S-Prihadi

Ha ha ha.....

Good thing I have lots of photo archive.
I almost got conned.
Seller uses a true MB Dealer name, but he/she is not the true MB dealer.
Box looks good in the display photo.

I then search for my photo archive during the oil leak fix of the VVT mini window.

The genuine one , its P/N its part of the casting mold, so the alphabet/numbers pop out.



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The genuine tensioner one also has INA label, which is the type of CHAIN used for my car.




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The fake one was priced close to a European seller's Euro 79.00 , a tiny bit higher in fact, so I was not suspicious.
The FCP Euro price is US$118, FOB USA.


The fake ones.. The P/N is printed or laser etch perhaps and no INA label/marking and the way it is written is not in MB style.
MB P/N has space between 3+3+2+2 digits. It will be written as A276 050 25 00 and not A2760502500







I guess fake tensioner producer does not want their casting-mold to be complex with a single P/N and waste their money, so he label the tensioner with ink/laser etching whatever the name is for such print work.




Example of MB genuine turbocharger oil return hose. See how the P/N always have space between them 3+3+2+2 digits.




I have made official complaint to the platform ( Tokopedia ) because seller in description wrote GENUINE MERCEDES.
This platform is like Indonesian version of Amazon, but do not keep inventory like Amazon does with its in-house inventory SHIPPED/SERVE BY AMAZON thingy
Tokopedia is totally a commission based platform like Ebay.

I never failed to get refund, because my purchase track record has been a long time good boy and I have spent A LOT there, worth a small brand new Japanese car 1.5L.

I once claimed a welding wire I bought too, where it is a corrupted under size by like near 10% , a common trick in Indonesia among small brand wire and steel re-bar seller.
All I need to do is show another brand , from Australia, with same MM2 spec, but surely more copper because no cheating of size.
The seller is a proper registered company and not individual and owned that "10% undersize-brand", they refunded me my $$... ha ha ha.

I shall update the outcome in a few days.


So guys, be careful when buying tensioner , now you at least know what a good fake looks like with black plastic push end, not green like MB one.

Sunnyslope48

Surya - You continue to amaze me. Keep it up.

S-Prihadi

I hope I wont ever come to this again....

I am still fighting the case on the selling platform as we speak. The Admin/Judge is not so smart because his/her understanding of intellectual property rights seems so low.
Ebay once got blasted high dollar fine over fake luxury goods on their platform. https://www.nytimes.com/2008/07/01/t...gy/01ebay.html


I will go to MB official dealer to get their professional point of view aka PROOF..... on this fake tensioner.
Its not about the $$ for me, its about how PISSED I am

CaliBenzDriver

the platforms choose to look the other way and not enforce any laws. Counterfeits are a real problem.

S-Prihadi

My GENUINE 2 tensioner is ready for pick up tomorrow.
LEFT and RIGHT. The bottom one special order 30+ days.

Price is SURPRISINGLY only 10% higher than FCP Euro when USA sales tax added 10%...Wow.
I mostly buy thru my Indie, let them get like 10%. The Indie boss is a good guy and quite close to me.

This is the only component MB Indonesia did not F--K me at minimum 50% extra compared to USA.


Some entertainment for today :

I scan the fake tensioner barcode , I should have done it first day hahahaha.

So the crook got lazy for printing a good fake label and both fake tensioners, their barcode read as GENUINE PATS ( spelling error too PARTS ) and not the Part Number of the product. Ha ha ha
So this is very much likely China sourced fake. Typo error is very common for fake goods out of China.





This is my N135 Board for the steering side tranny pedal shifter issue 2 years ago . Genuine.



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So the fake tensioner started naked, no part number from China. Ony V6L and V6R Left / Right by casting



Uhhhh, black plastic end tip too , like my fake one.

And then they do the P/N printing using special ink.... Viola !!! fakey fakey.



One can go to online barcode reader web for fun too, like this two :

https://products.aspose.app/barcode/recognize
.
https://www.onlinebarcodereader.com/

using photos.... have fun and try.

FAKE

FAKE

.

GENUINE

GENUINE



One more thing, if genuine, the QR Code will link to Mercedes Parts website and the parts , but if your computer is not authorized, it will ONLY go to Mercedes Website but not into the true parts database.
The QR Code for the fake tensioner is this one >>>> http://p.mb-qr.com/A05000271_15 . Faker is using a VVT sprocket part number of M271




Above is how Mercedes on purpose scramble the Part Number sequence. Above and below is how to decode it.









Genuine parts, the QR code is the same as the BarCode for Part Number, but scrambled the positions too. Hence fake tensioner maker uses what sample he has from older M271 engine hahahah.




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Without special authorization on your computer, the website landing page is always each person internet IP own country MB website.
For me to click this : http://p.mb-qr.com/A05000271_15 or all of the genuine QR, same landing page , I get : MB Indonesia website.

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So now you can ask online seller you feel suspicious of, to take good photo of the label too, so you can get their QR code and Barcode to scan.
Aside from proper good quality photo of the product itself.
.

S-Prihadi

From MB Indonesia.

The latest Tensioners Left and Right, both get extra 2 digits part number 64 at its end. So it is 13 digits total, not 11 anymore.
I got the one from Slovakia


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Sealed plastic bag and not simple open ended plastic bag.


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The physical product P/N still retain the 11 digits. GREEN end tip plastic and the safety release pin is much longer than fake one.







I managed to scan one of the QR code where it was not bent 90 degrees ( scanner can not read a 90* bent sticker ).
This time they pack more data and it may probably be someday used like how Mobil 1 uses Scantrust QR service to verify genuine product .

This is from xxx A276 050 25 00 64 or LEFT tensioner. QR code.






==============


Mobil 1 using ScanTrust Service.
What is Scantrust ? : https://www.scantrust.com/
We need to install the ScanTrust Apps first to access it for genuine product verification. Mobil 1 is a common target for faker.




So when you guys buy Mobil 1, you can try to verify if they are genuine or not too.


.

Andre Cateb

The amount of fake MB parts on the internet is amazing... After some disappointments, I've stopped using the market place sites in Brazil for the same reason. Even when the seller list the part as original, it is usually a counterfeit from Aliexpress. I'm limiting to buy parts from FCP Euro or from MB Star Parts and having them delivered at a friend house in the US.

S-Prihadi, I've looked into the video from when I was fixing the mini-VVT cover leak and the same here, the original tensioner has the PN engraved.

S-Prihadi

Thanks Andre


Close up photos




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MB dealer in Ohio has the new P/N with 13 digits on their system. The extra 64 as last 2 digits 12th and 13th.
This is their online web : https://www.mboemparts.com/oem-parts...r-276050250064
Cheaper than FCPEuro by $13.00 but will not export out of USA .

sdhayuj

I just wish Germans were also terrified of selling cars with ticking time bombs as engines. Truly makes me sad that they don’t feel bad putting plastic parts in engines that will blow up an engine.





Kodi

S-Prihadi

Well, plastic is more and more everywhere now, doing critical fluid handling. I hate it too,
Wait tll you see same era/year BMW, Mini, Porsche and many more plastic lovers.... LOL

Crito

LOL, you guys are talking about stuff blowing up and the part actually looks like a hand grenade. Not to mention you just woke up some dude at the NSA. Information overload baby! hehe

S-Prihadi

Ha ha ha, indeed that PULL pin looks scarry

JettaRed

iTrader: (1)

I don't remember your mentioning why you are replacing the tensioners. How many miles are on your engine? What are the symptoms that they need replacing?

S-Prihadi

It is not because of an issue, it is because I will be in there , read here : https://mbworld.org/forums/e-class-w...r-replace.html
go to post #4

ADD
My engine is now 40,000KM only.
I also ordered the bottom or 3rd chain tensioner.

JettaRed

iTrader: (1)

😳

So, no immediate problem. You are just paranoid?

Wondering if replacing coolant more often than every 10 or 15 years would help ensure no coolant leak. On my 2004 Audi TT, there is an electric coolant pump to keep the coolant running through the turbo after shutting the engine down. I know our cars have separate turbo and engine cooling circuits. Wonder if an electric coolant pump could be added for the engine to keep it running another 5 minutes after shut down. Now, there's a project for you!

CaliBenzDriver

These tensioners are the cheapest incarnation of what is still be useful. They need good oil pressure to work.

The oil check valve was made an external option. At the beginning of production it was only used on some engines but not others. A TSB was issued to add tensioners on all engines.

This basic tensioner is a shaft held by a spring. The shaft diameter is tapered and the undersized seal material is engineered for limited usefulness. The shaft being tapered forces the seal to also acts as a bearing surface for the shaft. The furthest extended is the tapered shaft the more pressure leakage is guaranteed.

​​​​​​When the oil bleeds out of this unit through its shaft, it is no longer able to keep the camshaft in time. The plunger is free to travel in and out uncontrolled. That's why good tensioners are one-way ratcheted to hold adjustment regardless of oil pressure. This tensioner shaft goes limp and seal wears out further to dump more pressure.

Without good oil pressure this tensioner allows the related camshaft to shift forward. In our GDI engines, the HPFP proportioning valve control needs to be precisely timed to work with 3 or 4 lobes.

When you run a limp tensioner past its prime you get degraded engine performance plus increasingly more wear from decreased lube. Some of us recognize that slippery slope and act to get better than new Benz.


> LISTEN to recognize your limp tensioners...
- Low oil pressure help waste tensioners by letting the shaft ram back and forth over bearing seal.

- When you hear the engine idle in wobbly cycles like you could count the number of revs... that is limp tensioner letting your camshafts rush forward with chain slack!

- Here we have one chain tensioner per bank... twice the wobbly timings.

> Smart moves:
Research analysis comes through uncommon ways.
We are very appreciative of Master Surya pointing out what has his attention captured. It is clever to recognize these WORTHLESS PARTS ARE ESSENTIAL.

S-Prihadi

Its not paranoid ... , its more of predictive & preventive maintenance. The 2 el-cheapo seals will leak guaranteed 100%, but when ? That is the tough question.
If those 2 el-cheapo seal does leak coolant into my oil, I will ruin my engine and I would have failed my own predictive & preventive maintenance to keep running well for as long as I can, minimum 20th year of age.

Replacing coolant more often will not help with how the polymer/rubber seals would degrade over time.
I replace coolant latest once per 5 years. In fact I am on my 3rd coolant already. 1st one from MB was the old yellow coolant. So I replaced the blue one twice.
I also have replaced the coolant expansion tank , because it will crack and the reason MB coolant can last that long is because inside the coolant expansion tank there is a bag
of chemical which its job its to inject additive over time to make the coolant long life. The Audi has that too.

Also my timing for LEFT intake is 1.27* adapted, that means there is that much degree of a timing chain stretch or the tensioner is not healthy enough

JettaRed

iTrader: (1)

As they say, it's not being paranoid if the danger is real.

CaliBenzDriver

So I've found the pics I snapped when I was replacing my tensioners a while back.

FCP parts show like your known-good ones with numbering die cast, not etched.

Couple interesting things to notes:
The QR code has morfed into something else other than a web link. It's more like a product serial number.

FCP Euro packaging


surface defects from factory

I had to send the mating surface smoothe. Tensioners are installed without any surface seal. The 60PSI Max oil pressure shows up there, don't want to drop any available head pressure.


bleed hole, 1000 grit, cast numbers


smooth flat mating surface

The 2023 superseeded latest and greatest tensioners look identical as the 2013 originals.
👏

> FUN INVESTIGATION...
Don't worry about the grenade pin, the spring is super weak. You can easily squeeze shaft with one hand. No big dangerous spring surprise there.

You have couple spare counterfeit parts, how about itchy fingers investigation??

I was quite surprised by the behavior of these tensioners - The shaft does not travel in/out freely.
Shaft travel inward easily but gets stuck extending - That is the opposite of what we want.

We want a shaft extend easily and does not retract.
What's getting jammed inside??
Play with your good tensioners manually without the pin, you'll see what I mean about the shaft jamming ​​​​​​

What did MB invent to make these tensioners amazing service items??

CaliBenzDriver

either we go looking for the fun Easter Eggs in each system or the bugs gang up an odd failure.

Coolant-oil mayo is an old favorite of the heat exchangers.

Now MB has the timing cover setup to leak coolant into the oil pan. Nicely concealed leak, hard to find.

S-Prihadi

Yes Cali, I wonder too why the MATING SIDE ( oil trapping ) surface finish of the tensioner is not super smooth and how much would that make a leak.
Those are rough machining lines ...right ?




==================

I made a kind offer to the seller and Admin of the platform.
I will accept one of the "fake" and return the other one.
I want to keep 1 fake one for memory and to play with it .
I think by Monday I can get confirmation of the return of my funds for one of the fake tensioner.



So, I will play with the fake one I am keeping. For Cali : FAKE RIGHT SIDE TENSIONER


Genuine tensioners will not allow the dual-shafts to slip out of the tensioner housing, its seems pressed in quite good for the lower fatter shaft.
Fake one dual-shaft simply slide out when you angle the tensioner. So more oil leak will happen with fake one from the lower shaft OD I guess.
Also the spring on the fake one is weaker compared the genuine..
1 and 2 represent the region where there is like a "stop".
This video will explain what I mean by 2 STOPs:


==============

GENUINE
LEFT SIDE , not RIGHT SIDE
Left side genuine tensioner also has the stop, but only 1 region.
Its like a friction stop, same with the fake one but genuine one move smoother.




The GENUINE RIGHT SIDE
I almost thought I can't push back in the dual shaft.....LOL
It was much harder than the RIGHT SIDE.
Here is the funny video for it

.
.
I finally able to push the dual shaft in.
I bath the tensioner in Mobil 1 oil. Let oil seep into the dual shaft internal and get a lower table so I can use more of my body weight but while being extra cautious. Sorry no video.
It was very hard pressure to overcome the initial resistance when that dual shaft was fully extended. I wonder what kind of mechanism is in there.
I don't think it is a simple spring only. Spring alone does not behave like that at initial depression.

Still by feel I find the genuine RIGHT SIDE tensioner is harder than the genuine LEFT SIDE tensioner, this is for today's conclusion.
Perhaps when I bath them in oil both soak it for a good 30 minutes and test again. Someday, not today though.


================


Something to note :




For RIGHT side tensioner, one of its bolt hole is part of the oil gallery.
Right side tensioner has a much smoother finish for its MATING SIDE ( oil trapping ). I can't feel the machine lines like the one on the LEFT side tensioner .
Is this because MB predicted that one of the bolt will be an oil leaker too ? So they made the surface finish better to trap oil , to compensate ?

CaliBenzDriver

Isn't that super weird the way the tensioner shaft moves are jerky and it gets jammed on the way out instead of tension the chain smoothly.


not vented vs. vented to squeeze air out

For some reasons both banks tensioners are different, I guess to accomodate the HPFP.
One has a tiny vent hole while the other one does not. So air will be trapped and act spongy.

I think ttensione4s have some form of inner checkvalve. When I squueze the shaft in some oil comes out around the shaft poor seal but nothing through oil inlet hole.


sticking out defect on MB tensioner

The damaged matting surface I had was from factory after beeing machined. I was not super impressed with all the cutting marks so I polished roughness out for 10mn. I rationalized this will hold oil pressure better.

So as always double-check your parts to save assembly time of detective items✌️

S-Prihadi

yep weird the way it is NOT shock-absorber kind of smooth movement.

Ohh I did not notice one has no vent hole at shaft end near the green plastic tip.
When the time comes to install I will make sure the mating surface I will improve ....thanks

Make sense if RIGHT side tensioner is harder compared to the left one, prepared for more torque needed to operate the HPFP lobes.

Yakatak

The sealing surfaces on those tensioners are terrible, as is the sticky action. Just doesn't look like anything that was manufactured anywhere in Western Europe. Do we know who manufactures these for MB?

CaliBenzDriver

made in Europe

this tensioner comes directly from SLOVAKIA in central Europe.


flat edges

I was questioning the lack of a basic silicone seal, since the surface had been banged I sanded the ridges smooth to my liking.

On the lower timing cover, fingers crossed we're okay or else everyone is gona have to go in to fix an internal leak.
🤞