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This morning, I came back from a 2-week trip where I had car parked at airport. Upon starting engine, car shook and engine sounded like there were rocks inside, so I immediately turned it off. I waited a few seconds and attempted another start. It started with same symptoms, but all smoothed out in about 10 seconds. I drove home and had no other hiccups.
What the heck was that? I have not hooked up STAR, as there is no current obvious problem.
I kept car parked for a few days and decided to start it today, but I checked oil level before and it was fine. Upon starting all went well and there was no repeat of what happened earlier this week. Very puzzling.
OP, since you have a 2013(according to your sig), you might be hearing timing chain rattle. MB issued a TSB and it calls for installing updated secondary tensioners on both banks, as well as one way valves which keep oil from draining back into the head. What you heard was "normal" noise for a part that has drained all oil, and the noise was gone as soon as pressure was reached.
I am currently dealing with this issue and did the TSB however I am still getting the noise. My issue now is a failed camshaft adjuster which should always keep pressure but with age it has failed and after I start my engine which sat for 2 hrs or more, I get this rattle sound. Its becoming more and more common on M276 , M278 and M157 as they all use the same part.
Tensioners and valves, cost me ~ $275 and my labor, however one camshaft adjuster from MB is appox ~$700(there are 4), and the job on M276 is about 6hrs of labor(unless you take a shortcut and dont remove valve covers)
OP, since you have a 2013(according to your sig), you might be hearing timing chain rattle. MB issued a TSB and it calls for installing updated secondary tensioners on both banks, as well as one way valves which keep oil from draining back into the head. What you heard was "normal" noise for a part that has drained all oil, and the noise was gone as soon as pressure was reached.
I am currently dealing with this issue and did the TSB however I am still getting the noise. My issue now is a failed camshaft adjuster which should always keep pressure but with age it has failed and after I start my engine which sat for 2 hrs or more, I get this rattle sound. Its becoming more and more common on M276 , M278 and M157 as they all use the same part.
Tensioners and valves, cost me ~ $275 and my labor, however one camshaft adjuster from MB is appox ~$700(there are 4), and the job on M276 is about 6hrs of labor(unless you take a shortcut and dont remove valve covers)
S140s
Thank you so much for chiming in! I am dealing with exactly the same problem. I also did the TSB Ll05.10-p-056435 and much to my dismay; still have the rattling when the oil pressure drops down after sitting for some time, in my case one hour or less. I even re-opened both front covers to check to see if there was something holding up the tensioners to allow the oil to drain back. Everything appeared to be okay. I am getting a fault codes P034600 & P002177 "Position of intake camshaft Bank2 deviates from specific value, the commanded position cannot be reached". Exactly as you said, the cam adjuster Bank2 seems to have failed on my engine.
I have to do some more research. I saw in another post that there is a test routine in SDS for the cam adjusters. That will be my next step when I get time to find and carry out those tests on my SDS.
I am not sure if my skill set is up to playing around with this repair, how about you??
Thanks guys! I used to think that MB engines were bullet proof, but learning about this as well as issues with the M272 engine, balance shaft sprocket being made of a soft metal, very disappointing indeed. I guess this would cost a bundle as I don't dare open up the engine. I guess I'll try to keep car running at least 1-2X a week. Would it help if before turning engine on to turn key to position ll for a few seconds, which would allow oil pressure to build up?
Thanks guys! I used to think that MB engines were bullet proof, but learning about this as well as issues with the M272 engine, balance shaft sprocket being made of a soft metal, very disappointing indeed. I guess this would cost a bundle as I don't dare open up the engine. I guess I'll try to keep car running at least 1-2X a week. Would it help if before turning engine on to turn key to position ll for a few seconds, which would allow oil pressure to build up?
Oil pressure does not start building up untill you are cranking, only thing that would help would be disconnecting ignition or fuel system to prevent starting and cranking the engine for 10 seconds. I personally would wait with the repair until it starts to rattle every morning(overnight).
Thank you so much for chiming in! I am dealing with exactly the same problem. I also did the TSB Ll05.10-p-056435 and much to my dismay; still have the rattling when the oil pressure drops down after sitting for some time, in my case one hour or less. I even re-opened both front covers to check to see if there was something holding up the tensioners to allow the oil to drain back. Everything appeared to be okay. I am getting a fault codes P034600 & P002177 "Position of intake camshaft Bank2 deviates from specific value, the commanded position cannot be reached". Exactly as you said, the cam adjuster Bank2 seems to have failed on my engine.
I have to do some more research. I saw in another post that there is a test routine in SDS for the cam adjusters. That will be my next step when I get time to find and carry out those tests on my SDS.
I am not sure if my skill set is up to playing around with this repair, how about you??
Thanks again for posting……
Bob
The repair is not really that involved but you need to make sure everything goes back the way it came out. I read multiple workshop pages and it still amazes me that MB did not make clear timing marks and you set timing marks to a bolt on the tensioner. I am getting a code for over advance on intake cam on drivers side, however when I perform the test it passes with flying colors. My problem is that the camshaft adjuster fails to retain oil pressure and rattles after 2 hours. I will not be paying $700 a piece and will just source a low milage head from 15-16 e350 and it will give me all the necessary parts that I need. I found one head recently , from a 2016 e350- 12k miles, for $500. Comes with 2 camshafts and adjusters.
The repair is not really that involved but you need to make sure everything goes back the way it came out. I read multiple workshop pages and it still amazes me that MB did not make clear timing marks and you set timing marks to a bolt on the tensioner. I am getting a code for over advance on intake cam on drivers side, however when I perform the test it passes with flying colors. My problem is that the camshaft adjuster fails to retain oil pressure and rattles after 2 hours. I will not be paying $700 a piece and will just source a low milage head from 15-16 e350 and it will give me all the necessary parts that I need. I found one head recently , from a 2016 e350- 12k miles, for $500. Comes with 2 camshafts and adjusters.
I am like you, I hate to have to spend $970 list and 6 hrs labor to the dealer or Indy. However, a one tooth mistake and the whole motor goes up in flames. You also need special tools to clamp the cams to prevent movement during the disassembly-reassembly. Easy enough for me to make if I still was working and had access to our machine shop. Your idea of sourcing a complete head and swapping parts is a good one. I am triggering a check engine light every 5-7 starts then it goes away after about the same number of restarts. It then stores a Bank2 code. I have yet to talk to an Indy shop for their input.
I am extremely disappointed in MB engineering as others have stated. I love the idea of driving an MB but understand that BMW and Audi have their issues too.
Keep us informed of your final solution.
Good luck,
Bob
Last edited by mercy-me; 09-29-2019 at 07:30 AM.
Reason: Clarity
I am like you, I hate to have to spend $970 list and 6 hrs labor to the dealer or Indy. However, a one tooth mistake and the whole motor goes up in flames. You also need special tools to clamp the cams to prevent movement during the disassembly-reassembly. Easy enough for me to make if I still was working and had access to our machine shop. Your idea of sourcing a complete head and swapping parts is a good one. I am triggering a check engine light every 5-7 starts then it goes away after about the same number of restarts. It then stores a Bank2 code. I have yet to talk to an Indy shop for their input.
I am extremely disappointed in MB engineering as others have stated. I love the idea of driving an MB but understand that BMW and Audi have their issues too.
Keep us informed of your final solution.
Good luck,
Bob
The hold down clamps do not lock cams in place. When the valve cover is in place it pushes the cam all the way down, when you remove the cover, the valve springs push the cam up and its pushing against those factory clamps(they are there so the cam doesn't come off the head).The camshaft rides in the head and valve cover, there are no cam caps. The hold down tool is used to "simulate" valve cover in place, so it pushes the cam into proper position, and you can remove the chain from the sprockets. If you do not have the hold down tool, the valve springs would be pushing the cam up, and you would not be able to remove chain. I spoke with a MB master tech, he told me on this engine I can replace the adjuster through the access panel in the front. You remove injection pump/vacuum pump(whatever side you work on) on the back to have access to the rear of cam, put a socket on there and remove the bolt out front, he said you can get the adjuster out that way.
The hold down clamps do not lock cams in place. When the valve cover is in place it pushes the cam all the way down, when you remove the cover, the valve springs push the cam up and its pushing against those factory clamps(they are there so the cam doesn't come off the head).The camshaft rides in the head and valve cover, there are no cam caps. The hold down tool is used to "simulate" valve cover in place, so it pushes the cam into proper position, and you can remove the chain from the sprockets. If you do not have the hold down tool, the valve springs would be pushing the cam up, and you would not be able to remove chain. I spoke with a MB master tech, he told me on this engine I can replace the adjuster through the access panel in the front. You remove injection pump/vacuum pump(whatever side you work on) on the back to have access to the rear of cam, put a socket on there and remove the bolt out front, he said you can get the adjuster out that way.
I am having the same issue as many of you all did with the rattle sound from the cam adjusters (see video attached). I took the car in to the dealer so they could tell me what exactly am I looking at to fix it and boy let me tell you, it's a pretty penny (outlined further below). I mean of course at this point for all their suggested work it doesn't make sense with the value of our cars. The interesting part here is my dealer told me we are going to need to replace the cam as well which I notice wasn't mentioned in the earlier posts, is that something you all went through as well? What was some of the resolution you all had on this?
- Mehroz
Last edited by Lexani1217; 09-21-2021 at 10:12 PM.
Reason: add video reference
I am having the same issue as many of you all did with the rattle sound from the cam adjusters (see video attached). I took the car in to the dealer so they could tell me what exactly am I looking at to fix it and boy let me tell you, it's a pretty penny (outlined further below). I mean of course at this point for all their suggested work it doesn't make sense with the value of our cars. The interesting part here is my dealer told me we are going to need to replace the cam as well which I notice wasn't mentioned in the earlier posts, is that something you all went through as well? What was some of the resolution you all had on this?
- Mehroz
this repair quote looks a little goofy... single parts quantities ...
1 VVT adjuster and 1 camshaft... how about the other 3 units??
Were they not damaged from the low oil pressure leaking through the tensioner??
Last edited by CaliBenzDriver; 09-22-2021 at 01:11 PM.
Yes, I had an intake camshaft replaced... in fact, they [dealer] did it twice: bolted everything together with original camshaft, ran diagnostics, and timing was reading out of spec. Pulled it apart, replaced with new camshaft, got everything together, ran the diagnostics, and it was still reading out of spec. Installed a second replacement (M-B's own cost for all that entailed), and finally all was within spec. Visually, the camshaft was fine - the issue was timing, with the explanation that the pulse ring on the camshaft may have possibly shifted (effectively making the timing out of phase with the lobes on the cam). Tolerances are exceptionally tight... and I have full confidence in the tech that did the work... but I can't fathom how such a shift could happen... and for the first new one, seems suspect that it could be out-of-spec at time of manufacture.
Regardless... all good, after ~15k kms and counting.
They should be able to show you the out-of-spec reading, or provide better explanation why the camshaft needs replacing.
09-23-2019, 03:24 PM
