said staggered set up should not affect 4matic system.

Not sure whats the best set up would be:
255/35/19 & 285/30/19 E63 sizing i believe.
or
245/35/19 & 285/30/19 give identical overall diameter, what is important for the 4matic sytem.

Arrie

What would be the reason for MB to build this beatuful car with the staggered wheel setup but then not include it in the 4-wheel drive equipped models? Are they just stupid or would there be a real reason for it? I don't think they are stupid.

The reason is that the staggered wheel setup that they use on the rear wheel drive cars gives too much wheel diameter difference between front and rear.

Now, what the hell has this to do with anything? Well, to my understanding MB use a very simple spring loaded "disk brake" as differential locking between the axles. If the front and rear wheels have diameter difference this disk brake will wear out, i.e. the different speed between the axles will make the middle differential to work at all times. Constant movement at the differential then wears the locking disks out. It is kind of if you drive the car with foot on the brake.

1985mb

Except you make the rolling diameters identical (or virtually identical) with the right combination of tire sizes (typically 30mm wider on the rear with one notch, i.e. 5%, less sidewall ratio).

Staggered wheels on AWD cars have been around as long as AWD has.

Arrie

Staggered setup has been around on AWD cars for long time but usually these cars are equipped with far more sophisticated central differential locking system than what MB use in the E models. These systems do not care if there is a speed difference between the axles.

Tjdehya

Really?
Are staggered wheels are optional for the E550 4Matic from Mercedes?
Does Mercedes use the same 4matic system on all their vehicles?

BTW you guys are off topic... and the Topic that you are bringing up has been discussed many times before... Do a search!

Back on Topic... I have staggered wheels on my 2011 E550 and No, it does not void your warranty.

BadBlack550

so what is the set up are you are running?

ddeliber

Normally I wouldn't comment on a topic like this, but this time I feel I have to. There are TONs of discussions out there describing why using staggered wheels are bad for 4matics (maybe it is just the C and E I'm not sure). Whether or not is voids your warranty is not the point, it is bad for the type (older technology) of AWD that is used on these cars.

I read that the standard staggered config that is used on the RWD E's will have 1 tire revolution difference in something like 140 m driven. You wear out the discs in the differential by doing this, it is not me I have seen this several times, you should look it up before you decide to change your wheels.

The point that Mercedes has this option on the non 4matic (I even believe it is more common than non-staggered configs - possibly even standard with the 18" wheels) and doesn't even offer it as a special order on 4matics is not something to be blown off. This and the fact that MB uses an older technology for their 4matic is not off point. It explains why you shouldn't put staggered wheels on these cars.

BadBlack550

But if you are running identical diameter wheels front and back, wouldn't that solve the problem?
285/30/19 tire/wheel has the same exact diameter as 245/35/19.

Arrie

Well, it is not exactly the same diameter but within 0.5 mm it is so close enough.

But how about the fir of the 285 wide wheel in the back? Sure it will not rub?

Arrie

Well,

If you ever run in situation that your AWD becomes useless due to non-existent central differential lock (like on snowy roads in mountains) and then you take your car to MB dealer with the complaint please leave those staggered wheels ON so we can see what they tell you about fixing it under warranty. I personally think you would be digging in your own pockets.

BadBlack550

Why would i do that?
E63 has 285s in the back, i am sure they will fit E550

WEBSRFR

I've actually heard it is a bad idea to mix and match tires with different tread patterns even if the tires are the the same diameter as that might not be optimal for the type of traction control and AWD we have in our cars. It does not mean it will not work but I think the car's systems will be working harder to compensate. Stagerred wheels takes this to a whole new level + you will not be able to rotate your tires properly. Personally I would never mess with the tire setup of my E550 4MATIC. Like someone else said I think there is a reason Mercedes does not offer it.

This discussion is one more reason why I'd never touch a car modified to change critical factory specifications with a 10 foot pole if I'm looking to buy a used car.

Tjdehya

Vossens VVS-083 20x9 Front 20x10.5 rear
Nitto Invo 245/30/20 front 295/25/20 Rear

The only things that are more amazing that your ignorance on this subject is your persistence on displaying it and your reluctance to learn.
Did you answer the questions I asked you?
Did you search the forum?
Here are a couple more questions for you...
Why does the CLS550 4Matic have staggered wheels?
Why does the C300 4Matic have staggered wheels?
Answer those two questions along with the ones that I already asked you then maybe you might be able to gain some credibility.
Until you answer those questions.. STFU!!!

If you dont care about this subject enough to look up the answers then.... STFU!!

And I mean that in the nicest way possible. I love you!

They do offer it!
And yes I agree... I do not buy used cars for that same reason. Modified or not, because they could have made changes and returned it back to stock before the sale.

bigigg

I have a nice 20" staggered setup for sale, if any1 is interested.. click on link in my signature.

ddeliber

Funny I was thinking the same thing about you.
The following pic is taken directly from a build page for the C300. Look it up yourself, well, you probably won't do that because it could prove you wrong, so others, if you are considering doing this please look it up.

in case you can't see it from the pic, it says staggered wheels (option for rear axle) cannot be used on 4Matic vehicles.

ddeliber

I don't have a lot of time this morning, but I just did a build for a CL550 and i see the same thing but not hidden by a disclaimer. Just click any of the 3 wheel options, right there on the details page:
Option for rear axle cannot be used for 4Matic vehicles.

threeMBs

Forget mbusa.com. Just go to your local dealer and see what wheels/tires are on C300 4matics and CLS550 4matics. You will see they're staggered - 225/45-17 front and 245/40-17 rear for C300 4 (sport) and 255/40-18 front and 285/35-18 rear for CLS550 4. And if you do calculations you will see that front to rear are not even identical diameters (2/10" or 5mm less at the rear).

One has to undertand that even for non-staggered equiped AWD 4matics, MB builds in tolarences (I believe) of about 3/10" (8mm or so) to compensate for uneven front/rear ware - not everyone (I never do) rotates and they have to account for it.

Since MB uses only 265/35-18 tires on rwd W212 (and this tire is almost 1/2" shorter than front's 245/40-18), it can not be used on W212 4matics. But what they (MB) should have done was to use 275/35-18 (like was done on W210s) which would make front/rear close enough to be safely used on 4matics.

We, on this board, took it one step further by stating that if one uses identical front/rear diameters like i.e. 245/40-18 front and 285/35-18 rear (285s fit W212 rear without any issues with lower than stock offsets) on W212 they will have no AWD related issues. BTW 255/285 is perfectly fine as well as 255/295 (for 19"/20" with perfect rear offset for 295).

BadBlack550

What offset would you go with on the rear with 285 tire?

threeMBs

That would depend on wheel's width:

9.5" - et40-45
10" - et45-50

Tjdehya

Yea... that's so cute... at least you kinda know how to look something up... How about you look at the stock wheels for the C300 4Matic and the CLS550 4Matic instead of the OPTIONAL wheels that Mercedes decides to put on their website...
Look it up yourself, well, you probably won't do that because it could prove you wrong!
Or better yet... go into the C Class and CLS forum and ask the members what stock wheels they have on their 4Matic.
So many people on here know nothing about the things they feel the know everything about!

I love you too!

ddeliber

I have to say the value of this discussion is pretty darn low and it is not going in the direction that would be helpful for someone that is looking to understand what should or shouldn't be done. I've re-stated what MB recommends, they explicitly state that they won't put staggered wheels on 4matics - they even state it on the S and SLs (well the ones that you can get with 4matic anyway). What someone puts on their cars is up to them.

MB uses older technology for their AWD system and it is bad for it to have different diameter tires front and back. Is it really going to make a difference if there is a 5mm variance, probably not, I don't know, never claimed to be an expert. But what I am stating is what MB says, not what the guy that wanted to sell me a set of wheels said. I trust MB more, and I wouldn't want to have warranty issues should something go wrong.

The point that confuses me most is why would you want to put staggered wheels on an all wheel drive car? What possible value is there? Do you understand why they put em on the RWDs? Is it just appearance? If so, knock yourself out, get even bigger ones and bump out the fenders. Maybe even put the fatter ones on the left side for all the good it will do you.